Originally posted by King Kandy
Ah, but that was mindless Drax. This Drax is smarter and has more tactical finese.
And just what is all his tactical finese going to do against a being who can move so fast that he can actually travel billions of universes in second or slip between dimensions or the time stream?
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Then why would thanos need the rest? you do realize that thanos powes amplified to universal lvls would be all he needs to take over. no, the gems magnify each other.
Space gem: Matter
Time Gem: Time
Reality Gem: Physics
Mind Gem: Mind
Soul Gem: soul
Power Gem: Energy.
They all have unique powers.
Originally posted by King Kandy
No, you misunderstand.The other five dems get extra powers because the Power gem amps them.
But the poweer gem itself isn't amped.
Originally posted by King Kandy
The power gem control energy.Space gem: Matter
Time Gem: Time
Reality Gem: Physics
Mind Gem: Mind
Soul Gem: soul
Power Gem: Energy.They all have unique powers.
I know. and the way you put the power gem, you make it seem as if all one such as thanos has to do its tap the pg's power and he could rule. Not so. the gems have to be used in conjunction in order to tap thier full potential.
I don't remember such limitations ever being built into the Infinity Gems. Surely, possession of the other gems does help. But not having the other gems does not stop a person with the Power Gem amping his strength to above PC Superman strength and killing him with one punch. Or from shielding himself with a limitlessly powerful impenetrable shield. Likewise, there is nothing stopping a sole Power Gem wielder from simply emitting a beam of energy so potent as to render PC Supes to ashes.
Each one in their own right, grants the user separate mastery over each facet. You don't need the Power Gem to be able to use the Mind Gem to beat Professor X. A sufficiently competent person could simply harness the Mind Gem to make his mind impenetrable from Prof X's psi attacks. He doesn't have to use the Power Gem in conjunction with it to do so. Same thing for the others.
Limitations are only present when the use of each individual gem has to overlap with another gem's area. Therefore, my Power gem's super pwnerz blast isn't going to do anything to a person's astral form. That's my take on it, and I think the Infinity Gauntlet and the precedign Thanos Quest makes that sufficiently clear.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I don't remember such limitations ever being built into the Infinity Gems. Surely, possession of the other gems does help. But not having the other gems does not stop a person with the Power Gem amping his strength to above PC Superman strength and killing him with one punch. Or from shielding himself with a limitlessly powerful impenetrable shield. Likewise, there is nothing stopping a sole Power Gem wielder from simply emitting a beam of energy so potent as to render PC Supes to ashes.Each one in their own right, grants the user separate mastery over each facet. You don't need the Power Gem to be able to use the Mind Gem to beat Professor X. A sufficiently competent person could simply harness the Mind Gem to make his mind impenetrable from Prof X's psi attacks. He doesn't have to use the Power Gem in conjunction with it to do so. Same thing for the others.
Limitations are only present when the use of each individual gem has to overlap with another gem's area. Therefore, my Power gem's super pwnerz blast isn't going to do anything to a person's astral form. That's my take on it, and I think the Infinity Gauntlet and the precedign Thanos Quest makes that sufficiently clear.
(And for the record, the limits of the gems out of union was demonstrated by Warlock, when he admitted that the souls of beings like Galactus, Eternity, and Infinity were beyond his power. If he had the entire gauntlet though, THEN he would actually have FULL mastery of all souls, and would be able to affect even those three.).
Originally posted by golem370
The dumbazz people who said Superman in any form could sneeze a galaxy away.most be the same people who made Beyonder more powerful then LT also most be the people that said Mr M is Multiversal but yet Superman beats him all the time.If Superman was so beyond anything back then why was he even worrying about Hulk.
You cannot win against Superman fanboys. I am telling you. I have followed the majority of threads that involves Superman and startling enough, would you believe that 95% of those threads have Superman winning every fight? I mean its that problematic in this forum, the fanboyism
Originally posted by darthgoober
Yes but NO ONE has EVER used a gem to it's fullest potential without the other gems. Anyone who actually had full mastery of any individual gem, would be almost unbeatable.(And for the record, the limits of the gems out of union was demonstrated by Warlock, when he admitted that the souls of beings like Galactus, Eternity, and Infinity were beyond his power. If he had the entire gauntlet though, THEN he would actually have FULL mastery of all souls, and would be able to affect even those three.).
