I believe terms are being mixed here.
There's a difference between a power feat and a skill feat, that's the problem. I'll give an example:
Let's say I had a character that controlled visible light. As a novice with these powers I could create flash bangs, hard light constructs, intense heat, bend light to make myself invisible, etc. Common light based attacks.
However, with time and experience with these powers (and intelligence) I may be able to learn how to pull off other feats, being as light is simply a particular frequency of the electromagnetic spectrum, like manipulating other wavelengths (since all energy is related).
My power is still control over light, but through experience and my intellect I'm able to expand my abilities and it's applications.
The same goes with telepathy. Piggy backing TP on laser scanner beams is not a simple telepath feat. Anyone with TP could learn to do it, but it's not simply a common application of the powerset, just as controlling radiowaves isn't a common application of control over light. You have full use of your telepathic powers, but Jim Rhodes is your mind, not Emma, and Jim Rhodes isn't, say, Reed Richards or some other super genius that may think of that feat as a possible application of the power. Emma learned how to perform that feat through years of experience. It's not a common telepathic ability that Rhodes would have prior knowledge of (and you only have Rhode's experience, not Emma's).
That was my reasoning in my decision that you couldn't bypass the scanners as Emma did, and that was based on Goober's own statement in the draft process that you get the powers but you don't get the power character's skills, just full use of the powers. Full use of the powers doesn't include skill feats (see my gun analogy in previous post).
If Goob forgot that he said that it's a common mistake, especially considering all of the information he's been processing as of late.
No sense whatsoever.
Not to mention Goob has also said the opposite twice. It's likely that Goob forgot what he'd said earlier in the draft process (which stands to reason because he's gone through hundreds of PMs and posts in the last month or so). Just like when he approved Leo's time manipulation attack and then retracted it.
You get full use of the powers, that's granted and a given, but nuanced skill feats are up to the mind character.
Jim Rhodes is not piggy backing telepathy on laser scanner beams. I doubt Rachel Summers could (or has).
Maybe if your mind was a genius or had telepathic experience of a similar stature (like the Dane/Backlash amalgam) it would be viable.
Originally posted by illadelph12How am I going too far with this 😕
You guys are all going a little too far with this.Death's Head II has the ability within himself to assimilate [b]knowledge
. He simply downloads knowledge from the source into his databanks (and it's only knowledge, no powers), he's not taking the physical harddrive (per se). That's fine and legal.If he were to, say, take Ironman's repulsor cannon itself (the actual cannon) that would be illegal. If he downloads the specs for it and has a means to create the weapon himself it would be legal.
And yes, self BFR is an automatic loss. [/B]
You can not deny that he is absorbing abilities from another person and taking them into his being.
Once again I point out that there are three categories.
Mind
Body
Power
Leo amped up his Mind category by taking in BP's knowledge and Fighting ability. There is no denying it, he has even said so himself he made his character stronger by absorbing abilities from another. If he can do that to his Mind category then you can not take that ability away from the other category's.
There is nothing different from what I did to my Powers category and what Leo did for his Mind category. None at all. So either I am allowed to do my Absorbing ability at the end of match or Leo doesn't get his either way I am fine but keep the rules the same for everyone 😬
Originally posted by Newjak
How am I going too far with this 😕You can not deny that he is absorbing abilities from another person and taking them into his being.
Once again I point out that there are three categories.
Mind
Body
PowerLeo amped up his Mind category by taking in BP's knowledge and Fighting ability. There is no denying it, he has even said so himself he made his character stronger by absorbing abilities from another. If he can do that to his Mind category then you can not take that ability away from the other category's.
There is nothing different from what I did to my Powers category and what Leo did for his Mind category. None at all. So either I am allowed to do my Absorbing ability at the end of match or Leo doesn't get his either way I am fine but keep the rules the same for everyone 😬
My God...
Newjak, I'm going to say this one last time:
Power copying was banned outright.
Gaining knowledge is not power copying, and is not banned.
Downloading Black Panther's Spinning Baboon Palm Strike is not gaining a power. It's not like he could download Cyclop's optic blasts or anything. That would be banned.
