and that of course is the problem with strange. in the mini he DID seem to be afraid of sentry, but he's seemed overwhelmed in the past, and been ko'd by things it seems he SHOULDN'T be ko'd by. depends entirely upon which showings you wish to go by. he has also easily beaten off the avengers -- thor included but at other times been portrayed much weaker.
of all the characters in the forum, strange is the most difficult to figure in battles, imo.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Considering it merely took Sentry seconds to fly to the sun that's not a lot of time. Meh! others such as Beta Ray Bill have ko'ed Strange rather easily. I think people are over-rating Strange he is far from unbeatable even Long_pig even stated that in a thead and that the hype has gotten too much.Quasar didn't do much at all, and Thor didn't straight up fight him, he had prep and used various other things. Even all Bill could do was just crack Galactus's armor.... that's it.
If he wants to kill Hulk, the Void scene will happen all over again and yes Sentry = Void and that's a stated fact.
Strange even stated he was afraid of him...so yeah that mini heavily implied Sentry was above him.
Right, so who’s to say Sentry’s fight wasn’t like any of their battles with Galactus?
Even so, that’s still a few seconds worth buying for the Strange strategy I mentioned earlier.
Strange didn’t say he was scared of Sentry though. Just that he was scared. Overall he seemed to be scared of the idea that if the formula that gave Bob his powers were to get into public hands, then we’d have a world full of Sentries, each one with his/her own Void. And really, who wants that?
Originally posted by Accel
I’m not saying Strange will solo the whole team. There’s still Surfer to provide back-up, Iceman to flash-freeze Thor, SW, or Sentry if he gets the chance, and Namor and Hulk to provide minor distractions at least. All in all, very likely that Strange could erect a shield given a few seconds time to protect him while he concocts an even more power full spell to take out others.Right, so who’s to say Sentry’s fight wasn’t like any of their battles with Galactus?
Even so, that’s still a few seconds worth buying for the Strange strategy I mentioned earlier.
Strange didn’t say he was scared of Sentry though. Just that he was scared. Overall he seemed to be scared of the idea that if the formula that gave Bob his powers were to get into public hands, then we’d have a world full of Sentries, each one with his/her own Void. And really, who wants that?
You are indeed implying Strange could take the team, as well as everyone else who picked Avengers. They see Strange it usually mean an automatic win on this board, and that's a sad fact. Surfer will be busy with Thor or even Quasar who has taken it to him as well, Ice Man is not going to flash-freeze Thor. If Frost Giants can't why the heck would Iceman?
Because we are learning his power of a million of exploding suns is legit, he overloaded Absorbing Man. Not even Odin, Galactus, Thor, Hulk or anyone else has done anything like that. Heck, Sentry easily broke Terrax's axe like it was a toy. He made a hearld look like a joke. As the Void he destroyed most of the strongest heroes himself.
Won't matter as he has to fend off attacks directly towards him as well
Naaaa...it was heavly implied Strange was directly afraid of Sentry, and shocked he overpowered his magic. As much as I hate to say it, he's being underated here.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
You are indeed implying Strange could take the team, as well as everyone else who picked Avengers. They see Strange it usually mean an automatic win on this board, and that's a sad fact. Surfer will be busy with Thor or even Quasar who has taken it to him as well, Ice Man is not going to flash-freeze Thor. If Frost Giants can't why the heck would Iceman?Because we are learning his power of a million of exploding suns is legit, he overloaded Absorbing Man. Not even Odin, Galactus, Thor, Hulk or anyone else has done anything like that. Heck, Sentry easily broke Terrax's axe like it was a toy. He made a hearld look like a joke. As the Void he destroyed most of the strongest heroes himself.
Won't matter as he has to fend off attacks directly towards him as well
Naaaa...it was heavly implied Strange was directly afraid of Sentry, and shocked he overpowered his magic. As much as I hate to say it, he's being underated here.
Odin merely toyed with Sentry; I doubt he actually tried to overload him with his wind attacks and all. From what I recall, Creel never absorbed any thing from Thor that should have overloaded him. We have seen Creel reach his limits when dealing with Quasar and when he tried to absorb the planet. He clearly has limits.
Showing more physical power than a herald like Terrax isn’t that big a deal either. I mean, didn’t Iron Man beat the guy? Didn’t Surfer also break the guy’s axe? And then there’s Air-Walker, who was pretty much beaten down by Thor on at least two occasions.
Namor can distract Thor, even if only for a moment. And Surfer can hold off Quasar. I have my doubts Sersi’s matter-manipulation powers would override Strange’s magic, so I don’t see her posing much of a thread to Strange.
