Originally posted by RonnieBarkay
Does anyone agree that the hole prinicple of religion has been tarnished by the fact that 'jedi' was officially classified as a religion?! I mean surley that means anything could be a religion if enough people believe in it??
It all depends on rather you are a Jedi or not. You heathen, you. 😆
What would a fundamentalist Jedi be like? 😱
Originally posted by RonnieBarkay
Does anyone agree that the hole prinicple of religion has been tarnished by the fact that 'jedi' was officially classified as a religion?! I mean surley that means anything could be a religion if enough people believe in it??
Well yeah. If enough people belived in it and came under the criteroia for religion then yeah. Jedi would be a religion, dont know if enough people follow it though. I know that Tolkeinsm is actually a religion ive spoken to Tolkeinists.
Er I just did a quick google on it...people actually follow the religion!
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well yeah. If enough people belived in it and came under the criteroia for religion then yeah. Jedi would be a religion, dont know if enough people follow it though. I know that Tolkeinsm is actually a religion ive spoken to Tolkeinists.Er I just did a quick google on it...people actually follow the religion!
Hmmmm, but then doesn't that put into question the whole point of religion, the fact that they're believing in something that is REAL or has happened, they may be right or wrong but they at least have a reason for believing in it.. What do Jedi followers believe that after death they are transported to the death star to do battle with the Sith for eternity 😆 ??
Originally posted by RonnieBarkay
Hmmmm, but then doesn't that put into question the whole point of religion, the fact that they're believing in something that is REAL or has happened, they may be right or wrong but they at least have a reason for believing in it.. What do Jedi followers believe that after death they are transported to the death star to do battle with the Sith for eternity 😆 ??
As far as I know the concept of the jedi is partially taken from the concept of Zen which I do belive has some basis in reality. The concept of the Tao sounds very similar to the force.
If they believe that they do battle with the sith after they die then they probably will. There was a case of two people who were clinicaly dead. The one who did not believe in the afterlife experienced nothing, the person who believed in the afterlife saw visions.
Originally posted by Alfheim
As far as I know the concept of the jedi is partially taken from the concept of Zen which I do belive has some basis in reality. The concept of the Tao sounds very similar to the force.If they believe that they do battle with the sith after they die then they probably will. There was a case of two people who were clinicaly dead. The one who did not believe in the afterlife experienced nothing, the person who believed in the afterlife saw visions.
So what your saying is that whatever people believe happens after death, thats what happens to them? I suppose everyone has their own visions of life after death..
Originally posted by Alfheim
There was a case of two people who were clinicaly dead. The one who did not believe in the afterlife experienced nothing, the person who believed in the afterlife saw visions.
there are much better explanations for that phenomenon
goooooooooooo psychology!
Originally posted by inimalist
there are much better explanations for that phenomenongoooooooooooo psychology!
Well i'll have a look but I guess all its going to say is that they are hallucinations. 🙄
Well heres the problem with the article it talks about near death expreinces. For example it talks about a man who was unconsicous and people who had operations. The two people I mentioned were DEAD. No brain activity and no heart actvity.
At the end of the day it doesnt matter if they are hallucinations, they were dead and they percieved a reality. We all die alone so it doesnt matter.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well heres the problem with the article it talks about near death expreinces. For example it talks about a man who was unconsicous and people who had operations. The two people I mentioned were DEAD. No brain activity and no heart actvity.At the end of the day it doesnt matter if they are hallucinations, they were dead and they percieved a reality. We all die alone so it doesnt matter.
If they came back to life, they were not brain dead. A brain dead person never comes back. Heart activity is not a good indication of dead. Brain activity is the true death indicator.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If they came back to life, they were not brain dead. A brain dead person never comes back. Heart activity is not a good indication of dead. Brain activity is the true death indicator.
Well bro they said that there was no brain activity. srug first time for everything I guess.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well bro they said that there was no brain activity. srug first time for everything I guess.
there is a point of near death where our tools are incapable of measuring the minor activation in the brain.
and, while you may scoff at the idea of "hallucinations" (which isn't necessarily the neurological principal, but close enough that its ok) there is considerable evidence to back this up, much more than any alternative hypothesis.
