I wasn't stating Revan was the chosen one persay, I was staying that it may very possibly look that way judging by what he had to do and how he went after the remnants of the old sith empire alone. The point is he is a lot more powerful than Anakin.
I agree that Revan is above any PT Jedi or Sith (but that's my own opinion).
A lot more powerful? No. Sidious or Yoda (by the PT) would give him one hell of a fight.
Originally posted by jollyjim311
Look, Revan can't be good just because you want him to be. You need to back up your argument, no matter who you are, and, I've shown a few links. All you have is that he beat Malak (we don't know his power, either), and, had lightning that came from the sky (it could have been lasers, the Raktan were primitive, if I remember correctly). I look forward to a rebuttal with facts in the morning, good night.
Well...
Revan beat Malak who was strongest in a Sith Order of thousands. Malak has shown us:
1) Use of competant force lightning
2) The ability to choke two Jedi at once
3) The saber ability to best Kavar, the leader of the Jedi Guardians.
Revan beat him on the Star Forge, where Malak clearly had the advantage with the extra lives. He's easily on Ani's level, at least.
Well, Anakin is one of the most powerful in an order of 10 thousand, and beat Dooku, who:
1)Has force lightning also.
2) The ability to choke great Jedi such as Obi Wan and Quinlan Vos while using the force to take his lightsaber and gun away, casually. http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=195&page=36
3)The saber ability to beat Mace Windu, Asajj Ventress, General Greivous, Sora Bulq and many more.
Anakin beat him on his own ship when Dooku would have wanted to impress his master.
Originally posted by jollyjim311
Well, Anakin is one of the most powerful in an order of 10 thousand, and beat Dooku, who:
1)Has force lightning also.
2) The ability to choke great Jedi such as Obi Wan and Quinlan Vos while using the force to take his lightsaber and gun away, casually. http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=195&page=36
3)The saber ability to beat Mace Windu, Asajj Ventress, General Greivous, Sora Bulq and many more.Anakin beat him on his own ship when Dooku would have wanted to impress his master.
Anakin defeating Dooku in a saber duel is inconclusive. For all we know, Dooku was testing Anakin's capabilities for Sidious. He was given those direct orders, and an apprentice does obey their master.
Do you think Sidious would order his apprentice to kill the Jedi with one of the most highest potentials? The battle was a test, so obviously Dooku was not trying his hardest. Even if the strongest combatant in the world were fighting a young upstart, if he wasn't out to damage him but test his potential, he would be leaving himself open to wide range of weak spots..
The ridiculous comments from the ROTS novelization does not support your points. You know this as well as I, the novelization is merely an author's interpretation on the subject. About as good as ours.
Secondly, Malak was stronger than Dooku when Revan defeated him. Why you ask?
His powers were amplified with the Star Forge. The darkside energies of an entire race empowered him, and he was described as being "unstoppable."
2. I suppose it is too hard to imagine that Revan would just resist Anakin's feeble attempts. You forget the knowledge bases Revan had over Anakin. Malachor 5, and the tombs on Korriban which still possessed buried holocrons. The Rakatans described him as slaughtering their ranks with his "magics" and summoning lightning to kill them. They were in awe of his power.
This is a side note, but about Mace's defeat
This is flat out untrue, as the two were described as being tied, until Dooku's droids interfered. Hardly what I call outdueled.
It has already been debated over and over and over about the Anakin vs Dooku, and Anakin won. The mods even said so, and if you try to say against them then you go against the forums canon policy.
And Sidious sent out Assaj to kill Anakin, so much for being afraid he would die.... It was clear and had been said by Sidious himself that if Anakin failed he was not strong enough....
Originally posted by kamikz
It has already been debated over and over and over about the Anakin vs Dooku, and Anakin won. The mods even said so, and if you try to say against them then you go against the forums canon policy.And Sidious sent out Assaj to kill Anakin, so much for being afraid he would die.... It was clear and had been said by Sidious himself that if Anakin failed he was not strong enough....
There is a difference between sending a well trained dark Jedi who was once a Jedi Master (with heaps of talent with the lightsaber and very strong connection to the force), and a bald six foot woman.
Again, I can'tunderstand why people would think Anakin actually defeated Dooku. Ignore the fact that Dooku tied Mace Windu, and also ignore the fact that earlier in AOTC Dooku WTFpwned the duo.
Subsequently, he WTFpwned Kenobi when the two Jedi were wailing on him. Noticed that he got Obi Wan out of the fight?
Why because his objective was to test Anakin, not Obi Wan. In light of these facts, people still hold that Dooku was actually intending to kill Anakin.
Originally posted by zephiel7
Anakin defeating Dooku in a saber duel is inconclusive. For all we know, Dooku was testing Anakin's capabilities for Sidious. He was given those direct orders, and an apprentice does obey their master.
Actually, it's conclusive.
Originally posted by Motoko Sama
About the Anakin versus Dooku fight I've found:"Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."
--George Lucas, The Making Of ROTS; Page 41.
"In this particular case the idea is that Palpatine is testing Anakin to see if he is strong enough to become his new apprentice, and he doesn't tell Dooku what he's actually up to." -- Lucas, ROTS Commentary.
Among other things, but these were the two main things. Now, it's not as if I have access to the commentary or "The Making of ROTS", but if these are correct (and they've given sources so you people can check), and coupled with other various facts - then Anakin beat Dooku fair and square.
