Who's the fastest??????

I remember this thread ...question though.
The Original Poster claimed that ALL the characters here were to be at their FULL POTENTIAL.

Even went as far as giving the Runner the Space Gem (which is an external power source, but then puts the Runner at FP).

Alright.

Doesn't that mean, then, that the Flash (to be at full potential) would have to merge with the Speed Force.
After all, if Runner is getting an EXTERNAL power source, then Flash should be able to tap into his power source (which in many ways is not external, since Wally has a main-line to it ....and if it is Bart we are talking about it was in him).

In which case, Full Potential Flash is one with the Speed Force.

Which would make him a god of kinetics.

And he would be everywhere (in the Kingdom story line, they had a Flash who had become one with the force, and he was - literally - everywhere at the same time ....INCLUDING DIFFERENT DIMENSIONS, to the extent he was able to pull someone out into his main dimension who had been brought by the Spectre to view those events).

People may discount the 'faster than instantenous travel' feat because Flash borrowed that speed (although he did do it using his own power set, and we are talking FP here, and it is valid, but no need beating a dead horse). But even if that is discounted, and we are talking FP, then that means that the Flash (if the Runner is allowed to tap into the Space Gem) should be able to immerse himself in the Speed Force (Wally can survive, and apparently Bart).

A full potential Flash would be a manifestation of the Speed Force, in essence the embodiment of that force in 'human' (he'd be so far from human at that point that it is almost funny calling him that) form. He would not only be the epitome of speed, he would also be the epitome of time and space. Everywhere at the same time, including divergent and parallel dimensions, and quite probably even everywhen.

That is beyond speed.

He wins (as long as we are talking Full Potential here, and giving certain people Space Gems). With the Speed Force fully tapped the Flash is a god.

Silver Surfer can travel at half a million lightyears per second, i dont think Flash can even hit 1 lightyear a second, and isnt Runner even faster then Silver Surfer? Flash is way outta his league here

The fastest ever is the Runner with the Space Gem. After him, it's really so close it's almost impossible to determine, between Flash Bart Allen, Flash Wally West, Flash Barry Allen, Zoom II, The Runner, Makkari, and Black Flash. It's really so close that in a fight theyre speed would be so close it wouldnt make a difference. But if i had to put them in order of a race, i'd say:

1) The Runner w/ Space Gem
2) Black Flash
3) The Runner
4) Zoom II
5) Bart Allen Flash
6) Barry/Wally/Makkari

Makkari beat Runner

Gaiman's Eternals awesome. I look for Makkari's feat

Why is Quicksilver in this debate? Northstar >>> Quicksilver, even at most recent levels (IMHO)

Considering the rest of the group, Quicksilver is full of fail. My vote goes to Flash...

Originally posted by shksprtx
Why is Quicksilver in this debate? Northstar >>> Quicksilver, even at most recent levels (IMHO)

Considering the rest of the group, Quicksilver is full of fail. My vote goes to Flash...

QFT

Zoom auto wins

No matter how fast you go zoom will always be faster cause he isnt in your time line

Originally posted by Terryc250
Silver Surfer can travel at half a million lightyears per second, i dont think Flash can even hit 1 lightyear a second, and isnt Runner even faster then Silver Surfer? Flash is way outta his league here

He would not have to.

Once again, the OP said Full Potential. FP Flash is one with the SpeedForce, and in KC FPFlash was not only everywhere at the same time, he was even in different dimensions at the same time.

That is a totally different league of 'speed' my friend.

The Runner has combat speed at the same level or Surfer's travel speed, and his travel speed is even faster than the Surfer's best travel speeds. And with the Space Gem, that was amplified to the point where by the time he thinks about where he wants to go, he's already there. Runner with the Space Gem is the fastest character ever. Period.

above all feats and speculations,

why all those characters always tagged by slower opponents?
take note: face to face and with no common reasons

examples:

quick silver, flash, superman and silver surfer

Originally posted by nij-ayias
above all feats and speculations,

why all those characters always tagged by slower opponents?
take note: face to face and with no common reasons

examples:

quick silver, flash, superman and silver surfer

In a nutshell, because it makes the story long enough to fill sufficient pages in the comic book.

Imagine if there was a KMC comicbook (written per the KMC rules ....by the way, if someone wants to go ahead with it i can actually back it up however i can, although litigation issues would probably kill it dead). Anyways, imagine there was a KMC comicbook with the Flash starring.

That comic would just be four panels long ...not four pages ...fourpanels.

The first panel to show the threat.

The second to show the Flash coming to the scene.

The third to show the Flash jumping into action and saving the day.

And the fourth to show that everything is back to normal.

Conclusion: That comic would not sell. No one is going to spend money to buy a page long, four panel, comic 'book.' (Maybe 'comic page' would be a better title).

Thus the characters have to, basically, job to some level to make the story long enough.

Originally posted by spetznaz
In a nutshell, because it makes the story long enough to fill sufficient pages in the comic book.

