Well what occurred to me is that none of the characters are safe on land with the exception of Elizabeth and even that is questionable.
Will can't return to land so long as Beckett is in power. He's an outlaw and has the power to give Beckett what he wants. Even if Beckett were in fact dead, there would still be the matter of, there is no Governor of Port Royale, therefore the crown would send someone else to run the town. That means, and I think it's a little bit of foreshadowing, that Will's fate is at sea. (Bootstrap says to Will: It was always in my blood to die at sea, it was not a fate that I ever wanted for you.) He also didn't want for Will to become a pirate, and look what happened.
As I've said before, Jack is not safe on land. Though he's not necessarily a pirate, he is condemed to be treated as one because he was branded a pirate by Beckett so many years ago.
Elizabeth on the other hand, has the potential to live on land, and that mainly has to do with her persona of the Governor's daughter. I firmly believe that just as Jack's over all persona is in fact his method of survival in the Pirate world, that Elizabeth's governor's daughter persona is in fact a facade. (Notice that she speaks in a higher, more delicate voice when she is in Port Royal. Also, what I've noticed is that she is more than willing to solve Norrington's problem with a sword in the Tortuge bar scene, but when vestiges of her old life appear (Will and Norrington) she implores them to use the not so pirate-like act of diplomacy.) (Watch the chest sequence again 🙂 )
She is a pirate to the core. However, her stature as Governor's daughter allows her to navigate both worlds safely. Beckett is the only person who could jeporadize that. Elizabeth's unique understanding of the pirate world, and her facade as the genteel Governor's daughter puts her in the position, possibly, to claim her father's vacant seat. Elizabeth owes Jack a debt of gratitude for going to his death essentially for her. He sacrificed his freedom for her, she would have to do something similar for him in order for them to be square. Though she wants to be a pirate, I can see her giving that up to take a seat as a Governor who can protect the remaining pirate world.
So where does that put J/E. It's hard to say at the moment.
Oh, I have to take issue with Norrington abandoning his morals 'easily'. Think about what the man went through in a time period of what was a year or less...the man didn't just drop his morals because he hit a little rough spot...
His whole world was turned upside down by Jack Sparrow's entrance (and exit). He put everything he had on the line for certain people and it ultimately backfired on him; he lost his ship, his fiance, his prisoner, his men...all in a week...then after that, he lost more men, his ship and his comission (Ted said that he likes to believe that Norrington did indeed resign, instead of getting kicked out of the Navy).
The only thing Norrington had left was his tattered life and his honor. When the opportunity came to maybe make something of his life, he took it, because he felt he had no options left.
And I'm not sure Will 'easily' abandoned his morals either. He LOVES Elizabeth. Not just a little, not as a passing fancy, but he loves her enough to die for her. He would do ANYTHING for her, and that's not an easy choice to make.
I suspect that of Norrington survives the third film, he will be the key to how everyone lives at the end of the movie. I suspect that he would pardon Jack, or maybe give him letters of Marque....he'd pardon Will and Elizabeth for sure. I suspect that he will be the one to take up being governor, or the head of EITC.
Not sure how that will all play out, but I think that would be the most logical of ways to tidy up the loose ends. 😄
Originally posted by Chiki Mina
u got some imagination surreal lol. Norrie has nothing to do in granting pardon lol only Bucket head can. And Jack is the one who has the letters by the way.
Scratch that I remeber that Norrington signed his name in the letters and gave it to beckett. Its been a while since I saw the movie. So I was wrong. BUt I dont think norrington is the key lol
Actually, Norrington does sacrifice all that made him good an honorable, especially in the leaked script. Elizabeth makes a comment about all that he gave up. I'm not saying that it wasn't the logical choice, or that he's wrong to do it. But he sacrificed all that was noble about him when he chose to work for Beckett to regain his "honor".
It wasn't Jack that caused his misery though. It was the fact that he loved a woman that who did not return that same affection. If you look at the sword fighting scene, Jack does essentially tell the truth and name why it is the three of them are actually fighting.
While we're on the subject, someone once said that essentially, Elizabeth is of the same importance of the eyes of Norrington, Will and Governor Swann as the Black Pearl once was to Jack; freedom.
I think that's something important to look at because the Pearl or what he was willing to do to achieve the Pearl led Jack down a very dark path that caused him problems later in his life.
Terry said something about how Jack was willing to sacrifice his soul to the devil to achieve this ideal of Freedom that he had in his head, but later discovered that sacrificing his soul for a ship meant only death or eventual loss of identity.
So, look at what we have going on with Norrington, Will and Governor Swann. Elizabeth's father dies to protect her. Norrington's fate is questionable, but if you look at the route his life took after she essentially used him, he does indeed sacrifice all that made him good in CotBP (allowing Jack a one day's head start, releasing Elizabeth from their engagement with honor and dignity). When I say Norrington's morals, I'm talking about those morals, not the ones that he believes to be important.
Now to Will. Like it or not, Will is prepared to murder Jack for what he believes to be Jack's role in their estrangement. He goes to great lengths to seek vengance against Jack and regain Elizabeth. What seems strange to me, is that in the leaked script his focus is not so much regaining the love he seems to have lost from her, but on removing the threat that Jack seems to pose to their relationship.
I'm not saying that Will doesn't have the right to be angry. And really, it's a safe assumption, given Jack's behavior with women, to assume that he was the perpertrator. All I'm saying is that his anger is directed in such a way that it's detrimental to the man he once was.
