What's So Bad About Hudlin? Really?

Originally posted by Apolloknight
An article by mcduffie

http://homepage.mac.com/dmcduffie/site/TBC3.html

The part I like best is this, and its the truth..

[b]The Black Panther wasn't the first black character I'd seen in comics. Blacks had already appeared in crowd scenes and even occasionally as supporting characters (the Panther himself first appeared in THE FANTASTIC FOUR). One Black character even starred in his own book. Marvel's LUKE CAGE, HERO FOR HIRE had been running for over a year when I first discovered JUNGLE ACTION. But I never connected with Cage, a super-strong "angry black man" who wore chains around his waist, didn't seem particularly bright and spoke in a bizarre version of "street slang" that didn't even remotely resemble the speech of any Black people I knew. Spider-Man made sense to me, Cage? I just couldn't relate.

In those days, when black people in comics weren't busy being angry, they appeared either as faithful sidekicks, or worse, as helpless victims who begged white super-heroes to rescue them ("How come you never did nothing for the Black skins, Mr. Green Lantern?" And this was actually progress). The Black Panther was nobody's sidekick and if there was any rescuing to do, he'd take care of it himself, thank you. Moreover, the Black Panther was king of a mythical African country where black people were visible in every position in society, soldier, doctor, philosopher, street sweeper, ambassador &emdash;suddenly everything was possible. In the space of 15 pages, black people moved from invisible to inevitable.

Im not defending Hudlin, nor mcduffie, but people do need to open there eyes and see the truth and stop acting like they know everything. [/B]

I can't stand black Americans who act like this, like they victims and can justify anything by saying "But, I'm black! My great-great-great granny was a slave!"

Bah, my parents were raised in Africa BEFORE apartheid ended, that's racism. Not having enough black people flying around in capes is ludicrous. He doesn't care about us or our well being, if he did he wouldn't advertise malt liquor on BET every 30 seconds.

Erggggggggggg.

I think Andy Rooney needs to talk to Hudlin (Andy Rooney quotes)

I don't think being a minority makes you a victim of anything except numbers
The only things I can think of that are truly discriminatory are things like the United Negro College Fund, Jet Magazine, Black Entertainment Television, and Miss Black America.
Try to have things like the United Caucasian College Fund, Cloud Magazine, White Entertainment Television, or Miss White America; and see what happens...
Jesse Jackson will be knocking down your door.

When 70% of the people who get arrested are black, in cities where 70% of the population is black, that is not racial profiling;
it is the Law of Probability.

I am sick of 'Political Correctness.' I know a lot of black people, and not a single one of them was born in Africa;
so how can they be 'African-Americans'?
Besides, Africa is a continent.
I don't go around saying I am a European-American because my great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather was from Europe .
I am proud to be from America and nowhere else.

I don't think there is a city where blacks are the majority to that extreme.

I know Washingto. DC is like 60% and nearly 90% of crimes in DC are comitted by us.

Originally posted by long pig

I can't stand black Americans who act like this, like they victims and can justify anything by saying "But, I'm black! My great-great-great granny was a slave!"

Where did it say he is acting like a victim!? he is only speaking the truth, writers DID in fact write luke cage as a slang using ghetto black kid from the "hood" gave him some gold chains and super strength, money. In the 60's - 90's, black people in comics were in fact, in the crowds, being saved, or the "token black guy", no different then the way movies used to be.

Originally posted by long pig

Bah, my parents were raised in Africa BEFORE apartheid ended, that's racism. Not having enough black people flying around in capes is ludicrous. He doesn't care about us or our well being, if he did he wouldn't advertise malt liquor on BET every 30 seconds.

Well long pig, not every black guy is like you, you can be right in your own opinion based off your personal motivations and beliefs, but don't expect your behavior to effect the outcome of others, because others, such as myself, WANT to see more black hero's, not because I'm a racist, its just my personal preference.

I like black women.

I like orange juice.

I like BBQ ribs.

I like ford mustangs.

I enjoy the military.

All my personal beliefs in which I feel comfortable in, not everybody is comfortable in a mustang, but I am.

There is no difference in yearning for more black hero's in comics.

