I did read it, and, what do you want me to say? That we've never seen Kas'Im outduel and kill anyone? That Kas'Im has only shown us a force push? He did kill a rancor, once, so, he's God on these forums now. He has one hyperbole to his name. Yoda is mentioned to be the most powerful Jedi, and judging from what we've seen from him, that seems about right. Kas'Im won't win this.
Originally posted by jollyjim311
I did read it, and, what do you want me to say? That we've never seen Kas'Im outduel and kill anyone? That Kas'Im has only shown us a force push? He did kill a rancor, once, so, he's God on these forums now. He has one hyperbole to his name. Yoda is mentioned to be the most powerful Jedi, and judging from what we've seen from him, that seems about right. Kas'Im won't win this.
For the millionth time.
1. Described as the perfect warrior
2. Described as possibly the greatest swordsman ever
3. Described as the best swordsman of the era
4. Mastered all 7 forms of lightsaber combat, the jar'kai style, and the double bladed lightsaber.
As you can see, i'm talking about a lightsaber duel in which I think Kas'im stands a VERY good chance, if not a victory.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
1. Described as the perfect warrior
Does being a perfect warrior make you invincible? No. Does this auotmatically mean you cant be beaten? No. While it is a mighty fine credential it doesnt make him better than Yoda. The same Yoda who is described as the strongest foe the dark side has ever encountered or some sh*t like that.
2. Described as possibly the greatest swordsman ever
So was Yoda. Point moot.
3. Described as the best swordsman of the era
So was Yoda. Point moot.
4. Mastered all 7 forms of lightsaber combat, the jar'kai style, and the double bladed lightsaber.
As you can see, i'm talking about a lightsaber duel in which I think Kas'im stands a VERY good chance, if not a victory.
As said before, knowing all forms doesnt ensure victory. Cin Drallig is the perfect example of this. Not saying that knowing all 7 wont help - it just doesnt make him uber like you are making it out to be.
Though that is just my two cents, posted purely because im bored.
Originally posted by Rampant ox
[B]Does being a perfect warrior make you invincible? No. Does this auotmatically mean you cant be beaten? No. While it is a mighty fine credential it doesnt make him better than Yoda. The same Yoda who is described as the strongest foe the dark side has ever encountered or some sh*t like that.
As said before, knowing all forms doesnt ensure victory. Cin Drallig is the perfect example of this. Not saying that knowing all 7 wont help - it just doesnt make him uber like you are making it out to be.
Actually there is no proof that anyone other than Kas'Im mastered all seven forms, let alone the saberstaff and jar'kai style as well.
Now Kas'im definitely has this.
'Within the first few passes Bane knew he couldn't win. Kas'Im had trained his entire life for this moment. After years of study, he'd mastered all seven forms of the lightsaber. Then he'd honed his skill for decades, perfecting every move and sequence until he had become the perfect weapon and the greatest living swordsman in the galaxy. Maybe the greatest swordsman ever. Bane was no match for him.' - Pod, Pg. 244.
Now this passage makes it pretty clear that noone had mastered the art of the saber to such a high degree like Kas'im had.
'He knocked once softly, careful not to wake the others. Before he could knock a second time, the door swung open to reveal the Twilek... The Blademaster's highly tuned reflexes had reacted to the first knock so quickly that he had already crossed the room and opened the door by the time the second rap came.' - PoD, Pg. 144.
This passage shows just how quick his reflexes really are.
'Bane hung his head and lowered his blade in an admission of defeat. The last pass he had held Kas'im off, but with each swing of his saber he and grown a microsecond slower. Fatigue was setting in. Even the force couldn't keep his muscles fresh forever, and the seemingly endless duel had finally taken too great a toll. The Blademaster, on the other hand, had lost almost none of his speed or sharpness' - PoD, Pg. 159.
This passage makes it clear that physically, Kas'im >>>>> Bane, and Bane was in very good physical condition himself, having spent most of his early life working on the gruelling mines of Apatros.
I think it's pretty safe to say that Kas'im's superior mastery of the saber and incredible physical condition would put him above Yoda.
Originally posted by jollyjim311
I did read it, and, what do you want me to say? That we've never seen Kas'Im outduel and kill anyone? That Kas'Im has only shown us a force push? He did kill a rancor, once, so, he's God on these forums now. He has one hyperbole to his name. Yoda is mentioned to be the most powerful Jedi, and judging from what we've seen from him, that seems about right. Kas'Im won't win this.
Clearly you missed him creating a force shield that was able to redirect a wave of energy that was able to collapse the entire Rakatan temple. No, Kas'im's pretty much the most powerful sith in the BoD, with the exception of Bane, he is incredible.
