Abraxis Wins.
1) The Blast from Micheal's demise was ONLY Universal on scale, multiversal AT MOST....but NOT fkn Omniversal, so please.
2) Ultamate Nullifier is still greater as it has the capacity to wipe out a Multiverse, which was necessary for Abraxis's destruction.
3) It has already been established that Galactus at FULL POWER can destroy a Universe....guess what. Abraxis murdered multiple Galactus's throughout the 616 Multiverse. 😱
4) Abraxis took out Roma.....overseer and protector of the Multiverse.
5) Multi Eternity, the embodyment of the multiverse, a being who consists of such cosmic mass, that "big bangs" are like popped zits to his being, was TERRIFIED of Abraxis.
6) The Greatest Feats that LUCIFER has ever performed were: Creating a Universe, Surviving a Big Bang explosion, and Defeating two idiotic / simple minded titans who took Yahweh's power.
That does not compare to Abraxis' feats of murdering countless Galactus's, defeating Roma, terrifying Multi-Eternity, etc.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Continues...Here ya go:
"It will be a WEAPON of UNIMAGINABLE POWER that will WIN this DAY"
The Cosmics were obviously hiding in a corner somewhere.
Abraxas is the MULTI-VERSAL embodiment of Destruction, ONLY the UN could stop him as Roma pointed out, as the story proved.
Off Panel, On Panel, they were murdered one way or another,
and Abraxas does not use weapons or energy sources, so it was with his own power.
EVERY Reed Richards in the Multi-verse simultaneously, which equals to an Infinite number of Alternate Reed Richards since the Multi-verse is Infinite.
Eternity, actually MULTI-ETERNITY was terrified, and had to summon Reed Richards and Dr Druid to get help against Abraxas:
"and where ONE ETERNITY would ensure a BOUNDLESS Universe, a MULTI-ETERNITY would ensure a BOUNDLESS MULTI-VERSE"
"What was revealed to me through the Cosmic Entity known as ETERNITY (MULTI-VERSE)
"Was a Being like NO OTHER I have EVER encountered, his name is ABRAXAS, and to say HE (MULTI-ETERNITY) had nothing to FEAR in our discovery is an UNDERSTATEMENT"
Evidently you do.
abraxas is a monsta nice job mm
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
[b]Abraxis Wins.1) The Blast from Micheal's demise was ONLY Universal on scale, multiversal AT MOST....but NOT fkn Omniversal, so please.
2) Ultamate Nullifier is still greater as it has the capacity to wipe out a Multiverse, which was necessary for Abraxis's destruction.
3) It has already been established that Galactus at FULL POWER can destroy a Universe....guess what. Abraxis murdered multiple Galactus's throughout the 616 Multiverse. 😱
4) Abraxis took out Roma.....overseer and protector of the Multiverse.
5) Multi Eternity, the embodyment of the multiverse, a being who consists of such cosmic mass, that "big bangs" are like popped zits to his being, was TERRIFIED of Abraxis.
6) The Greatest Feats that LUCIFER has ever performed were: Creating a Universe, Surviving a Big Bang explosion, and Defeating two idiotic / simple minded titans who took Yahweh's power.
That does not compare to Abraxis' feats of murdering countless Galactus's, defeating Roma, terrifying Multi-Eternity, etc. [/B]
and 1. Implies that Lucifer Resisted a blast that was Multiversal in scale, enough to create (Or Destroy) a Multi-verse. Why, that's just what got rid of Abraxes, isn't it.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
[b]Abraxis Wins.1) The Blast from Micheal's demise was ONLY Universal on scale, multiversal AT MOST....but NOT fkn Omniversal, so please.
2) Ultamate Nullifier is still greater as it has the capacity to wipe out a Multiverse, which was necessary for Abraxis's destruction.