So, assuming these are correct, Anakin beats Dooku while Luke watches/is killed off by Dooku. Or after the fight, is killed by Anakin.
The ridiculous comments from the ROTS novelization does not support your points. You know this as well as I, the novelization is merely an author's interpretation on the subject. About as good as ours.
Well, considering there's a few more points to consider - the ROTS novelization > your "interpretation".
Secondly, Malak was stronger than Dooku when Revan defeated him. Why you ask?
Yeah, tell me.
His powers were amplified with the Star Forge.
And you can amplify the powers behind the Star Forge somehow?
The darkside energies of an entire race empowered him, and he was described as being "unstoppable."
Seems the description was wrong, seeing as he was stopped.
Well, considering there's a few more points to consider - the ROTS novelization > your "interpretation".
It is an author's interpretation, not actual fact. The facts are :
Ignore the fact that Dooku tied Mace Windu, and also ignore the fact that earlier in AOTC Dooku WTFpwned the duo.Subsequently, he WTFpwned Kenobi when the two Jedi were wailing on him. Noticed that he got Obi Wan out of the fight?
Why because his objective was to test Anakin, not Obi Wan. In light of these facts, people still hold that Dooku was actually intending to kill Anakin
Again I ask, how can people believe that Dooku was actually intending to kill Anakin? You are ignoring a hundred different variables from the very fact that Dooku knew that either way, he would not die. Anakin was fighting for his life. And yes, I was right, Dooku WAS testing Anakin. Orders from Sidious.
And you can amplify the powers behind the Star Forge somehow?
The Star Forge had two abilities. One was to create an infinite fleet, and the other was to amplify the powers of any dark Jedi powerful enough to use it. This is narrated by Malak himself as well as the computer in the Rakatan temple.
GL himself stated, "Palpatine never told Dooku what was going on, he was only told to fight Anakin and Obi-Wan". There was no test mentioned in Lucas words. THis is the creator of Dooku, and the creator of Star Wars, ignore his words and your pretty off.....
Second, the novelization is said to be second to the films. It doesn't matter if you think that the author just thinks in a different way than you, that's the KMC policy, deal with it. And that book showed Dooku thinking "it was time to kill".
Originally posted by zephiel7
It is an author's interpretation, not actual fact. The facts are :
Actually, the facts are what I laid out in front of you. Perhaps you missed it? Lenses needs an adjusting, hm?
Again I ask, how can people believe that Dooku was actually intending to kill Anakin?
Because he was told to go all out on Anakin? Not hold back? No indication otherwise (other than Dooku fanboys that can't accept Anakin > Dooku)? Because in The Making of ROTS "if Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku"?
What happened btw? Anakin did what? He killed Dooku?
Yes, he killed Dooku fair and square. Disprove the quotes I gave you, or shut up.
The only problem with what Dooku thought was the fact the plan was suppose to be that Palpatine would save Dooku from dying, which was addressed on several occasions. On top of that, it gives explanation as to why Dooku looked at Palpatine like that before he became the Headless Horseman.
The Star Forge had two abilities. Once was to create an infinite fleet, and the other was to amplify the powers of any dark Jedi powerful enough to use it. This is narrated by Malak himself as well as the computer in the Rakatan temple. [/B]
"Amplify the powers of any DJ..." - blah blah. How much does it amplify their powers by?
Originally posted by kamikz
GL himself stated, "Palpatine never told Dooku what was going on, he was only told to fight Anakin and Obi-Wan". There was no test mentioned in Lucas words. THis is the creator of Dooku, and the creator of Star Wars, ignore his words and your pretty off.....Second, the novelization is said to be second to the films. It doesn't matter if you think that the author just thinks in a different way than you, that's the KMC policy, deal with it. And that book showed Dooku thinking "it was time to kill".
1. "Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."
1. Care to dispute this from GL?
2. It is an interpretation, and should not be treated as having any worth especially when it is so illogical. Regardless of KMC regulations, it doesn't make the interpretation any more right.
Although a little extreme, that would the equivalent of saying, Hitler killing Jews is right, because that was Nazi German regulation and policy.
What do you mean no? Explain to me how Anakin would defeat Revan in a versus match? Force abilities clearly go to Revan as Anakin never reached potentials. Revan was also a lightsaber prodigy in a more martial time. You want to argue that Anakin>Revan because he beat Dooku? I can counter your argument with Anakin getting pwned by Obiwan. And again, play KOTOR or at least read the storyline. Revan was the most powerful of his time, where there were more powerful Jedi/Sith. Anakin was what, behind Yoda, Mace, Sidious, Dooku, etc? Yea, Anakin iz theee ch0zen 0ne.
Originally posted by zephiel7
1. "Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."1. Care to dispute this from GL?
2. It is an interpretation, and should not be treated as having any worth especially when it is so illogical. Regardless of KMC regulations, it doesn't make the interpretation any more right.
Although a little extreme, that would the equivalent of saying, Hitler killing Jews is right, because that was Nazi German regulation and policy.
Don't you see, there is nothing to suggest he held back. Palpatine said, "if he gets the better of you I'll stop the fight", apparently he got the better of him. He also said, "if you get the better of him we let him wait", apparently that never happened. THere is nothing to suggest he held back and the novelization supports this. Also, Lucas has said that Dooku was told to fight Anakin, not hold back because it was a test, but to fight Anakin. Even if it was a test he never said he would hold back because of that....
If you don't like the policy, don't come here, but that's the way it is.