"Their clash transcended the personal; when new lightning blazed, it was not Palpatine burning Yoda with his hate, it was the Lord of all Sith scorching the Master of all Jedi into a smoldering huddle of clothing and green flesh. "
"It did not come from a flash of lightning or slash of energy blade, though there were these in plenty; it did not come from a flying kick or a surgically precise punch, though these were traded, too.
It came as the battle shifted from the holding office to the great Chancellor's Podium; it came as the hydraulic lift beneath the Podium raised it on its tower of durasteel a hundred meters and more, so that it became a laserpoint of battle flaring at the focus of the vast emptiness of the Senate Arena; it came as the Force and the podium's controls ripped delegation pods free of the curving walls and made of them hammers, battering rams, catapult stones crashing and crushing against each other in a rolling thunder-roar that echoed the Senate's cheers for the galaxy's new Emperor.
It came when the avatar of light resolved into the lineage of the Jedi; when the lineage of the Jedi refined into one single Jedi.
It came when Yoda found himself alone against the dark.
In that lightning-speared tornado of feet and fists and blades and bashing machines, his vision finally pierced the darkness that had clouded the Force.
Finally, he saw the truth.
This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known . . .
just-
didn't-
have it.
He'd never had it. He had lost before he started.
He had lost before he was born.
The Sith had changed. The Sith had grown, had adapted, had invested a thousand years' intensive study into every aspect of not only the Force but Jedi lore itself, in preparation for exactly this day. The Sith had remade themselves.
They had become new. "
Yoda is the most powerful Jedi up until that point. One quote that may have been Bane's unsupported opinion won't change the fact that Yoda will whoop up on a weaker version of the Sith.
Originally posted by jollyjim311
"Their clash transcended the personal; when new lightning blazed, it was not Palpatine burning Yoda with his hate, it was the Lord of all Sith scorching the Master of all Jedi into a smoldering huddle of clothing and green flesh. "
"It did not come from a flash of lightning or slash of energy blade, though there were these in plenty; it did not come from a flying kick or a surgically precise punch, though these were traded, too.
It came as the battle shifted from the holding office to the great Chancellor's Podium; it came as the hydraulic lift beneath the Podium raised it on its tower of durasteel a hundred meters and more, so that it became a laserpoint of battle flaring at the focus of the vast emptiness of the Senate Arena; it came as the Force and the podium's controls ripped delegation pods free of the curving walls and made of them hammers, battering rams, catapult stones crashing and crushing against each other in a rolling thunder-roar that echoed the Senate's cheers for the galaxy's new Emperor.
It came when the avatar of light resolved into the lineage of the Jedi; when the lineage of the Jedi refined into one single Jedi.
It came when Yoda found himself alone against the dark.
In that lightning-speared tornado of feet and fists and blades and bashing machines, his vision finally pierced the darkness that had clouded the Force.
Finally, he saw the truth.
This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the darkness had ever known . . .
just-
didn't-
have it.
He'd never had it. He had lost before he started.
He had lost before he was born.
The Sith had changed. The Sith had grown, had adapted, had invested a thousand years' intensive study into every aspect of not only the Force but Jedi lore itself, in preparation for exactly this day. The Sith had remade themselves.
They had become new. "Yoda is the most powerful Jedi up until that point. One quote that may have been Bane's unsupported opinion won't change the fact that Yoda will whoop up on a weaker version of the Sith.
Weaker version of the sith? I'm glad you bring no facts nor arguments into this debate.
Stop giving this guy hand jobs, BEATING A SITH WHO'S ONLY BEEN TRAINING FOR MONTHS IS NOT IMPRESSIVE. You guys are on this "teh more forms you know the besteset you are!" Bull shit, when its not true, look at Anakin who was quite possible the best duelist ever and all he mastered was Djem So, look at Luke who has his own custom style. Both would shit on this loser who we know about 3 things about.
And if Kas'im is teh uber 11sith why is he not the leader of the brotherhood, why does he like so many others hero worship Kaan, why is he Kaans lackey? And seriously the NSO SUCKED ASS, being the strongest in them is NOT a big feat, especially when you have people like Revan who was stated to have more Sith knowledge ALONE then the ENTIRE Korriban Archives. Big Fish Small Pond.
All I hear is this Perfect Warrior Hyperbolic bullshit, what has Kas'im really done?
Beat Bane.
Mastered 7 forms
Killed a Rancor.
And you seriously expect us to believe with that joke of a list of accomplishments he can beat YODA, give me a ****ing break. Yoda was the greatest for the darkness had EVER known, he would take a large shit on Kas'ims chest.
