Originally posted by Darth Sexy
As usual lightsnake, Obiwan's mastery of Soresu is irrelevant when he's facing superior saber duelists.
How is that even implied by the current argument? Soresu didn't play a factor because Anakin and Obi Wan knew each other "more intimately then lovers" Now how does that imply Obi Wan's Soresu mastery is irrelevant against superior duelists, especially when he was able to defend blows from the likes of Grievous coming in at all angles simultaneously.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Lightsnake is saying that Obiwan can hold his own because he held his own against Anakin and because he's a soresu master. I'm saying the point is moot because he knew Anakin inside and out[B], and his soresu mastery is irrelevant when he's facing a superior duelist. [/B]
Um...how? If your referring to Dooku, Dooku had to use force powers to take Obi Wan out of the equation because he was being overwhelmed. And the only other time we see Obi Wan dueling someone of supposed "superior" skill then him (Grievous) he utterly tools him and defends from blows coming in on four angles at once, Obi Wan's Soresu mastery is FAR from irrelevant.
The Force duel is in the Sith's favor, as Kenobi's not incredibly strong with the Force and would get pwnd by eitehr Exar or Ulic (just like he was pwnd by Dooku). I think Exar could probably take Yoda with his amulents, if not he could hold him off till Ulic pwns Kenobi and then together they'd take Yoda.
Sabers is alot closer, Kun and Yoda could go either way, and Kenobi's strong point is his saber skills, he might be able to take out Ulic that way. I'm not sure about this one, it depends on the Ulic and Kenobi match I think.
All out I'd give to the Sith, either hold off Yoda for a while whiel the otehr defeats Kenobi quickly with the Force and then together they'd take Yoda.
So Sith in all of them except maybe sabers.
Originally posted by xxXAcStylesXxx
Um...how? If your referring to Dooku, Dooku had to use force powers to take Obi Wan out of the equation because he was being overwhelmed. And the only other time we see Obi Wan dueling someone of supposed "superior" skill then him (Grievous) he utterly tools him and defends from blows coming in on four angles at once, Obi Wan's Soresu mastery is FAR from irrelevant.
I guess you forgot all about the AOTC duel then. His mastery is irrelevant when he faces a superior duelist. For example, if he faced Mace, Yoda, or Sidious, his "mastery of Soresu" would be of no use to him as he would be sliced into pieces.
Originally posted by darthsith19
The Force duel is in the Sith's favor, as Kenobi's not incredibly strong with the Force and would get pwnd by eitehr Exar or Ulic (just like he was pwnd by Dooku). I think Exar could probably take Yoda with his amulents, if not he could hold him off till Ulic pwns Kenobi and then together they'd take Yoda.Sabers is alot closer, Kun and Yoda could go either way, and Kenobi's strong point is his saber skills, he might be able to take out Ulic that way. I'm not sure about this one, it depends on the Ulic and Kenobi match I think.
All out I'd give to the Sith, either hold off Yoda for a while whiel the otehr defeats Kenobi quickly with the Force and then together they'd take Yoda.
So Sith in all of them except maybe sabers.
Darthsith, honestly, why do you always, ALWAYS favor the ancients, no matter what the confrontation?
Honestly, Obi-wan could play the waiting game while Yoda handles his opponent in anything except Force and even then, Yoda might defeat Ulic as fast
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Darthsith, honestly, why do you always, ALWAYS favor the ancients, no matter what the confrontation?Honestly, Obi-wan could play the waiting game while Yoda handles his opponent in anything except Force and even then, Yoda might defeat Ulic as fast
Trust me lightsnake, you favor the PT Jedi a lot more than he favors the ancient sith. And you say "obiwan could do this this and that", but these hypothetical statements don't help the debate. I could just say "Kun decides enough is enough and unleashes his amulet blasts killing Yoda and Mace, the end". Not a very good way to debate is it.
Yeah, I don't see how Kenobi's going to draw out his duel with Ulic. You admitted Kenobi's a massive weak link with the Force.
Kenobi is not a liability with the Force, people. Dooku managed to pull off a very impressive combination attack on Obi-Wan that caught him off guard.
Kenobi's masterful use of Soresu and his strong defense is not going to get him pwned by Ulic at all.
Besides, Ulic is as good with Exar wielding only one blade. Had Kun dueled Qel-Droma with his double-bladed mastery, he would have surely won.
Kenobi can easily stall the duel.
What the heck happened to my post? This is gay.
I was being on-topic, sheesh. It's a feat of Anakin's that has been mentioned by Advent in this topic and I was simply pointing out it's more demonstrative of idiocy than anything else.
The fact that this fight has 3 different rules for 3 different scenarios makes it confusing. You have to analyze fighting in 3 locations and how saber combat would work in those situations and then there's 2 where no sabers are allowed and only The Force... iT'S WEIRD.
iI'm still not really convinced Exar is a better swordsman than even Dooku and Dooku is below Yoda.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
I guess you forgot all about the AOTC duel then. His mastery is irrelevant when he faces a superior duelist. For example, if he faced Mace, Yoda, or Sidious, his "mastery of Soresu" would be of no use to him as he would be sliced into pieces.
So whats your point...his AOTC duel when his mastery of the form was not complete, is in refrence to his ROTS self? Which this duel is apparently about, sorry not happeneing. I guess by your logic Anakin sucks because in AOTC he got owned by Dooku. And then we have Mace (whom you listed) as saying that Obi Wans raw skill and mastery trumps his own, making him the best suited for dealing with Grevious. And for your argument to even be slightly correct you'd have to assume that Ulic is on the level of Mace, Sidious, and Yoda in terms of dueling which you've yet to do.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Again, I highly doubt Ulic can stall any duel with Ulic. Ulic stalemated a Jedi without the force, so his lightsaber skills are exceptional.
And for that to be impressive you;d have to prove that Sylvar is worth a shit as a Jedi. You;d have to prove she has improved beyond getting owned as a padawan by Exar Kun, you'd then have to prove she has improved beyond being of such little insignificance that Exar didn't even bother with her. BTW killing bugs doesn't count.
Boba Fett?
And its not irrelevant, Ulic still was a Jedi, a rather good one at that even though losing the force, he still had retained knowledge of how to fight with a saber, even though he doesn't have the force saying "move here" and even still its not like he needs all that much skill dealing with a Berserker whos just blindly charging showing no skill. Sylvar blew.
You're not understanding. Without the "force" to guide him, he would be as useful with a lightsaber as that tool who shot him. Sylvar was an average Jedi and he STALEMATED her in saber combat, without any use of the force. That is indeed an accomplishment and it speaks volumes about his saber abilities.