Originally posted by Beta Ray Howard
No kiddin. Jessica Drew actually brought depth to the roster. Wolverine was there for fanboys to buy the comic.
Why cuz she was a female? ok... i guess. She was alright. Echo is a female, and Ronin might end up being one as well. Dr. Strange brings plenty "depth" to the team. We have't even heard who the rest of the team are.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Their numbers have been steadily declining actually, people are getting tired of this book.
Thats not actually true. The book's numbers have gone down from from the first issue (a tread nearly every book follows), but the numbers for the most part have been holding steady and even rising in some cases.
http://www.newsarama.com/marketreport/2006_year_end.html
Not even factoring the CW issues New Avengers are still a consistent top seller and with New Avengers 19 and 20 outselling 16, 17 and 18 there goes your theory about decreasing sales huh.
And for those going on about bad reviews, most of those come from fans who are just upset that Bendis has destroyed the Avengers. Most reviews, or at least the ones I've seen, have been fairly positive with a few exceptions. Issues like 16 where a whole lot of nothing happened was a waste of money and the Sentry arc didn't clear up as much things as I would have hoped.
Originally posted by nimbus006
Not a big fan of her character, sorry to dissapoint.
Maybe its cuz she was acting as a double agent earlier in the NA series.I did like NA 23 when she tells Hydra to go to hell. Perhaps ill give her a 2 for that. Hopefully she grows on me.
Wolverine when written correctly is one of the more interesting characters in all of Marvel. People are so caught up in fanboys that they begin to hate a character for it. I still enjoy reading anything with him, and don't care about how many fanboys there are.
Wolverine is an x-man 😐
Not an avenger
Besides, when he's not with the astonishing x-men, or going on his own solo adventures or going on his origins adventures, where would he have time to be on the avengers?!?
Originally posted by marvelprince
Thats not actually true. The book's numbers have gone down from from the first issue (a tread nearly every book follows), but the numbers for the most part have been holding steady and even rising in some cases.http://www.newsarama.com/marketreport/2006_year_end.html
Not even factoring the CW issues New Avengers are still a consistent top seller and with New Avengers 19 and 20 outselling 16, 17 and 18 there goes your theory about decreasing sales huh.
And for those going on about bad reviews, most of those come from fans who are just upset that Bendis has destroyed the Avengers. Most reviews, or at least the ones I've seen, have been fairly positive with a few exceptions. Issues like 16 where a whole lot of nothing happened was a waste of money and the Sentry arc didn't clear up as much things as I would have hoped.
It's selling well now due to Tie-ins just like how Fantastic Four was struggling but the tie-ins allow it to bring up it's numbers.
Actually it is decreasing you even admited it yourself, it sells well but without a tie-in they WERE going down. Those were tie-ins
No, I don't mind some of Bendis work such as his brillant work in Daredevil and Powers. I dropped the book not because of Bendis, but because the book didn't live up the hype. I have no problem against change, but really since the start of the series what has the New Avengers done?
There were the first few issues with the breakout, which were okay since they were meant to be introductory. Then the antarctic vibranium thing, which was meh. Then the Sentry stuff, which was meh. Then the Ronin stuff which was both meh and relatively pointless. Then came HoM and Decimation. The Collective stuff which mainly consisted of Iron Man and Sentry, while everyone else watched. And now Civil War tie-ins.
Annnnnd for today we have....
Power Man & Iron Fist! Together Again!
http://forum.newsarama.com/showthread.php?t=97902
And Cage is apparently the leader of this ragtag Avengers team...
Aw, you beat me to posting the link Lucid. Good job. Honestly I'm not at all surprised Luke is to be team leader. Bendis has been grooming Cage for this and with Cage generally being Caps right hand man it makes sense if Cap's not around for him to take over. From the looks of the preview pages Luke is still a fugitive post Civil War. I'm a little bit confused cause Danny is known as Iron Fist but yet we see the Mighty Avengers simply talking to him (as if they are inquiring about Luke) instead of just bringing him in. Hopefully with the end of Civil War that scene will make more sense.
I'm a very happy man right now. All I need is Spider-Man's annoucement tomorrow and I'll be as cool as a cucumber
Originally posted by King_Mungi
It's selling well now due to Tie-ins just like how Fantastic Four was struggling but the tie-ins allow it to bring up it's numbers.Actually it is decreasing you even admited it yourself, it sells well but without a tie-in they WERE going down. Those were tie-ins
No, I don't mind some of Bendis work such as his brillant work in Daredevil and Powers. I dropped the book not because of Bendis, but because the book didn't live up the hype. I have no problem against change, but really since the start of the series what has the New Avengers done?
