Islam Questions

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Prove it.

I am not . In fact, I even tried to call a truce via PM, and you ignored it. If anyone is holding a grudge, it is you.

Aisha is [b]underage. He's a peadophile, just face it please.

Secondly, you say that I beleive Muhammed was a murderer because the western culture brainwashed me ? Okay...check out this middle eastern testimony:

http://www.derafsh-kaviyani.com/english/exposingthemythofIslam.html [/B]

Man come on everyone knows islam is the second largest religon in the world

i ignoured your truce because you simply was asking me for help because you were underattck

And who are you to say Aisha is not allowed to marry the prophet when she herself said yes?

the Authors name is craig winn sounds a lot like western dosent it?

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
[b]Alliance, you act as if Lil B is making stuff up, which you and I know she is not. Everything she mentioned is fact. Even you admitted that Islam is a violent religion today, but we should respect it because blah blah blah....

Sure, Islam has the potential to be much better, hell it's even reforming in places such as Egypt, etc.

However, in general it condones violence, and you know this. Lil B is simply pointing this out. You argue that we should examine it's good side, but that's like saying "I know Hitler killed many people, but he also had good characteristics"

Sorry bro, but the bad outweights the good this day and age. Not a million good deeds could possibly over shadow or erase the bloodshed Islam is responsible for. Lil B makes Islam look bad....anyone can make Islam look bad, it's so damn easy....how much more ammo do we need ?

-women being burnt alive
-women being blamed for thier own rape
-separation of church and state not possible
-young gay boys getting executed or castrated
-theives getting thier hands chopped off
-slanderers and blasphemers getting thier tongue cut off
-atheists being executed

In most Islam countries it is against the Law to be anything other than Islam, and punishable by death. Come on !!!! Islam customs are so integrated into Law, that they have become virtually inseparable.

I do not see what you are defending...are you defending the people or the religion itself ? Or the Quran ? The violence ? What exactly are you trying to defend ?

You take it as if myself and Lil B are attacking the people, as if we are labelling them savage and unthinking, calling us bigots, and you have no idea what you are talking about. In the past you have even went so far as to lie and falsely testify what my argument was, to easier antagonize me 👇

Lil B and myself do not respect the Quran. It is NOT BIGOTRY to dislike a BOOK...do you understand that ? Especially when this book is indirectly responsible for the torture and deaths of thousands of innocent people.

Lil B and myself are NOT BIGOTS...so quit with the accusation of prejudice. If we didn't care about the Arab/Middle Eastern people, or if we loathed them as you claim, we wouldn't even care that Islam is ruining so many of their lives.

But the truth is that although some Muslims are happy with thier religion, and although many others claim to be, Islam is also making others suffer greatly.

Ask Ghazul Omid...she suffered first hand because of Islam. Read her biography. Are you going to call her a bigot ? 🙄

****************************************************

Oh and I find it fkn hilarious that you would bash Buddhism...of all religions.. wow...... [/B]

He bashes Buddhism and Persians hoping I will take it personaly. I don't. He displays an unreal amount of ignorance in hope to spite me, because he knows nothing of Islam, and is too lazy to read it.

Furthermore, if he did read it, and found what we were saying is true (as one would) it is just too damn difficult to admit that one can be ignorant and keep on defending that. Not knowing is bad, not wanting to know is worse.

He can bash Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism... He has not read anything of Buddha to support anything he says, nor has he read the Qur'an, to counterargue anything I am saying.

He can continue to bleat.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well a while back you were bashing buddhism. Making sweeping statements, of all the religons you bash you had to bush buddhism.

The problem with you is you just want to prove to everybody how pc you are.

I'm not trying to be anything. I am what I am.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
[b]Alliance, you act as if Lil B is making stuff up, which you and I know she is not. Everything she mentioned is fact. Even you admitted that Islam is a violent religion today, but we should respect it because blah blah blah....

Oh and I find it fkn hilarious that you would bash Buddhism...of all religions.. wow...... [/B]

Go back to your corner. Lil B does make that stuff up. However, being the giant hypocrite that you are, you never take the time to examine these issues.
Learn about who writes her "sources".

oh and Buddhism, if you even actually were Buddhist, has many problems of its own, which you ignore because you are delusional (maybe why lil and you get along so well).