Adam Warlock has complete mastery over the soul gem. As a matter of fact, that's the reason why he could contain himself when he acquired the IG. Furthermore Thanos was in control of the gems and was learning how to master them very rapidly. Its his subconcsious that lead him to defeat
Originally posted by darthgooberI don't believe that full mastery over the Soul Gem would permit mastery over Galactus', Eternity's or LT's souls. Their roles in the cosmic consonance do not permit their characters' essence to be reduced to a mere soul. The essence of Captain America and Thanos may be reduced to the idea and manifestation of a soul, but Eternity's essence is space, time and reality as we know it. Galactus' essence is existence's balance. And LT is a step above that. Perhaps the soul of Galan might be susceptible to the Soul Gem's influence, but the soul of Galan is not the very essence of Galactus, he's much more than that. You mess with the essence of either of those big three, you're messing with much more than just a soul, you're messing with reality, time and space.
Yes but NO ONE has EVER used a gem to it's fullest potential without the other gems. Anyone who actually had full mastery of any individual gem, would be almost unbeatable.(And for the record, the limits of the gems out of union was demonstrated by Warlock, when he admitted that the souls of beings like Galactus, Eternity, and Infinity were beyond his power. If he had the entire gauntlet though, THEN he would actually have FULL mastery of all souls, and would be able to affect even those three.).
And really... for the record, whenever the Infinity Gems are introduced, each one permits the user full mastery over their own respective aspect. It's like the disclaimer to the darn trinkets. Power Gem permits mastery over power, plain and simple. Do you have mastery over another person's soul? Or mind? No. But pure power? Hell yes, you've got it in spades. The IG is so potent because you've got mastery over everything. And just because people haven't used single gems in such fashions, most are either restraining themselves (like Infinity Watch members), or unaware of the gem's nature (dumb Drax and Champion).
You say that if I had full mastery over power, that I'd be unstoppable? Yeah right, all someone would have to do is teleport my gem away from me and I'd be screwed. Spatial teleportation, just another way of saying space manipulation. If I had full mastery over the mind, sure I could shut down the minds of every being in the universe, but if I tripped over a stone and cracked my head open, I'd be sh1t out of luck. I'm not sure why you think complete mastery over any single aspect leads to absolute omnipotence. It doesn't. And since it doesn't, your objection to each gem's mastery over each aspect has no real basis for consternation. What I'm saying is not that hard to reconcile.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I don't believe that full mastery over the Soul Gem would permit mastery over Galactus', Eternity's or LT's souls. Their roles in the cosmic consonance do not permit their characters' essence to be reduced to a mere soul. The essence of Captain America and Thanos may be reduced to the idea and manifestation of a soul, but Eternity's essence is space, time and reality as we know it. Galactus' essence is existence's balance. And LT is a step above that. Perhaps the soul of Galan might be susceptible to the Soul Gem's influence, but the soul of Galan is not the very essence of Galactus, he's much more than that. You mess with the essence of either of those big three, you're messing with much more than just a soul, you're messing with reality, time and space.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0 And really... for the record, whenever the Infinity Gems are introduced, each one permits the user full mastery over their own respective aspect. It's like the disclaimer to the darn trinkets. Power Gem permits mastery over power, plain and simple. Do you have mastery over another person's soul? Or mind? No. But pure power? Hell yes, you've got it in spades. The IG is so potent because you've got mastery over everything. And just because people haven't used single gems in such fashions, most are either restraining themselves (like Infinity Watch members), or unaware of the gem's nature (dumb Drax and Champion).
Originally posted by OneDumbG0 You say that if I had full mastery over power, that I'd be unstoppable? Yeah right, all someone would have to do is teleport my gem away from me and I'd be screwed. Spatial teleportation, just another way of saying space manipulation. If I had full mastery over the mind, sure I could shut down the minds of every being in the universe, but if I tripped over a stone and cracked my head open, I'd be sh1t out of luck. I'm not sure why you think complete mastery over any single aspect leads to absolute omnipotence. It doesn't. And since it doesn't, your objection to each gem's mastery over each aspect has no real basis for consternation. What I'm saying is not that hard to reconcile.
Originally posted by darthgooberAre you fugging kidding me? The scan itself says that Galactus has no soul. That completely proves my entire point. What are we arguing about? Just think about it for god sakes. Just assume for the moment, that what I say is correct: the Mind Gem gives complete mastery over one's own mind and everybody's else's mind. A robot comes over with preprogrammed instructions to shoot a gun at me. Would my complete mastery over teh Mind mean a rat fart against this mindless robot? NO. So how is the exact same analogy COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY not proven in your scan?! I just told you that Galactus' essence cannot be reduced to a mere soul. Galactus' essence is more than a soul. The frigging scan confirms my blasted opinion! What in the world are you pointing out other than your own utter wrongness?
Read this scan. They have souls but they are BEYOND the power of the gem. That's because NO ONE can utilize the gems to their fullest potential without the other gems present. I challenge you to find ONE example of ANY gem being used to it's fullest potential without the aid of other gems.
