Re: Re: Re: Does a degree only hold respect from others with degrees?
Originally posted by Regret
I am making an uneducated assumption by broadly generalizing all those who dont have similar levels of education as myself. This is the first step in the process of gaining an understanding of whether my assumption or hypothesis is correct. Once I have learned what I can here, I may, if it is of enough interest consider making a complete study into the subject. Only by asking the question is it possible to become educated in the subject.Also, I work in I/O Psychology, I have experience with a large number of individuals and hiring of individuals for high level jobs. In my experience individuals that do not have a college level education tend towards this type of behavior. I believe it may be due to a blow to the self-esteem when passed over in favor of someone with an education.
No, but this topic is addressing the perception of individuals as to the value of a degree, not whether the degree makes one infallible as to his specialization.
IMO CS is the area of study that has the most difficult time with this phenomena, those that work effectively and make a decent living without the degree have a low opinion of those that followed the educational approach . My minor was CS, and my major was initially CS. I have seen that these statements hold true in many situations between CS and non-CS personnel.
You missed the irony I attempted to present in my previous post about your hypothesis. By your own admission, you have now attested to being uneducated about the opinions of those who have not obtained some form of higher education. So based on your initial reasoning, it would be foolish for one to consider your hypothesis on the matter as being valid, particulary since stated hypothesis was coming from an uneducated individual such as yourself.
Further demonstrating this irony is the fact that your hypothesis is solely based on personal opinion and experience, rather than study or education.
Moving back to the original topic of the thread, I do believe obtaining a degree can be very valuable, and those who obtain one through some form of higher education should be acknowledged for their accomplishments. Still I do not support the notion that such accomplishments should automatically make one an unquestionable-omniscient authourity whilst presenting opinions in their field.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Does a degree only hold respect from others with degrees?
Originally posted by Mr Ed
You missed the irony I attempted to present in my previous post about your hypothesis. By your own admission, you have now attested to being uneducated about the opinions of those who have not obtained some form of higher education. So based on your initial reasoning, it would be foolish for one to consider your hypothesis on the matter as being valid, particulary since stated hypothesis was coming from an uneducated individual such as yourself.Further demonstrating this irony is the fact that your hypothesis is solely based on personal opinion and experience, rather than study or education.
I did miss the irony of your statement, but I think it was in error all the same. The initial impetus behind research is curiosity in a fairly narrow area, it is often initially motivated based on personal experience and opinion. I admit my lack of knowledge because that is the reason for research. Hypothesis are never considered valid prior to testing of them. What I have approached here is extremely gross preliminary research into the subject of interest. If it seems that my thoughts have some merit, and I desire to continue, a literature review on research that would pertain to this topic would be performed. This would be to verify that a need for such a study could be considered of value, or to replicate another study to increase the validity of such findings, while also narrowing the subject of study to a more exact and concise statement. Then we would proceed to designing the experiment and testing the hypothesis.
Originally posted by Mr Ed
Moving back to the original topic of the thread, I do believe obtaining a degree can be very valuable, and those who obtain one through some form of higher education should be acknowledged for their accomplishments. Still I do not support the notion that such accomplishments should automatically make one an unquestionable-omniscient authourity whilst presenting opinions in their field.
Thank you, this is the type of response I was wanting.
Originally posted by Nellinator
All I can say is that telling people you have a degree to convince them of your viewpoint doesn't seem to work. It never helped me 🙁
Maybe...just maybe...you should have convinced them with your better arguments, but that's just a theory of mine. What do I know, I don't have a degree.
Originally posted by Regret
I did miss the irony of your statement, but I think it was in error all the same. The initial impetus behind research is curiosity in a fairly narrow area, it is often initially motivated based on personal experience and opinion. I admit my lack of knowledge because that is the reason for research. Hypothesis are never considered valid prior to testing of them. What I have approached here is extremely gross preliminary research into the subject of interest. If it seems that my thoughts have some merit, and I desire to continue, a literature review on research that would pertain to this topic would be performed. This would be to verify that a need for such a study could be considered of value, or to replicate another study to increase the validity of such findings, while also narrowing the subject of study to a more exact and concise statement. Then we would proceed to designing the experiment and testing the hypothesis.
