The only real chance someone has using Force powers on Anakin is in the beginning of the fight, where there is some distance between opponents, but when Anakin comes close and fights with blades, your a goner, like you said(Subjekt)in some other thread, he is just to fast, combined with his raw power and physical strength, he is unstoppable.
Originally posted by Count Makashi
Yes, but Asajj isn't strong in the Force as Revan.
But Dooku could be. And even if Revan was exponentially more powerful with Dooku in the force (which I would give a big "Hell No" to), it doesn't mean that he would have a chance to use his powers or that they would be much more than a nuisance to Anakin.
Originally posted by jollyjim311
But Dooku could be. And even if Revan was exponentially more powerful with Dooku in the force (which I would give a big "Hell No" to), it doesn't mean that he would have a chance to use his powers or that they would be much more than a nuisance to Anakin.
What do you mean could be? Judging from what we know of Revan, Dooku, and other sith, the only ones that are on his level or above or Sidious and Exar Kun(excluding the ancient sith). Dooku is not anywhere near Revan's force abilities.
Originally posted by ((The_Anomaly))
Anakin would whoop Revan in a saber duel. But a Force battle would go to Revan. Overall I think its too close to call given Anakin's much superior Saber skill.
What kind of logic is that? We don't have anything definitive on Revan's saber skill, so by default Anakin whoops him? Nevermind that Revan was #1 in his order. Nobody is disputing that there are too many sources NOT to give a saber duel to Anakin, but "whoop" is hardly the word I will use for their duel.
Originally posted by Advent
I mean, just look at the bullshit you posted on behalf of Kavar.
But I can make this job a little easier for you here!
Quote from KOTOR:
It was initially believed by the Mandalorians that Kavar, the "famed Jedi Guardian" will lead the Jedi to help Republic during the Mandalorian Wars.
From KOTOR II:
A Jedi Master once said this about Kavar: "It was Kavar's plan—he was always the greatest tactician among us. And had seen more war than the rest of us."
From this comment, it is evident that Kavar was an intelligent person and was also very experienced as he participated in more battles then all other Jedi Masters of his age. Kavar was also known to have fought in the Great Sith War of Exar Kun. His popularity was so high that Mandalorians believed that Kavar will actually lead the Jedi to help Republic during the Mandalorian War before the events of JCW.
When Jedi Exile meets Kavar, he instructs her about all Saber Forms. He is an expert in Saber Combat as he is the battlemaster of the Old Republic and trained many Jedi in Saber Combat. And he mastered following Saber Styles: Ataru, Shien, Niman and Juyo. he also was a practitioner of Jar Kai. All this is evident from the game itself.
Regarding his help to Exile, he helped Exile by eliminating several enemies during the unrest in Onderon.
Contrary to all this I have not seen much from Cin Drallig. He was known to have mastered Form I and Form VI and thats it. And Dralling did not held a reputation of an intelligent person like Kavar and did not participated in any major war that would give him some real experience in combat. So it is safe to rate Kavar higher then Dralling in all categories.
Originally posted by Advent
Thank you for being completely irrelevant. How does getting a description ("titantic", "epic", etc.) indicate anything about a lightsaber duel, as you said 'all these cases'? Oh? What's that? They don't?
In the official blogsNow, can you provide me with any proof that it was specifically, and undoubtedly just a saber duel, as Nebaris' initial post implied? Thought not, so go back to the sandlot, junior.
It was actually stated in the Malak's profile in the official Star Wars Blogs section that Revan killed Malak in a "titanic duel". Now what does the word "duel" tells you? It gives an expression that a saber duel took place between Revan and Malak and the word titanic suggests that it was an "epic" duel. And last time I checked, the word "duel" is used to describe a Saber duel in case of fights between Jedi.
This case does indicate that an epic duel took place between Revan and Malak.
Originally posted by Advent
So, because he's merely got his lightsaber pointed down, and whatnot, it was a straight lightsaber duel? If that's the case Count Dooku never tried to assault Obi-Wan with Force lightning in AotC, simply because to anyone who saw just that part where Dooku is about to bring his blade down on Obi-Wan, it would've looked as if they were dueling the entire time.