3) It has already been established that Galactus at FULL POWER can destroy a Universe....guess what. Abraxis murdered multiple Galactus's throughout the 616 Multiverse. 😱
4) Abraxis took out Roma.....overseer and protector of the Multiverse.
5) Multi Eternity, the embodyment of the multiverse, a being who consists of such cosmic mass, that "big bangs" are like popped zits to his being, was TERRIFIED of Abraxis.
6) The Greatest Feats that LUCIFER has ever performed were: Creating a Universe, Surviving a Big Bang explosion, and Defeating two idiotic / simple minded titans who took Yahweh's power.
That does not compare to Abraxis' feats of murdering countless Galactus's, defeating Roma, terrifying Multi-Eternity, etc. [/B]
He actually has more feats then that 🙄 .. Killing gods when he's POWERLESS! Making another Creation just like Gods, something we have never seen anyone in Marvel do. Killing Fenris the immortal god of destruction (Fenris was watching Lucifer for BILLIONS OF YEARS and still lost lol). Can destroy everyone in hell. Cared nothing for the triumvirate and closed hell down without asking them.. 😱
Abraxas seems to be the Imperiex of the MU. I'll ask again, would Abraxas or hell even LT be able to beat any gods in Marvel powerless? Lucifer still wins
Originally posted by kevdude
He actually has more feats then that Killing gods when he's POWERLESS!
Doesn't that actually mean that he wasn't powerless?
Originally posted by kevdude
Making another Creation just like Gods, something we have never seen anyone in Marvel do.
Wasn't it just a Universe he created?
How is that the same as making another DC Reality?
Originally posted by kevdude
something we have never seen anyone in Marvel do.
Well Marvel happens to be rediculously bigger than DC though.
And the UN alone created the 616 MULTI-VERSE from scratch.
And pre-retcon Beyonder created a Universe bigger than the original Multi-verse (which was ALL of MARVEL at the time)
Originally posted by kevdude
Killing Fenris the immortal god of destruction (Fenris was watching Lucifer for BILLIONS OF YEARS and still lost lol). Can destroy everyone in hell. Cared nothing for the triumvirate and closed hell down without asking them..
ALL the gods of Marvel are jokes to Abraxas.
Originally posted by kevdude
Abraxas seems to be the Imperiex of the MU.
😆
Originally posted by kevdude
I'll ask again, would Abraxas or hell even LT be able to beat any gods in Marvel powerless?
Again, this doesn't make any sense
Originally posted by kevdude
Lucifer still wins
I think not.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Doesn't that actually mean that he wasn't powerless?Wasn't it just a Universe he created?
How is that the same as making another DC Reality?
Well Marvel happens to be rediculously bigger than DC though.
And the UN alone created the 616 MULTI-VERSE from scratch.
And pre-retcon Beyonder created a Universe bigger than the original Multi-verse (which was ALL of MARVEL at the time)
ALL the gods of Marvel are jokes to Abraxas.
😆
Again, this doesn't make any sense
I think not.
1. Went into Mansions of Silence as just a mortal and killed everyone there.
2. The DC Multiverse is separate from the rest of the Universe but still a part of it understand?
3. All of the Gods in DC are a joke to Lucifer as well 😱 .
4. If Abraxas or LT was a mere MORTAL in another gods realm and beat them yes I would put them at Lucifer level, but they have never done this. 😉
Originally posted by kevdude
1. Went into Mansions of Silence as just a mortal and killed everyone there.
So was he powerless or not?
At first you claimed he was powerless, now it was that he became Mortal,
I guess you figured that just didn't sound right.
Originally posted by kevdude
2. The DC Multiverse is separate from the rest of the Universe but still a part of it understand?
I understand,
I also understand as I've just been informed that it was a SINGLE UNIVERSE indeed that Luc created, not another Creation like yahweh's as you first said.
Creating a Universe is nothing to Abraxas, who had an ENTIRE MULTI-VERSE panicking over the survival of it's existence.
