Creation vs Evolution

Started by ~Flamboyant~221 pages

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I love you too with the love of God shed abroad in my heart by the Holy Spirit (i.e. Godly love which is not physical or earthly it transcends all other forms of human love). Human love between a man and a woman is romantic and/or sexual love. The love between a parent and child is emotional and/or unconditional love. But the love of God is a love that has no strings of any kind attached and it is the highest kind of unconditional love. It is with this love by faith that Christians love the unsaved, Jesus-rejecting populace. We are only capable of expressing this kind of love by the presence of the Holy Spirit because He is Love (and He dwells in us). This is the same love that Jesus Christ expressed as He hung on the cross in absolute, unutterable, unprecedented, humiliation and pain. Jesus' pain was not just physical, but spiritual as well. Jesus' pain pervaded every part of His being: spirit, soul, and body. Jesus suffered the weight and condemnation of the sins of the entire world. The two thieves that were on either side of Jesus were crucified for their own respective sins. But Jesus Christ was crucified for our sins...(I feel like weeping). In addition to the intense physical beating and torture that Jesus underwent (including the fact that He hadn't had any food or rest, and had loss substantial amounts of blood)--Jesus suffered the pain of being separated from His Father for the first time in His eternal existence. Jesus had always experienced unbroken fellowship with His Father for eternity. But the moment that Jesus took our sins upon Himself (i.e. the moment that Jesus willingly became the object of His Father's judgment and wrath against sinners/sin), His Father turned His back on Him (treating Jesus as if He were us: wicked sinners). That is why Jesus cried out,

[B]Matthew 27:46
And about the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”

We don't truly grasp nor understand what Christ went through to make Heaven attainable for anyone. Anyone can have a right to the Tree of Life in Heaven thanks to Jesus. Anyone can be saved. All it takes is child-like faith in Jesus. What are you (all) waiting for? Ask Jesus Christ to save you from your sins so that you can go to Heaven. I double dog dare you. He will do it posthaste. But you must be sincere. It does not matter whether you are Black, White, Red, Yellow, or Brown, the same Lord (i.e. Jesus) over all is rich to all who call upon Him.

Romans 10:12
For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him. [/B]

Well, going with the off topic theme.....what about love between man and a man, or woman and a woman?

Actually I'll make a thread.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
All it takes is child-like faith in Jesus.
I like this part the best, “child-like faith”, a child will believe anything that you tell them from Santa Claus to the Easter bunny.

Originally posted by ThePittman
I like this part the best, “child-like faith”, a child will believe anything that you tell them from Santa Claus to the Easter bunny.

child-like faith = blind faith

blind faith = control of the masses

control of the masses = power for the few

JIA, serious question... I have no doubt that you really believe what you believe for the most part, but don't you desire or even demand that your beliefs you hold so dear be sustained with something of greater sustenance than "child-like faith" as an adult?

I believe in evolution and will acknowledge it has holes and faults, but I continue to believe regardless of these faults because the positives far outweigh the negatives and not just blind faith that it is correct. Being it is science based, I do realize that knowledge comes with time and eventually those holes will be filled and somethings will be reworked/revised to fit as science progresses and shows us our previous misconceptions.

Originally posted by Robtard
JIA, serious question... I have no doubt that you really believe what you believe for the most part, but don't you desire or even demand that your beliefs you hold so dear be sustained with something of greater sustenance than "child-like faith" as an adult?

I believe in evolution and will acknowledge it has holes and faults, but I continue to believe regardless of these faults because the positives far outweigh the negatives and not just blind faith that it is correct. Being it is science based, I do realize that knowledge comes with time and eventually those holes will be filled and somethings will be reworked/revised to fit as science progresses and shows us our previous misconceptions.

the word you're looking for is "canon"

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
control of the masses = power for the few

Combine with the Church and Christina Ideology and you have TOTALITARIANSIM!

YAY!

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
the word you're looking for is "canon"

I realize creation, exile from the garden, the flood etc. is held as accepted facts in religion, but who initially decided it was "canon"? As a thinking person I would demand facts or the very least 'high probability scenarios' to back up my beliefs and not live my life on the premise that someone else who lived who knows how long ago just said "This is how it is, do not ask question".

Originally posted by ThePittman
I like this part the best, “child-like faith”, a child will believe anything that you tell them from Santa Claus to the Easter bunny.

Fulfilled Prophecy: Evidence for the Reliability of the Bible
by Hugh Ross, Ph.D.

Unique among all books ever written, the Bible accurately foretells specific events-in detail-many years, sometimes centuries, before they occur. Approximately 2500 prophecies appear in the pages of the Bible, about 2000 of which already have been fulfilled to the letter—no errors. (The remaining 500 or so reach into the future and may be seen unfolding as days go by.) Since the probability for any one of these prophecies having been fulfilled by chance averages less than one in ten (figured very conservatively) and since the prophecies are for the most part independent of one another, the odds for all these prophecies having been fulfilled by chance without error is less than one in 102000 (that is 1 with 2000 zeros written after it)!

