Originally posted by Scoobless
And it's already been pointed out that his resources are less than Aquaman's, his intelligence isn't that big a deal compared to some of the others.... and they all have connections
Aquaman's a dick. He hardly does anything for the team. Intelligence is what Batman usually does for the team. It's just plain wrong to ignore that fact just because you don't like it. 🙄 And they don't have their connections that usually pull through like Bats. Check out "Rock of Ages." Check out "Devided We Fall." Batman pulls through.
Honestly, strategically Plastic Man is the least useful for the team. He doesn't have anything that J'onn can't provide.
Originally posted by Accel
No one's saying Batman is useless, just the least useful. If Flash took ten minutes of his time to study all the subjects Bruce exceeds in, he could become about as intelligent as Bats in those areas. GL can probably apply the ring to do the same.
That could be said for a lot of people on the team. Who needs J'onn, Superman, or Plastic Man when you've got a Green Lantern ring that can do ANYTHING? 🙄 Flash and Kyle aren't the brains of the group, that isn't their job. They've never been the geniuses of the group, so don't go making assumptions.
Originally posted by batdude123
That could be said for a lot of people on the team. Who needs J'onn, Superman, or Plastic Man when you've got a Green Lantern ring that can do ANYTHING? 🙄 Flash and Kyle aren't the brains of the group, that isn't their job. They've never been the geniuses of the group, so don't go making assumptions.
Every one serves at least one purpose in the JLA and whatever Batman brings to the table, others can bring as well (intelligence, weapons, etc). The opposite, however, cannot be correctly stated.
Originally posted by Accel
Exactly, but they are capable of doing it and you know it. This isn't asking who is the MOST useful, which is most likely Green Lantern in the JLA, but the LEAST useful, which is Batman in the JLA.Every one serves at least one purpose in the JLA and whatever Batman brings to the table, others can bring as well (intelligence, weapons, etc). The opposite, however, cannot be correctly stated.
How is Batman less useful than Plastic Man when he consistently strategizes for the team, and gives them information, not to mention has fail safes for everyone? Plastic Man strategically does absolutely DICK and you know it. Plastic Man isn't even telepathically immuned like some believe. The only time I've seen that was in his fight with Fernus. But, I've seen his mind be telepathically penetrated way too many times for me to think that. It's just plain wrong to ignore ALL the times Batman has come through for the JLA. In fact, it's down right illogical. Batman comes up with plans and actually thinks stuff out for them. That's how it's basically portrayed in all the comics. It doesn't make it UNTRUE simply because you may not like that fact. He's basically the "general" of the group. 😉
Originally posted by batdude123
How is Batman less useful than Plastic Man when he consistently strategizes for the team, and gives them information, not to mention has fail safes for everyone? Plastic Man strategically does absolutely DICK and you know it. Plastic Man isn't even telepathically immuned like some believe. The only time I've seen that was in his fight with Fernus. But, I've seen his mind be telepathically penetrated way too many times for me to think that. It's just plain wrong to ignore ALL the times Batman has come through for the JLA. In fact, it's down right illogical. Batman comes up with plans and actually thinks stuff out for them. That's how it's basically portrayed in all the comics. It doesn't make it UNTRUE simply because you may not like that fact. He's basically the "general" of the group. 😉
Batman being the least useful on the JLA is nothing to be ashamed of. The fact that he's part of the team in the first place says a lot.
Originally posted by Accel
Batman is the consistent strategical mind of the group, yes, but he doesn't have to be. As I pointed out, Flash is capable of going over every single strategy possible in his mind in a matter of seconds. Then you have that combined with the intelligence of Superman and MM as well as the plot device of the GL ring and they should easily be able to come up with plans at the very least as good as Batman's strategies. Plastic Mind isn't a strategical genius, but he didn't become part of the team to develop plans for them and whether or not he is telepathically immune is irrelevant.Batman being the least useful on the JLA is nothing to be ashamed of. The fact that he's part of the team in the first place says a lot.
Again I ask you, what makes Batman less useful than Plastic Man?