And if Kas'im is teh uber 11sith why is he not the leader of the brotherhood, why does he like so many others hero worship Kaan, why is he Kaans lackey?
I already defeated this point in other thread Styles, why are you still bringing it up?
The points is, the BoD didn't have the same philosophy as the other sith order, it wasn't where 'the strongest rule' (proof of this is where Quordis was the master of the Korriban academy, Kas'im was only a master, yet Kas'im would pwn Quordis), technically everyone in the BoD was equal, and Kaan naturally was a good leader due to his ability to inspire others.
Originally posted by xxXAcStylesXxx
Stop giving this guy hand jobs, BEATING A SITH WHO'S ONLY BEEN TRAINING FOR MONTHS IS NOT IMPRESSIVE. You guys are on this "teh more forms you know the besteset you are!" Bull shit, when its not true, look at Anakin who was quite possible the best duelist ever and all he mastered was Djem So, look at Luke who has his own custom style. Both would shit on this loser who we know about 3 things about.And if Kas'im is teh uber 11sith why is he not the leader of the brotherhood, why does he like so many others hero worship Kaan, why is he Kaans lackey? And seriously the NSO SUCKED ASS, being the strongest in them is NOT a big feat, especially when you have people like Revan who was stated to have more Sith knowledge ALONE then the ENTIRE Korriban Archives. Big Fish Small Pond.
All I hear is this Perfect Warrior Hyperbolic bullshit, what has Kas'im really done?
Beat Bane.
Mastered 7 forms
Killed a Rancor.
And you seriously expect us to believe with that joke of a list of accomplishments he can beat YODA, give me a ****ing break. Yoda was the greatest for the darkness had EVER known, he would take a large shit on Kas'ims chest.
Do you even understand what a hyperbole is? I guess not. Oh and I forgot, Yoda being "The strongest foe darkness has ever known" equates to him in battle with ANYBODY. Oh wait, it doesn't. See THATS hyperbole. The author clearly explains that Kas'im is the greatest of the new sith order, the perfect warrior, mastered all 7 forms of combat, while Yoda didn't do it with Jar'kai or a double blade. Stop verbally fellating Yoda just because of 1 damn quote, that's not a logical argument.
What, there's no proof that Kaan was more powerful than Kas'im. His true talents lied in influencing others, Kas'im was far more martial.
And about the quote about Yoda, it's up to interpretation whether that statement was coming directly from the omniscient narrator, or whether it was the narrator indirectly voicing Yoda.
And I really don't see what's so special about Yoda, Kas'im's most likely imo better than him with a saber, and seeing as how Kas'im was able to defend against Bane's wave of force energy, I doubt Yoda can do anything to him with the force.
There's no proof? He was the dark Lord of the Sith before HE declared them equal. Kaan was powerful and skilled, hence him, an ex-Jedi Master, taking over. The Kaan we see later, the paranoid, cringing Kaan, is not the charismatic, powerful Kaan of yesteryear, before Hoth defeated him.
And stop this 'up to interpretation,' Bullshit. It's not. It's direct, canon and approved.
Oh, and who's stronger with the Force? Yoda or Bane? Yoda can use the force to lift guns the size of houses and half a mountainside....and what's so special about Yoda? I dunno, his containing of the Dark Side, ability to take three Jedi masters at once, destroy armies...
Please, Sithari...
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Kaan>Kas'im by a considerable margin with the Force, Kaan was the strongest for a reason, after all.Oh, and for the record, that quote of Yoda's IS still canon and he's shown us far more than Kas'im.
Kas'im cannot defeat Yoda.
nobody is arguing for Kas'im in force abiities. Yoda would stomp him in those. But that little quote doesn't make him more powerful than ANYONE, it just says he's the most powerful of the lightside until Luke. So it has NO bearing on this versus fight. Yoda for once is outclassed in a saber duel.
Most powerful of the Lightside until Luke puts him above quite a few people...and I'd be amazed if Kas'im's saber abilities were on par with Yoda's, who was better than Windu and Dooku.
How does Kas'im outclass him? He doesn't. He has one duel to his name and while he's up there, he has NOT defeated armies, he has NOT outmatched three Jedi masters at once, Vaapad master included, he has NOT crushed Count Dooku in a duel...
There's nothing Kas'im can do to Yoda here
Originally posted by Lightsnake
[B]Most powerful of the Lightside until Luke puts him above quite a few people...and I'd be amazed if Kas'im's saber abilities were on par with Yoda's, who was better than Windu and Dooku.