It is first and foremost a religion.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
He bashes Buddhism and Persians hoping I will take it personally. I don't. He displays an unreal amount of ignorance in hope to spite me, because he knows nothing of Islam, and is too lazy to read it.

Furthermore, if he did read it, and found what we were saying is true (as one would) it is just too damn difficult to admit that one can be ignorant and keep on defending that. Not knowing is bad, not wanting to know is worse.

He can bash Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism... He has not read anything of Buddha to support anything he says, nor has he read the Qur'an, to counter argue anything I am saying.

He can continue to bleat.

No one needs to bleat to expose what a hypocrite you are. You’re a West-bashing Muslim-hating xenophobe. I don't BASH anyone or any group here, which is the difference between me and your antics. I point out flaws, address issues. You ignore fact, ignore issues, and sit and spin in your own opinion. I've never called anyone evil, you have, and you tell me I'm bashing? You are, imo, exactly what is wrong in the world today.

Also, I have read texts, both from Buddhism and Islam, and I have close friends who are religious studies majors who can tell me their own opinions. My statements are incredibly more justified than your crap, because they are actually objective and don't come from authors whose credibility and reactionary interpretations have been called into question on an international scale.

I could say "I love you" and you'd accuse me of bashing. Please just admit that you hate me and lets move on. Because all I've seen is hate spew from your lips.

Originally posted by muslimscholar
Man come on everyone knows islam is the second largest religon in the world

Actually, I am wrong and you are correct. Islam is the second largest religion in the world, I didn't read your last quote. My apologies.

What I meant was it is not specifically the fastest growing religion. Christianity is.

Anyways, i dont get your point. You try to argue that Islam is valid because it is a major religion..so what ?

Christianity is far more popular than Islam, yet you critisize Christianity all the time....

Originally posted by muslimscholar
i ignoured your truce because you simply was asking me for help because you were underattck

WHAT ?

OMG..r u kidding me ? 🤨 Did you really take it that way ? Why is everything about refuge with you ?

I called a truce, because I felt bad for antagonizing you earlier, and nothing more. I see that tons of people on these forums attack you and Fatima, and you guys are the only ones standing up for Islam, while everyone else corners and humiliates you guys

Also, I called a truce with everyone not just you.

I AM NOT UNDER ATTACK...no one is attacking me for my sexuality...I thought you and I could understand each other because we are both minorities, but I guess things like empathy and understanding are beyond your comprehension.

How sad 👇

Originally posted by muslimscholar
And who are you to say Aisha is not allowed to marry the prophet when she herself said yes?

I am not debating that. Why are you side stepping my point. I said that is peadophilia which it is...do you deny it ?

Muhammed married a 9 year old girl....that is peadophilia. Do you agree or disagree ?

And secondly, I thought peadophilia was forbidden in Islam....was I wrong ?

Originally posted by muslimscholar
the Authors name is craig winn sounds a lot like western dosent it?

He lived in the Middle East... 🙄

And you also denounces by last Middle Eastern source, Ghazul Omid.

edit double post

edit

Originally posted by Alliance
I said certain Muslims are violent. The religion itself is not violent, nor should be considered violent.SO quit making up things to pretend you have points.

Oh, No ?

Do you actually READ the Quran ? It calls for dismemberment of thieves and liars, it calls for the beheading of blasphemers and atheists, it calls for the execution of gays, and the harsh discipline of women.

Who the **** are you kidding ?

Originally posted by Alliance
Go back to your corner.

Uh oh, is that a closet joke ?

Originally posted by Alliance
Lil B does make that stuff up. However, being the giant hypocrite that you are, you never take the time to examine these issues.
Learn about who writes her "sources".

Is that why you ignored Ghazul Omid's entire testimony ? Or any ex Muslim refugee for that matter ?

Idiot 👇

Originally posted by Alliance
oh and Buddhism, if you even actually were Buddhist, has many problems of its own, which you ignore because you are delusional (maybe why lil and you get along so well).

1) I am Buddhist

2) Besides troubles with intepretations and seeming contradictions, what problems does Buddhism contain that even compares to the atrocities of Islam ?

