Ryu Hayabusa vs Urien and Gill

Due to the retarded 15 minute edit rule,

Originally posted by JacopeX
Actually, he is right. You are somehow a fan of Hayabuse, but you will never admit that Hayabusa can be beaten. Even against two messiah god like fighters. That is plain pathetic.

Alex can't beat Gill, that was a plot device... 😬 In SF3 it explains it all as you play it.

Alex got beat by Ryu.

I still don't see the reason as to why Urien and Gill can't be killed by the True Dragon Sword, as it was able to kill a far more fierce opponent such as this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XQBz5xrRX4

As I said on the second page, Ryu would lose if he was unarmed. I assumed Snafu excluded the weapons in NG in order to make the fight fair; it turned out it didn't. Armed, Ryu would kill Urien and/or Gill; I don't know why this is a 1 on 2 match. Unarmed, Ryu would lose against both of them. Try making this into VE and Murai vs Gill and Urien. The thong brothers would get wtfpwned.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XQBz5xrRX4

Originally posted by King Nothing
Gill parted an ocean, sky, and a mountain with a flick of his hand no green energy in his hands were even necessary. I think that may beat the VE's feat, not to mention Gill did that and he is several hundred times smaller then the VE.

*Waits for Ashtar to come and b*tch and say it has nothing to do with NG despite the fact that it shows what the Vigoor Emperor can do* 😆

Is that pic from Ninja Gaiden, I have yet to see that one until now.

Originally posted by King Nothing
Is that pic from Ninja Gaiden, I have yet to see that one until now.

The Book of Evil Deities

The ancestor of all Evil Deities, Vigoor, began to devour the territory of Gurdu , beginning at its center. During endless solar and lunar eclipses, the earth shook and split, the seas dried up only to flood into existence again, and intense winds swept over everything and fires burned down all of existence, ignoring even the concept of time itself. Eventually, Gurdu lost his strength, and the world once again plunged into the chaos from which it had come.

Source: http://www.ninjafortress.com/story.htm

It's true The Vigoor Empire may have split earth, but it occurred "during endless solar and lunar eclipses". It's not like The Emperor just got pissed and punched the ground. It's impressive, but given time, Gill could probably do the same.

Originally posted by StyleTime
It's true The Vigoor Empire may have split earth, but it occurred "during endless solar and lunar eclipses". It's not like The Emperor just got pissed and punched the ground. It's impressive, but given time, Gill could probably do the same.

Secondly, it said "Vigoor" split the Earth, not the Emperor. The Emperor is infused with more power than just Vigoor's. Read:

The Book of the Future

The land that the Evil Deity Vigoor once held as his final territory has become this, the land of Vigoor. The treachery of the Dark Dragon also occurred here, and this was where the Ancient Tribes lived. That is why their descendants, us the Fiends, have taken over control of these lands. With this land as a barrier, the power of Vigoor is limited only to this Earth.

Vigoor is the Demon of Destruction and the Deity who creates history; when the decadence of this world has piled up, he will return in a blaze of all-destroying flame and recreate the world. Chaos, like the floods on the banks of a great river, will fulfill this world once again, and we will be the first recipients of this fulfillment. Evolution has and always will begin from here, the land of Vigoor. It has been several hundred years, since the Supreme Fiend Gogohn established what would eventually become the Vigoor Empire here on these lands.

If a new warrior of the Dragon Lineage shall appear, the Holy Emperor shall be infused with the power of the Evil Deities. After seven days, from the unity of His Majesty with the Dark Dragon once again, we Fiends will be blessed with an exquisite harmony.

Source with all text: http://www.ninjafortress.com/story.htm

Vigoor is the ancestor of all evil deities meaning he's not the only one. Vigoor does not just possess Vigoor's power but the evil deities' as well. In addition, he possesses the power of the Dark Dragon. All this occurs when Ryu appears to fight him/her, as explained in the text above.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
That doesn't matter since this is what Vigoor has already done:

The Book of Evil Deities

The ancestor of all Evil Deities, Vigoor, began to devour the territory of Gurdu , beginning at its center. During endless solar and lunar eclipses, the earth shook and split, the seas dried up only to flood into existence again, and intense winds swept over everything and fires burned down all of existence, ignoring even the concept of time itself. Eventually, Gurdu lost his strength, and the world once again plunged into the chaos from which it had come.

Source: http://www.ninjafortress.com/story.htm

The entire earth was not split. Earth was meant as the ground in that area splitting from an earth quake he created, not him simply pulling the world apart. He simply made an earth quake, a VERY powerful earth quake but not an earth splitting earth quake. As far as seas go, back then many things were over exaggerated (as in many things in many things in The Book Of Evil Dieties) to add dramatic affect, I doubt the seas dried up, probably large lakes in the area dried up but not entire seas.