J'onn has admitted that the JLA has needed the help of Batman many times. He's said that he's not as good of a detective or a strategizer as Batman. And Superman is more of an inventor type person. He is an analyzer/strategizer like Bruce is. Despite Arthur, Batman provides funding and connections. Arthur is usually too much of an ass to do what is needed for the JLA. And when he's a part of it, he doesn't really help other than to fight for the team. Batman actually uses his mind and connections on land (not under water) to help out the JLA. Plus, his detective skills usually comes in handy at one point or another. Again, it's wrong to ignore issues where he is the proliminary strategizer of the group. If J'onn thinks so, then you know he isn't lying. Superman has also expressed how important it is for Batman to be a part of the JLA. Plastic Man doesn't provide a vital part in the team AT ALL. He doesn't do anything really. And of course Batman has those fail safes for everybody. So, he could take the team himself if he preped for it!! evillaugh
Originally posted by batdude123
Again I ask you, what makes Batman less useful than Plastic Man?J'onn has admitted that the JLA has needed the help of Batman many times. He's said that he's not as good of a detective or a strategizer as Batman. And Superman is more of an inventor type person. He is an analyzer/strategizer like Bruce is. Despite Arthur, Batman provides funding and connections. Arthur is usually too much of an ass to do what is needed for the JLA. And when he's a part of it, he doesn't really help other than to fight for the team. Batman actually uses his mind and connections on land (not under water) to help out the JLA. Plus, his detective skills usually comes in handy at one point or another. Again, it's wrong to ignore issues where he is the proliminary strategizer of the group. If J'onn thinks so, then you know he isn't lying. Superman has also expressed how important it is for Batman to be a part of the JLA. Plastic Man doesn't provide a vital part in the team AT ALL. He doesn't do anything really. And of course Batman has those fail safes for everybody. So, he could take the team himself if he preped for it!! evillaugh
Superman "is NOT" an analyzer like Bruce is, rather. 😄
Marvel's Illuminati - Xavier or Black Bolt. Xavier doesn't really have much influence over mutants at large, especially these days. Black Bolt doesn't even do much at Earth these days, he lives in moon, and there are not many Inhumans left. Whereas Namor commands most of the Earth...
Great Lakes Avengers - Flatman
Doom Patrol - Elasti-Girl
Stormwatch - Don't know
Defenders - Namor or Hulk. Hulk has probably saved them more times then not...
New Warriors - Don't know
Imperial Guard - Too many members to say
Exiles - Currently? Longshot.
Squadron Supreme - Tom Thumb
X-Factor - Rictor
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Marvel's Illuminati - Xavier or Black Bolt. Xavier doesn't really have much influence over mutants at large, especially these days. Black Bolt doesn't even do much at Earth these days, he lives in moon, and there are not many Inhumans left. Whereas Namor commands most of the Earth...
Great Lakes Avengers - Flatman
Doom Patrol - Elasti-Girl
Stormwatch - Don't know
Defenders - Namor or Hulk. Hulk has probably saved them more times then not...
New Warriors - Don't know
Imperial Guard - Too many members to say
Exiles - Currently? Longshot.
Squadron Supreme - Tom Thumb
X-Factor - Rictor
Yeah, Rictor is no good to anyone without his powers.
Originally posted by batdude123
Again I ask you, what makes Batman less useful than Plastic Man?J'onn has admitted that the JLA has needed the help of Batman many times. He's said that he's not as good of a detective or a strategizer as Batman. And Superman is more of an inventor type person. He is an analyzer/strategizer like Bruce is. Despite Arthur, Batman provides funding and connections. Arthur is usually too much of an ass to do what is needed for the JLA. And when he's a part of it, he doesn't really help other than to fight for the team. Batman actually uses his mind and connections on land (not under water) to help out the JLA. Plus, his detective skills usually comes in handy at one point or another. Again, it's wrong to ignore issues where he is the proliminary strategizer of the group. If J'onn thinks so, then you know he isn't lying. Superman has also expressed how important it is for Batman to be a part of the JLA. Plastic Man doesn't provide a vital part in the team AT ALL. He doesn't do anything really. And of course Batman has those fail safes for everybody. So, he could take the team himself if he preped for it!! evillaugh
As for Plastic Man, he may not be as smart as Batman, but his other abilities come in handy in a fight against the typical cosmic threat the JLA usually faces off. If I saw Doomsday charging at me, I'd feel much better with PM at my side than with Bats.
Originally posted by Accel
J'onn's probably right that's he's not as a good as a detective as Batman, but when you take into consideration of the combination of the powers and intelligence of MM, Superman, Flash, GL, and possibly Wonder Woman, along with the fact that the JLA doesn't typically solves mysteries, J'onn doesn't need to be as good. With their abilities, just about any one of them should easily become as skilled as Batman as far strategizing is concerned, but for some reason they never do.As for Plastic Man, he may not be as smart as Batman, but his other abilities come in handy in a fight against the typical cosmic threat the JLA usually faces off. If I saw Doomsday charging at me, I'd feel much better with PM at my side than with Bats.
J'onn and the JLA have expressed their desire for having Batman on the team. They've said that they have needed him before, and we're supposed to ignore that? 😑 Bottom line; Batman is portrayed to be consistently strategizing and coming up with plans for the JLA that they typically don't even think of. Again, I make a reference to the fail safe thing.
Plastic Man has less use than Batman imo. He doesn't bring anything to the table that J'onn doesn't already bring. Not to mention at least Batman contributes to the JLA while PM is just another member who fights. Batman who preps and strategizes is more useful imo than Plastic Man on they fly. Again, Batman is always the one with the plan. Look at "Terror Incognita," "Rock of Ages," and "Devided We Fall." Those are simply a few of the MANY books where they've needed him to come through for them before.