Originally posted by kevdude
3. All of the Gods in DC are a joke to Lucifer as well
It was you that brought up measly gods into this picture. 😱
Originally posted by kevdude
4. If Abraxas or LT was a mere MORTAL in another gods realm and beat them yes I would put them at Lucifer level, but they have never done this.
Again, this doesn't make ANY sense.
I'm sorry if Abraxas and LT are not Mortals, and Luc can become one and kick meaningless gods around.
How does this help him, I don't understand.
Has anyone read a comic book written before 2001?
The entire Vertigo IMPRINT is simply an imprint for over 18 readership. Some of the Vertigo stuff is canon to the DCU some is not.
It is safe to say that anything in a Vertigo title whose characters spun out of a regular DC title is canon.
For instance, John Constantine's first appearance was as part of a Swamp Thing crossever with Batman, back when Swamp Thing was a DC non Vertigo book. Swamp Thing jumped to Vertigo in mid stream in his 3rd or 4th series.
Vertigo Death, you know the hot chick, is officially canonically the Death for the entire DCU. Neil Gaiman has written that over and over again. In fact Gaiman has the Endless as serving their purposes for the entire DCU. IIRC Morpheus has crossed over with the JLA and Batman.
There is only one Phantom Stranger, the same one who appears in Vertigo titles is the one who appears in Shadowpact for example.
Now as to Lucifer...
the only thing that Lucifer cannot do is create something from nothing. That is the Demiurgic power, which was only given to his brother Michael.
Michael on the other hand is not a reality crafter in Lucifer's power level.
Lucifer can for instance wipe out a Creation (the DCU is referred to as the second Creation of Yahweh) and use that energy to create another universe in the Void. Lucifer accidently destroys some Creations or purposely, who knows during his series.
The Spectre cannot even harm Lucifer or Michael. Yahweh created both of them so powerful than only Yahweh and his aspects are more powerful
The Presence is the aspect of Yahweh that appears inside various Creations and on the throne of the former Heaven.
Another famous aspect of Yahweh is the GEB.
The entire IC event coincided with the deliberate absence of Yahweh from the DCU, as he was trying to pass it to Lucifer. The reining in of the Spectre coincided almost to the month with Elaine taking on the role of the Presence.
If the fullpowered Spectre is about equal to the LT, and the LT is greater than Abraxus (I say yes), then Lucifer houses Abraxus.
Mr. Master I don't see how you can't understand this. Mortal and Powerless is, having no powers at ALL. Its the same thing.. And Lucifer did indeed create another Creation/Universe. The Multiverse is a part of the Universe cut off.. Lucifer cares nothing for the Multiverse.
And imagine if Abraxas was without his powers and in the realm of Asgard fighting Odin? Who would win? Is it that hard to comprehend? 😉
Really should read more Lucifer comics.
Originally posted by kevdude
Mr. Master I don't see how you can't understand this. Mortal and Powerless is, having no powers at ALL. Its the same thing..
WRONG Magneto is mortal, but is powerful as hell. Superman is mortal but is as powerful as hell. Goku is mortal but is as powerful as hell.
Lucifer was mortal, but NOT powerless.
Originally posted by King Kandy
3. Is illogical, because NONE of the Galactus's that Abraxes killed where Full-Power. They were all just Well-Fed.and 1. Implies that Lucifer Resisted a blast that was Multiversal in scale, enough to create (Or Destroy) a Multi-verse. Why, that's just what got rid of Abraxes, isn't it.
1) Prove to me that all the Galactus' were not at full power.
2) Ultmate Nullifer is not just a "blast" like Micheal's big bang is. The Ultamate Nullifier ERASES the multiverse with ease. Abraxas was not blown up...he was ERASED by the UN.
It's not the same deal.
3) There is no proof that Micheal's big bang was multiversal. It was most likely universal, since the Lucifer series only deals on a universal scale.