God is not the only one, however, who uses forecasts of future events to get people's attention. Satan does, too. Through clairvoyants (such as Jeanne Dixon and Edgar Cayce), mediums, spiritists, and others, come remarkable predictions, though rarely with more than about 60 percent accuracy, never with total accuracy. Messages from Satan, furthermore, fail to match the detail of Bible prophecies, nor do they include a call to repentance.

The acid test for identifying a prophet of God is recorded by Moses in Deuteronomy 18:21-22. According to this Bible passage (and others), God's prophets, as distinct from Satan's spokesmen, are 100 percent accurate in their predictions. There is no room for error.

As economy does not permit an explanation of all the Biblical prophecies that have been fulfilled, what follows in a discussion of a few that exemplify the high degree of specificity, the range of projection, and/or the "supernature" of the predicted events. Readers are encouraged to select others, as well, and to carefully examine their historicity.

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(1) Some time before 500 B.C. the prophet Daniel proclaimed that Israel's long-awaited Messiah would begin his public ministry 483 years after the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem (Daniel 9:25-26). He further predicted that the Messiah would be "cut off," killed, and that this event would take place prior to a second destruction of Jerusalem. Abundant documentation shows that these prophecies were perfectly fulfilled in the life (and crucifixion) of Jesus Christ. The decree regarding the restoration of Jerusalem was issued by Persia's King Artaxerxes to the Hebrew priest Ezra in 458 B.C., 483 years later the ministry of Jesus Christ began in Galilee. (Remember that due to calendar changes, the date for the start of Christ's ministry is set by most historians at about 26 A.D. Also note that from 1 B.C. to 1 A.D. is just one year.) Jesus' crucifixion occurred only a few years later, and about four decades later, in 70 A.D. came the destruction of Jerusalem by Titus.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 105.)*

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(2) In approximately 700 B.C. the prophet Micah named the tiny village of Bethlehem as the birthplace of Israel's Messiah (Micah 5:2). The fulfillment of this prophecy in the birth of Christ is one of the most widely known and widely celebrated facts in history.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 105.)

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(3) In the fifth century B.C. a prophet named Zechariah declared that the Messiah would be betrayed for the price of a slave—thirty pieces of silver, according to Jewish law-and also that this money would be used to buy a burial ground for Jerusalem's poor foreigners (Zechariah 11:12-13). Bible writers and secular historians both record thirty pieces of silver as the sum paid to Judas Iscariot for betraying Jesus, and they indicate that the money went to purchase a "potter's field," used—just as predicted—for the burial of poor aliens (Matthew 27:3-10).

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 1011.)

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(4) Some 400 years before crucifixion was invented, both Israel's King David and the prophet Zechariah described the Messiah's death in words that perfectly depict that mode of execution. Further, they said that the body would be pierced and that none of the bones would be broken, contrary to customary procedure in cases of crucifixion (Psalm 22 and 34:20; Zechariah 12:10). Again, historians and New Testament writers confirm the fulfillment: Jesus of Nazareth died on a Roman cross, and his extraordinarily quick death eliminated the need for the usual breaking of bones. A spear was thrust into his side to verify that he was, indeed, dead.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 1013.)

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(5) The prophet Isaiah foretold that a conqueror named Cyrus would destroy seemingly impregnable Babylon and subdue Egypt along with most of the rest of the known world. This same man, said Isaiah, would decide to let the Jewish exiles in his territory go free without any payment of ransom (Isaiah 44:28; 45:1; and 45:13). Isaiah made this prophecy 150 years before Cyrus was born, 180 years before Cyrus performed any of these feats (and he did, eventually, perform them all), and 80 years before the Jews were taken into exile.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 1015.)

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(6) Mighty Babylon, 196 miles square, was enclosed not only by a moat, but also by a double wall 330 feet high, each part 90 feet thick. It was said by unanimous popular opinion to be indestructible, yet two Bible prophets declared its doom. These prophets further claimed that the ruins would be avoided by travelers, that the city would never again be inhabited, and that its stones would not even be moved for use as building material (Isaiah 13:17-22 and Jeremiah 51:26, 43). Their description is, in fact, the well-documented history of the famous citadel.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 109.)

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(7) The exact location and construction sequence of Jerusalem's nine suburbs was predicted by Jeremiah about 2600 years ago. He referred to the time of this building project as "the last days," that is, the time period of Israel's second rebirth as a nation in the land of Palestine (Jeremiah 31:38-40). This rebirth became history in 1948, and the construction of the nine suburbs has gone forward precisely in the locations and in the sequence predicted.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 1018.)

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(8) The prophet Moses foretold (with some additions by Jeremiah and Jesus) that the ancient Jewish nation would be conquered twice and that the people would be carried off as slaves each time, first by the Babylonians (for a period of 70 years), and then by a fourth world kingdom (which we know as Rome). The second conqueror, Moses said, would take the Jews captive to Egypt in ships, selling them or giving them away as slaves to all parts of the world. Both of these predictions were fulfilled to the letter, the first in 607 B.C. and the second in 70 A.D. God's spokesmen said, further, that the Jews would remain scattered throughout the entire world for many generations, but without becoming assimilated by the peoples or of other nations, and that the Jews would one day return to the land of Palestine to re-establish for a second time their nation (Deuteronomy 29; Isaiah 11:11-13; Jeremiah 25:11; Hosea 3:4-5 and Luke 21:23-24).

