Originally posted by Darth Sexy
I was skimming through your wonderful speech and I saw Sidious>Yoda. Calm down.
No, what you saw was: "And on top of all that, Anakin was beating the piss out of Obi-Wan up until Obi-Wan securely got the high ground. That situation looks familiar...
Yoda vs. Sidious! Sidious had the high ground and thus the advantage needed to beat Yoda."
Sidious had the advantage needed to fend off Yoda. Yoda > Sidious on even ground, where did I imply otherwise? It's the same concept as Anakin > Obi-Wan on even ground.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
It sounds like an A>B>C argument Escape. With that I could say Anakin could defeat Sidious because Mace defeated Sidious, or Anakin would stalemate Yoda because Sidious did. I don't think it's logical at all to put Anakin in the same category as Yoda or Sidious.
Lol, actually you were using the same argument since you said Mace>Sidious, Anakin>Mace, Anakin>Sidious....
And please, prejudice? I've laid down a logical argument with statements, facts, and logical deductions. What have you shown me? "ANAKIN WAS BEING TESTED! DOOKU WASN'T FIGHTING BEST!"...hm, did you see a No. 2 pencil in Anakin's hand? I sure as hell didn't. Dooku was going all out, using all his strength and seeing if
Anakin could best him. That's the ENTIRE POINT.pointless babbling
Who would fight better? They'd fight equally. Considering Dooku is loyal a la Darth Maul, and will listen to his master. He was told to fight Anakin, he did so. And doesn't Dooku realize he's in trouble near the end anyways? Seems your points are pretty much done with.
You are completely ignoring the fact that Sidious guaranteed Dooku's safety right from the get go, in order to further your point. Dooku was mislead. Dooku was meant to test Anakin's ability with the lightsaber NOT kill him. If he were trying his best, then Ankain would have surely been killed, WHICH WOULD HAVE GONE AGAINST SIDIOUS' orders
1. "Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."
Bolded. Easier for you to read bub...
Who would fight better? They'd fight equally. Considering Dooku is loyal a la Darth Maul, and will listen to his master. He was told to fight Anakin, he did so. And doesn't Dooku realize he's in trouble near the end anyways? Seems your points are pretty much done with.Also, who would you rather have - someone who is weaker, or someone who is stronger when you're about to wage war with the Jedi? Or here's another brainteaser, why would you want to have a new apprentice that isn't even good enough to defeat your current apprentice?
Dooku was in a difficult situation because he was ordered to spare Anakin's life. To disarm or disable an opponent is much more difficult than straight out killing them. It seems your points are pretty much done with. Dooku was not putting his all, because he was ordered to not kill Anakin, "but let him go, and let him stew for a few more years until he's ready."
I am sure Palpatine would not be happy if Dooku went "all out" and killed a potentially powerful ally.
Anakin is > Dooku, and Anakin is also > Obi-Wan, it just so happens that a few things got in the way during the Obi-Wan/Anakin bout (arrogance, terrain, etc.)Want to watch ROTS again? .
I have seen it once, but once is enough. The battle lasted for a long time, with no side gaining a significant advantage against the other.
And Anakin going on the offensive? OF COURSE. It has something to do with, oh lightsaber styles if you ever heard of them? No of course not... Obi Wan used Soresu, a defensive stance, in order to tire Anakin.
Anakin forcing the offensive on Obi Wan does not mean he was tooling Obi Wan. It is a consequence of Obi Wan's chosen combat style.
Oh yeah, for sure Anakin is greater than Dooku 🙄, DESPITE the fact that Dooku held the two Jedi back even when they were both attacking him at once. And the fact that he deflected Anakin and removed Obi Wan from the fight in one effective stroke? VERY LOGICAL DEDUCTIONS there buddy. I mean if he could repel the attacks of possibly one of the best co-ordinated duos in Star Wars, then he could not take one of them down. I suppose taking down a mob would be much easier than taking down one member at a time . 🙄
Well, Anakin is one of the most powerful in an order of 10 thousand, and beat Dooku, who:
1)Has force lightning also.
True, however Dooku clearly refrained from using force lightning on Anakin... for whatever reason.
2) The ability to choke great Jedi such as Obi Wan and Quinlan Vos while using the force to take his lightsaber and gun away, casually. http://www.swtimeline.ru/?comics=195&page=36
Yep, Dooku had great control over force telekenisis... but we haven't really seen Malak fight someone on their level, except Bastila, and he gave that b*tch a good whipping.
3)The saber ability to beat Mace Windu, Asajj Ventress, General Greivous, Sora Bulq and many more.
Well, he did beat Mace several years ago. We don't really know how they stack up by RotS, but it's fair to say they're close in power.
Another thing: Revan is known to be calm and patient. We see this on his flagship when he defensively waits for the Jedi to attack him.
Anakin is a hot-headed brute by nature. Anakin did face a calmer, more experienced and defensive opponent before... and got three of his limbs removed.
True, but Anakin wouldn't be emotionally confused. He would use his anger to "give him focus, make [him] stronger." Also, Obi Wan knew Anakin's attacks inside and out. He was his instructor. Revan also knew all of Malak's training, most likely, and, probably wouldn't fair so well against him if he didn't. Obi Wan had the same advantage over Anakin that Revan did over Malak. Revan knew how to go about fighting Malak. He wouldn't know how to fight Anakin, at least not in the same sense or as well as he did against Malak.
Originally posted by zephiel7
You are completely ignoring the fact that Sidious guaranteed Dooku's safety right from the get go, in order to further your point. Dooku was mislead. Dooku was meant to test Anakin's ability with the lightsaber NOT kill him. If he were trying his best, then Ankain would have surely been killed, WHICH WOULD HAVE GONE AGAINST SIDIOUS' orders
You realize he wouldn't have to make the killing blow simply point his saber or withhold it at the end, right? Have you ever seen a bout with a bokken? Or perhaps fencing? Same concept applies.
