Captain America versus Luke Cage

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Hands I could see as well.

Punching Thunder ball down briefly and having him spatter out blood.

KO'ing a fatigued Rhino with a kick targeting his nose.

KO'ing Powerman the original one with a punch.

Breaking Hulk's wrist grip with a kick to Hulk's face.

To having Ironman rub his metal jaw after a punch to the face.

Cap's martial art strikes seem to affect a bit very durable beings, especially with him targeting pressure-points/sensitive areas.

IMO he could, not with a one hit, but by targeting that same area repeatedly.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes I know didnt I say that already??????
Her MA abilties
Self explanatory
Which is what you said before. Well done twice in a row now, you cant read.
Er see above. Furthermore thats no different from what you said before.
eg Iron Mans powerset is his intellect which enbales him to build a suit that perform the power feat of Koing the Thing for example.

From that sentence:
Mantis powerset I define as her being a master of martial arts.
Mantis has a feat where she KOed Thor from behind with normal strength and martial arts somehow. Whether or not I consider this feat valid, it is a feat and not "a part of her powerset."

Meanwhile you read that sentence and because it's from a bio consider it as a whole to be "a powerset."

Analogous sentence:
Black Panther's enhanced speed and proficiency in martial arts | has enabled him to armlock the Silver Surfer.

The first part separated with | I define as his powerset, the second I define as a feat. While you would technically be taking the entire sentence and saying that the ability to armlock Silver Surfer is part of his powerset.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Er xmarks you will probably find it in published verisons of Marvel Universe. Secondly even if it is off Marvel.com its OFFICIAL. Her Bio says she can do it the comics says she can do it. There is no argument its a fictional universe and in that Universe Mantis can knock out Thor.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Mars has a different atmosphere to Earth you dont apply the same rules as you do to Mars just because you dont like it 🤨

I have no idea what that analogy was meant to convey. 😐

But it's nice that at least you've calmed down since last.

Edit 2: Oh and I'm flattered you keep all these really old quotes of mine. 313

the black guy ftw.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

From that sentence:
Mantis powerset I define as her being a master of martial arts.

Thats not what I said?

Originally posted by Alfheim

So what your telling me is that despite the fact that her powerset

Originally posted by Alfheim

Her MA abilties

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Mantis has a feat where she KOed Thor from behind with normal strength and martial arts somehow.

Which is what I said.

Originally posted by Alfheim

enables her perform the power feat of KOing Thor and her bio states that its in her ability to do so your rejecting it?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Whether or not I consider this feat valid, it is a feat and not "a part of her powerset."

See above.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Meanwhile you read that sentence and because it's from a bio consider it as a whole to be "a powerset."

See above.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Analogous sentence:
Black Panther's enhanced speed and proficiency in martial arts has enabled him to armlock the Silver Surfer.

You failed hes bio deosnt say that.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

The first clause I define as his powerset, the second I define as a feat.

I KNOWWWW!!!!!

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

While you would technically be taking the entire sentence and saying that the ability to armlock Silver Surfer is part of his powerset.

No I wouldnt.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

IIRC Marvel.com is fan editable. See above.

Marvel directory says the samething and I know they get their info from Marvel Universe.

http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/m/mantis.htm

Thus, by knowing the right areas of the body to strike, Mantis could stun even a being as powerful as Thor even though she herself had no superhuman strength.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

It's a fictional universe and in that universe Black Panther can armlock Silver Surfer. That doesn't mean I'm meant to automatically agree with it.
...

I have no idea what that analogy was meant to convey. 😐

The point is if both the bio and the comics are correct its official. Therefore saying its incorrect is like saying Cheetahs cant run up to lets say 100 miles per hour because you dont like it eventhough its been documented and proven. (Hypothetical argument I dont know how fast Cheetahs can run).

In this reality it doesnt make sense. But the MU is a universe with a whole set of different laws. What applies in this universe does not neccesarly imply in the MU.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

But it's nice that at least you've calmed down since last.

**** you.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Edit 2: Oh and I'm flattered you keep all these really old quotes of mine. 313

No I dont I went looking for it. You did the samething as well Victor Von Doom.

P.S. I suspect you are doing this unpurpose you sadist.

Originally posted by Alfheim
You failed hes bio deosnt say that.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I KNOWWWW!!!!!