This prophetic statement sweeps across 3500 years of history to its complete fulfillment—in our lifetime.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 120.)

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(9) Jeremiah predicted that despite its fertility and despite the accessibility of its water supply, the land of Edom (today a part of Jordan) would become a barren, uninhabited wasteland (Jeremiah 49:15-20; Ezekiel 25:12-14). His description accurately tells the history of that now bleak region.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 105.)

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(10) Joshua prophesied that Jericho would be rebuilt by one man. He also said that the man's eldest son would die when the reconstruction began and that his youngest son would die when the work reached completion (Joshua 6:26). About five centuries later this prophecy found its fulfillment in the life and family of a man named Hiel (I Kings 16:33-34).

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 107).

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(11) The day of Elijah's supernatural departure from Earth was predicted unanimously—and accurately, according to the eye-witness account—by a group of fifty prophets (II Kings 2:3-11).

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 109).

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(12) Jahaziel prophesied that King Jehoshaphat and a tiny band of men would defeat an enormous, well-equipped, well-trained army without even having to fight. Just as predicted, the King and his troops stood looking on as their foes were supernaturally destroyed to the last man (II Chronicles 20).

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 108).

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(13) One prophet of God (unnamed, but probably Shemiah) said that a future king of Judah, named Josiah, would take the bones of all the occultic priests (priests of the "high places"😉 of Israel's King Jeroboam and burn them on Jeroboam's altar (I Kings 13:2 and II Kings 23:15-18). This event occurred approximately 300 years after it was foretold.

(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 1013). Since these thirteen prophecies cover mostly separate and independent events, the probability of chance occurrence for all thirteen is about 1 in 10138 (138 equals the sum of all the exponents of 10 in the probability estimates above). For the sake of putting the figure into perspective, this probability can be compared to the statistical chance that the second law of thermodynamics will be reversed in a given situation (for example, that a gasoline engine will refrigerate itself during its combustion cycle or that heat will flow from a cold body to a hot body)—that chance = 1 in 1080. Stating it simply, based on these thirteen prophecies alone, the Bible record may be said to be vastly more reliable than the second law of thermodynamics. Each reader should feel free to make his own reasonable estimates of probability for the chance fulfillment of the prophecies cited here. In any case, the probabilities deduced still will be absurdly remote.

Given that the Bible proves so reliable a document, there is every reason to expect that the remaining 500 prophecies, those slated for the "time of the end," also will be fulfilled to the last letter. Who can afford to ignore these coming events, much less miss out on the immeasurable blessings offered to anyone and everyone who submits to the control of the Bible's author, Jesus Christ? Would a reasonable person take lightly God's warning of judgment for those who reject what they know to be true about Jesus Christ and the Bible, or who reject Jesus' claim on their lives?

*The estimates of probability included herein come from a group of secular research scientists. As an example of their method of estimation, consider their calculations for this first prophecy cited:

Since the Messiah's ministry could conceivably begin in any one of about 5000 years, there is, then, one chance in about 5000 that his ministry could begin in 26 A.D.
Since the Messiah is God in human form, the possibility of his being killed is considerably low, say less than one chance in 10.
Relative to the second destruction of Jerusalem, this execution has roughly an even chance of occurring before or after that event, that is, one chance in 2.
Hence, the probability of chance fulfillment for this prophecy is 1 in 5000 x 10 x 2, which is 1 in 100,000, or 1 in 105.

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For a catalog of materials pertaining to faith, science, and the Bible please write or call:

REASONS TO BELIEVE
P.O. Box 5978
Pasadena, CA 91117
(626) 335-1480.

Copyright 1975, Reasons To Believe

P7501

Revised 08-22-2003 by Krista Bontrager

JIA's post being a total waste of time.

Probability: 1

Oh yay, another largely unpublished person with the letters PhD after their name that we're supposed to take note of for no apparent reason. I.e. spam.

Usally a PhD in religious studies from an unaccredited University or one that has no record of their attendance or completion of that degree.

(Kent Hovnid)

Originally posted by Alliance
Usally a PhD in religious studies from an unaccredited University or one that has no record of their attendance or completion of that degree.

(Kent Hovnid)

About Our Founder

Dr. Hugh Ross, Ph.D.
President and Director of Research
Reasons To Believe
P.O. Box 5978
Pasadena, CA 91117-0978
(626) 335-1480

Education

B.Sc. (1967) in Physics, University of British Columbia
Ma.Sc. (1968) in Astronomy, University of Toronto
Ph.D. (1973) in Astronomy, University of Toronto

Honors and Awards

Grand Award winner, British Columbia Science Fair, 1963
British Columbia Provincial Scholarship, 1963-1967
National Research Council of Canada Graduate Fellowship, 1968-1972
National Research Council of Canada Post-doctoral Fellowship, 1973-1975
Listed in Outstanding Young Men of America, 1979 and 1980
Angel Award for Excellence in Television Broadcasting , 1992, 1993
Logos Bookstore award for Beyond the Cosmos: What Recent Discoveries in Astronomy and Physics Reveal About the Nature of God, 1996
Angel Award for Journey Toward Creation video, 1999

