Can you handle the Truth?

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I don't follow you. What is not manifest in my life?

If you had the holy spirit of a loving god within you, this fact would change you and your actions would then also change. This change would be evident in your actions. Just imagine what you would be like if you had the holy spirit of a loving god within you inhabiting your life. You would be forever patient, and absolutely forgiving. You would never hate, and you would dedicate your life to helping other people to relieve them from their suffering. In Buddhism we have a word for this. It is called a Bodhisattva. I am sure you are not a Bodhisattva. However, keep working on it.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If you had the holy spirit of a loving god within you, this fact would change you and your actions would then also change. This change would be evident in your actions. Just imagine what you would be like if you had the holy spirit of a loving god within you inhabiting your life. You would be forever patient, and absolutely forgiving. You would never hate, and you would dedicate your life to helping other people to relieve them from their suffering. In Buddhism we have a word for this. It is called a Bodhisattva. I am sure you are not a Bodhisattva. However, keep working on it.

actually, God is helping you to do just that. But He isn't going to control you like some puppet or robot - He lives in you and tells you what your actions should be, but He is not controlling you. He gives you a choice. It's up to you whether to follow Him, or not.

...how do you know for sure that we're not "changed", anyway?

Originally posted by Jaeh.is.Awesome
actually, God is helping you to do just that. But He isn't going to control you like some puppet or robot - He lives in you and tells you what your actions should be, but He is not controlling you. He gives you a choice. It's up to you whether to follow Him, or not.

...how do you know for sure that we're not "changed", anyway?

I'm talking about influence. Wouldn't you think that an all loving god would be an ultimate influence on our lives?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I'm talking about influence. Wouldn't you think that an all loving god would be an ultimate influence on our lives?

what do you mean about being an ultimate influence? Can please you explain further?

Originally posted by Jaeh.is.Awesome
what do you mean about being an ultimate influence? Can please you explain further?

If you can be influenced by a person, then the influence from a god would be an ultimate influence.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If you can be influenced by a person, then the influence from a god would be an ultimate influence.

well, yeah 😄... it actually all comes down to choice again. God is not forcing you to follow Him or to be influenced by Him or His Word. It's still your choice... God chose not to make you some puppet that He could control and make do stuff, instead, He influences your everyday decisions, but it's still up to you whether to act upon those influences or not.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If you had the holy spirit of a loving god within you, this fact would change you and your actions would then also change. This change would be evident in your actions.

* how did you know? 😕

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Just imagine what you would be like if you had the holy spirit of a loving god within you inhabiting your life. You would be forever patient, and absolutely forgiving. You would never hate, and you would dedicate your life to helping other people to relieve them from their suffering.

* there's no absolutes... in the Bible, people with Holy Spirit can lose patience, would also hate... allow me to explain... there are certain instances that a person should be angry:

"Be angry, and do not sin: do not let the sun go down on your wrath,"
Ephesians 4:26

"And this account of them is really true. Because it is true, rebuke them sharply, deal sternly, even severely with them, so that they may be sound in the faith and free from error,"
Titus 1:13

"Then Saul, who also is called Paul, filled with the Holy Spirit, looked intently at him,
And said, O full of all deceit and all fraud, you son of the devil, you enemy of all righteousness, will you not cease perverting the straight ways of the Lord?"
Acts 13:9-10

* there are instances that a person should hate:

"Hate evil, love good; Establish justice in the gate. It may be that the Lord God of hosts will be gracious to the remnant of Joseph."
Amos 5:15

"Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good."
Romans 12:9

* the Bible teaches no hypocrisy... Christians are also people like you who knows how to be angry, to hate and to lose patience... saying that if the Holy Spirit is in a person, that person should be forever patient and absolutely forgiving is purely a misinterpretation on how the Holy Spirit work in a person's daily life...

Originally posted by peejayd
* how did you know? 😕

Originally posted by Jaeh.is.Awesome
...how do you know for sure that we're not "changed", anyway?

* mr.shakyamunison, please justify yourself by saying we - as Christians - do not manifest something in our lives... how do you know? do you see us everyday? if not, that is one of your most judgmental posts ever made... 😉

Originally posted by peejayd
* mr.shakyamunison, please justify yourself by saying we - as Christians - do not manifest something in our lives... how do you know? do you see us everyday? if not, that is one of your most judgmental posts ever made... 😉

* majority does not equal truth... same majority voted for the same president, blah, blah, blah... you get my point... politics... 😛

Did I miss the part where replies stopped relating to the point?