Originally posted by darthgooberFirst of all, why would Thor hitting people while using the Power Gem automatically and unavoidably result in him hitting people with unlimited power? What basis gives you such an assumption? Why are you assuming that if he had it, and used it, he MUST HAVE amped himself to unlimited wtfpwnerz power levels? Just because you have complete mastery over something does not irreducibly mean that you have to use it ub3rwtfbbqpwnerz levels. So if anybody is speculating, its you. Because somehow, you think that just because someone has complete mastery over power, every single time he hits someone, it's with unlimited power.
A bearer of the Power Gem doesn't automatically gain absolute control of all power. If that were true, Thor(who wasn't restraining himself and was aware of the gems nature) would have one shotted EVERYONE(because each shot would have been backed by INFINITE power), and would have been completely immune to every attack made against him(because all of those attacks used one form of power or another). The fact that NO ONE has displayed absolute mastery of the gem means that all you are providing is speculation on the subject.
Originally posted by darthgooberAnd if I used my handy dandy teleportation device and teleported the power gem away, what would happen? If I hypnotized you and asked you to give me the power gem, what would happen? Yes, with the Power Gem, you could one shot anybody you wanted as long as you willed yourself to the requisite power. And it'd work. As logn as he wasn't a mental projection, or he didn't just teleport himself away, or he didn't stop time at that instant, or he didn't hypnotize you...
I said that anyone with full mastery of a gem would be ALMOST unbeatable, not omnipotent. What I mean by that, is that if you had ABSOLUTE mastery of power, then you could one shot ANYONE. It would also mean that NO actual attacks(punches, blast, etc) would work against you at all, because all of them are backed by some form of power.
Originally posted by darthgooberSo how have you even started to prove that a person could not one-shot someone with the Power Gem, since it has been literally and explicitly described to give its bearer absolute mastery over power... because you don't like the idea of a nearly unbeatable person with the Power Gem? Or you've seen douschebags like Drax and Champion not use it properly? Where in your entire argumetn is an actual premise that goes towards proving that the Power Gem doesn't give you absolute mastery over Power? Because Thanos and Warlock and Magus and a sh1tload of other people have actually stated, each gem giving its bearer absolute mastery over so-and-so. Nobody, has ever stated that you needed the other Gems to fully bring out the potential of another Gem. Nowhere is it even intimated in the least. The scan you just showed me, completely proves my point. It baffles me why you can't see it either. Just roll the thought out in your head and use this simple analogy: Would complete and utter universal mastery over the Mind (over everybody's mind for that matter, including my own), mean anything if a robot was attacking me? No, it wouldn't. So if I couldn't affect the robot, does that disprove that I had complete and utter mastery over the Mind? No, it doesn't. The Warlock scan is the exact same thing, and lends credence to my position utterly. So until you show me something to negate what people like Warlock and Thanos and Magus and Galactus and Eternity have stated the gems bestow, please think about how you completely proved my own argument against you.
And the same goes for ANY of the gems. If used to their fullest potential, each of them could be used to beat just about anyone with no real fight required. So once again, if you can find a single instance of one of the gems being used to it's fullest extent, without the aid of other gems, I'll concede that your right. Cause at this point all your doing is speculating on the extent to which someone would be able to use one of the individual gems.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Are you fugging kidding me? The scan itself says that Galactus has no soul. That completely proves my entire point. What are we arguing about? Just think about it for god sakes. Just assume for the moment, that what I say is correct: the Mind Gem gives complete mastery over one's own mind and everybody's else's mind. A robot comes over with preprogrammed instructions to shoot a gun at me. Would my complete mastery over teh Mind mean a rat fart against this mindless robot? NO. So how is the exact same analogy COMPLETELY AND UTTERLY not proven in your scan?! I just told you that Galactus' essence cannot be reduced to a mere soul. Galactus' essence is more than a soul. The frigging scan confirms my blasted opinion! What in the world are you pointing out other than your own utter wrongness?
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
First of all, why would Thor hitting people while using the Power Gem automatically and unavoidably result in him hitting people with unlimited power? What basis gives you such an assumption? Why are you assuming that if he had it, and used it, he MUST HAVE amped himself to unlimited wtfpwnerz power levels? Just because you have complete mastery over something does not irreducibly mean that you have to use it ub3rwtfbbqpwnerz levels. So if anybody is speculating, its you. Because somehow, you think that just because someone has complete mastery over power, every single time he hits someone, it's with unlimited power.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
And if I used my handy dandy teleportation device and teleported the power gem away, what would happen? If I hypnotized you and asked you to give me the power gem, what would happen? Yes, with the Power Gem, you could one shot anybody you wanted as long as you willed yourself to the requisite power. And it'd work. As logn as he wasn't a mental projection, or he didn't just teleport himself away, or he didn't stop time at that instant, or he didn't hypnotize you...