It's sort of obvious that this is a bit of a legend or tale, similar to those in bibles because it says the fires burned down all of existence but in later years where Ninja Gaiden takes place, existence seem fine to me. And none of this world wide destruction seems to be present in the game. I'm not saying the VE is not powerful (it would be foolish to think otherwise) but he isn't planet destroying material. If he parted the planet, then who put it back together?

Originally posted by King Nothing
That site was cool (I love Ninja Gaiden) but...

The entire earth was not split. Earth was meant as the ground in that area splitting from an earth quake he created, not him simply pulling the world apart. He simply made an earth quake, a VERY powerful earth quake but not an earth splitting earth quake. As far as seas go, back then many things were over exaggerated (as in many things in many things in The Book Of Evil Dieties) to add dramatic affect, I doubt the seas dried up, probably large lakes in the area dried up but not entire seas.

It's sort of obvious that this is a bit of a legend or tale, similar to those in bibles because it says the fires burned down all of existence but in later years where Ninja Gaiden takes place, existence seem fine to me. And none of this world wide destruction seems to be present in the game. I'm not saying the VE is not powerful (it would be foolish to think otherwise) but he isn't planet destroying material. If he parted the planet, then who put it back together?

The Book of Evil Deities

Then, a great change occurred. During the throes of the unending destruction, the body of Gurdu himself split into fourths. Each part became a Deity itself, controlling Sentiment, Wisdom, Immorality, and Creation. Eventually they would come together to restore shape to the world again, but in their panic-stricken state after their birth they still had little power.

And no, nothing is exaggerated. Splitting the Earth, drying up seas, and burning down existence means just that, but things are restored back to the way they were by the work of Gurdu.

Edit: If you read more carefully, it said the Emperor's power extends around the Earth.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
Sorry I hadn't put the rest of the text down:

The Book of Evil Deities

Then, a great change occurred. During the throes of the unending destruction, the body of Gurdu himself split into fourths. Each part became a Deity itself, controlling Sentiment, Wisdom, Immorality, and Creation. Eventually they would come together to restore shape to the world again, but in their panic-stricken state after their birth they still had little power.

And no, nothing is exaggerated. Splitting the Earth, drying up seas, and burning down existence means just that, but things are restored back to the way they were by the work of Gurdu.

Originally posted by King Nothing
I think that old Japan though their country was the world. If the VE had these world ending powers, why didn't he just use them on Ryu? I really think it's an exaggeration.

It said the four deities restored shape to the Earth, so if he didn't split it in two, they wouldn't have anything to work for, unless this means he magically warped the Earth which I know he didn't. Also read the edit.

He was, and was killed in matter of time before he succeeded. If he couldn't destroy the Earth, Ryu wouldn't have fought him in the first place.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
It said the four deities restored shape to the world, so if he didn't split it in two, they wouldn't have anything to work for.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
He was, and was killed in matter of time before he succeeded. If he couldn't destroy the world, Ryu wouldn't have fought him in the first place.

Also, even if it is not an exaggeration, (which I think it is) it was never stated how long it took the VE to accomplish such a feat. For all we know, It could've took 100 years.

One more thing, it says his power extends around the earth, but that most likely means, it extended as far as the eye could see.

Originally posted by King Nothing
The Deities do have something to work for, the restoration of Japan.

He can destroy the world, no doubt. I mean he can't destroy it instantaneously. He can do it, but in a matter of time. Not with just one blow.

Also, even if it is not an exaggeration, (which I think it is) it was never stated how long it took the VE to accomplish such a feat. For all we know, It could've took 100 years.

One more thing, it says his power extends around the earth, but that most likely means, it extended as far ast the eye could see.

-Point is, he can. Evidence was given saying that Vigoor could, and I've yet to see anything saying Gill can pull off a feat that comes close to what Vigoor alone can do. Have you read my other post on this page where it explains why the Emperor is more powerful than Vigoor himself?

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
-Where are you getting Japan from considering the text mentions the destruction of the Earth more than once.

- Point is, he can. Evidence was given saying that the Emperor could, and I've yet to see anything saying Gill can pull off a feat that comes close to what Vigoor alone can do. Have you read my other post on this page where it explains why the Emperor is more powerful than Vigoor himself?

-My point is, given time, Gill, Urien, or any one on a similar or greater level can destroy the world, given time. There is also evidence that Gill can avoid destruction of the world seeing as how he is said to be able to save it and create his own paradise, impervious to worldly destruction.

