Originally posted by Starhawk
Charity is something you give willingly. Taxes are different. It should be run on taxes and not charity.Not all of them CAN provide back, disabled people and mentally impaired are a prime example, it doesn't mean they deserve less of a quality of health care or a right to live.
In certain Tax forms you're asked to provide any information if you help a certain charity.
Disable people are exactly that...disable and there is NO law agaisn't that. Pretty understandable reasons....however, the jobless junkie down the street gets sick from an overdose and goes to the hospital and gets treatment and later when he gets better gets high again. It's not contributing to the commonwealth in any way. Rather than helping he is hurting it. Every citizen capable of contributing to the commonwealth should get health care. Those that don't...end up hurting the state. Is that fair for you?
Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
In certain Tax forms you're asked to provide any information if you help a certain charity.Disable people are exactly that...disable and there is NO law agaisn't that. Pretty understandable reasons....however, the jobless junkie down the street gets sick from an overdose and goes to the hospital and gets treatment and later when he gets better gets high again. It's not contributing to the commonwealth in any way. Rather than helping he is hurting it. Every citizen capable of contributing to the commonwealth should get health care. Those that don't...end up hurting the state. Is that fair for you?
They still have a basic human right to live and not suffer. And unfortunately we can't pick and choose. I would rather have everyone including the junkies get the same health care then a two tiered system where the rich get better care. No solution is perfect but mine is better then the alternative.
And yes I think people should get the same health care whether or not they contribute to the economy.
Originally posted by Starhawk
They still have a basic human right to live and not suffer. And unfortunately we can't pick and choose. I would rather have everyone including the junkies get the same health care then a two tiered system where the rich get better care. No solution is perfect but mine is better then the alternative.And yes I think people should get the same health care whether or not they contribute to the economy.
They also have the basic human right to work. But they don't choose to work and be productive members of the state...why should they then receive the same health care as a member who does provide for the commonwealth?
I completely understand your notion of everyone's equality. But that same responsiblity of equality comes with the duty to provide back. Charity is there for them...if they want health care then work and provide back to the state.
Can't get more socialist than that.
Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
They also have the basic human right to work. But they don't choose to work and be productive members of the state...why should they then receive the same health care as a member who does provide for the commonwealth?I completely understand your notion of everyone's equality. But that same responsiblity of equality comes with the duty to provide back. Charity is there for them...if they want health care then work and provide back to the state.
Can't get more socialist than that.
I'm not 100% percent sure about the states, but in Canada the problem is not people not wanting to work. And yes even the lazy deadbeats still have a right to live and not suffer. We don't get to play executioner just because was disagree with their lifestyle.
Let me make it clear that my argument is restricted only to health matters. I have no problem with the fact that rich people have bigger houses or faster cars or other perks, that is acceptable. But health care is, or at least should a right of all people regardless of station in life. And disabled people should not have to live off of charity they deserve health care just as much.
Originally posted by Starhawk
I'm not 100% percent sure about the states, but in Canada the problem is not people not wanting to work. And yes even the lazy deadbeats still have a right to live and not suffer. We don't get to play executioner just because was disagree with their lifestyle.Let me make it clear that my argument is restricted only to health matters. I have no problem with the fact that rich people have bigger houses or faster cars or other perks, that is acceptable. But health care is, or at least should a right of all people regardless of station in life. And disabled people should not have to live off of charity they deserve health care just as much.
now, if the state provides this care to people, why does it also have the right to restrict private entrepraneuers who wish to practice medical procedures and the like not offered or not convenient enough in the public system?
Originally posted by inimalist
now, if the state provides this care to people, why does it also have the right to restrict private entrepraneuers who wish to practice medical procedures and the like not offered or not convenient enough in the public system?
Because of the fact that it leads to a two tier system where the rich end up getting better health care.
Fixing the health care systems does not have to mean sacrificing the private sector. And the rich will always have a greater access to better health care. That won't change unless we socialize our entire government. But these days, in America, there is a huge disparity between the healthcare people can afford. When you go to a public healthcare facility, the treatment you recieve severly lacks in quality. However, when you check into an exclusive hospital you recive far superior treatment. While the law states that you can't be denied healthcare due to your inability to pay, you're 1) not getting equivalent healthcare, and 2) you're going to spend the rest of your professionally poor career having that bill hanging over your head. And what good does that do for the poor individual who's "working hard to acheive the American dream"? A working-class mother doesn't need that kind of crap to deal with while she's trying to better herself and raise her children.