Originally posted by Nataku8188

I am sick of 'Political Correctness.' I know a lot of black people, and not a single one of them was born in Africa;
so how can they be 'African-Americans'?
Besides, Africa is a continent.
I don't go around saying I am a European-American because my great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather was from Europe .
I am proud to be from America and nowhere else.

So its blacks fault that we have the title "African American"!?

Originally posted by BlueDMighty
Now that I'm back, allow me to bring this back to the point.

As far as Hudlin goes, I never read his Spider Man, so I can't comment on it.

As far as I'm concerned, I like his Black Panther, I've got some complaints about his Storm, but nothing that will make me quit reading/buying the book.

I'm curious, what if Emma Frost hooked up with Black Panther. And Storm got the boot. Would you drop the book then?

On the subject of race, it's funny how people act like there isn't a problem (I posted several good exaples. Third smartest, next to who? who are #1 and #2? )

Good examples? You're upset that Marvel/DC pay more attention to their characters that have been established for over 40+ years.

It seems, like every other "minority" in the room has a problem with the fact that I have a problem with the lack of my group's "equal" representation. (Because, they don't have a problem with their group's lack of "equal" representation?)

That's probably because every other individual on this forum can see past something as trivial as the colour of ones skin.

I'm not asking aybody to care about the lack of representation in other books (I care, and I'm enough). But when looking at Hudlin's characterization of white people you feel, exactly, how I feel when I read books like "Runaways" and "New X-Men". Some of you are acting just like some of Hudlin's "White" characters.
( I DARE one of you to print this thread out and let one of your "Black" friends read it, and ask what he thinks.) [/B]

You're playing the race card where it's not warranted. When looking at the way years of characterisation is being shat upon eg. Storm, Doom, The X-Mens reaction to Storms wedding etc then that's what's upsetting. If a character is good and just happens to be black then cool. The same would apply to any other race.

Black friends or Black African American friends? Because I only have one Black African American friend and he doesn't carry on the way you do. I'd say the majority being South African since I grew up there. Some are British, Irish, Ghanaian, Mozambican, Nigerian and another is Jamacian. I also have other non-black friends from other parts of the world who might be interested. Chances are they'd probably all end up laughing at A.) Me using a forum. B.) The topics we discuss on this forum. C.) The point you're trying to establish.

On a positive note: Kudos to Hudlin for not ruining Crystal and Emma Frost.

Overcompensation ? Maybe. But as a black guy, the only time I interact with white people is at work.

This would explain a lot, I grew up when apartheid was coming to an end in South Africa. Thankfully I was exposed to all types of backgrounds, cultures and people and brought up to see past the colour of ones skin.

****. I wrote out a reply that got deleted.

Short and to the point here is a review, which is basically a response to BlueDMighty.

A. Mr. Terrific is craftier than Batman in my opinion, see T-Spheres and all the crazy shit he does with them, and has proven to be his own defined character that isn't just a watered down black Batman. He's a master surgeon, the best on DC Earth, and 6 black belts, and 14 PHDs.

My point is, every new character has the potential for greatness. That being said, is there a rule that says a black person can't be #1. I mean if the story is good and the art is good you'd buy it right?

I may not be catching your first point there. I can't tell what you mean by "is there a rule that says a black person can't be #1?". Are you saying that a black man should be the smartest man in the world? If so, I wouldn't really mind either way. I don't think anyone said that a white guy NEEDS to be #1. It's just written the way it's written.

To the other point, yes. Each character is different and has differnet potential, which is what makes you writing Terrific off as a Batman rip-off sort of ironic.

B. I just thought your view my be interesting, since he wasn't on your list, and I've never seen racist situations in his book despite the heavy integration.

C. Doom saying that is debateable overall. Remember he's a very traveled man and wouldn't just bark out a slur without thought. Though he would also know that T'Challa wouldn't react to it. Discussing whether he'd say that or not is a wasted effort in my opinion.

D. Runaways dissappoints me in many ways. Race being one. Different discussion for a different time.

E. I could dig a comic book that only featured black people, if it was justfied. But portraying every white man as an ignorant stereotype angers me as much as comics that feature black stereotypes angers you.