Originally posted by Advent
Thanks for, again, proving nothing. For all we know, they had a huge Force battle initially, and ended it off in a short, two second samurai saber duel, or similar circumstances. We don't know what happened, and you can't make a deduction based off the evidence we currently have. Too bad, so sad.
Originally posted by Advent
2. The above cases suggest nothing about straightforward lightsaber combat, nor do they prove much of anything, except that the duel was seemingly close; which means that Revan didn't utterly demolish Malak.
But then again the above cases do suggest that a Saber duel took place between Revan and Malak and one case suggests that it was a "titanic duel" or an "Epic duel" and thus we have an indication of some sort.
Originally posted by Advent
That just furthers my point. Thanks for the support.
What I said that it was not stated in the SW Databank that "Malak's Forces were nearly unstoppable." and what was actually stated in the SW Databank is that "Malak was nearly unstoppable". The choice of words are clear here. Terms such as "Malak" and "Malak's Forces" are not the same thing. When you use word "Malak", then you are talking about him and not about his Forces. This is a matter of common sense.
Originally posted by Advent
Wow, you're not lying at all. Let's see the quote from the databank:"Malak was nearly unstoppable, but the Republic emerged from that epic conflict victorious, as the Star Forge was eventually destroyed."
It says "Malak", not whatever you've suggested. So, what are you smoking? Furthermore, even if it did, it really doesn't matter, because if you had any grasp over the English language (you don't), you'd know that nearly the entire paragraph was dedicated to talking about the Republic against Malak's forces, likewise, it states that the Republic won due to the fact that Star Forge was destroyed, so we can make an inference through that, that it was insinuating Malak was nigh unconquerable, because of all the support he had at his disposal (Star Forge, Bastila, etc.).
Originally posted by Advent
Again, you have no grasp over the English language. It's clearly indicating that the Star Forge's infinite supply of forces are what is making him "nearly unstoppable", hence the beginning, and end of the lines talking about "Republic forces", and "Malak's forces".
The things that were making Malak himself nearly unstoppable are:
- The help of Star Forge itself.
- The strong presense of Dark Side on Star Forge that fueled his power.
- The captured Jedi he kept in his chamber (for feeding or Draining purposes) during the fight to replenish his energies if necessary.
Now Star Forge was indeed churning out end-less supply of ships as well but that suggested the case of making "Malak's Forces nearly unstoppable" and not the Malak himself. The ships were aiding Malak's Forces outside the Star Forge and they were obviously not helping Malak during his fight against Revan. So you supposition is only partly true and not fully true as I used the choice of words used in the SW Databank and some other missing details (from the Databank) to explain the whole sittuation to back my case. So much for your proficiency in English.
Originally posted by Advent
Even if you don't want to believe such, the quote is up for interpretation, ergo you cannot say that "Ooh! Malak himself is nearly unstoppable", and act as if it matters much, because it can be said both ways, and you can't prove yours as being absolutely correct (neither can I, but that's not what I'm trying to do anyways).
Originally posted by Advent
^
You see, if I want to take down your argument, I will. It's not hard, I just have to take time I'm not going to take, because in my perspective, your posts are pathetic, and the one you made in response to mine was needlessly lengthy, because it didn't prove much of anything. [/B]
You did destroyed my argument in one thread but this does not means that you can do this in all cases and subjects. Thanks for your in-complete analysis of the situation in this thread.
Originally posted by Kadesh
Dueling does not always mean you fight with swords this and that. For example legend if i were to duel you, it means i could duel you in a debate, in singing or wrestling ^.~Now a duel in starwars does not always mean a "clash of sabers". It could mean a force fight as well
But the vision of Duron does indicates that a Saber clash took place between them. Anyways! I will soon know the answer as I have asked the relevant KOTOR author about this and am waiting for his response.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
hmm!But the vision of Duron does indicates that a Saber clash took place between them. Anyways! I will soon know the answer as I have asked the relevant KOTOR author about this and am waiting for his response.
Where? I only saw Revan standing over Malak's body with his saber ignited, it's not like he would have it turned off just because he wanted to use the force as well...