Association Memberships

American Association for the Advancement of Science
American Astronomical Society
American Institute of Physics
American Scientific Affiliation
Evangelical Theological Society

Research and Teaching

Research Fellow in Radio Astronomy, California Institute of Technology, 1973-1978
Minister of Evangelism, Sierra Madre Congregational Church, 1976-1987
Minister of Apologetics, Sierra Madre Congregational Church, 1987 to the present.
President and Director of Research, Reasons To Believe, 1986 to the present
Professor in the Master of Arts program of Simon Greenleaf University, Anaheim, Calif., 1992 to 1997.
Lecturer in the Simon Greenleaf Institute of Apologetics at Trinity Law School, Santa Ana, Calif., 1997 to the present.

Publications

Technical

"Verification of Radio Variability of the Galaxy PKS 0048-09." Nature, 262 (1970), p. 431.
with E. R. Seaquist, "The High Frequency Radio Spectra of Secondary Standard Sources." Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society, 170 (1975), pp. 115-119.
"Variable Radio Source Structure on a Scale of Several Minutes of Arc." The Astrophysical Journal, 200 (Sept. 15, 1975), pp. 790-802.
with K. Y. Lo, R. T. Schilizzi, and M. H. Cohen, "VLBI Observations of the Compact Radio Source in the Center of the Galaxy." Astrophysical Journal, 202 (Dec. 1. 1975), pp. L63-L65.
with K. Y. Lo, M. H. Cohen, and R. T. Schilizzi, "An Angular Size for the Compact Radio Source at the Galactic Center." Astrophysical Journal, 218 (Dec. 15, 1977), pp. 668-670.
with David L. Block, "Unser Universum: Zufall oder Absicht?" Die Sterne, 68 (1992), pp. 325-339.

Popular level books

The Fingerprint of God. Orange, Calif.: Promise Publishing, 1989, 2nd ed'n 1991, 3rd ed'n 2005
The Creator and the Cosmos. Colorado Springs: NavPress, 1993, 2nd ed'n, 1995, 3rd ed'n 2001.
Creation and Time. Colorado Springs: NavPress, 1994.
Beyond the Cosmos. Colorado Springs: NavPress, 1996, 2nd ed'n 1999.
The Genesis Question, Colorado Springs: NavPress, 1998, 2nd ed'n 2001.
The Genesis Debate, Mission Viejo, CA: Crux, 2002. (with five other authors)
Lights in the Sky and Little Green Men, Colorado Springs: NavPress, 2002.
The Origins of Life, Colorado Springs: NavPress, 2004. (with Fuz Rana)
A Matter of Days, Colorado Springs: NavPress, 2004.
Who Was Adam? Colorado Springs, NavPress, 2005 (with Fuz Rana)
Putting Creation to the Test, Colorado Springs, NavPress, 2006
The Creation Hypothesis, Downers Grove, IL: InterVasity Press, 1994 (contributed one chapter)
Mere Creation, Downers Grove, IL: InterVarsity Press, 1998 (contributed one chapter)
Why I Am a Christian, Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Book House, 2000 (contributed one chapter)
The Day I Met God, Sisters, OR: Multnomak 2001 (contributed one chapter)
Time and the Physics of Sin, in "What God Knows: Time, Eternity, and Divine Knowledge" Edited by Harry L. Poe, Baylor University Press, (in press)

Articles in Charisma, Christianity Today, Decision, Moody Monthly, Canadian Challenge, Eternity, Issues, Family Life Today, Houston Chronicle, Los Angeles Times, New Man Magazine, Vision, Epiphany, Today's Pentecostal Evangel, World Magazine, The Real Issue, and Spiritual Counterfeits Project Journal

More than 50 papers on science-and-faith issues .

Editorial board, American Scientific Affiliation Committee for Integrity in Science Education and Truth journal, published by the International Institute for Mankind.

Science-Faith Speaking Events

Hugh Ross has addressed students and faculty on over 300 campuses in the United States and abroad on a wide variety of science-faith topics, from small sectarian colleges to large state universities, from theological seminaries to technical institutes. The typical event features a one hour lecture by Dr. Ross followed by as much as three hours of Q&A interaction with the audience. The list since 1988 includes, among others,