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
[b]WRONG Magneto is mortal, but is powerful as hell. Superman is mortal but is as powerful as hell. Goku is mortal but is as powerful as hell.Lucifer was mortal, but NOT powerless. [/B]
Actually I was thinking of when Lucifer went to the Japanese Gods realm and beat Izanami when he was powerless and mortal! During the Mansions of Silence event, he killed an untold number just by being in the there realm then killed Tsuki-Yomi.
And the fact that Michaels big bang helped create ANOTHER Creation, something that the Multiverse is a part of. Yah it couldn't destroy the multiverse 😂
Originally posted by Mr MasterI was under the impression that the main reason Reed needed to destroy/recreate the Multiverse was because he needed to fix what Abraxas has done to it, not necessarily because this was the only way to banish Abraxas.
And the big daddy is,ONLY the Ultimate Nullifier was able to banish Abraxas.
So UNLESS Lucifer can ERASE and RECREATE a Multi-verse in an instant...
If you could shed some light, that would be great.
Originally posted by kevdude
Actually I was thinking of when Lucifer went to the Japanese Gods realm and beat Izanami when he was powerless and mortal! During the Mansions of Silence event, he killed an untold number just by being in the there realm then killed Tsuki-Yomi.And the fact that Michaels big bang helped create ANOTHER Creation, something that the Multiverse is a part of. Yah it couldn't destroy the multiverse 😂
Originally posted by kevdude
Mr. Master I don't see how you can't understand this. Mortal and Powerless is, having no powers at ALL. Its the same thing..
There are countless beings that are Mortal and are still extremely Powerful.
What doesn't make sense about your statement is that a Powerless being, still can be Powerful, that's sort of an oxymoron.
I think your confusing the two.
He might of been Mortal, (for whatever reason) but like MANY others he was still Powerful.
Originally posted by kevdude
And Lucifer did indeed create another Creation/Universe. The Multiverse is a part of the Universe cut off.. Lucifer cares nothing for the Multiverse.
Whether he cares about the Multi-verse or not is inconsequential.
My point was he did NOT create another Creation like the DC Reality, he created a SINGLE Universe.
Originally posted by kevdude
And imagine if Abraxas was without his powers and in the realm of Asgard fighting Odin? Who would win?
It would be the same outcome for Luc,
by the very definition, Powerless means, ..... well..... Powerless.
Originally posted by kevdude
Is it that hard to comprehend?
The way your phrasing it?
Yes.
Originally posted by kevdude
Really should read more Lucifer comics.
As you should read more Marvel.
Originally posted by Galan007
I was under the impression that the main reason Reed needed to destroy/recreate the Multiverse was because he needed to fix what Abraxas has done to it, not necessarily because this was the only way to banish Abraxas.If you could shed some light, that would be great.
Both,
the ONLY way to Banish Abraxas was to Erase and Create a NEW Multi-verse in which Abraxas never manifested in.
Here Roma says it:
"It will be a WEAPON of UNIMAGINABLE POWER that will WIN this DAY"
Here Galactus says it, and Reed realizes this truth:
"But THIS Time, THIS Day can END ONLY ONE WAY"
Reed says, "Yes.... God help me, I can see that now"
Here when Reed uses the UN, Abaxas and Reed say to each other:
Abraxas says, "Put it down Richards, you have no idea"
Reed says, "Actually Abraxas I do, You NEVER INTENDED to FIRE the Nullifier for the very same Reason I MUST"
So you see, it's quite clear that Abraxas himself KNEW, the ONLY possible way to get rid of him, (even if he used it himself), was with the Ultimate Nullifier.
Originally posted by kevdude
Actually I was thinking of when Lucifer went to the Japanese Gods realm and beat Izanami when he was powerless and mortal! During the Mansions of Silence event, he killed an untold number just by being in the there realm then killed Tsuki-Yomi.
He was NOT powerless....only mortal. HE still had the power to kill them. If he didn't have the power to do so, then it would have not happened.