God you are SUCH a dumbass 👇

Originally posted by Alliance
It is first and foremost a religion.

Your point ?

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Oh, No ?

Do you actually READ the Quran ? It calls for dismemberment of thieves and liars, it calls for the beheading of blasphemers and atheists, it calls for the execution of gays, and the harsh discipline of women.

Who the **** are you kidding ?

Thailand, a Buddhist nation, executes drug criminals.

There is clearly a distinction between texts and religions. Appreciate it.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Uh oh, is that a closet joke ?

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Is that why you ignored [b]Ghazul Omid's entire testimony ? Or any ex Muslim refugee for that matter?[/B]

Have you listened to ex-gay testimony lately? Omid has an agenda. I don't doubt that many problems she discusses are real and affect many women. Thats not ignorance, thats being objective. Instead of screaming OMG and then hating Islam and Muslims.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
1) I am Buddhist

2) Besides troubles with intepretations and seeming contradictions, what problems does Buddhism contain that even compares to the atrocities of Islam ?

God you are [b]SUCH a dumbass 👇[/B]

Why, because I point out flaws in your argument. I don't recall being buddhist saving you from being a bad person? Buddhism is not perfect, nor are Buddhists.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Your point ?

Originally posted by Alliance
Quite honestly, Religion is a practice, not a text. I don't care what a text says, I care what Muslims do. And unfortunately for reactionary xenophobes like you and lil, extremists don't represent Islam.

Yes, and part of that practice, a large part in fact is dismemberment and death for tons of innocent people who haven't done anything other than violate a quote in the Quran 😬

Extremists don't represent Islam...that is true. But neither do the moderates. Islam, as a whole, needs a lot of reforming before it can claim to be a peaceful religion.

Originally posted by Alliance
Thailand, a Buddhist nation, executes drug criminals.

I am aware, as do many Orient countries, however, nothing in Buddhism or Buddhist text permits, allows, or condones execution. Absolutely nothing.

Thailand, is not actually practicing Buddhism by doing such a thing. It is like claiming to be a Christian but not beleiving in Christ....

Originally posted by Alliance
There is clearly a distinction between texts and religions. Appreciate it.

Religion is a practice based intepretation and selection of text. And yes, although there is a distinction between the writings and the actual actions, Islamic actions in general have been far worse than the writings.

When I say this, I particularly mean in Islamic run nations...Muslims in the USA and Europe tend to be far more moderate and not so loyal to the Quran.

The same way Christianity is not as loyal to the Bible as it has been for centuries. I am not saying Christianity is a perfect religion, you KNOW I would never flatter the religion in such a way, but it has come much farther than Islam has.

Thanks to Muslims who demand fairness and reform, Islam is getting better...but it still has a long way to go. As long as thier are Fundamentalists who run governments and people's lives by the Quran, Islam will not be able to call itself a peaceful religion.

Originally posted by Alliance
No, and you should know I'd never make fun of anyone for being homosexual. That was a reference to you taking your "time out" a week or so ago.

Did you feel the need to bring it up ? I don't get it....

Originally posted by Alliance
Have you listened to ex-gay testimony lately? Omid has an agenda. I don't doubt that many problems she discusses are real and affect many women. Thats not ignorance, thats being objective. Instead of screaming OMG and then hating Islam and Muslims.

Yes, and all of them have said that they still have homosexual attractions, they have simply been conditioned to ignore them rather than give in.

In fact, a Christian program called Love In Action, which is aimed to help Gay people "become" straight, has not claimed to cure homosexuality. Representatives, ex-gays, as you call it, still admit to having homosexual attractions. Some of them even say they feel they will always have that....but because of the desire to live a different life, they suppress thier natural desires, and compromise them with idealized ones.

Omid has an agenda ? Yes, to reveal how she was oppressed in a nation run by Islam....everyone has a fkn agenda, Alliance, get a grip.

Like you don't have one ? Please...we all do.

And finally, I do not hate Islam. Stop putting words in my mouth, I never insulted one Muslim...

LIKE I STATED BEFORE...THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH BEING A MUSLIM. IT IS FUNDAMENTAL ISLAM AND GOVERNMENTS RUN BY ISLAM THAT I ATTACK, AS WELL AS THE QURAN.