No they weren't. I was careful to leave out the Civil War tie-ins out of my response but the issues prior to the tie ins (The Collective Arc) sold better than the Spider-Woman arc (Secrets and Lies) and the Collective prologue.
As for what they've accomplished. They've discovered a rogue faction of SHIELD in the Savage Land, discovered that villians are being secretly stockpiled, introduced a new villian in the form of the New Super Adaptoid, weaved a mystery about Spider-Woman's loyalties, went public, made a move to reduce street crime, tried to make some sense of the Sentry, got a new hq and battled the Collective (which set up more conflict between the team and SHIELD and introduced a new character in Michael). By all means not a whole lot but to say they've accomplished nothing is selling them a bit short. Ronin was pretty pointless btw
Luke Cage and Iron Fist isn't much of a surprise, but at least they've finally thrown together some characters with a bit more history and chemistry together.
It's not so much the street-level thing, and it's not so much the lack of the more classic/traditional Avengers that seems off to me... it's that it just seems like a random assortment of characters with no real ties to each other being mixed together. Maybe it will work... iunno.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Luke Cage and Iron Fist isn't much of a surprise, but at least they've finally thrown together some characters with a bit more history and chemistry together.It's not so much the street-level thing, and it's not so much the lack of the more classic/traditional Avengers that seems off to me... it's that it just seems like a random assortment of characters with no real ties to each other being mixed together. Maybe it will work... iunno.
Well what ties do they need? There were for the most part a team pre-Civil War. All thats new is that Danny is there, and he was with Cap and Co. from day one in Civil War, and Dr Strange. Isn't like they're just being flung together now without a premise. They were a team before the war, fought together during the war and its strange to see them together afterward?
Echo is harder to place, but see was a member completing a mission abroad. Missions ends so she comes back to the team. Iron Fist wasn't there pre-CW but he was there during plus he's best friends with Luke and has a history with Spider-Man and Wolverine. Wolverine wasn't there during the war but he was a member prior to it and Dr Strange is also very good friends with Spider-Man. Doesn't seem very random imo
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Luke Cage and Iron Fist isn't much of a surprise, but at least they've finally thrown together some characters with a bit more history and chemistry together.It's not so much the street-level thing, and it's not so much the lack of the more classic/traditional Avengers that seems off to me... it's that it just seems like a random assortment of characters with no real ties to each other being mixed together. Maybe it will work... iunno.
I'm sure it'll work, financially speaking. Anything with Avengers on it sells like hot cakes.
Originally posted by marvelprincePre-CW they had Captain America and Iron Man there as centrepoints. The pre-CW NA wasn't exactly the benchmark for team line-ups anyway. 😬
Well what ties do they need? There were for the most part a team pre-Civil War. All thats new is that Danny is there, and he was with Cap and Co. from day one in Civil War, and Dr Strange. Isn't like they're just being flung together now without a premise. They were a team before the war, fought together during the war and its strange to see them together afterward?Echo is harder to place, but see was a member completing a mission abroad. Missions ends so she comes back to the team. Iron Fist wasn't there pre-CW but he was there during plus he's best friends with Luke and has a history with Spider-Man and Wolverine. Wolverine wasn't there during the war but he was a member prior to it and Dr Strange is also very good friends with Spider-Man. Doesn't seem very random imo
Already noted that having the Luke Cage/Iron Fist pair up again is positive thing.
You really don't think this line-up-
Echo
Ronin (depending on who's inside)
Wolverine
Dr Strange
Spider-Woman
Luke Cage
Iron Fist
and probably Spider-Man
-is kinda random? 😬
On another note... Dr Strange is going to take orders from Luke Cage? 😑
Originally posted by H. S. 6
I'm sure it'll work, financially speaking. Anything with Avengers on it sells like hot cakes.
Cause the Avengers were always big draw points? Honestly pre-Bendis the Avengers weren't that hot. Now to say the book will only sell cause of the name isn't giving credit where credit is due.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Pre-CW they had Captain America and Iron Man there as centrepoints. The pre-CW NA wasn't exactly the benchmark for team line-ups anyway. 😬Already noted that having the Luke Cage/Iron Fist pair up again is positive thing.