Strange seemed more scared of the idea of a world full of Sentries more than any thing. And I believe he just underestimated Sentry when he was trying to keep him asleep. Overall, I really don’t see how that would automatically put Sentry above Strange.
Well, feat wise, Strange is above Sentry.
About the Absorbing Man feat, Strange did the same thing to Absorbing Man. Overloaded him and turned him into goo.
The thing about Strange in the Sentry comics, he never once showed his full power. Not a single time did he use his whole arsenal.
Technically, Strange could one shot kill Sentry with a soul rip. He's reached in and grabbed souls before or simply gave the soul to Mephisto/Satannish. If Sentry has a soul, then he could be taken out by that.
Is everyone forgetting that all Sentry did was break out of a spell? He didn't overpower a fighting back Strange, he broke out of a spell... a spell, which Sentry knew that that kind of magic couldn't hold him back for long.
That isn't even really relevent when dealing with this thread... at all!
Unless... Strange is going to put him in a spell, and just forget him. And that spell was to help him, not to put him down.
If he is going to put him in a spell, why not use the Bands? Why does he only have one-showing in this thread (from what I seen)?
Hell, make him shoot blasts, but don't use one showing to decide the fight.
Originally posted by long pigQuite, and Sentry was a dick about it.
I see what you're saying.Seemed to me, Strange was holding back. He used passive magic to help Sentry.
Sentry won't be breaking any of his cosmic spells unless Sentry is more powerful than the god he gains power from. If Sentry isn't>Vishanti, then Vishanti's powers will work him over.
Strange would wreck Sentry based on what has been shown. Too many options, and only one piece of evidence against him, which is not even a battle showing, or good evidence to begin with.
I think the Defenders win, mainly due to the Surfer. With is rescent upgrads, he could, not solo, but nearly all the others.
Stephen take out Wanda, Namor could kick the crap out of Captain America. I think that the Surfer have the potential to beat Thor. Hulk too. He already done it. After the fall of Thor, it will be a piece of cake for the Defender.
Don't forget Iceman, the dude is a big gun too.
Originally posted by Accel
Strange is the biggest gun on the Defenders, yes, but he’s not winning by himself. If it was just him versus the Avengers, I’d give it to them. Really, he just needs time to throw a shield around himself (maybe made from the Crimson Bands of Cyttorak) and then concoct a more devastating spell in there. Or he could freeze time for every one except his teammates. Surfer can old off some of the opposition as well. Thor’s not immune to a flash-freeze (I don’t recall any Frost Giants displaying freezing abilities on the same level as Bobby). If he turns his back against Bobby, he’s a popsicle.Odin merely toyed with Sentry; I doubt he actually tried to overload him with his wind attacks and all. From what I recall, Creel never absorbed any thing from Thor that should have overloaded him. We have seen Creel reach his limits when dealing with Quasar and when he tried to absorb the planet. He clearly has limits.
Showing more physical power than a herald like Terrax isn’t that big a deal either. I mean, didn’t Iron Man beat the guy? Didn’t Surfer also break the guy’s axe? And then there’s Air-Walker, who was pretty much beaten down by Thor on at least two occasions.Namor can distract Thor, even if only for a moment. And Surfer can hold off Quasar. I have my doubts Sersi’s matter-manipulation powers would override Strange’s magic, so I don’t see her posing much of a thread to Strange.
Strange seemed more scared of the idea of a world full of Sentries more than any thing. And I believe he just underestimated Sentry when he was trying to keep him asleep. Overall, I really don’t see how that would automatically put Sentry above Strange.
Yet, the Defenders have more firepower other than Strange, so why do people automatically give the Avengers the win when all they really have is Silver Surfer who can easily be fend off and Dr.Strange who is become the source of the universe on this board. The bands have been broken by Namor and even Captain Britian...their meh! They held Galactus, but Galactus is by all accounts higher than Cyttorak. Their mystical creatures who by legend froze the earth. So what's to stop Thor from even stealing their soul?
Odin never fought Sentry, and Creel took on all of Asgard and what did Odin have to do to stop him.....BFR.
Don't recall if Iron Man did, but apparently Iron Man can go toe to toe with the Surfer too does that make it legit? All you examples not one even remotely came close to beating a Hearld that easily. None.