NOT THE INDIVIDUAL MUSLIM.

I do not intend to repeat myself on this. So do not accuse me of hating Muslims, because I will simply put you back on Ignore, and that will be that.

Originally posted by Alliance
Why, because I point out flaws in your argument. I don't recall being buddhist saving you from being a bad person? Buddhism is not perfect, nor are Buddhists.

You pointed out nothing. You simply insulted me for having an opinion other than your own, like you do to anyone who has. 👇

I never said Buddhism is perfect, get over it already, enough with these made-up accusations.

Originally posted by Alliance
All religions have flaws and you can't be religious and atheist at the same time.

That is true, but what is your point ?

And yes, you can be Atheist and Religious at the same time. I am a Buddhist who does not beleive in God.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Extremists don't represent Islam...that is true. But neither do the moderates. Islam, as a whole, needs a lot of reforming before it can claim to be a peaceful religion.

Yes, moderates do represent Islam, because they are the majority. Just because you choose not to listen, does not make them inaudible.

Just because some Muslims do things that reflect poorly on Islam does not mean that they are representative. If you're going to group all Muslim sects into "Islam", you cant choose the minority to speak for the majority.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
I am aware, as do many Orient countries, however, [b]nothing in Buddhism or Buddhist text permits, allows, or condones execution. Absolutely nothing.

Thailand, is not actually practicing Buddhism by doing such a thing. It is like claiming to be a Christian but not beleiving in Christ.[/B]

Have you read every Buddhist text? If the Thai government executes a criminal, does that make them less Buddhist.

You seem to present religion as a set of ideal types. If this is so, true religion can never be obtained. If this is true, you have no business lambasting the Quran or any other text for any words it contains. Religion is about practice, not archaic texts.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Islamic actions in general have been far worse than the writings..

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
When I say this, I particularly mean in Islamic run nations...Muslims in the USA and Europe tend to be far more moderate and not so loyal to the Quran.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Yes, and all of them have said that they [b]still have homosexual attractions, they have simply been conditioned to ignore them rather than give in.[/B]

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Omid has an agenda ? Yes, to reveal how she was oppressed in a nation run by Islam....everyone has a fkn agenda, Alliance, get a grip.

Like you don't have one ? Please...we all do.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
And finally, I do not hate Islam. Stop putting words in my mouth, I never insulted one Muslim...

You attack Islam, their religion which they have every right to believe in. You clearly don't understand the depth of your comments and what the hell you're actually saying.

I don't hate gays, I hate homosexuality...how does that statement fly with you?

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
You pointed out nothing. You simply insulted me for having an opinion other than your own, like you do to anyone who has.

Yeah, OK. You freak out an accuse me of stalking you and bringing our dispute over Islam into other threads, just because I posted in them, and I'm the one being irrational.

I have continuously made points, most all have been unaddressed and simply replied with "you're an idiot" and "i have an unbased opinion"

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
I never said Buddhism is perfect, get over it already, enough with these made-up accusations.

So why does Islam have to be perfect for you not to bash it?

Originally posted by Alliance

I said certain Muslims are violent. The religion itself is not violent, nor should be considered violent.

What do you say to a statement like that? Im confused please clarfiy exactly what you mean by this. I think im seeing things.

bored

sigh. it seems like zakir naik and daawa have created a stream of spirited, self righteous and empassioned neo islamic preachers who think that islam has finally been proven to be the LOGICAL relegion. hate to burst ur bubble, but zakir and daawa are only good at bashing{half the time illogically abeit hidden by wit and supperiortalking skills} other relegion. theirarguments dont really work too well when trying to DEFEND islam as a relevant relegion, far form it , although the ability to talk and quote can delude the rather dum and wishful audience to believe in faulty logic{and it IS faulty if u even try to go a little deeper, muslimscholar, faulty, circular and self contradictory}

actually the relegion is violent, not so much as is portrayed in the media and not in the same way. the reason why some peole think it isnt is
because sum1 quoted a few ayahs form the quran and hadith speaking of lotsa peace. what WE must understand is that most relegions like islam, christianity, judaism, hinduism, are not ONE whole, bt are self contradictory and paradoxical{ie, not constant throughout and not an integrated whole} if we are to look at the relevant peaceful parts{and it depends on ur definition of peace} than its peaceful but if we are to look at the equally valid hate preaching and violent parts, its violent, they both exists simultaneously, erronously and are contradictions.