And I still say that Norrington and Will share more similarities than differences.
Chiki: I was saying that in the third movie, Norrington might be able to help the others out. Not in the second movie.
If Beckett is out of the picture (and I assume he will be, given that he's all ~EVIL~ and stuff), then Norrington might very well be the one left in power. Therefore, Norrington might be able to give the others pardons. Savvy?
SavvySparrow:
So, look at what we have going on with Norrington, Will and Governor Swann. Elizabeth's father dies to protect her. Norrington's fate is questionable, but if you look at the route his life took after she essentially used him, he does indeed sacrifice all that made him good in CotBP (allowing Jack a one day's head start, releasing Elizabeth from their engagement with honor and dignity). When I say Norrington's morals, I'm talking about those morals, not the ones that he believes to be important.
Oh, I never argued about the nosedive his life took. I'm just stating that it's more than just him giving up after a slightly tough time. The man lost everything, and he thinks (wrongly) that the way to regain what his honor was is to work for Beckett.
I have a feeling he will come to understand that he made a bad deal...just like Jack did. So then we'll see how he develops after all that. And I think Norrington IS seeking back his honor and dignity. He thinks that by working for Beckett a 'good man', then he will be able to make up for the deaths of his men and the loss of his ships. He's hit bottom and is seeking any way to get out of the pit.
Whoops, posted before I was finished. 😄
Now to Will. Like it or not, Will is prepared to murder Jack for what he believes to be Jack's role in their estrangement. He goes to great lengths to seek vengance against Jack and regain Elizabeth. What seems strange to me, is that in the leaked script his focus is not so much regaining the love he seems to have lost from her, but on removing the threat that Jack seems to pose to their relationship.I'm not saying that Will doesn't have the right to be angry. And really, it's a safe assumption, given Jack's behavior with women, to assume that he was the perpertrator. All I'm saying is that his anger is directed in such a way that it's detrimental to the man he once was.
Oh yes. Will is definitely getting darker, and I am not arguing the facts about his character development. I just want to point out that Will is not entirely in the wrong here. Jack did pursue an engaged woman.
Will had trusted him somewhat...I think that he would have been willing to forgive getting ditched on the Flying Dutchman, but when you add that Jack was romancing and kissing his fiance, it not only angered Willl, I think it really hurt him too.
I'm not talking about just Liz hurting him, by the way. I think the betrayal from BOTH of Jack and Elizabeth really pushes Will over the edge.
Oh, and I have no doubts that Norrington are very, very alike. I believe that out of all the characters, they have the most in common, though they'd probably rather die than admit it!! 😆
I have to take issue with Jack "pursuing" an engaged woman. It is Liz that initiates the flirting nearly every time. I really do think the "dress or nothing" quote was more light-hearted than serious. Every other time, Liz was the one who turned their conversations into flirtations.
Note the curiosity scene: Yeah, Jack is suggesting they marry and you could even argue he's going so far as proposing to her, but come on! He's not being completely serious, and they're not really talking about marriage. They're talking about intimacy. So when Liz stands up and Jack starts noting how alike they are, he's really not seducing her. He's not as close to her as she moves to him when it's her turn to talk about curiosity. He doesn't use such suggestive language as "what it tastes like" as she does.
Even earlier in "persuasion," Jack is more amused and probably admiring her all the more for getting the letters, and he does playfully say "persuade me," but who ups the ante? Liz! "You do know Will taught me how to handle a sword?" What the hell? She bites, so Jack bites back.
That even happens in the kiss. Jack's hands aren't busy, he's not dominating.
So I don't know if you can call it going after an engaged woman. There is no doubt in my mind feelings are there, but Liz is the one making the efforts to push the relationship forward, not him. And allow me to quote Michael from "The Office."
"Engaged ain't married."
Sorry surreal, I also have to take umbridge with the idea that Jack pursued an engaged woman. Every interaction of any salt between them is marked by Elizabeth's openly pursuing it while Jack essentially is trying his best, after all he's only human, and he is Jack, to resist said temptation.
Also, might I point out that his compass was spinning towards Elizabeth and also away Elizabeth, meaning that though there was this interest, he did quintessentially do his part to stay away at the beginning of the movie.
Ha, and you're right about Will and Norringinton dying before they'd admit the similarity. Actually, that's what makes the sword fighting scene between them so ironic.
I'm not arguing that Will doesn't have the right to be angry with Jack, which that he focuses the anger there in and of itself is interesting, but I am saying that it seems that his mind is more focused on murder than on winning Elizabeth back, which I find.....telling. Granted it may just be based on his assumption that she's in love with Jack, but on the other hand, why then, if he's already lost the battle, would he want to conclude the war with murder? What good would murdering Jack do if Elizabeth is in love with him? Other than it might make him feel better. One could argue that he wants to take his revenge against Elizabeth by taking away what she may or may not want most or he may in fact understand in his soul that their relationship is over. That act would certainly do nothing to bring them together
You see how the actions are shady and contradictory? Hopefully that's a little clearer in the actual movie than it is in the script.
Don't ask me why. Maybe it's because I think that the outcome of the couple ships will have less to do with Jack or Elizabeth's decisions, and more to do with Will's.
It's all so difficult to put the puzzle pieces together, isn't it?