Non-Sectarian Colleges And Universities, USA

U. S. Air Force Academy
Arizona State University
Art Center College of Design, Pasadena, CA
Auburn University, Alabama
Boise State University
California Institute of Technology
California Polytechnic, San Luis Obispo
California State University at Fresno
California State University at Fullerton
California State University at Long Beach
California State University at Los Angeles
California State University at San Diego
California State University at San Jose
Case Western Reserve University
Chapman University, Orange, CA
Claremont McKenna College
Colorado School of Mines
Colorado State University
Dartmouth
Denver University
Duke University
Emory University
Emory University School of Medicine
Georgia Institute of Technology
Iowa State University
Kent State University
Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Miami University of Ohio
Midland College, Texas
Montana State University
North Carolina State University, Raleigh
Ohio State University
Oklahoma State University
Orange Coast College
Oregon State University
Purdue University
Princeton University
Rice University
Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology
Southern Illinois University
Southwestern College Stanford University
Texas A&M University, College Station
Virginia Institute of Technology
University of Akron
University of Alabama
University of Buffalo
University of California at Berkeley
University of California at Davis
University of California at Irvine
University of California at Los Angeles
University of California at San Diego
University of California at Santa Barbara
University of California at Santa Cruz
University of Central Florida
University of Chicago
University of Cincinnati
University of Colorado
University of Dayton
University of Delaware
University of Florida
University of Houston
University of Illinois
University of Iowa
University of Maryland
University of Michigan
University of Minnesota
University of Mississippi
University of Montana
University of New Mexico
University of North Carolina, Greensboro
University of Oregon
University of Pennsylvania
University of South Carolina
University of Southern California
University of Tennessee
University of Texas at Austin
University of Texas at Dallas
University of Texas Health Science Center (Houston)
University of Virginia
University of Washington
University of Wisconsin

Non-Sectarian Colleges And Universities, International

Africa
Kenya
Daystar University College, Kenya
University of Nairobi, Kenya
Lesotho
National University of Lesotho
South Africa
National University, South Africa
University of Bophuthatswana, SA
University of Cape Town, SA
University of Durban, Westville, SA
University of KwaZulu, SA
University of Natal, Pietermritzburg, SA
University of Pretoria, SA
University of South Africa
University of Stellenbosch, SA
University of the Western Cape, SA
University of the Witwatersrand, SA
University of Zululand, SA
Westphalian University, Durban, SA
Swaziland
University of Swaziland
Zimbabwe
University of Zimbabwe
Australia

Macquarie University
Monash University
Sydney University
University of Melbourne
University of New South Wales
University of Sydney
University of Western Australia
University of Wollongong
Victoria University
Canada

Carlton University
Simon Fraser University
University of Alberta, Calgary
University of Alberta, Edmonton
University of British Columbia, Vancouver
University of Guelph
University of Manitoba
University of Northern British Columbia
University of Ottawa
University of Toronto
University of Victoria
University of Western Ontario
University of Winnipeg
Estonia
Tallinn Technical Institute, Estonia
Tartu University, Estonia
Hong Kong

Hong Kong Institute of Science and Technology
Hong Kong University
Japan

Tokyo Institute of Technology
Russia

Institute for Astrophysics, St. Petersburg
Institute for Engineering Physics, Moscow
Ukraine

Agricultural Academy of the Ukraine
Ukranian Academy of Sciences
Ukranian Agricultural Academy
Ukranian Institute of Automatization
Ukrainian Institute for Building and Construction
Ukranian Institute of Otorhinolaryngology
Ukranian Institute for Roads, Bridges, and Tunnels
Ukranian Institute of Statistics
Ukranian Technological Institute of Food Industry
United Kingdom

Cambridge University

Sectarian Colleges, Universities, And Seminaries, USA

Azusa Pacific University
Bethel Seminary
Biola University
Calvin College
Christ College, Irvine
Columbia International Univ.
Dallas Baptist University
Dallas Theological Seminary
Denver Seminary
Fresno State University Fuller Seminary
Hope College
Hope International University
Oral Roberts University
Point Loma Nazarene University
Reformed Theological Seminary
Regent University
Saint Anselm's College
Seattle Pacific University
Seattle University Simon Greenleaf University
Simpson College
Southwestern Baptist Seminary
Tocoa Falls College
Trinity Evangelical Divinity School
U. S. Center for World Mission
Westmont College
Wheaton College
Whitworth College
William Carey University

Sectarian Colleges, Universities, And Seminaries, International

Emmaus Bible College, Melbourne, Australia
Harvest Bible College, Melbourne, Australia
Hong Kong Baptist University Lesotho Anglican Seminary
Russian Orthodox Seminary, St. Petersburg
Trinity Western University, Canada

Other Science-Faith Speaking Events

As featured speaker or workshop leader, Dr. Ross has brought his consistency-of-science-and-Scripture message to scores of churches and conferences nationally and internationally. Some of his more recent venues include:

American Scientific Affiliation conferences
Buckhead Community Church, Atlanta
Christian Businessmen's Committee, chapter events and regional conferences
Christian Church national convention
Christian Leadership Ministry conferences
Christian Ministries Training Association annual convention
Crystal Cathedral, Hour of Power
European Leadership Forum, Sopron, Hungary
Evangelical Philosophical Society conference
Evangelical Theological Society conferences
First Baptist Church, Atlanta
Intelligent Design Network conferences
Ligonier Ministries annual conference
Los Gatos Community Church
Mar Thoma North American Convention
Mensa annual convention
"Mere Creation" conference, Biola University
Regent University Creation Conference
Second Baptist Church, Houston
Society for Neurosciences annual convention
South Delta Baptist Church, Vancouver
U. S. Center for World Mission
Willow Creek Community Church, Chicago
Nobel Laureate Dr. Richard Smalley Memorial Service (read full text)