You really don't think this line-up-
Echo
Ronin (depending on who's inside)
Wolverine
Dr Strange
Spider-Woman
Luke Cage
Iron Fist
and probably Spider-Man-is kinda random? 😬
On another note... Dr Strange is going to take orders from Luke Cage? 😑
No I don't think it's random cause there was a point for them to be together. Take out Civil War and the fact that they were Avengers pre-CW then I could see your point.
And what's wrong with Dr Strange taking orders? Has he really shown that he doesn't any respect anyone's leadership in the past?
Originally posted by marvelprince
No they weren't. I was careful to leave out the Civil War tie-ins out of my response but the issues prior to the tie ins (The Collective Arc) sold better than the Spider-Woman arc (Secrets and Lies) and the Collective prologue.As for what they've accomplished. They've discovered a rogue faction of SHIELD in the Savage Land, discovered that villians are being secretly stockpiled, introduced a new villian in the form of the New Super Adaptoid, weaved a mystery about Spider-Woman's loyalties, went public, made a move to reduce street crime, tried to make some sense of the Sentry, got a new hq and battled the Collective (which set up more conflict between the team and SHIELD and introduced a new character in Michael). By all means not a whole lot but to say they've accomplished nothing is selling them a bit short. Ronin was pretty pointless btw
That's because Alpha Flight, I know a crap load wanted to buy it as they wanted to know why it was "Alpha Flight last battle" and then a huge outrage arised. Prompting ideas being made for Omega Flight.
AF in their first volume saved the world three times with the same number of issues they have had. What they did is very marginal, Ronin was a waste I hope Echo or the new Ronin do something other than the lackluster ark with ninjas.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
That's because Alpha Flight, I know a crap load wanted to buy it as they wanted to know why it was "Alpha Flight last battle" and then a huge outrage arised. Prompting ideas being made for Omega Flight.AF in their first volume saved the world three times with the same number of issues they have had. What they did is very marginal, Ronin was a waste I hope Echo or the new Ronin do something other than the lackluster ark with ninjas.
Alpha Flight's final battle was billed as the prologue, which sold less than all the other issues of that Arc.
Alpha Flight certainly accomplished a lot but simply because you can knock off things off of your to-do list quickly doesn't make you more efficient at it or make it a more interesting story.
Originally posted by marvelprince
Alpha Flight's final battle was billed as the prologue, which sold less than all the other issues of that Arc.Alpha Flight certainly accomplished a lot but simply because you can knock off things off of your to-do list quickly doesn't make you more efficient at it or make it a more interesting story.
Of course, because people wanted to know what happened to them afterwards. We still didn't even find out. The outrage came out of New Avengers #16 and continued for months afterwards.
No, but you compare what New Avengers have done it's very very very very low on the totem pole. They really havn't done anything major and that's a fact. Their stories wern't even that interesting and that's why I dropped it. Luke Cage civil war tie-in is what I feel the best in the series. The annual was another great comic, but the rest were meh!
Originally posted by marvelprinceIIRC Captain America wanted to assemble a new team of Avengers, with the instigating factor being that a large number of villains had escaped from The Raft - something they never particularly followed up on that I can remember.
No I don't think it's random cause there was a point for them to be together. Take out Civil War and the fact that they were Avengers pre-CW then I could see your point.And what's wrong with Dr Strange taking orders? Has he really shown that he doesn't any respect anyone's leadership in the past?
Luke Cage, Spider-Woman, Wolverine and Spider-Man are the returning members of the NA. The latter two being there at all I've always seen as more of a marketing device. If they had done anything particularly noteworthy in the past two years then I might see your point more, but they didn't really. I don't particularly see Luke Cage as a tie that binds such a ragtag group, in the same way a Captain America, or even an Iron Man could.
Like I said it might work. I dunno. Still find it random.
Also I think you're overreacting a little bit to these less-than-scathing criticisms.
Edit: Oh, and I just can't personally see Luke Cage ordering around the Sorcerer Supreme, just as I couldn't see him telling Uatu or Roma or the Silver Surfer what to do. Just seems off.
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
IIRC Captain America wanted to assemble a new team of Avengers, with the instigating factor being that a large number of villains had escaped from The Raft - something they never particularly followed up on that I can remember.Edit: Oh, and I just can't personally see Luke Cage ordering around the Sorcerer Supreme. Just seems off.
Basically the Ronin ark somewhat did as the Silver Samauri escaped from the Raft however, they havn't been persuing the criminals other than that
Even in Defenders Strange never really took orders, Nighthawk couldn't give him any