Two wrongs don't make a right, or a left. They make a shitty circle.

Originally posted by Apolloknight
An article by mcduffie

http://homepage.mac.com/dmcduffie/site/TBC3.html

The part I like best is this, and its the truth..

[b]The Black Panther wasn't the first black character I'd seen in comics. Blacks had already appeared in crowd scenes and even occasionally as supporting characters (the Panther himself first appeared in THE FANTASTIC FOUR). One Black character even starred in his own book. Marvel's LUKE CAGE, HERO FOR HIRE had been running for over a year when I first discovered JUNGLE ACTION. But I never connected with Cage, a super-strong "angry black man" who wore chains around his waist, didn't seem particularly bright and spoke in a bizarre version of "street slang" that didn't even remotely resemble the speech of any Black people I knew. Spider-Man made sense to me, Cage? I just couldn't relate.

In those days, when black people in comics weren't busy being angry, they appeared either as faithful sidekicks, or worse, as helpless victims who begged white super-heroes to rescue them ("How come you never did nothing for the Black skins, Mr. Green Lantern?" And this was actually progress). The Black Panther was nobody's sidekick and if there was any rescuing to do, he'd take care of it himself, thank you. Moreover, the Black Panther was king of a mythical African country where black people were visible in every position in society, soldier, doctor, philosopher, street sweeper, ambassador &emdash;suddenly everything was possible. In the space of 15 pages, black people moved from invisible to inevitable.

Im not defending Hudlin, nor mcduffie, but people do need to open there eyes and see the truth and stop acting like they know everything. [/B]

Well it is the truth.

Can't we go back to thinking of things that Hudlin does wrong? Wasn't that what the thread was initially about?

Originally posted by Nataku8188

I am sick of 'Political Correctness.' I know a lot of black people, and not a single one of them was born in Africa;
so how can they be 'African-Americans'?
Besides, Africa is a continent.
I don't go around saying I am a European-American because my great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather was from Europe .
I am proud to be from America and nowhere else.

Agreed ✅

My heritage runs from Canada, Portugal and Scotland, and you know what. I'm not proud of being from any of those places. I don't care where my ancestors lived, or whatever.

That's the great thing about America, it doesn't matter where you're from or whatnot, because being an American is more than being born in here, its about standing for what you believe in and representing the ideas of freedom and prosperity

usaflag

Originally posted by llagrok
Can't we go back to thinking of things that Hudlin does wrong? Wasn't that what the thread was initially about?

Well right now he is simply re-writing McDuffie's FF in his book, except when he does it, its garbage and it takes him twice as long to get through the same plot 😐

Originally posted by Grimm22
Well right now he is simply re-writing McDuffie's FF in his book, except when he does it, its garbage and it takes him twice as long to get through the same plot 😐

Nothing is holy to Hudlin. It wouldn't surprise me if he resurrects Goliath, only to have him ARM-BAR GALACTUS!!

Btw: where'd you get that picture of Hellion? It's badass

Originally posted by llagrok
Nothing is holy to Hudlin. It wouldn't surprise me if he resurrects Goliath, only to have him ARM-BAR GALACTUS!!

Btw: where'd you get that picture of Hellion? It's badass

Exactly, Hudlin doesn't even bother doing resarch on the characters he writes, he just writes them on how THINKS they should be written, even though its completely ignorant to everything the character has ever done.

For instance, why the hell do Black Panther and Storm care so much about Goliath's death?!? They didnt even know him!

Plus, its from New X-men #29's cover

Originally posted by llagrok
Can't we go back to thinking of things that Hudlin does wrong? Wasn't that what the thread was initially about?

And advoid the truth, isnt that what true racism is, pointing out all the flaws in ones ways, cultrue, religon, race, gender, and failing to see the other side of things, not saying that you have to agree with it, but you get my point.

Originally posted by Grimm22
Agreed ✅

My heritage runs from Canada, Portugal and Scotland, and you know what. I'm not proud of being from any of those places. I don't care where my ancestors lived, or whatever.