Originally posted by muslimscholar

And who are you to say Aisha is not allowed to marry the prophet when she herself said yes?

.....*ahem*...... SHE WAS NINE YEARS OLD!!!!!!!!!

Get a ****ing grip!!!!

muhammad was a pedofile, thats fact. on top of having more wives than any of his companions, he married any women GIFTED to him, married his own adopted sons wife after dissoving the marriage, and married his companions 8 year old daughter aisha, who GOD made laweful for him and was god's GIFT to him. there are sahih{true} accounts of him having sex with the entire harem in one night one after the other. his wives were also not allowed to dissolve their marriage or marry after their death or infact leave their quarters after his death.

{lol on the above statement, u obviously dont understand what it means to be a 9 year old girl, just because SHE said yes doesnt mean she knew what she was getting into. 9 year olds dont understand sex or being part of a harem or their rights or what the question imposes or infact have any physical sexual MATURATION! perhaps next time any man rapes a 5 year old, they can hullify the case against themselves because they were able to persuade the victim to say YES to playing house!

pedophilia is not forbidden in islam. as long its not among family members. infact i think there is an authentic tradition{i think} of the prophet saying to a companion just after he was married, "why didnt u choose a nice young virgin so that you cud have fun and pleasure with her" again not sure if this is sahih or not and not quoting exactly. oh yea, marital rape doesnt exist in islam and any women who refuses to come to bed with her husband and the husband spends the night in a bad mood, all the angels curse her until the dawn{sahih hadith}.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
oh yea, marital rape doesnt exist in islam and any women who refuses to come to bed with her husband and the husband spends the night in a bad mood, all the angels curse her until the dawn{sahih hadith}.

Yeah im quite sure about that as well.

Originally posted by Alliance
Yes, moderates do represent Islam, because they are the majority. Just because you choose not to listen, does not make them inaudible.

I recall you earlier stated that the majority does not speak for, or represent, the minority.

Also this majority you speak of live all over the world, while I am addressing the Islamic Extremism which is particularly concentrated in the Middle East. I am not addressing Muslims who live in USA, Europe, or other parts of Asia, Africa, etc. because those governments are not Islam run and there are no executions or tortures done in the name of Allah in these areas.

Originally posted by Alliance
Just because some Muslims do things that reflect poorly on Islam does not mean that they are representative. If you're going to group all Muslim sects into "Islam", you cant choose the minority to speak for the majority.

These particular Muslims don't just commit random acts of violence for the hell of it. Everything they do is supported through Quran, execution of gays, dismemberment of theives, oppression of women, etc.

Their actions are justified in thier religion, their religion does not teach against it. So, yes, this is part of thier religion. Face it.

And these are done in the majority of nations where Islam is Law, like it is meant to be according to Quran. These things dont happen in Europe and USA because Islam is not the majority religion, and those Muslims are integrated into other culture whether they realize it or not.

But if you grow up in an Islamic run nation where executions and torture are the norm, you start to think these kind of things are okay. That is what I am addressing.

Originally posted by Alliance
Have you read every Buddhist text? If the Thai government executes a criminal, does that make them less Buddhist.

Buddha's original teachings do not promote or condone killing of any kind. If a future leader writes his own sutra and includes killing as part of his philosophy, then he is teaching against the Buddha.

It does make them less Buddhist, if Buddhist at all.

If a Christian tells me that he worships Kali and Shiva, then he is not Christian. Or at least less Christian than others.

If you are a Buddhist and you promote killing or violence of any kind, then you are not truly Buddhist.

However, you can be violent and kill, and still appropriately call yourself Christian or Muslim, because the bases of Christianity and Islam allow for these kind of things.

Originally posted by Alliance
You seem to present religion as a set of ideal types. If this is so, true religion can never be obtained. If this is true, you have no business lambasting the Quran or any other text for any words it contains. Religion is about practice, not archaic texts.

No...religion is a practice and tradition based on influential text.