Originally posted by Advent
Wow, mommy, Revan might have mastered one or two more forms than Anakin Skywalker! That means jack shit.Ooh, a [b]Prodigal Knight
? I want to be a Prodigal Knight, but then again, what does "proving to be a Prodigal Knight" have to do with this discussion?Anakin proved his worth by defeating Count Dooku on the Invisible Hand, and he could very well be the numero uno swordsman in a stronger Jedi Order of thousands (as well as the galaxy), and even if wouldn't consider him as such, whomever is ahead of him is more adept, and more skilled than Revan, or Malak (e.g. Yoda, Mace).
But, then again none of that matters, because Revan is a Prodigal Knight.
No, Anakin can take him in bladed combat, him being a Prodigal Knight doesn't change that. [/B]
Ooo...I think someones in love...
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Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Bullshit? I have posted no bullshit regarding Kavar here
Obviously you've misinterpreted "bullshit", as something false, when all I meant was that it was: a) irrelevant, and b) doesn't prove a damn thing. For example,
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Then kavar instructed Jedi Exile in the arts of Saber Combat and she turned out to be one of the most successful fighters in her age and also helped her in difficult situations during fights.Kavar was also known to practise Force Lightning (even as a Jedi). I would rate Kavar much higher then Dralling.
Do you realize how ****ing stupid that sounds? For one, if you're going to make a claim about a person, at least prove up on it. Where does it state Kavar knows Force lightning, as no source I've seen indicates such? Then, I'd like you to tell me who gives a shit if he instructed the Exile, because Drallig instructed several students, as he was the head lightsaber instructor. And guess what? Two of his students just happen to be considered the greatest Jedi team ever to grace the galaxy, Anakin Skywalker, and Obi-Wan Kenobi (source: Casualty Report: Order 66). So, your point really holds no water.
Cin is also said to be fully trained in all forms of bladed combat, save for Vaapad ("although well versed in nearly all styles of the lightsaber, except for Form VII..."; Visual Dictionary, p. 33), and on top of that, he's noted as being "one of the Order's top swordsmen", yet Anakin took him out in a few swings, even with using the other hand to manually choke the padawan.
It's even noted that "Drallig's skills marked him as a priority target for elimination by Lord Vader". Now, I don't even know where you got the impression I was arguing that Cin > Kavar, but it looks like your case for proving the opposite sucks. You have no real evidence suggesting Kavar was better, nor "much higher" in the rankings. Try again, chump change.
The entire reason I even mentioned Cin was to show just how dominate Anakin is in lightsaber combat, even against a man considered to be one of the best, knows multiple forms, and said to be able to take down Grievous. You took my post out of context, and argued against something non-existent.
and most of the points are true and based on what he demonstrated in KOTOR II and some other sources.
Except, again, they prove literally nothing.
If you had played KOTOR II and also KOTOR I and paid attention to the quotes/events then you would have known what I said.
I own KotOR 2, but that's irrelevant, I don't have to have it in my possession, or even play it. It's your job to provide strong evidence to back up your assertions, and the like. Not mine to replay a sub par game.
From this comment, it is evident that Kavar was an intelligent person and was also very experienced as he participated in more battles then all other Jedi Masters of his age.
That's wonderful, we've seen intelligent Jedi masters who haven't seen much combat at all, your point? How does being a strategist on the battle field account for jack shit when comparing him with another being? Again, nothing.
In reality, just because someone was mentioned as "intelligent" doesn't really mean too much; Darth Vader (OT) was intelligent, but would be decimated by the top dogs of the PT in a saber battle.
Kavar was also known to have fought in the Great Sith War of Exar Kun.
Oh my Buddha, what does that prove? It only shows that he's more well experienced, but as we know, experience hasn't had too much of an impact on the outcome of duels (see: Vodo/Kun, Odan/Kun, Anakin/Dooku, etc.), nor does it prove he's powerful. Tott "Small fry" Doneeta fought in the Great Sith War, too, is he more powerful than Drallig, FFS?
His popularity was so high that Mandalorians believed that Kavar will actually lead the Jedi to help Republic during the Mandalorian War before the events of JCW.
Thanks for repeating yourself. 👆 I think I disregarded it the first time for a reason. Drallig skill was so great that he was said to be able to take down General Grievous, a man who's killed more Jedi than Kavar has digits.
When Jedi Exile meets Kavar, he instructs her about all Saber Forms. He is an expert in Saber Combat as he is the battlemaster of the Old Republic and trained many Jedi in Saber Combat. And he mastered following Saber Styles: Ataru, Shien, Niman and Juyo. he also was a practitioner of Jar Kai. All this is evident from the game itself.