That's the great thing about America, it doesn't matter where you're from or whatnot, because being an American is more than being born in here, its about standing for what you believe in and representing the ideas of freedom and prosperity

usaflag

Again, this is what been so sad about this debate, you are right in your own sense, if you dont care about your heritage, its no skin off my back. Thats your own personal view and belief.

I happen to care about my heritage, am I wrong for this, NO.

Is hudlin wrong for this, NO.

At the same time, am I defending him, NO.

Mcduffie said it best in his article, THERE WERE NO BLACK HEROS PERIOD BACK IN THOSE DAYS. People like me, who are proud to be black, yearning for a black superheros that dealt with racism and the other things some blacks deal with (yes racism still exist and for those of you who think it doesnt your kidding yourself).

THAT, is whats great about america, the fact that one can express his own personal views and beliefs, and not be wrong or right. Not be throw in prison nor have his head chopped off.

I read this thread in even though there are alot of views I do not agree with, its your guys views, and it makes me smile to live in, and defend a country were we all can express it.

Originally posted by Draco69
He IS a murderer, you stupid hack...

😂

God, even Chris Rock and David Chapelle admit that he murdered his wife.

Hell, O.J. Simpson was gonna print a book called "IF I Did It..." to rub his get out of jail free card in the faces of America.

Oh please.

You think O.J. Simpson is innocent? Next you're gonna tell us that Michael Jackson genuinely just invited little boys to sleep in his bed with absolutely no sexual intentions whatsoever.

😆

This isn't about race. It's about justice.

Your another one who likes to miss the point on purpose.

I'll spell it out. In "America" (you know, land of the "free", land of the "brave".) people are innocent until "PROVEN" guilty? Right?

So, the fact that he was found INNOCENT of Murder by a jury of his peers in a court of "LAW", and has subsequently been "Punished" for being a "Black Guy" who got off.
it is slander to call him a murderer.

Two wrongs don't make a right? You mean like "Do as i say. Not what I do?"

Black people in this country have been told to "shut up" and "get over it" for years. (Like our past won't affect our future.)

Hudlin noting and talking about racial issues in his book is fine. Him making the panther a major player is fine.

Hudlin being a failure of a writer? ****ing up characterization after characterization? That's NOT so fine.

Originally posted by BlueDMighty
Your another one who likes to miss the point on purpose.

I'll spell it out. In "America" (you know, land of the "free", land of the "brave".) people are innocent until "PROVEN" guilty? Right?

That's the way the law works, but the way REALITY works is that people are innocent till they commit the crime. 😐.

Originally posted by BlueDMighty

So, the fact that he was found INNOCENT of Murder by a jury of his peers in a court of "LAW", and has subsequently been "Punished" for being a "Black Guy" who got off.
it is slander to call him a murderer.

It's only slander if it's not true. 313.

I meant land of the Free. Home of the Brave

Originally posted by Draco69
Next you're gonna tell us that Michael Jackson genuinely just invited little boys to sleep in his bed with absolutely no sexual intentions whatsoever.

Originally posted by Soljer
That's the way the law works, but the way REALITY works is that people are innocent till they commit the crime. 😐.

It's only slander if it's not true. 313.

So, what your saying is, Black people were right all along.

We really are "Guilty until proven Innocent."

Like I said before, I've got some issues with Hudlin's Storm. But the future does look bright. In my opinion, I'm glad to see her in an environment that may allow some growth for her character.

I wanted people to print out the entire thread and allow one of their black friends to read it and then as they're opinion.

Simply put allot of attitudes (not JUST the Hudlin supporters) in this thread are, at their root, race related. there were several remarks besides the Doom quote that were rooted in the fact that Hudlin runs BET and something to do with House Party (one of the funniest movies ever). It was also only a matter of time before somebody brought up OJ.

As far as Books are concerned, what "justifies" a comic? How do you give a comic "justification". People act like the pen has power when they want it to, and when they don't, they change the rules.
"You start keeping pace, they start changing up the tempo." (Most Def ref.)

While we're talking about OJ and MJ, we might as well talk about the other MJ and a stack of other pro black atheletes, Bill Cosbey, Martin Lawrence, Dave Chapelle, and Rappers in general

oh what the ****. house party isn't even in the top fifty funnies movies ever.