Come on now, Namor would be finished so quick against Thor. Quasar is no chump, he knocked down a Watcher. That's debatable, and once again Strange does not automatically have all his shields up and most powerful spells going. So really it comes down to who attacks first. If she can turn Thor into a frog, I doubt Strange is out of her grasp
I read it the other way, considering in the first volume Sentry was stated to be a treat to the universe thanks to the Void.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yet, the Defenders have more firepower other than Strange, so why do people automatically give the Avengers the win when all they really have is Silver Surfer who can easily be fend off and Dr.Strange who is become the source of the universe on this board. The bands have been broken by Namor and even Captain Britian...their meh! They held Galactus, but Galactus is by all accounts higher than Cyttorak. Their mystical creatures who by legend froze the earth. So what's to stop Thor from even stealing their soul?Odin never fought Sentry, and Creel took on all of Asgard and what did Odin have to do to stop him.....BFR.
Don't recall if Iron Man did, but apparently Iron Man can go toe to toe with the Surfer too does that make it legit? All you examples not one even remotely came close to beating a Hearld that easily. None.
Come on now, Namor would be finished so quick against Thor. Quasar is no chump, he knocked down a Watcher. That's debatable, and once again Strange does not automatically have all his shields up and most powerful spells going. So really it comes down to who attacks first. If she can turn Thor into a frog, I doubt Strange is out of her grasp
I read it the other way, considering in the first volume Sentry was stated to be a treat to the universe thanks to the Void.
Heh, meant to say Odin was toying with Creel. Any way, Odin did BFR him, but only after admitting he was toying with him. And like I said, it’s not like Odin was using his galaxy-level attacks on Creel, so it’s not out of the question for him to take the attacks he did without overloading. However, he was overloaded when he dealt with Quasar and when he tried to absorb the earth.
You mean just stopping a herald’s charge and then breaking his axe? Seriously, with Terrax, that’s not beyond any one with top-tier strength. Morg has broken Surfer’s board before. She-Hulk once gave Air-Walker a good smack that sent him flying and left him vulnerable to Thor’s assault. Hulk once asserted more raw power than even Surfer could when the Defenders were trapped in the Kree Star Wheel. Exerting more physical power, even that easily, doesn’t put Sentry any higher than any other top-tier.
I know, and while Thor’s BFRing Namor or roasting him or whatever, that’s Iceman’s chance to flash-freeze him. Strange doesn’t need his shields to be automatically up; all he needs is an instant to put them up and he’s golden. And Thor’s not exactly resistant to transmutation; heck, Hulk’s proven to be more resistant to transmutation than Thor has, so because her powers worked on Thor doesn’t mean they’ll work on Strange with his magical barrier.
Originally posted by Accel
The Crimson Bands have only been broken when Strange was in astral form and/or distracted. When he isn’t, they’re unbreakable, even by top-tiers. So the Frost Giants haven’t even tried to do a flash-freeze like Iceman can, have they? When Thor’s distracted with Namor, Iceman can use the opportunity to flash-freeze him. Thor’s never shown immunity to this whatsoever.Heh, meant to say Odin was toying with Creel. Any way, Odin did BFR him, but only after admitting he was toying with him. And like I said, it’s not like Odin was using his galaxy-level attacks on Creel, so it’s not out of the question for him to take the attacks he did without overloading. However, he was overloaded when he dealt with Quasar and when he tried to absorb the earth.
You mean just stopping a herald’s charge and then breaking his axe? Seriously, with Terrax, that’s not beyond any one with top-tier strength. Morg has broken Surfer’s board before. She-Hulk once gave Air-Walker a good smack that sent him flying and left him vulnerable to Thor’s assault. Hulk once asserted more raw power than even Surfer could when the Defenders were trapped in the Kree Star Wheel. Exerting more physical power, even that easily, doesn’t put Sentry any higher than any other top-tier.
I know, and while Thor’s BFRing Namor or roasting him or whatever, that’s Iceman’s chance to flash-freeze him. Strange doesn’t need his shields to be automatically up; all he needs is an instant to put them up and he’s golden. And Thor’s not exactly resistant to transmutation; heck, Hulk’s proven to be more resistant to transmutation than Thor has, so because her powers worked on Thor doesn’t mean they’ll work on Strange with his magical barrier.
Errr...even in astral form Strange is just as strong, he even has all access to his equipment and items even in astral form. The Frost Giants are insanely uber. Thor's never shown immunity to it? ...I vastly diagree considering the various mystical creatures Thor has dealt with. Thor easily just steals Iceman's soul...and it's done, and yes he can do it.
That what about all of Asgard? they definetly wern't toying with him. Yet he Creel has taken blasts from Galactus and he was fine, he's absorbed all the strength of the Hulk and Hulk destroyed an astroid twice the size of Earth and didn't overload. He has shown against vastly superior fighters and not overloaded. Heck, when Surfer tried to absorb Ego he couldn't, Quasar did so that's hardly a knock against him.