Originally posted by King Nothing
-Earth does not always have to mean the entire world, it can mean the ground, dirt, or soil as well.

-My point is, given time, Gill, Urien, or any one on a similar or greater level can destroy the world, given time.

-Back that up please.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
"Could" isn't going to cut it unless there's something claiming that he can pull it off.

Secondly, it said "Vigoor" split the Earth, not the Emperor. The Emperor is infused with more power than just Vigoor's. Read:

The Book of the Future

The land that the Evil Deity Vigoor once held as his final territory has become this, the land of Vigoor. The treachery of the Dark Dragon also occurred here, and this was where the Ancient Tribes lived. That is why their descendants, us the Fiends, have taken over control of these lands. With this land as a barrier, the power of Vigoor is limited only to this Earth.

Vigoor is the Demon of Destruction and the Deity who creates history; when the decadence of this world has piled up, he will return in a blaze of all-destroying flame and recreate the world. Chaos, like the floods on the banks of a great river, will fulfill this world once again, and we will be the first recipients of this fulfillment. Evolution has and always will begin from here, the land of Vigoor. It has been several hundred years, since the Supreme Fiend Gogohn established what would eventually become the Vigoor Empire here on these lands.

If a new warrior of the Dragon Lineage shall appear, [b]the Holy Emperor shall be infused with the power of the Evil Deities. After seven days, from the unity of His Majesty with the Dark Dragon once again, we Fiends will be blessed with an exquisite harmony.

Source with all text: http://www.ninjafortress.com/story.htm

Vigoor is the ancestor of all evil deities meaning he's not the only one. Vigoor does not just possess Vigoor's power but the evil deities' as well. In addition, he possesses the power of the Dark Dragon. All this occurs when Ryu appears to fight him/her, as explained in the text above. [/B]

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
"Could" isn't going to cut it unless there's something claiming that he can pull it off.

Secondly, it said "Vigoor" split the Earth, not the Emperor. The Emperor is infused with more power than just Vigoor's. Read:

Source with all text: http://www.ninjafortress.com/story.htm

Vigoor is the ancestor of all evil deities meaning he's not the only one. Vigoor does not just possess Vigoor's power but the evil deities' as well. In addition, he possesses the power of the Dark Dragon. All this occurs when Ryu appears to fight him/her, as explained in the text above.

I apologize. It's late. It was a typo. But Eclipse_XII my friend, just hear me out.

Now, Vigoor IS the Holy Emperor just with the power of the dieties as well. The dieties honestly won't add much, if anything, to Vigoor's power here. If you recall, the Evil Dieties were too weak to actually stop Vigoor. In fact, they had to use 13 dragons that evolved independently in power from the dieties to combat Vigoor.

In this age of panic, the Serpent, Deity of Creation was the only one of the Deities who managed to keep some semblance of sanity. The Serpent gave birth to a tiny presence, something that no other being would even notice... the seeds of life. These seeds managed to take hold and grow in the storm of chaos, and ever so slightly began to evolve, eventually becoming thirteen Dragons, whose destinies were to be found in battle. The Dragons waged an endless battle against Vigoor, who never ceased in his attempts to bring the world into chaos of hatred. Eventually the Dragons were able to banish Vigoor to the very ends of the world.

Furthermore, the Dark Dragon is canonically the lowest of all the dragons as shown here. Hell, the Dark Dragon even suffers from low self esteem.

However, it was at this time that the youngest and lowest in position of the Dragons, the Dark Dragon, summoned the Hatred with its feelings of inferiority.

Throw in the fact that all of the aforementioned dieities and their offspring are defeated at the hands of humans as shown here.

The Dark Dragon, now full of evil intent, joined with Vigoor and his spawn of Evil Deities to further capture the territory of Gurdu . This conflict continued throughout the eons of history, and during its struggle the first spark of human life appeared in the form of the Ancient tribes. Of course, old conflicts never cease, and even in the age of the Ancient tribes of the Dragon Lineage and Evil Deities continued their battle for tens of thousands of generations, a struggle that finally ended when the members of the Dragon Lineage were able to seal away the Evil Deities and their spawn.

You basically have Vigoor = Emperor. The only "feat" we have of Vigoor is splitting the Earth in an indefinite amount of time possibly not even under his own power and scorching the ground in front of Hayabusa.

Also, I'd like to take this time to point this out to everyone. The scorching of the earth in front of Hayabusa is the combined power of all the evil dieties, the Dark Dragon, and Vigoor.