Thanks for repeating yourself. 👆 I think I covered this above, but for kicks, I'll tell you that Cin was also the Battle master of the "Golden Age of the Jedi", an expert in almost all forms (except Vaapad), and has taught said forms to thousands of students. All this is evident from actual source material.
Regarding his help to Exile, he helped Exile by eliminating several enemies during the unrest in Onderon.
Wow, he defeated some guards! "OMFGKAVAR=GOD".
Contrary to all this I have not seen much from Cin Drallig.
You haven't even shown any evidence that Kavar's better, except for opinions, and beliefs (not factual), miscellaneous shit like "he taught Exile!" (big ****ing deal), and that he mastered some forms. Now, compare this to narration telling us how good Cin is, reputable masters commenting on his skill, and other things. Even if he's not that much greater (though, he intuitively is), it's apparent that he, at the very least, rivals him. Not that any of that was the point, though.
He was known to have mastered Form I and Form VI and thats it.
See above; you're lying, and/or uninformed.
And Dralling did not held a reputation of an intelligent person like Kavar
And this is indicative that Drallig is lower than Kavar in dueling prowess? No, it's not. We can deduce that Drallig is wise, otherwise he wouldn't be instructing students whatsoever.
and did not participated in any major war that would give him some real experience in combat. So it is safe to rate Kavar higher then Dralling in all categories.
No, it is safe to say you're a biased KotOR fanboy, and that you have no idea what you're talking about. You've haven't provided a decent quantity (or even any) amount of viable evidence, and the things you've written don't put Kavar on a higher level than Cin, anyways.
Trying to be smart! huh!
I don't try, son. As much is apparent through my days here. If I was "trying to be smart", then I'd been using someone else's vocabulary; which is something I've noticed you to be doing lately.
It was actually stated in the Malak's profile in the official Star Wars Blogs section that Revan killed Malak in a "titanic duel". Now what does the word "duel" tells you?
duel, n.
A prearranged, formal combat between two persons, usually fought to settle a point of honor.
I don't know how you automatically think "it was a lightsaber duel!", simply because the last part of the word is in there. For example,
"The two entered into a spectacular duel -- a contest between the most powerful practitioners of the Force's light and dark sides." (Yoda, Star Wars databank).
Now, as we know, Yoda and Sidious' battle in RotS was not purely a lightsaber duel, nor was the majority of it involving lightsabers. Despite this, it's still noted as a "duel", ergo you're entire premise is faulty.
A duel by definition, even Star Wars definition, isn't 3/4 lightsaber combat, or a full on bladed battle, it's just two people trying to kill each other. If we believed what you say to be true, Yoda and Palpatine must've not battled using the Force. I mean, you do realize back in olden times, a duel was settled with guns? Alexander Hamilton, and Aaron Burr ring a bell?
It gives an expression that a saber duel took place between Revan and Malak and the word titanic suggests that it was an "epic" duel. And last time I checked, the word "duel" is used to describe a Saber duel in case of fights between Jedi.
Well, then you need to check again, because you've been "examination" was disproved; see above, chump change.
And you don't need to continuously tell me things that aren't really relevant, or have already been addressed (i.e. "epic", etc.). You sound like a broken record.
This case does indicate that an epic duel took place between Revan and Malak.
But, that's not what I asked, so try again, chump change. If you need some refreshing, I asked: how does getting a description ("titantic", "epic", etc.) indicate anything about a lightsaber duel, as you said 'all these cases'? Oh? What's that? They don't?
Indeed, mere description imply absolutely zilch in regards to what type of combat took place, which was my point, and the point that completely flew over your head like Superman.
I never suggested that Revan and Malak were dueling there all the time
So, then, why did you respond to when I asked Nebaris if it was a straight lightsaber duel, as his post insuiated?
but an epic duel did took place between them as indicated from the above case.
If you seriously say that one more time, I'm going to reach through my monitor, and kick your ass. What relevance does this have, at all? The only thing it seemingly means is that it wasn't a squash match, which says that Revan didn't win easily; so, it's rather irrelevant to bring up. My original point regarding by what margin did Revan defeat him was more or less to say that we can't say it was the aforementioned (a slaughter).