Darn right, no one has done something like that so effortesly. Once again none of your examples of them even come close to easily dominating a hearld the way Sentry did. Actually it's a stated fact Surfer has shown to increase his levels higher than Hulk. Hulk kepeted jumping on Surfer's head and he was none the worse foe wear and the fact right after Abomination beat Hulk, he clashed with a WEAKENED, vastly weakened Surfer who could barely stand and Surfer easily ko'ed him.
Come on now, your underating Thor and over-rating Iceman. Yet majority of the time their arn't impregnable. Even a spaceship during the Hulk Amenesty used claws and hurt him so bad he couldn't even cast a spell. Wait now...so your saying Strange is immune to being transmutated or manipulated? 😕
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Errr...even in astral form Strange is just as strong, he even has all access to his equipment and items even in astral form. The Frost Giants are insanely uber. Thor's never shown immunity to it? ...I vastly diagree considering the various mystical creatures Thor has dealt with. Thor easily just steals Iceman's soul...and it's done, and yes he can do it.That what about all of Asgard? they definetly wern't toying with him. Yet he Creel has taken blasts from Galactus and he was fine, he's absorbed all the strength of the Hulk and Hulk destroyed an astroid twice the size of Earth and didn't overload. He has shown against vastly superior fighters and not overloaded. Heck, when Surfer tried to absorb Ego he couldn't, Quasar did so that's hardly a knock against him.
Darn right, no one has done something like that so effortesly. Once again none of your examples of them even come close to easily dominating a hearld the way Sentry did. Actually it's a stated fact Surfer has shown to increase his levels higher than Hulk. Hulk kepeted jumping on Surfer's head and he was none the worse foe wear and the fact right after Abomination beat Hulk, he clashed with a WEAKENED, vastly weakened Surfer who could barely stand and Surfer easily ko'ed him.
Come on now, your underating Thor and over-rating Iceman. Yet majority of the time their arn't impregnable. Even a spaceship during the Hulk Amenesty used claws and hurt him so bad he couldn't even cast a spell. Wait now...so your saying Strange is immune to being transmutated or manipulated? 😕
All of Asgard doesn’t really equate to Odin though. Like Odin, a blast from Galactus doesn’t automatically mean he’s going all out; I mean, Hulk’s once taken a blast from Galactus and survived. Comparing Hulk’s physical strength to Sentry’s energy is basically comparing apples to oranges, but there was War Hulk who overloaded Creel with the energy from his sword. Fact is, I wouldn’t put Quasar, War, or the earth above Odin, so Sentry’s fight doesn’t put him above him either.
So he did it slightly easier. Like I said, it’s not that big deal for a top-tier to stop someone who IIRC is about as physically strong as Thing. Surfer’s never really amped himself above Hulk from his own power. In one of their first clashes, when Surfer stopped Hulk’s attacks, Surfer had to be infused with a gamma-powered machine that made his strength work the same way as Hulk’s. When Hulk stomped on Surfer’s head, he wasn’t shrugging it off, since his teeth were clenched and he had to shield himself to stop the attacks. As for Abomination, the very issue after he beat the crap out of Hulk, he was depowered to half his strength, so Surfer only beat up the Abom that every one else, including She-Hulk, beat. Hulk on the other hand, proved to be physically superior when he broke through a field that none of the Defenders, including Surfer, could break free from.
Not at all. Thor has a physical body; therefore, he’s vulnerable to a flash-freeze. If Iceman can freeze the Stranger’s eye beams, Thor shouldn’t be a problem there. If Strange’s shields aren’t enough, then he can freeze time. It’d be much easier for him then. And I’m not saying he’s necessarily immune to transmutation, but that I wouldn’t say that because Thor has been transmutated, Strange would be.
Originally posted by Accel
He still didn’t have all his attention focused on the bands when Namor or Hulk broke them. Frost Giants can be as strong as they want, but if they’ve never even attempted a flash-freeze Thor, then there’s no saying he’s immune to it. Thor could go for the soul steal, but then who’s to say he can pull it off before Iceman freeze’s him?All of Asgard doesn’t really equate to Odin though. Like Odin, a blast from Galactus doesn’t automatically mean he’s going all out; I mean, Hulk’s once taken a blast from Galactus and survived. Comparing Hulk’s physical strength to Sentry’s energy is basically comparing apples to oranges, but there was War Hulk who overloaded Creel with the energy from his sword. Fact is, I wouldn’t put Quasar, War, or the earth above Odin, so Sentry’s fight doesn’t put him above him either.