Yes, the combined efforts of all those guys are still well under planet-busting level. I'm sure some of you knew already, but the texts of Ninja Gaiden are mostly hyperbole and should be taken as such. These dieties, save for maybe Gurdu, are not nearly as powerful as some would have you believe.......and Hayabusa still needed a plot device to win.

Hayabusa loses to Urien and Gill.

Originally posted by Eclipse_XII
-Back that up please.

Also,there is also evidence that Gill can avoid destruction of the world seeing as how he is said to be able to save it and create his own paradise, impervious to worldly destruction. The evidence of Gill destroying the world is as plain as day, he can't do it all at once but he can. The time it takes for VE to do these feats is not specified.

Originally posted by StyleTime
I'll concede that. It won't matter much in this fight though.

I apologize. It's late. It was a typo.

Now, Vigoor IS the Holy Emperor just with the power of the dieties as well. The dieties honestly won't add much, if anything, to Vigoor's power here. If you recall, the Evil Dieties were too weak to actually stop Vigoor. In fact, they had to use 13 dragons that evolved independently in power from the dieties to combat Vigoor.

In this age of panic, the Serpent, Deity of Creation was the only one of the Deities who managed to keep some semblance of sanity. The Serpent gave birth to a tiny presence, something that no other being would even notice... the seeds of life. These seeds managed to take hold and grow in the storm of chaos, and ever so slightly began to evolve, eventually becoming thirteen Dragons, whose destinies were to be found in battle. The Dragons waged an endless battle against Vigoor, who never ceased in his attempts to bring the world into chaos of hatred. Eventually the Dragons were able to banish Vigoor to the very ends of the world.

Furthermore, the Dark Dragon is canonically the lowest of all the dragons as shown here. Hell, the Dark Dragon even suffers from low self esteem.

However, it was at this time that the youngest and lowest in position of the Dragons, the Dark Dragon, summoned the Hatred with its feelings of inferiority.

Throw in the fact that all of the aforementioned dieities and their offspring are defeated at the hands of humans as shown here.

The Dark Dragon, now full of evil intent, joined with Vigoor and his spawn of Evil Deities to further capture the territory of Gurdu . This conflict continued throughout the eons of history, and during its struggle the first spark of human life appeared in the form of the Ancient tribes. Of course, old conflicts never cease, and even in the age of the Ancient tribes of the Dragon Lineage and Evil Deities continued their battle for tens of thousands of generations, a struggle that finally ended when the members of the Dragon Lineage were able to seal away the Evil Deities and their spawn.

You basically have Vigoor = Emperor. The only "feat" we have of Vigoor is splitting the Earth in an indefinite amount of time possibly not even under his own power and scorching the ground in front of Hayabusa.

Also, I'd like to take this time to point this out to everyone. The scorching of the earth in front of Hayabusa is the [B]combined power of all the evil dieties, the Dark Dragon, and Vigoor.[B]
Yes, the combined efforts of all those guys are still well under planet-busting level. I'm sure some of you knew already, but the texts of Ninja Gaiden are mostly hyperbole and should be taken as such. These dieties, save for maybe Gurdu, are not nearly as powerful as some would have you believe.......and Hayabusa still needed a plot device to win.

-Those aren't the evil deities smart guy. They are the 13 dragons the Deity of Creation spawned to wage war against Vigoor and his spawn of evil deities.

- 😆 No offense or anything but you do know that the Dark Dragon at that time (which is the dawn of history according to the prologue) is absolutley NOTHING compared to how powerful the Dark Dragon was by the end of NG? All this time it has been growing in power for eons. Murai possessed the Dark Dragon at it's highest state of power.

-Don't leave things out, such as this: However, in that age of chaos all of the bloodlines of Ancient tribes were mixed, and the form and nature of the Ancients has been carried on by us, the Fiends.

Knowing that, those are no ordinary humans, as they are ancestors of Ryu, Doku, Rachel, Alma, Nicchae, Ishtaros, Marbus, and all the rest of the fiends in NG.

-Vigoor is not = Emperor. The Emperor w/Power of the evil deities + the Dark Dragon >> Vigoor alone.

-Yeah, an indefinite amount of time. It took a matter of seconds to turn a seemingly endless garden into a hellish battleground by just being present. Hayabusa made a last second action that saved himself from melting in molten rock.

-Which took a matter of seconds to do and this doesn't counter the fact that Vigoor alone can split the Earth given however much time he needs, whereas Gill can't unless something says that he can. Emperor's >> Vigoor's considering he/she's not only infused with Vigoor's power but with all the evil deities', and the Dark Dragon's.