Look at this:
1. Shaky makes an assertion about christians
2. PJ calls him on it on the grounds that he might not see x-tians every day
3. KK notes that Shaky most likely does see members of that faith every day
4. PJ responds with "majority does not equal truth" and something about politics

Am I the only one a bit lost about how the argumentum ad populum fallacy relates to making an assertion about a group of people with which one is likely very familiar? Especially since the speaker claims to have followed the faith in question for 20 years?

God is not forcing you to follow Him or to be influenced by Him or His Word. It's still your choice... God chose not to make you some puppet that He could control and make do stuff, instead, He influences your everyday decisions, but it's still up to you whether to act upon those influences or not.

Is it likely that a perfect and omnipotent being, one likened to a Parent in many ways would be incapable of successfully influencing those who accept his goodness and seek to please him? If mortal parents are capable of success, even without compulsion, then wouldn't an omnipotent God be also? And to an even greater extent, considering its ubiquity! My parents' lessons, deep though they may be, do not inhabit my 'soul' in the way you claim the Holy Spirit does.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I'd just like to say that given that the vast majority of americans are christian, it is in fact likely that he sees them everyday.

from what you're implying, that's the downside of choice. We have the freedom to do what we want and sometimes... some people just don't follow what god intends them to do. But, God loves us THAT much that He lets us have freedom to make choices.

Kind of like how parents let their kids do something on their own...

I'm not well versed in Religion so bare with me but I've always wondered, that if God is in fact real, and he would condemn us if we do not believe in him and so on (Old Testament?), then why give us free will, and the ability to think for ourselves and not present and factual prove of his existence outside of a old book written by man? Of course people are going to stray into different facts of worship and so on. Isn't it human nature?

Also, if God does exist, and his responsible for everything, has he ****ed up royally? I mean looking at the state of the world?

Originally posted by Jaeh.is.Awesome
from what you're implying, that's the downside of choice. We have the freedom to do what we want and sometimes... some people just don't follow what god intends them to do. But, God loves us THAT much that He lets us have freedom to make choices.

Kind of like how parents let their kids do something on their own...

No, shaky seeing christians everyday is not like how parents do something on their own. It is not like the downside of choice. It is not like the freedom to do what we want. It is EXACTLY WHAT I SAID. Please only post your rebuttals when they actually have something to do with what I said. Because right now this post in complete nonsense.

Originally posted by King Kandy
WTF are you talking about? This is not related to what I said in any way, shape, or form. I said shaky sees Christians everyday. How does that have ANYTHING to do with the "downside of choice", "God loving us", or "freedom of choice"? I did not imply one damn thing in that post and you have changed it into this speculative gibberish.

No, shaky seeing christians everyday is not like how parents do something on their own. It is not like the downside of choice. It is not like the freedom to do what we want. It is EXACTLY WHAT I SAID. Please only post your rebuttals when they actually have something to do with what I said. Because right now this post in complete nonsense.

I wasn't posting a rebuttal. I was making a comment, actually. on what you posted. It wasn't a rebuttal...

Regardless, the ideas of "omnipotence" and "freedom of choice" cannot coexist.

Originally posted by Ordo
Regardless, the ideas of "omnipotence" and "freedom of choice" cannot coexist.

I personally believe that giving freedom you yourself created is a gesture of love and power. If you truly love someone you'll give them the freedom to do as they please - and let them grow in the consequences of their actions, whether it be good or bad. Also, it's easy to just control someone if you can. It takes true power and superiority to let them have their freedom, but still be up top.

Originally posted by Jaeh.is.Awesome
I wasn't posting a rebuttal. I was making a comment, actually. on what you posted. It wasn't a rebuttal...

Originally posted by King Kandy
Your comment had nothing to do with what I posted though.

oh... really? 😄 I thought it did. oh well, it was a random observation then, I guess. Sorry if it was confusing. 🙂

I said shaky sees christians everyday. If you can find how that implied any argument about "freedom of choice", you win a cookie.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I said shaky sees christians everyday. If you can find how that implied any argument about "freedom of choice", you win a cookie.

lol, i guess i misunderstood the sentence and stuff. it was just a random observation, I guess.

*stares at the cookie and sighs*