Can you handle the Truth?

Originally posted by Da Pittman
Religion has always been a major deciding factor in how and who people vote for. How do you think that a gay can become president when they can't even get the same rights as a straight American in almost all the states, even in Democratic states? Hell there are still state constitutions on the books that ban Atheists from holding office or becoming even a boy scout. http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/StateConstitutions.htm

My understanding is they do have the same rights in all states...

What right do they not share?

Originally posted by inimalist
debatable

I could do a docu-drama about any of the famous atheists today and make them look all happy and fun in their personal lives

I do accept your point though, and it is quite likely because atheists aren't fighting for basic freedoms and equality

Thus the solution to implicit atheist oppression is explicit atheist oppression!

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
My understanding is they do have the same rights in all states...

What right do they not share?

Originally posted by Da Pittman
Well I just named a few right their, gays can't get married in most states and some states their still laws on the books that say they can't hold public office and you have the "don't ask, don't tell" policy in the military. Boy scouts are allowed to ban Atheist but still allowed to promote themselves in public schools. You have GW Sr. say that Atheist shouldn't even be classified as citizens or patriots.

I'm pretty sure that "being told you should be classified as a citizen and patriot by the President" is not a right that anyone actually has.

Originally posted by Da Pittman
Well I just named a few right their, gays can't get married in most states and some states their still laws on the books that say they can't hold public office and you have the "don't ask, don't tell" policy in the military. Boy scouts are allowed to ban Atheist but still allowed to promote themselves in public schools. You have GW Sr. say that Atheist shouldn't even be classified as citizens or patriots.

Gay men have the exact same rights as straight men in every state when it comes to marriage- they have the right to marry a woman. There is no law that says a gay man cannot get married in any state.

Your saying gay people are excluded from public office in some states? Evidence?

I am aware of the military- that's a sad thing.

Evidence of boyscouts banning atheists?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Thus the solution to implicit atheist oppression is explicit atheist oppression!

forget I said anything

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Gay men have the exact same rights as straight men in every state when it comes to marriage- they have the right to marry a woman. There is no law that says a gay man cannot get married in any state.

Your saying gay people are excluded from public office in some states? Evidence?

I am aware of the military- that's a sad thing.

Evidence of boyscouts banning atheists?

A little history on the Boy Scouts and Atheism http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/scoutaclu.htm

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I'm pretty sure that "being told you should be classified as a citizen and patriot by the President" is not a right that anyone actually has.

Edit: My bad, re-read over my post and I was talking about Atheist in my post as to holding office and forgot to put in Atheist instead of "they". Sorry about that.

Originally posted by Da Pittman
A little history on the Boy Scouts and Atheism http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/scoutaclu.htm

I love that she never asks if her kid wants to be in scouts or if the scouts will let him in. Just skips straight to the "I've heard bad things and will immediately start being a dick." Granted, she was right but still . . .

Your scout stuff is a decade a go and hetros and gays still have equal rights when it comes to marriage.

Heteros are allowed to marry the people they love. Why should we not allow gays to marry the ones they love?

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Heteros are allowed to marry the people they love. Why should we not allow gays to marry the ones [b]they love? [/B]

it depends how you define the inequality.

imho, marriage is one of the most aesthetic arguments to have on the issue.

Inheritance and insurance policies should be way higher on the priorities. Gays not being able to wed, to me, is not as bad as a gay man being denied his partner's insurance coverage because the company doesn't recognize homosexual couples.

However, marriage stands as a good battle ground that exposes a real inequity, and I guess is emblematic of all the related issues. It is just more nuanced legally. If the right is to have a legal marriage, then things are equal, if the right is to marry who you love, then they aren't. Where people get the idea they have a "right" to marriage is where I fall off.

lol, sorry, that turned into a pseudo rant

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Your scout stuff is a decade a go and hetros and gays still have equal rights when it comes to marriage.

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Heteros are allowed to marry the people they love. Why should we not allow gays to marry the ones [b]they love? [/B]

Lots of men and women don't get to marry the person they love...how the hell do you plan on enforcing that law.

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Lots of men and women don't get to marry the person they love...how the hell do you plan on enforcing that law.

Considering marriage already gets abused (as you pointed out) why should it matter at all?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Considering marriage already gets abused (as you pointed out) why should it matter at all?

Who said we shouldn't amend it? I just said they do have equal rights...

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Who said we shouldn't amend it? I just said they do have equal rights...

So a man and a woman that love each other can get married to each other by law, a man and a man that love each other can't get married to each other by law, a woman and a woman that want to get married can't get married to each other by law so how is this equal?

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Your scout stuff is a decade a go and hetros and gays still have equal rights when it comes to marriage.

"A pair of couples, one lesb1an and another agnostic, challenged a lease the Scouts signed with the city of San Diego allowing them to operate recreational facilities on park land. They said the deal violated the Establishment Clause because of the Scouts' professed reverence of God. In addition, they said they were averse to using the facilities because of the Scouts' stated policy of excluding gays and atheists."

http://atheists.org/blog/index.php/2009/01/06/boy-scouts-denied-again

"According to the Boy Scouts, atheists cannot be morally straight or the best kinds of citizens; therefore, they have no place in the organization either as scouts or as adult leaders. People who admit to being atheists are kicked out regardless of their past accomplishments -- in other words, the amount of good a person has done either in their lives or in the Boy Scouts is less important than simply not believing in any gods. "

http://atheism.about.com/od/religiousright/ig/Christian-Propaganda-Posters/Boy-Scouts-Fight.htm

It doesn't make a difference if it was ten years ago or not, they have an established ruling that allows them to do what ever they want and still get government funds.

inimalist, I was using marriage as a shorthand for the benefits it grants- the actual marriage seems less important than the rights it confers. As long as marriage is the only way to get equal treatment under the law though, and as long as it is denied to homosexuals there will be inequality.

Originally posted by Da Pittman
http://atheism.about.com/od/religiousright/ig/Christian-Propaganda-Posters/Boy-Scouts-Fight.htm

Wow . . . I can't imagine what people might have against atheists. It's not like they're going out of their way to be assholes or anything. Oh, wait.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Wow . . . I can't imagine what people might have against atheists. It's not like they're going out of their way to be assholes or anything. Oh, wait.

Generalizations good ✅

Originally posted by Bardock42
Generalizations good ✅

Literal irony!