In addition to preparing and presenting a weekly television program, "Reasons to Believe" (Trinity Broadcasting Network seen over their worldwide satellite network), a live interactive weekly web-cast, "Creation Update" (www.reasons.org and www.oneplace.com), writing books and papers, and offering yearly accredited courses on creation and evolution, Dr. Ross gives:

radio interviews on secular and Christian stations (more than 60 per year)
television interviews and consultation for documentaries, both secular and Christian
a weekly "Paradoxes" class at Sierra Madre Congregational Church
lectures to business and professional groups at:
Aerojet
Ball Technologies
Bell and Howell
Hughes Aircraft
Caltech Jet Propulsion Laboratory
Livermore Laboratory
Los Alamos Laboratory
Lucent
Microsoft
National Astronomical Observatory (Tokyo)
Oakridge Nuclear Facility
Sandia Laboratory
TRW
and elsewhere

Biography

Hugh Ross launched his career at age seven when he went to the library to find out why stars are hot. Physics and astronomy captured his curiosity, and they never let go. He was the youngest person--at age seventeen--ever to serve as director of observations for Vancouver's Royal Astronomical Society. With the help of a provincial scholarship and a National Research Council (NRC) of Canada fellowship, Hugh completed his undergraduate degree in physics (University of British Columbia) and graduate degrees in astronomy (University of Toronto). The NRC also sent him to the United States for postdoctoral studies at Caltech, where he researched quasi-stellar objects, or "quasars," some of the most distant and ancient objects in the universe.

Not all Hugh's discoveries had to do with astrophysics. He observed with amazement the impact of describing for people both inside and outside his collegial community the process by which he came to personal faith in Jesus Christ. A few expressed dismay but most seemed overjoyed to meet someone who started at (or near) religious ground zero and through reality testing, both scientific and historical, became convinced that the Bible is truly the Word of God. For his part, Hugh was stunned to discover how many individuals believed--or disbelieved--blindly, without checking evidence.

Hugh's unshakable confidence that God's revelation of Himself in Scripture and nature do not, will not, and cannot contradict became his hallmark, his unique message. Communicating that message as widely and understandably as possible became Hugh's mission. He scouts the frontiers of origins research to share with scientists and nonscientists alike the thrilling news of what's being discovered and how it connects with biblical theology.

Between writing books, papers, scripts, and articles as well as recording a weekly live web cast called "Creation Update" and a weekly television program called "Reasons to Believe" (also the name of the nonprofit organization he leads,) Dr. Ross travels across North America and around the world, challenging university (and younger) audiences, churches and professional groups to consider the evidence for what they believe. He presents a persuasive case for Christianity without applying pressure, and for that approach he is widely recognized and appreciated. Because he treats people's questions and comments with respect, he is in great demand both as a speaker and as a radio and television guest.

Any more questions? Then read Hugh's biography again. Go Hugh, go Ross, it's your birtday--oh, I got a little carried away.

😄

http://www.reasons.org/

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
[B]Any more questions? Then read Hugh's biography again. Go Hugh, go Ross, it's your birtday--oh, I got a little carried away.

really? You got carried away?

My first question would be this:

Do you know that Dr. Ross believes that the earth is 4.6 billion years old?

Originally posted by Robtard
JIA, serious question... I have no doubt that you really believe what you believe for the most part, but don't you desire or even demand that your beliefs you hold so dear be sustained with something of greater sustenance than "child-like faith" as an adult?

I believe in evolution and will acknowledge it has holes and faults, but I continue to believe regardless of these faults because the positives far outweigh the negatives and not just blind faith that it is correct. Being it is science based, I do realize that knowledge comes with time and eventually those holes will be filled and somethings will be reworked/revised to fit as science progresses and shows us our previous misconceptions.

Check out this site Robtard: http://www.reasons.org/, perhaps the answers to some of your questions can be found here.

A: Ten Reasons to Believe the Bible:

1) Its Honesty:

The Bible is painfully honest. It shows Jacob, the father of its "chosen people," to be a deceiver. It describes Moses, the lawgiver, as an insecure, reluctant leader, who, in his first attempt to come to the aid of his own people, killed a man, and then ran for life to the desert. It portrays David not only as Israel's most loved king, general, and spiritual leader, but as one who took another man's wife and then, to cover his own sin, conspired to have her husband killed. At one point, the Scriptures accuse the people of God, the nation of Israel, as being so bad they made Sodom and Gomorrah look good by comparison ( Ezekiel 16:46-52). The Bible represents human nature as hostile to God. It predicts a future full of trouble. It teaches that the road to heaven is narrow and the way to hell is wide. Scripture was clearly not written for those who want simple answers or an easy, optimistic view of religion and human nature.

2) Its Preservation:

Just as the modern state of Israel was emerging from thousands of years of dispersion, a Bedouin shepherd discovered one of the most important archeological treasures of our time. In a cave of the northwest rim of the Dead Sea, a broken jar yielded documents that had been hidden for two millennia. Additional finds produced manuscripts that predated previous oldest copies by 1,000 years. One of the most important was a copy of Isaiah. It revealed a document that is essentially the same as the book of Isaiah that appears in our own Bibles. The Dead Sea scrolls emerged from the dust like a symbolic handshake to a nation coming home. They discredited the claims of those who believed that the original Bible had been lost to time and tampering.