Originally posted by Alfheim
No I wouldnt.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Marvel directory says the samething and I know they get their info from Marvel Universe.

http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/m/mantis.htm

[B]Thus, by knowing the right areas of the body to strike, Mantis could stun even a being as powerful as Thor even though she herself had no superhuman strength.[/B]

But (I'll humor you) let's assume we take the (dated) "new" sentence for now. Now if you find something that says the same thing of Captain America, then you might actually be able to claim Mantis KOing Thor as a valid analogy for Captain America.

Originally posted by Alfheim
The point is if both the bio and the comics are correct its official. Therefore saying its incorrect is like saying Cheetahs cant run up to lets say 100 miles per hour because you dont like it eventhough its been documented and proven. (Hypothetical argument I dont know how fast Cheetahs can run).

In this reality it doesnt make sense. But the MU is a universe with a whole set of different laws. What applies in this universe does not neccesarly imply in the MU.

Since the feat can be distinguished from the powerset in the sentence, on the forum one can assert that the bus should not be affected in such a way when looking at the bus's "powerset" or the bus having a vast preponderance of contrary "feats."
My Black Panther/SS analogy was much easier to follow.

Originally posted by Alfheim
**** you.

No I dont I went looking for it. You did the samething as well Victor Von Doom.

P.S. I suspect you are doing this unpurpose you sadist.

Before I answer this post. You dont mean to tell me you are still actually saying that I havent disntinguished between powerset and powerfeat??? I mean I thought you were joking but you're serious. I just need to vefify this before I even consider going on.

You're saying that based on the initial sentence it's her ability to KO Thor as far as I can tell, which would in effect make it her powerset - and therefore you're saying I can't dispute it. Or something along those lines. Otherwise I have no idea why you're repeatedly asking me how I can call into dispute the feat. Easy, based on the initial sentence it's a feat subject to the same scrutiny as any other.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
You're saying that based on the initial sentence it's her ability to KO Thor as far as I can tell, which would in effect make it her powerset. Otherwise I have no idea why you're repeatedly asking me how I can call into dispute the feat.

Nooo. I said Powerset= MA ability, Powerfeat = Koing Thor. What we are debating is wether Mantis should be able to KO Thor with her given Powerset. Is this clear now?

Powerset and Powerfeats are two different things but a persons powerset enables them to do certain feats.....but thats what we are debating...you are saying Mantis should not be able to KO Thor with her Powerset I am saying she should.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Nooo. I said Powerset= MA ability, Powerfeat = Koing Thor. What we are debating is wether Mantis should be able to KO Thor with her given Powerset. Is this clear now?

Powerset and Powerfeats are two different things but a persons powerset enables them to do certain feats.....but thats what we are debating...you are saying Mantis should not be able to KO Thor with her Powerset I am saying she should.

We've mutually established that her KOing Thor is a feat she's performed. She did so with martial arts ability yes.

But when looking at any feat in the vs forum both parties must be taken into account. Based on Thor's abilities I don't think Mantis would have the sufficient strength to generate enough penetrative force regardless of her skill.

Has everybody pretty much KOed Thor, from street level to cosmic?
I'm not sure that's much of a feat given how often I see it in threads.
"Well he beat/KOed Thor".
Its a wonder people even think this guy is even remotely close to Superman's league given how often people whoop his ass.

Originally posted by Juntai
Has everybody pretty much KOed Thor, from street level to cosmic?
I'm not sure that's much of a feat given how often I see it in threads.
"Well he beat/KOed Thor".
Its a wonder people even think this guy is even remotely close to Superman's league given how often people whoop his ass.

Originally posted by Juntai
Has everybody pretty much KOed Thor, from street level to cosmic?
I'm not sure that's much of a feat given how often I see it in threads.
"Well he beat/KOed Thor".
Its a wonder people even think this guy is even remotely close to Superman's league given how often people whoop his ass.

Originally posted by Newjak
Thor is like the Universal welcome mat. Everyone has stepped on him. 😛

I mean, I'm not trying to shit on him or anything, I've enjoyed quite a few Thor appearances and arcs, but hell, I'm just calling it as I see it.

I think in the last few days alone I've read about a dozen different characters of all shapes, sizes, and statures/ranks/whatever, whooping or KOing him.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

We've mutually established that her KOing Thor is a feat she's performed. She did so with martial arts ability yes.