Who are these "they", let me see the thing they wrote. It is very likely that it was a 1 in a 1 000 000 000 000 recovery from almost no brain activity.
Originally posted by inimalist
there is a point of near death where our tools are incapable of measuring the minor activation in the brain.and, while you may scoff at the idea of "hallucinations" (which isn't necessarily the neurological principal, but close enough that its ok) there is considerable evidence to back this up, much more than any alternative hypothesis.
My point is even if it a "hallucination" if you have an NDE when there is no brain actvity it doesnt matter. You die alone.
Originally posted by inimalist
Who are these "they", let me see the thing they wrote. It is very likely that it was a 1 in a 1 000 000 000 000 recovery from almost no brain activity.
Well it was a porgram on televison. If I can remember the name of the program I will try and look it up. I did post something about this on this forum once but in all fairness it was some New Age crap and they were probably lying.
The program I saw was not a religous one but a scienticfic one.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Are you sure "they" are not lying to you? I have found that some Christians are not beyond twisting information to the point of a lie.
It wasnt a Christian program. It was a scientfic one. If I could remember the name of the program I would look for it on youtube.
Originally posted by Alfheim
My point is even if it a "hallucination" if you have an NDE when there is no brain actvity it doesnt matter. You die alone.
thats the thing. Just because we can't measure the brain activity, doesn't mean there isn't any. Very slight activity would not show up on an EEG but could be responsable for certain perceptions.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well it was a porgram on televison. If I can remember the name of the program I will try and look it up. I did post something about this on this forum once but in all fairness it was some New Age crap and they were probably lying.The program I saw was not a religous one but a scienticfic one.
Programs that are not scientific can do an awesome job of looking scientific. The majority of the time, people making the claim you are, are doing so with the intention of proving their ideological point, rather than scientific understanding.
I will do a literature search through the journals in a bit and see what comes up on "brain death". the technical usage of the term is only when people don't recover, so that instantly means that people who recover and have a NDE were never brain dead. In all likelyhood it is possible that the brain could stop, not be experiencing anything, then within moments kick start back on, and the part of the brain that gives us an explanation for our world (yes, this does exist) could reconstruct the experience. This would also explain why only people who believe in the afterlife experience these things. I don't think the brain would ever stop in an NDE, but brain death is a very complicated thing.
Originally posted by inimalist
thats the thing. Just because we can't measure the brain activity, doesn't mean there isn't any. Very slight activity would not show up on an EEG but could be responsable for certain perceptions.
Maybe, maybe not but we cant be sure can we?
Originally posted by inimalist
Programs that are not scientific can do an awesome job of looking scientific. The majority of the time, people making the claim you are, are doing so with the intention of proving their ideological point, rather than scientific understanding.
Thats possible.
Originally posted by inimalist
I will do a literature search through the journals in a bit and see what comes up on "brain death". the technical usage of the term is only when people don't recover, so that instantly means that people who recover and have a NDE were never brain dead.
Well if the heart can stop beating, why cant the brain stop working and recover?
Originally posted by inimalist
In all likelyhood it is possible that the brain could stop, not be experiencing anything, then within moments kick start back on, and the part of the brain that gives us an explanation for our world (yes, this does exist) could reconstruct the experience. This would also explain why only people who believe in the afterlife experience these things. I don't think the brain would ever stop in an NDE, but brain death is a very complicated thing.
Yes thats possible and you know what I bet we will never prove it a 100 percent. I bet the more you find out the more complicated things become.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/1685311.stm
The above url is not the program I saw but something about the topic. According to the article they tested 63 people who appeared to be brain dead who had NDEs.
Like they said there appeared to be no brain activity. I think it would be unfair to assume just because they had NDEs that there MUST have been some brain activity...maybe, maybe not.
Anyway I will look up brain death.