3) Its Claims for Itself:

It's important to know what the Bible says about itself. If the authors of Scripture had not claimed to speak for God, it would be presumptuous for us to make that claim for them. We would also have a different kind of problem. We would have a collection of unsolved mysteries, embodied in historical and ethical literature. But we would not have a book that has inspired the building of countless churches and synagogues all over the world. A Bible that did not claim to speak in behalf of God would not have become foundational to the faith of hundreds of millions of Christians and Jews (2 Peter 1:16-21). But with much supporting evidence and argument, the Bible's authors did claim to be inspired by God. Because millions have staked their present and eternal well-being on those claims, the Bible cannot be a good book if its authors consistently lied about their source of information.

4) Its Miracles:

Israel's exodus from Egypt provided a historical basis for believing that God revealed Himself to Israel. If the Red Sea did not part as Moses said it did, the Old Testament loses its authority to speak in behalf of God. The New Testament is just as dependent upon miracles. If Jesus did not rise bodily from the dead, the apostle Paul admits that the Christian faith is built on a lie (1 Corinthians 15:14-17). To show its credibility, the New Testament names its witnesses, and did so within a time-frame that enabled those claims to be tested (1 Corinthians 15:1-8). Many of the witnesses ended up as martyrs, not for abstract moral or spiritual convictions but for their claim that Jesus had risen from the dead. While martyrdom is not unusual, the basis on which these people gave their lives is what's important. Many have died for what they believed to be the truth. But people do not die for what they know to be a lie.

5) Its Unity:

Forty different authors writing over a period of 1,600 years penned the 66 books of the Bible. Four hundred silent years separated the 39 books of the Old Testament from the 27 of the New Testament. Yet, from Genesis to Revelation, they tell one unfolding story. Together they give consistent answers to the most important questions we can ask: Why are we here? How can we come to terms with our fears? How can we get along? How can we rise above our circumstances and keep hope alive? How can we make peace with our Maker? The Bible's consistent answers to these questions show that the Scriptures are not many books but one.

6) Its Historical and Geographical Accuracy:

Down through the ages, many have doubted the historical and geographical accuracy of the Bible. Yet modern archeologists have repeatedly unearthed evidence of the people, places, and cultures described in the Scriptures. Time after time, the descriptions in the biblical record have been shown to be more reliable than the speculations of scholars. The modern visitor to the museums and lands of the Bible cannot help but come away impressed with the real geographical and historical backdrop of the biblical text.

7) Its Indorsement by Christ:

Many have spoken well of the Bible, but no endorsement is as compelling as that of Jesus of Nazareth. He recommended the Bible not only by His words but by His life. In times of personal temptation, public teaching, and personal suffering, He made it clear that He believed the Old Testament Scriptures were more than a national tradition ( Matthew 4:1-11; 5:17-19). He believed the Bible was a book about Himself. To His countrymen He said, "You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me. But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life" (John 5:39-40).

8) Its Prophetic Accuracy:

> the days of Moses, the Bible predicted events no one wanted to believe. Before Israel went into the Promised Land, Moses predicted that Israel would be unfaithful, that she would lose the land God was giving her, and that she would be dispersed throughout all the world, regathered, and then re-established ( (Deuteronomy 28-31). Central to Old Testament prophecy was the promise of a Messiah who would save God's people from their sins and eventually bring judgment and peace to the whole world.

9) Its Survival:

The books of Moses were written 500 years before the earliest Hindu Scriptures. Moses wrote Genesis 2,000 years before Muhammad penned the Koran. During that long history, no other book has been as loved or as hated as the Bible. No other book has been so consistently bought, studied, and quoted as this book. While millions of other titles come and go, the Bible is still the book by which all other books are measured. While often ignored by those who are uncomfortable with its teachings, it is still the central book of Western civilization.

10) Its Power to Change Lives:

Unbelievers often point to those who claim to believe in the Bible without being changed by it. But history is also marked by those who have been bettered by this book. The Ten Commandments have been a source of moral direction to countless numbers of people. The Psalms of David have offered comfort in times of trouble and loss. Jesus' Sermon on the Mount has given millions an antidote for stubborn pride and proud legalism. Paul's description of love in 1 Corinthians 13 has softened angry hearts. The changed lives of people like the apostle Paul, Augustine, Martin Luther, John Newton, Leo Tolstoy, and C. S. Lewis illustrate the difference the Bible can make. Even entire nations or tribes, like the Celts of Ireland, the wild Vikings of Norway, or the Auca Indians of Ecuador have been transformed by the Word of God and the unprecedented life and significance of Jesus Christ.

© 2002 RBC Ministries-Grand Rapids MI, 49555-0001"

http://www.creationevidence.org/cemframes.html?http%3A//www.creationevidence.org/fa_questions/10reasons.html

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
[B]
Macquarie University
Sydney University

Ah, the two universities I currently am part of. Both get an excellent assortment of guest speakers (especially for the political and historical students) - Macquarie is very much a university of the humanities even though we have an excellent scientific section.

Ross visit was well before my time, though recently there have been a lot of political guest speakers - ambassadors and the like. A Syrian minister who came and spoke not long was especially fascinating.

Wait... what is this all about? I better go back and have a gander...