If the practice is done entirely disregarding the text, then it is not religion. If a Buddhist commits a murder, then he comitted a non-Buddhist action. This action cannot be considered a Buddhist action.

If a Christian spits on the cross, then he/she comitted a non-Christian action. This action cannot be considered Christian.

You cannot look at the practice and totally disregard the text when regarding religion. Both are the components to every religion.

Originally posted by Alliance
The actions of what, who? If its "Islam" you're wrong. Globalizing again. Try to actually analyze instead inhaling whatever you're told.

You tell me to only regard the practice, not the text, but then you disregard the practice of violence in Islam.... 😬

Actions of Islamic people in the major Middle Eastern nations. Actions of Islamic Government. Actions done against men, women, and children in thier own nations by those in charge.

Originally posted by Alliance
Oh, I see, so if Muslims are in government, that is a bad thing. Try again. Loyal to the Qu'ran? No religion has loyalty to a book? The vast majority of Muslims in the world are moderates, regardless of where they live.

No, but so far an Islamic based government is a shaky deal....be realistic Alliance. You dread a government based on Christianity, how could you possibly fathom a government based on Islam ? 🤨

Yes the vast majority of Muslims all over the world are moderate, because they live in nations where Islam is not the majority religion, and where they have to conform to the social norms there.

In Middle Eastern nations where Islam is dominant, is where the high concentration of violence occurs.

That is what I address.

Originally posted by Alliance
No. Not all. Some still deny that homosexual attractions exist.

Reps from Love in Action actually went on the Tyra Banks Show recently, and claimed they still have the homosexual attractions. It was interesting and eye opening.

The significant number of those who claimed they no longer have homosexual attractions still have homosexual sex 😬

Originally posted by Alliance
I'm not the one publishing a book, I'm simply arguing against bigots on KMC. Maybe you should figure out the agendas before you slurp up her statements. Examine the book in perspective, just like you should any piece of evidence to anything.

What's wrong with her publishing a book? She experience first hand the oppression under Islam. You didn't. You sit there and read your books and discuss this with your freinds, and you ignore the events that occur to innocent people all over the Middle East.

And then you tell me to be objective 🙄

And her agenda ? Equality for women in Islamic nations ? Oh my God, I'm so scared ...what a consipiracy !

And for you information she is not denouncing Islam in general, she still beleives in God and treasures her pilgramage to Mecca. It was the abuses of Islam in politics and the treatment of women that she is opposing.

She knows Islam can be better, it can change, and does not have to remain absolutely loyal to the Quran. She is right.

Please know what you are talking about before you accuse her of having a negative agenda, and accusing me of being a bigot. Thanks.

Originally posted by Alliance
You attack Islam, their religion which they have every right to believe in. You clearly don't understand the depth of your comments and what the hell you're actually saying.

They have every right to beleive in the Quran, but likewise, I have every right to attack the Quran.

I think it is you who doesn't know what the hell I am actually saying...

You call me a bigot because I have no respect for a book, and because I do not approve of the violence that occurs under dominant Islam. I'm a bigot huh ? I'm guilty of Bookism... 🙄

Originally posted by Alliance
I don't hate gays, I hate homosexuality...how does that statement fly with you?

Don't have Gay sex then....my mother thinks homosexual sex is disgusting, that doesn't mean she hates Gays.

Originally posted by Alliance
Yeah, OK. You freak out an accuse me of stalking you and bringing our dispute over Islam into other threads, just because I posted in them, and I'm the one being irrational.

When did I say you were stalking me ? 🤨

You antagonized me earlier, even in threads which had nothing to do with Islam, because of my opinion of Islam.

You are irrational and a hypocrite. You accuse me of being an antagonist, a bigot, etc. when you can be just as antagonizing and bigotted, so please....

You don't like me attacking Islam, but then it's okay for you to attack Buddhism ? 😬

Get a fkn grip !

Originally posted by Alliance
I have continuously made points, most all have been unaddressed and simply replied with "you're an idiot" and "i have an unbased opinion"

I did address your points, and beforehand instead of addressing my points, you simply stated "you are wrong..you don't know what you are talking about"

Then when I asked you to clarify, and attack my individual points directly, you replied "I don't ****ing have to"

You want respect ? Give and you shall recieve. Withdraw and I shall withdraw.