So he did it slightly easier. Like I said, it’s not that big deal for a top-tier to stop someone who IIRC is about as physically strong as Thing. Surfer’s never really amped himself above Hulk from his own power. In one of their first clashes, when Surfer stopped Hulk’s attacks, Surfer had to be infused with a gamma-powered machine that made his strength work the same way as Hulk’s. When Hulk stomped on Surfer’s head, he wasn’t shrugging it off, since his teeth were clenched and he had to shield himself to stop the attacks. As for Abomination, the very issue after he beat the crap out of Hulk, he was depowered to half his strength, so Surfer only beat up the Abom that every one else, including She-Hulk, beat. Hulk on the other hand, proved to be physically superior when he broke through a field that none of the Defenders, including Surfer, could break free from.
Not at all. Thor has a physical body; therefore, he’s vulnerable to a flash-freeze. If Iceman can freeze the Stranger’s eye beams, Thor shouldn’t be a problem there. If Strange’s shields aren’t enough, then he can freeze time. It’d be much easier for him then. And I’m not saying he’s necessarily immune to transmutation, but that I wouldn’t say that because Thor has been transmutated, Strange would be.
Captain Britain broke them pretty effortesly and if Dr.Strange has to focus on just maintaining the bands, he would be excluded from the fight as what else could he do if he has to focus on maintaining control. From what I recall they did, and he didn't even phase Thor due to having a connection to Gaeea. Er? a Thunder God who has battled Surtur, Kurse, Mangog would not be fast enough to stop a mutant from freezing him? come on. Plus every time he does the soul steal it's instant. Plus the fact even Sentry can go multiple lightspeed so he really could speedblitz majority of the team quick, and sadly he could do it.
Come on now your going to downgrad Asgard? Gods? Well considering Odin said no matter what he threw at him he absorbed it so he had to BFR. If Creel effortesly took on Asgard and your Odin you wouldn't pull some powerful attacks? Er? Well considering War Hulk was meant to battle Celestials moot point. No, but Quasar can absorb and redirect infinite amount of energy due to the nega bands.
Slightly? you kidding he did it vastly easier than all you listed, and even mentioned Morg another Herald who didn't do it that easy until he got the WOL. Terrax can use the power cosmic to amplify his strength also yes actually Surfer has, fresh off the victory from Hulk and still bragging a weakened Surfer dominated Abomination. I mean dominated. Naaaa...Surfer shrugged those blows off from a seriously pissed off Hulk. You have proof Abomination was depowered, because I have the tie-ins and don't recall it ever being stated he was depowered by half. Right, would look bad if Surfer did it now since all Hulk is just a melee fighter. Meh! She Hulk has beat the Champion. On this board you don't include PIS/CIS
You can't simply freeze energy blasts, that doesn't even make any scientifical scene. Yes, yes mutants and comic book world but it's not possible. Strange isn't simply going to instantly freeze time, especially with the likes of Sentry who literally could see it coming and with his speed would stop it. There is no one on the other team who could even stop him. Strange if anyone has a higher degree to be transmuted..he's just human.
Strange DOES have some immunity to being transmuted. In fact, once by Nightmare WHILE in Nightmare's realm, NM tried to turn him to stone. Strange simply said: "No." and it didn't happen.
Now, the only one who was able to transmute him was Dormammu, and Strange reversed it almost immediately. Sersi is no Dormammu.
As for the bands, they are more often than not unbreakable. Only twice or so (?) have they been broke. Once when Strange was k.o'd and once when Franklin Richards' universe allowed Hulk to break them. -edit- Captain Britain broke 'em? WTF?
Old Strange WOULD be the big guy on these teams, the new Strange would not be.
Originally posted by long pig
Strange DOES have some immunity to being transmuted. In fact, once by Nightmare WHILE in Nightmare's realm, NM tried to turn him to stone. Strange simply said: "No." and it didn't happen.Now, the only one who was able to transmute him was Dormammu, and Strange reversed it almost immediately. Sersi is no Dormammu.
As for the bands, they are more often than not unbreakable. Only twice have they been broke. Once when Strange was k.o'd and once when Franklin Richards' universe allowed Hulk to break them.
Old Strange WOULD be the big guy on these teams, the new Strange would not be.
Some but not complete immunity, basically magic users trying to transform strange with magic... meh!
Dormammu transforms people in a completly different manner you can't even compare the two.
Plus Captain Britian.
Manipulating molecules is just that no matter what powers are behind it.
Strange has had so much control over his own molecules that once he was dispersed into billions and billions of simple atoms and he brought himself back together. Actually, he did the same with Spiderman.
Sersi won't be turning Strange into anything. He probably could turn her into something, though.