Gaining powers is banned.
Originally posted by illadelph12If it is banned then Leo can not do it.
My God...Newjak, I'm going to say this one last time:
Power copying was banned outright.
Gaining knowledge is not power copying, and is not banned.
Downloading Black Panther's Spinning Baboon Palm Strike is not gaining a power. It's not like he could download Cyclop's optic blasts or anything.
Gaining [b]powers
is banned. [/B]
He can not be allowed to do something that isn't consistent with every other Category. Just because it is the mind category doesn't mean it gets special treatment. If you can not absorb the physical attributes from the body or powers from the powers category then you should not be able to absorb mind from the mind category.
And if it was so minimal then why did Leo so proudly proclaim he just got stronger. Could it be because he got every Fighting feat and Tech feat and Reaction feat of the Black Panther.
So either everyone gets the same kind of treatment on this and can do it or no one should be able to do it.
Originally posted by Newjak
If it is banned then Leo can not do it.He can not be allowed to do something that isn't consistent with every other Category. Just because it is the mind category doesn't mean it gets special treatment. If you can not absorb the physical attributes from the body or powers from the powers category then you should not be able to absorb mind from the mind category.
And if it was so minimal then why did Leo so proudly proclaim he just got stronger. Could it be because he got every Fighting feat and Tech feat and Reaction feat of the Black Panther.
So either everyone gets the same kind of treatment on this and can do it or no one should be able to do it.
Leo's not doing it.
He's downloading information, and it's perfectly legal. He's not copying powers.
And it is consistent. Experience gained in previous rounds carries over.
Originally posted by illadelph12That is Bullshit Ill.......
Leo's not doing it.He's downloading information, and it's perfectly legal. He's not copying powers.
And it is consistent. Experience gained in previous rounds carries over.
The fact is my guy isn't copying powers during a match and he isn't duplicating them. He is simply taking them after they are dead.
And yes what Leo does do is Absorb abilities from another character. I'm tired of the mind category getting such special treatment in this thing.
And experience isn't taking every memory from another person by using your powers and abilities to do so.
Originally posted by illadelph12I like that your done. I'm not the one trying proclaim that what Leo is doing isn't Absorbing abilities and the fact is yes he can get powers from this. If he absorbed another person like Spiral he just gained their powers as well. So yes it does and can grant other abilities.
Are you serious?Newjak...
I'm done man.
Originally posted by Newjak
If he absorbed another person like Spiral he just gained their powers as well. So yes it does and can grant other abilities.
That's a good point, we can't pick and choose when he should be allowed to absorb knowledge and if that knowledge can include powers (such as Spiral or others) then it falls into the same category as the no power stealing/copying/absorbing rule.
Originally posted by ScooblessOddly enough I made that point the first or second time I talked about this 😬
That's a good point, we can't pick and choose when he should be allowed to absorb knowledge and if that knowledge can include powers (such as Spiral or others) then it falls into the same category as the no power stealing/copying/absorbing rule.
He doesn't gain powers. That's the point you're missing. If he downloads Cyclops he would gain skill as a pilot, marksmanship, and leadership qualities/battle tactics. He would not be able to shoot optic blasts. He doesn't gain or copy powers, and the fact that you can not, or are simply unwilling to see this apparent fact is comical.
I'm not even discussing the point any further (for the third time).
I'm actually through discussing it. I will make no more statements on this topic. The distinction is very clear, and the amalgam amping limit is skyfather.
Getting smarter is perfectly legal and has my approval as a judge.
Originally posted by illadelph12
He doesn't gain powers. That's the point you're missing. If he downloads Cyclops he would gain skill as a pilot, marksmanship, and leadership qualities/battle tactics. He would not be able to shoot optic blasts. He doesn't gain or copy powers
But if he downloaded Iron Fist, Dr Strange, Dr Druid, Spiral (or any magic user) or any of a host of others then he would get powers.
Originally posted by illadelph12
the amalgam amping limit is skyfather.
The amalgam meshing limit is skyfather, using a single character to gain any additional power up (which is what's going on here) is limited at Extremis Iron Man