Imagine if there was a KMC comicbook (written per the KMC rules ....by the way, if someone wants to go ahead with it i can actually back it up however i can, although litigation issues would probably kill it dead). Anyways, imagine there was a KMC comicbook with the Flash starring.

That comic would just be four panels long ...not four pages ...fourpanels.

The first panel to show the threat.

The second to show the Flash coming to the scene.

The third to show the Flash jumping into action and saving the day.

And the fourth to show that everything is back to normal.

Conclusion: That comic would not sell. No one is going to spend money to buy a page long, four panel, comic 'book.' (Maybe 'comic page' would be a better title).

Thus the characters have to, basically, job to some level to make the story long enough.

if what you're saying is true, then why most people here used it in respect thread if slower opponents can hit them. what's the point...

conclusion: they lack skill or their speed are for travel only.

Originally posted by spetznaz
In a nutshell, because it makes the story long enough to fill sufficient pages in the comic book.

Imagine if there was a KMC comicbook (written per the KMC rules ....by the way, if someone wants to go ahead with it i can actually back it up however i can, although litigation issues would probably kill it dead). Anyways, imagine there was a KMC comicbook with the Flash starring.

That comic would just be four panels long ...not four pages ...fourpanels.

The first panel to show the threat.

The second to show the Flash coming to the scene.

The third to show the Flash jumping into action and saving the day.

And the fourth to show that everything is back to normal.

Conclusion: That comic would not sell. No one is going to spend money to buy a page long, four panel, comic 'book.' (Maybe 'comic page' would be a better title).

Thus the characters have to, basically, job to some level to make the story long enough.

Or imagine the KMC version of Superman in DOS Superman Story.

Doomsday shows up at the house scene where Superman let him punch him in the chest. Superman sees him off in the distance, speed blitzes him, punches him to Mercury so he's closer to the sun. Then takes a sundip, shows up at Mercury and uses T-Vo to whup his ass, then use his heatvision to one-shot Doomsday into a pile of ashes, which he then uses his ice breath on and speed blitzes each chunk of ice a separate direction at faster than light speeds into outer space. He then takes another sundip and flies back to Earth, meanwhile all of 4 panels went by instead of an entire huge series of comic books.

I'm glad actual comics aren't like KMC versions.

Originally posted by nij-ayias
if what you're saying is true, then why most people here used it in respect thread if slower opponents can hit them. what's the point...

conclusion: they lack skill or their speed are for travel only.

Read the rules before you post.

The "No PIS" Rule

PIS = Plot Induced Stupidity

At times, for the sake of the plot, characters that are immensely more powerful than their opponent will "job" to carry on the plot of the story, even though the characters powers and history would clearly show that they are more than capable of destroying their opponent. For this reason we have a No PIS Rule. This rule prohibits the use of such instances of PIS from being used as evidence in debates.

Originally posted by Kutulu
Or imagine the KMC version of Superman in DOS Superman Story.

Doomsday shows up at the house scene where Superman let him punch him in the chest. Superman sees him off in the distance, speed blitzes him, punches him to Mercury so he's closer to the sun. Then takes a sundip, shows up at Mercury and uses T-Vo to whup his ass, then use his heatvision to one-shot Doomsday into a pile of ashes, which he then uses his ice breath on and speed blitzes each chunk of ice a separate direction at faster than light speeds into outer space. He then takes another sundip and flies back to Earth, meanwhile all of 4 panels went by instead of an entire huge series of comic books.

I'm glad actual comics aren't like KMC versions.

it's a combination of super TRAVEL speed, physical strength, heat vision and freeze breath.

when you say combat speed, they can block, dodge and they are so skillful and agile.

Originally posted by Rorschach
Read the rules before you post.

my point is travel speed =/= combat speed

i'm only pointing what the character lacks as long as there are no proofs.

Originally posted by nij-ayias
my point is travel speed =/= combat speed

i'm only pointing what the character lacks as long as there are no proofs.

Flash, Runner, Zoom, Superman, Reverse Flash, and Quicksilver have all demonstrated combat speed.

Originally posted by Rorschach
Flash, Runner, Zoom, Superman, Reverse Flash, and Quicksilver have all demonstrated combat speed.

what kind of combat speed, by not dodging attacks?

Originally posted by nij-ayias
my point is travel speed =/= combat speed

i'm only pointing what the character lacks as long as there are no proofs.

I don't know whether your question was genuine or not, but I believe that Kutulu, Rorschach and myself have answered the technical part of your question quite well (with Rorschach even attaching the KMC rule pertaining to PIS).

That part is settled.

You can interpret anything else as you will.

Originally posted by nij-ayias
what kind of combat speed, by not dodging attacks?

No.

Stuff like:

*Fighting so fast that everything around them appears to be frozen in place.
*Fighting so fast that they appear invisible
*Blitzing a character who can react in a nanosecond
*Fighting so fast that they start to vibrate through one and other
*Fights that last only a picosecond

Stuff like that.