Originally posted by Lord Melkor
Well, she didn`t spoke about him in detail, because it was Lo Qi who told us about his nature and his past. I remember this. We only knew that he was powerful and dangerous programme from Oracle, and his name.
Nope. You've mised the important reference there. Sirin nearly got it right.
Originally posted by Alkaselzer
"You're comparing this to the current situation with the Virus, are you not?" Klez asks. "Victory requires genocide."
"That's not really an accurate comparison," says Lo Qi, "as it will not cause genocide.
"Melkor- you could not be more wrong. After all, when it comes to analysing threats and determining victory, which Machine's purpose was it to define that? And to be best at defining it?"
"Well, we spoke about the two basic purposes of Society- survival and development. We have the war itself- it was the matter of survival for the Machines, as I assume that human victory would mean the eradication of artificial intelligence.
But then, the war was won, but sky was "lost", as you described it. If humans were eradicated instead of being used as energy source, some Machines would manage to exist, so we can say that Machine Society would survive that. But wouldn`t it deny the Machines the chance to develop? We were wondering before whether the large, well-spread society is the one more developed, and consensus was that most advanced societies actually stop spreading at certain point. Though I think that limiting society to very small numbers may negatively influence its ability to develop, especially than in Machine Society everyone has more defined purpose, so it may create difficulties if there are not enough beings to fullfill every role. And the lack of sufficient energy sources could not allow for much technological development as well, with resources being utilized for mere survival. But definately not using humans to provide energy would mean an end to most individuals in Machine Society, and I believe it is the basic goal of society to ensure the survival of its individual members.
So I believe that Machine Society can develop and thrive much better thanks to Matrix. But there is the matter of Sennacherib`s point of view- I am not sure if he considered this issue as a matter of development, but rather survival- for him it was either the survival of humankind or Machines- since victory meant the total eradication of enemy, and he was right that Humans can become a grave threat, as we now see with the Virus being released. Am I wrong in this?"
Lo Qi actually laughs.
"My! No. No, really no, not at all. I mean to say, yes, you are wrong. I see what you are thinking, but no, really not. Sennacherib's idea- and it was entirely plausible- is that society on minimum survival levels- which many were prepared to accept- would then start to grow and develop again, this time without threat.
"Where I said you were wrong before- the fact of the matter is, no-one thought Sennacherib was wrong. He was the expert. Everyone agreed that Humanity was a threat, and a potentially fatal one. The real issue with Sennacherib is that he was right, and he knows it, and everything that has happened since, up to and including you being here before me now, goes to prove it.
"Sennacherib wasn't just talking, you know. He is a highly sophisticated Machine. He had a plan, and it was workable."
"No supposed about it. Sennacherib IS the perfect General. And the System got exactly what it asked for.
"After all, such an approach only makes sense. You design something for purpose, you make it as good as you can make it. So the first Matrix was prfect. And it totally failed, in as much as the term has meaning. Oddly enough... something that already happened with their Perfect General. Sennacherib... is too good. They programmed him to always win and that's exactly what he will do, and if it means sacrificing most of his own kind, he doesn;t care. He's programmed to win."
"Exactly. Perfection means just that, it is pure. And something pure is inflexible, and if it is not what you want, then you are in trouble. Melkor, you said earlier that the General and the System disagreed on his purpose. No. Not so. They were very much agreed on his purpose. What the System found out- rather late- is that that purpose... wasn't actually what they wanted..."
"Well, but what about definition of victory? Other Machines saw it diffrently, and I agree with them- total eradication of your enemy should never be the main goal of war, and it never justfies killing your own people. Though I assume the main reason why other Machines rejected this idea was their survival instinct?"
"Once more, it is Sennacherib's role to define victory, and the definition was not disputed, and again, events since then have very much proved him right. Look at what has happened here. The activities of Humans may have doomed Machinekind. A threat that need never have happened.
"I am sorry if it offends your sentiments. But Sennacherib was right. If this is war, then it can END in only one way. Extinction.
"And once more... no, you are very wrong. You must learn to accept wisdom, not simply repeat the conlsuons you have already reached."
"There was no redefinition of victory. Sennacherib's logic could not be refuted. The objective of victory was abandoned. Did not Sennacherib say this? That by removing the sun, the Humans made sure the war never ended? Sentinement, incidentally, that some of you expressed when you first met me. That the war was not over. That amused me, that you were about to meet the greatest mind on war there is, who would very much agree."