Originally posted by kevdude
And the fact that Michaels big bang helped create ANOTHER Creation, something that the Multiverse is a part of. Yah it couldn't destroy the multiverse 😂
Show me the scan where Micheal's big bang helped created another multiverse, and NOT another Universe. The term multiverse has not been used in the Lucifer series in regard to Yahweh's creation, only UNIVERSE has...
Originally posted by Mr MasterActually, Multi-Eternity was never scared.
And Abraxas scared Multi-Eternity 616, the most powerful Multi-verse in Marvel, so much so he didn't even dare try and stop Abraxas.
Originally posted by Mr MasterThat he is powerful enough to exists out of God's presence!
Nice,but I don't see how that's going to help him.
Originally posted by Mr MasterHe doesn't care about lower demons.
This will not help him either.
Originally posted by Mr MasterNo, he didn't.
Nice,Abraxas had an Infinite amount of Universes shivering in their Cosmic pants.
Originally posted by Mr MasterOK, I was wrong, just read the Abraxas arc. He destroys all of them.
No problem, I'll prove it.UN Destroys the Multiverse:
UN Remakes the Multiverse in an instant:
IS the Ultimate Nullifier capable of such a FEAT?
"Should Abraxas reach the NULLIFIER, He CAN OBLITERATE ALL the COMBINED REALITIES of the MULTI-VERSE"
Indeed it is.
About the Abraxas getting the UN, maybe it is because he can just transverse to different Universes and destroy them. Maybe it isn't talking about the whole multiverse, just that Abraxas can destroy them seperately.
I'm not arguing about him destroying it now, but that scan is irrelevent.
He teleported to Roma's, there is no solid evidence depending on that scan, one way or the other.
Originally posted by Mr MasterThis means...
Continues...Here ya go:
"It will be a WEAPON of UNIMAGINABLE POWER that will WIN this DAY"
Did it say that only the UN could defeat him, or did it say an unimaginable weapon could win? It could be talking about any extremely powerful weapon.
Originally posted by Mr MasterNo, an UNIMAGINABLE WEAPON COULD.
The Cosmics were obviously hiding in a corner somewhere.Abraxas is the MULTI-VERSAL embodiment of Destruction, ONLY the UN could stop him as Roma pointed out, as the story proved.
Originally posted by Mr MasterYa, how do you know, he just didn't kick them in the nuts or something?
Off Panel, On Panel, they were murdered one way or another,and Abraxas does not use weapons or energy sources, so it was with his own power.
Originally posted by Mr MasterYa I know.
EVERY Reed Richards in the Multi-verse simultaneously, which equals to an Infinite number of Alternate Reed Richards since the Multi-verse is Infinite.
Originally posted by Mr MasterYa, I know, but they only traveled through Multi-Eternity to see Abraxas.
Eternity, actually MULTI-ETERNITY was terrified, and had to summon Reed Richards and Dr Druid to get help against Abraxas:"and where ONE ETERNITY would ensure a BOUNDLESS Universe, a MULTI-ETERNITY would ensure a BOUNDLESS MULTI-VERSE"
Originally posted by Mr MasterWait, think about this one.
"What was revealed to me through the Cosmic Entity known as ETERNITY (MULTI-VERSE)"Was a Being like NO OTHER I have EVER encountered, his name is ABRAXAS, and to say HE (MULTI-ETERNITY) had nothing to FEAR in our discovery is an UNDERSTATEMENT"
No, it's Abraxas that is scared of the discovery.
Either that, or something is wrong here...
Originally posted by Mr MasterNo, what else is going to destroy him? There was no weapon other than the UN that was powerful enough to take him out. That does NOT mean that only the UN can take him out.
Evidently you do.
Do you think that LT couldn't wipe his ass out?
Also, what does Abraxas getting his ass kicked by the UN have to do with him beating Lucifer?