You are still missing the irony. Despite any conclusion determined from the exstensive research you will conduct, your hypothesis on said matter will never carry as much credibility as the opinions of the experts in this study.
All valid evidence provided to support your hypothesis should be quickly discarded in favor of expert opinion. And of course in this scenario, the experts represent those who do not have degrees.
So with that being stated please accept the opinions of the experts who have posted on this board. Any evidence you obtain to support your hypothesis, will not hold as much merit as their opinions due to your acknowledged lack of expertise regarding the subject.
Originally posted by Mr Ed
You are still missing the irony. Despite any conclusion determined from the exstensive research you will conduct, your hypothesis on said matter will never carry as much credibility as the opinions of the experts in this study.All valid evidence provided to support your hypothesis should be quickly discarded in favor of expert opinion. And of course in this scenario, the experts represent those who do not have degrees.
So with that being stated please accept the opinions of the experts who have posted on this board. Any evidence you obtain to support your hypothesis, will not hold as much merit as their opinions due to your acknowledged lack of expertise regarding the subject.
Haha, that is kind of funny.
Originally posted by PVS
an offshoot of another debate in which the opponent copped out and ran.a person with a degree certainly (hopefully) has more knowledge on a topic than someone without. (depending on the topic, of coarse, since a black man in georgia probably knows far more about racism than a white guy from new york who studied racism)
respect is not the issue. the issue is proof and evidence to support one's opinion. when a court of law brings in an expert, that expert is required to give more than just an opinion. a forensics expert doesnt just sit at the witness stand and say "i think he did/didnt do it" and get up and walk away, case closed. they must present evidence to support their opinion. i cant think of a single forum for debate where a person is above having to back up any claims. i cant think of a single instance where "because i said so" is acceptable proof of validity.........parenting aside, of coarse
Err, no, sorry, you are wrong there.
Experts are expected to provide 'expert opinion' on otherwise unsettled points of evidence.
It is absolutely expected in court that if a person is recognised as an expert, then his interpretation on the areas he is an expert in is in itself worth more than it would otherwise be, before you start putting any evidence in.
After all, any layman presenting what he says is 'evidence' or 'proof' is often rather meanginless, especially in the kind of technical areas that Courts deal with. There is only credibility to such statements if the person is an expert, which is why the idea of an 'expert' witness is normally established.
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"And you can be uneducated and still have a degree."
Geez, I hope not.
Frankly, I still think there is a disturbing lack of respect for decent education in this forum. I find myself having a great lack of respect myself for the kind of opinion Bardock holds here.
Originally posted by Ushgarak
Err, no, sorry, you are wrong there.Experts are expected to provide 'expert opinion' on otherwise unsettled points of evidence.
key words 'otherwise unsettled'. a lack of evidence of any kind renders that forensics expert useless. how can you study a crime with nothing to follow?
Originally posted by Ushgarak
"And you can be uneducated and still have a degree."Geez, I hope not.
Frankly, I still think there is a disturbing lack of respect for decent education in this forum. I find myself having a great lack of respect myself for the kind of opinion Bardock holds here.
:edit: *cough*online degree*cough* so yes he is correct imho
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Mr T has a doctorate.. he just doesn't like to brag..
And I am sure he doesn't need to, because he can back up his statements with reasonable facts and research and not just his degree.
Also, even though a degree alone is not worthy of respect, would you please refer to him as Dr. T? Thank you.
Originally posted by Bardock42Weird thing I found out apparently medical doctors who end up electing a surgical specialty end up with the title Mister.
And I am sure he doesn't need to, because he can back up his statements with reasonable facts and research and not just his degree.Also, even though a degree alone is not worthy of respect, would you please refer to him as Dr. T? Thank you.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Weird thing... gibberish...I don't think people with a degree deserve respect simply for having it... but the opinions of someone with a degree are more valid with regards to particular subjects at least with some classes of degree...
But if they don't happen to be the only "expert" in their field they should be able to produce information that goes beyond their opinion. If they can't, well then their opinion is just as useless as anyone elses.