I mean, what happened in AOTC? Why didn't he just do that if he is greater? Are you telling me he wasn't aiming to kill Anakin then too?
Anyways, if Dooku firmly is superior to Anakin, then why would Sidious want a weaker apprentice when he's about to execute Order 66 in a few days? Answer this point directly this time. As it makes no sense, nor does anything you say. And you can add to the fact that only three people of the PT Era can compete with Sidious - Mace, Yoda, and omg - Anakin. Dooku isn't on the list.
1. "Palpatine has told Dooku. 'I have somebody who I think will be a great Sith Lord and I think we can get him to join us. But we need to test him. So we're going to setup a situation where you fight him. If he gets the best of you, then I'll stop the fight and he'll have passed the test. If you get the best of him, then we'll let him go, and we'll let him stew for a few more years until he's ready.' But behind it, obviously, is Palpatine's real intention: If Anakin is good enough, Anakin can kill Dooku and become Palpatine's new apprentice. But he didn't tell Dooku that."Bolded.
And this means what exactly? Nothing? Anakin was good enough to defeat a Dooku that was fighting his best, thus was able to kill him. I'm going to ask again: why would Dooku be relaxing throughout the fight, or fighting at a lower standard when he's suppose to test Anakin's true power - which cannot be revealed by fighting a less motivated opponent.
Easier for you to read bub...
Comprehension isn't a strong point of yours I can see, Wolverine - you were better off at Marvel Comics, boy.
Dooku was in a difficult situation because he was ordered to spare Anakin's life. To disarm or disable an opponent is much more difficult than straight out killing them.
Uh, not really -- if Dooku is so much superior he should be able to disarm Anakin a la AOTC. He was ordered to FIGHT Anakin. You can definitely tell when someone lost a fight, they don't have to kill them. An example would be: Mace Windu vs. Sidious.
It seems your points are pretty much done with.
Not really.
Dooku was not putting his all, because he was ordered to not kill Anakin, "but let him go, and let him stew for a few more years until he's ready."
He was ordered to fight Anakin. To test Anakin's full strength, he cannot test Anakin's full power unless Dooku himself is giving his full strength. Simple concept, but you're making it a complicated one.
I am sure Palpatine would not be happy if Dooku went "all out" and killed a potentially powerful ally.
I'm sure Palpatine wouldn't be happy if Anakin beat someone who was holding back. What sense does that make? Why would he want Anakin if he gets the best of a relatively lowered Dooku? Answer: He wouldn't. Dooku went all-out.
I have seen it once, but once is enough. The battle lasted for a long time, with no side gaining a significant advantage against the other.
LOL! Anakin got seven hits on Obi-Wan while Obi-Wan was running away. Anakin was winning, and was getting his hits in. Obi-Wan was not. Perhaps you missed the 20 second long Dragon Sleeper?
And Anakin going on the offensive? OF COURSE. It has something to do with, oh lightsaber styles if you ever heard of them? No of course not... Obi Wan used Soresu, a defensive stance, in order to tire Anakin.
WTF are you talking about? Nothing in that quote said jack about Anakin going offensive. You need your glasses checked ASAP.
And now I know you need to watch the movie again, because Obi-Wan was the one that was tired (or at least looked it) - he was breathing hard while Anakin was fine perfectly.
Anakin forcing the offensive on Obi Wan does not mean he was tooling Obi Wan. It is a consequence of Obi Wan's chosen combat style.
No, the fact that Anakin broke Obi-Wan's guard several times is what I was talking about. He was whooping the defensive master with melee attacks.
Oh yeah, for sure Anakin is greater than Dooku 🙄, DESPITE the fact that Dooku held the two Jedi back even when they were both attacking him at once.
Anakin wasn't angry firstly, and secondly they needed to WORK TOGETHER. Sometimes two on one can work towards the one man if the two's combat styles don't mesh. Obviously Obi-Wan attacking on the offensive isn't good because that's not what his style was meant for, and Anakin got less swings in because of Obi-Wan.
And the fact that he deflected Anakin and removed Obi Wan from the fight in one effective stroke? VERY LOGICAL DEDUCTIONS there buddy.
Again, WTF are you talking about? Here's an instance where someone was better off one on one than working as a team:
TPM Kenobi did better against Maul than Qui-Gon and himself did.
There you go, another instance where one person faired better one on one than two on one.
I mean if he could repel the attacks of possibly one of the best co-ordinated duos in Star Wars, then he could not take one of them down. I suppose taking down a mob would be much easier, because taking them down one member at a time would be harder. 🙄
A mob? Sure, it'd be easier to take them out one on one. However, two people isn't something I'd consider a "mob" - at least in the context you're using it in. Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi were coordinated, I mean they had worked together for some damn time...yet Obi-Wan faired better against Maul alone. M I RITE? Yes.
Anyways, one last question (actually I have three more): if Dooku is superior, then why couldn't he just disarm him or disable him? If he's such the superior swordsman, he should be able to do such.
As well, doesn't Dooku even realize himself that he's in danger towards the end, and proceeds to go all out?
Regardless, it really makes no sense because if Dooku was superior then why would Anakin be tested against him if he was just going to lose anyways? And then you have the other query, why would he fight a lesser Dooku? The Sith don't want weaker apprentices - they want stronger ones. As much is obvious.
Anyways, argued that too much; back on the exact topic - can someone explain to me (not using bullsh*t words to describe Revan) how exactly will Revan defeat Anakin? Or, at the least, what exactly does he hold over Anakin?