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
So how have you even started to prove that a person could not one-shot someone with the Power Gem, since it has been literally and explicitly described to give its bearer absolute mastery over power... because you don't like the idea of a nearly unbeatable person with the Power Gem? Or you've seen douschebags like Drax and Champion not use it properly? Where in your entire argumetn is an actual premise that goes towards proving that the Power Gem doesn't give you absolute mastery over Power? Because Thanos and Warlock and Magus and a sh1tload of other people have actually stated, each gem giving its bearer absolute mastery over so-and-so. Nobody, has ever stated that you needed the other Gems to fully bring out the potential of another Gem. Nowhere is it even intimated in the least. The scan you just showed me, completely proves my point. It baffles me why you can't see it either. Just roll the thought out in your head and use this simple analogy: Would complete and utter universal mastery over the Mind (over everybody's mind for that matter, including my own), mean anything if a robot was attacking me? No, it wouldn't. So if I couldn't affect the robot, does that disprove that I had complete and utter mastery over the Mind? No, it doesn't. The Warlock scan is the exact same thing, and lends credence to my position utterly. So until you show me something to negate what people like Warlock and Thanos and Magus and Galactus and Eternity have stated the gems bestow, please think about how you completely proved my own argument against you.
Originally posted by darthgooberExactly. When something has no soul, that entity is beyond the Soul Gem's power. So what the hell is your point? What is your major malfunction? When something has no mind, it is beyond the Mind Gem's power. Are you that far gone that you can't realize this?
No, the scan says that he DETECTS no soul. And then Warlock goes on to say that his spirit must be like Eternity's and Infinity's, BEYOND THE GEMS POWER.
Originally posted by darthgooberYour argumentative logic is tantamount to this: The story says the gem gives complete mastery over an aspect of existence. Characters say it gives them complete mastery, but unless someone uses a single gem in a way that I think gives them mastery, I shall conclude that they are lying or the story is faulty. I'll get back to this point at the very bottom of my post where I completely gut your pathetic logic.
Just pointing out that someone who WASN'T restraining themselves or a moron, never demonstrated unlimited power. So once again, find proof of someone ever doing that, and you'll have a leg to stand on.
Originally posted by darthgooberAstral plane and mental powers and conscious thought are separate from corporeal power. Read enough X-Men or Dr. Strange and you'll figure that out. Energy in its matter/energy context has no affect on an astral form or a mental projection. And yes, if I knew a teleportation device or time machine was going to be used, I could cut off the power supply to it, but since the Power Gem doesn't make me a mind reader or a futurist clairivoyant, how the hell does having the Power Gem presume such knowledge that such tactics would be meaningless?
Well if you have ABSOLUTE control over power....teleportation devices rely on power, so if you have mastery over power, then you could stop them from working. Mental projections are a form of energy, so they'd be detected and nullified. Stopping time would require conscious thought, electromagnetic energy could be manipulated be the gem.
Originally posted by darthgooberAre you a f@cking complete moron? The storyline captions state that each gem gives the bearer complete mastery over each respective aspect of existence. The characters themselves have stated and reinforced such notions. You're telling me that the story captions and the characters are wrong and/or stupid. So if anybody is arguing against the god damn status quo it's you, you complete effing moron. It is up to YOU, to show me a single case where the gem was stated to be limited in its control over its own respective field of influence when not tied to the other gems. The Adam Warlock scan shows the Soul Gem ineffectual against a being that has no god damn soul. Are you so stupid to continue to believe that such a scan supports your position? It doesn't. Show me a conversation or an action that proves WITHOUT ANY ASSUMPTION that one or any of the gems cannot provide its user with mastery over its respective field of influence. You make the most ridiculously inane assumptions with some of your so-called examples, like Mad Thor not using one-shot blows proves he couldn't use one-shot blows because you stupidly assume that he must have used it to its fullest potential. Stop assuming these things retard.
I don't have to prove that it CAN'T be done. The burden of proof is on you, because YOUR the one making the claim that it grants more power than has ever been demonstrated by th gem alone. So until you have that proof, you really don't have a case here.
Your own argumentative logic disproves even a full IG's control over one aspect, "Well, durrr... Thanos w/ IG never sucked the souls of every single person in the universe, so he must not have had complete mastery over the Soul... durrrr." By your logic, since he never actually did such a feat, he could never do so... and yet here we are...