Yeah and we mutually established that her powerset were her MA abilities but you kept on telling me I didnt get it. Damn I thought you were winding me up on purpose but you were serious!

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Then I don't see why you're repeatedly asking me why I can dispute the feat.

But when looking at any feat in the vs forum both parties must be taken into account. Based on Thor's abilities I don't think Mantis would have the sufficient strength to generate enough penetrative force regardless of her skill.

Because the rules state that she can both the Bio and the comics illustrate that it can be done. Therefore it becomes fact like the Cheetah example it doesnt matter how insane it sounds its fact. Its also insane that human beings exposed to radiation can get superhuman powers but those are the rules of the MU.

Furthermore she doesnt use brute force, since shes an MA expert its likely shes uses Chi which is not brute force.

Originally posted by Juntai
Has everybody pretty much KOed Thor, from street level to cosmic?
I'm not sure that's much of a feat given how often I see it in threads.
"Well he beat/KOed Thor".
Its a wonder people even think this guy is even remotely close to Superman's league given how often people whoop his ass.

What streetlevelers have Koed Thor?

Originally posted by Juntai
Apperently.

I mean, I'm not trying to shit on him or anything, I've enjoyed quite a few Thor appearances and arcs, but hell, I'm just calling it as I see it.

I think in the last few days alone I've read about a dozen different characters of all shapes, sizes, and statures/ranks/whatever, whooping or KOing him.

I'm begining to think Thor just holds back way to much for his own good

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah and we mutually established that her powerset were her MA abilities but you kept on telling me I didnt get it. Damn I thought you were winding me up on purpose but you were serious!

Because the rules state that she can both the Bio and the comics illustrate that it can be done. Therefore it becomes fact like the Cheetah example it doesnt matter how insane it sounds its fact. Its also insane that human beings exposed to radiation can get superhuman powers but those are the rules of the MU.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I'm not sure I fully agree, but I don't think I can be bothered disputing it right now.

Dont fully agree on what? Its ok if you dont want to discuss it just tell me what you dont fully agree on. I hope its not what I think it it.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

It's still not a good analogy either way, since if we take that it is within her power to KO Thor because they've put the feat into her bio,

My point is that its established fact and you cant go against fcat because you dont like it.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

it still doesn't serve as analogous to Captain America.

My point is it can be done. Mantis is better than Cap, but Cap can do what she does on a lesser degree. They are both MA experts but Mantis is the better one. Hell DD has put Mr Hyde on the floor with a narve strike.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot

Hers is specifically ascribed to her and explained despite her lack of strength. While he doesn't have these specifics and explanation. 😬

1. It doesnt have to, she can and thats that..its fact.
2. If you want an explanation it could be a chi strike. A chi strike is not purely phsyical in nature a person could use minimal physical force but the chi would do the damage. This is a real concept in Tai Chi, I think they call it strong Jin.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Dont fully agree on what? Its ok if you dont want to discuss it just tell me what you dont fully agree on. I hope its not what I think it it.

Originally posted by Alfheim
1. It doesnt have to, she can and thats that..its fact.
2. If you want an explanation it could be a chi strike. A chi strike is not purely phsyical in nature a person could use minimal physical force but the chi would do the damage. This is a real concept in Tai Chi, I think they call it strong Jin.

Anyway on Cap vs Luke again as stated above imo he lacks the adequate strength to penetrate Cage's fortified skin and musculature to affect his nerves sufficiently, despite his skill in H2H. With the shield he can likely damage him since unlike other characters Cage is not a Golem-like character and maintains a physiology akin to humans, but I don't believe that gives him the majority. That's my two cents.

If you want to argue chi amping etcetera continue on, but I think I'm basically over the thread. Can agree to disagree or you can take this as some sort of concession. I don't really mind either way. 😬

This thread has done very little...

Except prove that X > Alfheim. 131.

Originally posted by Soljer
This thread has done very little...

Except prove that X > Alfheim. 131.

* Tempted to create Xmarksthespot vs Alfheim thread*

*but fears digi's wrath*

Originally posted by jasonk3
* Tempted to create Xmarksthespot vs Alfheim thread*

*but fears digi's wrath*

Spite thread....

🙂.