Originally posted by Alliance
So why does Islam have to be perfect for you not to bash it?

It doesn't have to be perfect Alliance, it just has to stop dismembering, torturing, and murdering people in the Middle East, then I'll stop attacking the religion.

Originally posted by Alfheim
What do you say to a statement like that? Im confused please clarfiy exactly what you mean by this. I think im seeing things.

bored

Because violence is the actions of people. Islam might enable violence, but that doesn't mean that Islam is inherently violent by itself.

Speaking namely about terrorism, the violence I've seen and read has much deepeer motivations than religion.

Speaking domestically, I stongly feel that these actions are of desert mountain tribes and isolated incidents. I believe that most Muslims don't do something, simply because they are allowed to by an old book.

Does that clarify?

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
I recall you earlier stated that the majority does not speak for, or represent, the minority.

Also this majority you speak of live all over the world, while I am addressing the Islamic Extremism which is particularly concentrated in the Middle East. I am not addressing Muslims who live in USA, Europe, or other parts of Asia, Africa, etc. because those governments are not Islam run and there are no executions or tortures done in the name of Allah in these areas.

and that is a product of the government adn education, not the religion. And you'd be wrong to belive that Islamicists don't live outside the Middle East, so don't make stupid regionalist statements.

When you say you hate Islam, you offend Muslims EVERYWERE, adn non-Muslims like me.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
These particular Muslims don't just commit random acts of violence for the hell of it. Everything they do is supported through Quran, execution of gays, dismemberment of theives, oppression of women, etc.

Their actions are justified in thier religion, their religion does not teach against it. So, yes, this is part of thier religion. Face it.

No, it is not. Most Muslims reject these statements. IN your argument, the only true Muslims are extremists, justifying your biogtry. In the real world, which some of us actually live in, Religion is a practice. YOu can justify most any biogetd action using some text or another, that doesn't mean that it is representatvie or commonplace. Its just means that you are looking for an excuse.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
And these are done in the majority of nations where Islam is Law, like it is meant to be according to Quran. These things dont happen in Europe and USA because Islam is not the majority religion, and those Muslims are integrated into other culture whether they realize it or not.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
But if you grow up in an Islamic run nation where executions and torture are the norm, you start to think these kind of things are okay. That is what I am addressing..

All those damn Muslims running governments....how perverse. Get over yourself, this is not a Muslim problem , this is a problem of governemnts who can't control their people and education and poverty.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Buddha's original teachings do [b]not promote or condone killing of any kind. If a future leader writes his own sutra and includes killing as part of his philosophy, then he is teaching against the Buddha.

It does make them less Buddhist, if Buddhist at all.[/B]

If you are a Buddhist and you promote killing or violence of any kind, then you are not truly Buddhist.[/B][/QUOTE]

Here you go with your ideal types again. You sound like JIA claiming there is a "true" Buddhism and a "true" everyhting else.

Therefore my original points still stand. There is no such thing as a "true" anything. A Buddhist who kills a man is still Buddhist. As a Christian is still a Christian despite the fact that he commits adultery or murders. It doesn't destroy any aspect of your religion at all and changes nothing. And most certainly, one act by one person says nothing about a religion. You even go into this yourself, actions are seperate from persons. Jsut because a Buddhist does somethign non-Buddhist, doesn't say a thing about what they are.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
No, but so far an Islamic based government is a shaky deal....be realistic Alliance. You dread a government based on Christianity, how could you possibly fathom a government based on Islam ? 🤨.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
Yes the vast majority of Muslims all over the world are moderate, because they live in nations where Islam is not the majority religion, and where they have to conform to the social norms there.

Besides, if life is all about coinciding to social norms, than whats wrong with tribal systems that execute homosexuals? They're just conforming to a social norm....or is it simply your social norm that you want everyone to conform to?

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
In Middle Eastern nations where Islam is dominant, is where the high concentration of violence occurs.

Try looking at other factors first. However, If I was just out to demonize Islam and all Muslims, I'd ignore everything else too.

The rest of this conversation is off topic so I'm ignoring it for now.