B.Sc. (1967) in Physics, University of British Columbia
Ma.Sc. (1968) in Astronomy, University of Toronto
Ph.D. (1973) in Astronomy, University of Toronto

Ummm... how exactly do those credentials lend themselves to authoritative speaking on Biblical prophesy?

Originally posted by Alliance
really? You got carried away?

My first question would be this:

Do you know that Dr. Ross believes that the earth is 4.6 billion years old?

8 Myths About Reasons To Believe (circulated among Christians)

http://www.reasons.org/about/8_myths_about_rtb.shtml

5. RTB's acceptance of a billions-of-years-old universe contradicts a literal interpretation of the Bible.

FALSE

Actually, the Hebrew word for "day" has three literal definitions: 12 hours, 24 hours, or a long time period. Reasons To Believe affirms the accuracy of the biblical writings and frequently engages in scholarly discussions concerning the best, and most faithful, way to interpret Genesis 1. As a "God-breathed" revelation, the Bible is completely without error (historically, scientifically, morally, and spiritually). God's written word is our supreme and final authority in all matters that it addresses. Many Christian leaders have affirmed that an old-earth creation interpretation does not compromise Scripture, including Norman Geisler, the late Gleason Archer, Chuck Colson, Jack Hayford, and the late Dr. Walter Martin. LEARN MORE...

Books and Other Resources
Matter of Days, by Hugh Ross
The Genesis Question, by Hugh Ross
Science & Faith: Friends or Foes? by C. John Collins
God’s Pattern for Creation, by Robert Godfrey

Yes, I am fully aware that Hugh has certain beliefs but so do I. So what is the problem?

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
A: Ten Reasons to Believe the Bible:

This should be good.

1) Its Honesty:

So it claims. And it is rather dodgy argument the whole "wouldn't the Bible paint its figures better? The fact they are warts and all makes the Bible honest."

I remember, when we did our mock trials in my High School Legal studies class. One of the occasions when I was prosecutor and a classmate was a defence figure he used a similar argument - something about how the defendant was so honest about his fallibility's it made it hard to believe he could be lying about yadda yadda yadda. Suffice to say I enjoyed dealing with that part of it, because that isn't actually proof of anything.

Historical records of full of "honest" portrayals delivered without "bias" - and it is a joke. Likewise the whole "the Bible is exceptional as it doesn't give easy answers and is so strict" - whoever writes that clearly knows little about ancient religion, because they weren't all sunshine and lollipops.

The Bible doesn't give easy answers? Funny, I know little easier then "It doesn't matter how bad you have been simply believe in Jesus and everything will be fine" - yes, that is terribly stringent.

3) Its Claims for Itself:

Silly rabbit, when will you ever learn? A claim can't validate itself by claiming it is true. It requires proof to do that. The fact the Bible claims it is true and the word of God is irrelevant, unless equal weight be given to the Koran. And the texts of Gurus. Hell, Ganesh wrote some epic poetry with his broken tusk.

But none of them get kudos for claiming they are true.

4) Its Miracles:

So it claims. Of course this brushes over the facts that aren't supported historically or scientifically (creation, flood, exodus and so on.)

And witnesses. It is once again easy to come up with witnesses for acts when the account is written many years after the so called event. I can sit here know and claim all sorts of things about my family, chuck in some common Irish/English and Scandinavian names... and who can argue?

5) Its Unity:

Of course this has nothing to do with some Roman's cherry picking religious texts to get something cohesive... does it? Everyone always forgets all the Books that were considered and didn't make it in.

As well as the variations and contradictions between OT and NT. But we have another failsafe clause here don't we - Jesus updated the OT rules, so it isn't contradiction.

6) Its Historical and Geographical Accuracy:

Historical fiction does the same. As does the Iliad. And numerous other Greek mythological stories. And the Koran, and Hindu texts. And Egyptian myths.

That is like saying a Tom Clancy novel is exceptional because he mentions Paris and the Farm.

7) Its Indorsement by Christ:

Oops - doubling up there. Claims verify claims because they claim they are true.

8) Its Prophetic Accuracy:

Easy to make prophesies when we are relying on texts written after Moses.

9) Its Survival:

Funny, because historical consensus is that the Hindu faith predated Mosaic religion as the first organised religion by at least a couple of hundred years.

The rest of this point - conjecture and personal aggrandisement - The Bible has been the most loved or hated book! Oooooo, special. Not really.

10) Its Power to Change Lives:

I love the way you make out it was the power of the Bible, not the acts of fantastical Europeans, that can be accounted for the conversion of people like the Celts.

I guess they take after the romantic view of history, not the "Christians killing and spreading disease and obliterating culture after culture" kind of history.

Biased and inaccurate reports, JIA, don't help your claims.

JIA responded to Alliance, but I have a sneaking suspicion that he was also responding to me. Tsk tsk. I think an angel just died.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Ummm... how exactly do those credentials lend themselves to authoritative speaking on Biblical prophesy?
Especially considering the notable lack of publications. Oh and JIA before you provide us with Ross' lovely CV again perhaps you should figure out what the words "largely unpublished" mean with regard to scientific and academic achievements; of which Ross has very few.