Photon/Sentry vs Surfer/Stardust/Firelord

With regards to SS destroying multiple planets at the same time, I couldn't get the scan of his energy release from Annihilation where he releases enough that Rav can't follow him, but I remember that being big.

More importantly, with regard to black holes. If we were to say that black holes created by SS were just intermediate black holes, not Super-massive ones. Wouldn't the creation of a black hole of that magnitude "thousands of solar masses" destroy planets. I mean we are talking about creating a vacuum in space that is thousands of times the mass of our Sun.

I am not physicist, but I would call that multiple planet destroying power. I will have to dig deep to find specific scans of destroying multiple planets, but given that SS usually tries to preserve life there would have to be multiple dead planets around.

SS has had no trouble distroying planets before, and his power output is legendary. Just look at Annihilation, or better yet when he added his power to MM and almost overloaded him. MM said it could have destroyed him (or something to that extent).

Originally posted by Photon009
Not really that impressive for Surfer. Especially considering later on in a Surfer arc Terrax healed from his fight with the NW/FF/Surfer and came back after Surfer fresh and wasnt scared at all, even when Surfer had Firelord and Air-Walker backing him up.

Are you talking about the morg storyline, when they went looking for him?

He pretended he was dead to avoid them. I would consider that fear, wouldn't you???

Originally posted by Jebus reborn
And yet, he still didn't put him down.
Terrax might not have stood a chance (maybe, but even then Terrax is a massive jobber, so it's hardly a comparison anyway), but it's still hardly relevant, seeing as he never put down Terrax like Surfer did.
Terrax was there to kick off Sentry's solo, and he did.

It's Surfer's own power to do so though, plus, you asked for it, and I showed you.
Plus, I see how you ignored Surfer creating a black hole earlier (which would destroy multiple planets). Not to mention, that he barely let out any energy, or even tried, when he did this.

Also, wouldn't it have been Genis destroying the planets, since Sentry wasn't outputting any energy?

Genis even using his awareness for a second, should have been able to see this though, using Genis logic on the forum.

So, why would they say this, if it's been proven faulty, many a time in comics?

It doesn't add up, and it also seems completely irrelevant to the forum.

So you're holding it against Sentry that instead of turning Terrax into gravel in one panel, Sentry was nice and gave him a chance to leave the planet? That doesnt make any sense. Sentry's feat against Terrax is far more impressive that Surfer's.

Another feat that solidly puts Sentry above Thor/Surfer types is against the Absorbing Man. Absorbing Man has effortlessly absorbed the power of Mjolnir, which has proven to be stronger than Surfer's power cosmic, yet when he tried to absorb Sentry's power, Sentry easily overloaded him.

No it's not Surfer's own power to do so. He absorbed that being and let it out in a big burst of energy. He got an external powerup, therefore it isnt under his own power. That's like Absorbing Man stealing the Power Cosmic from Surfer and then beating the shit out of the Hulk with it. It happenned, but only because Absorbing Man got an EXTERNAL powerup. And i asked for on-panel evidence of Surfer destroying multiple planets under his own power, aka WITHOUT AN EXTERNAL POWERUP.

I dont know what you're trying to prove saying Sentry wasnt outputting any energy so it mustve been Genis doing all the destroying. No, both of them were destroying multiple planets on their own, and they were both spitting out massive amounts of energy. And they were both holding back on top of that. If they didnt hold back theyre wouldve be galaxy-wide or maybe even universe-wide collateral destruction.

And i didnt ignore Surfer creating a black hole. It's just useless thats all. Genis has created black holes through not only space, but also time as well, and far easier than Surfer ever has. Hell, Genis once even did it subconsciously/accidentally. When it comes to creating portals and black holes, Surfer is even further out of his league against Photon than he is in overall power.

And Genis had lot more things to worry about than Purple Man putting pheromones in the water. He cant look at everything at once, just the most important things because if he looks at everything at once, thats what drives him insane and obviously he doesnt want that. See purple man wasnt Genis' #1 priority (probably not even top 10 because Purple Man is nothing compared to Genis in power). But for example, in his figt against Sentry and the New Avengers, fighting them was his #2 priority (his #1 priortiy throughout his entire time as "Photon" was tuning his cosmic awareness so he could see everything without going insane, which he was never able to do), so he was able to use it effectively to predict Sentry and the Avengers' moves. And thats what will happen against Surfer. Since this is a VS Forum battle, Genis doesnt have to worry about going insane, so he can make beating Surfer's ass his #1 priority if he wants, and then Surfer's royally screwed, fighting an Insane Photon Genis who knows Surfer's moves before even Surfer does.

Oh, and Stupid Rookie, in Annihilation, Surfer created a moderately sized Black Hole, yes, but it obviously didnt have enough pull to destroy multiple planets as not even Thanos who was watching close by was pulled in. So it obviously didnt have much pull. And when he stopped Ravenous from following, that was only one planet that was destroyed. He just destroyed the planet Ravenous was on, which only got Ravenous angry, but kept Ravenous away since he cant fly. And no im not talking about the Morg storyline. Im talking about the storyline a couple issues/arcs before it, when Terrax came back after Surfer wanting Revenge for Surfer stranding Terrax on that planet without his axe, and Surfer, Firelord, Air-Walker, and Nova all trying to put Terrax down H2H and failing.

I am not arguing that SS is above Genis, just so you know.

I do like how you seem to have ignored (unless I missed it) my comment about why start this tread if Genis is above Eternity and Sentry is above SS. I mean it is just spite and a reason for you to call people dumb (which it took like 3 responses for you to get to).

I want to know where it is stated that Mjolnir is more powerful than PC. I agree that thor can go toe to toe with SS, but to say that on pure power output Mjolnir is more powerful I will never believe that.

Until someone shows me Mjolnir creating life on an entire planet, almost overpowering MM, releasing the energies of the Crunch (which G said he could barely withstand), resurecting BRB (with help of course) I doubt that statement's validity.

ALso didn't SS recreate stormbreaker in that scene. I think Odin didn't even know if was possible.

Genis>>>>>Silver Surfer>>>>Stardust>>>>Sentry>>>Firelord.

Originally posted by Stupid Rookie
I am not arguing that SS is above Genis, just so you know.

I do like how you seem to have ignored (unless I missed it) my comment about why start this tread if Genis is above Eternity and Sentry is above SS. I mean it is just spite and a reason for you to call people dumb (which it took like 3 responses for you to get to).

I want to know where it is stated that Mjolnir is more powerful than PC. I agree that thor can go toe to toe with SS, but to say that on pure power output Mjolnir is more powerful I will never believe that.

Until someone shows me Mjolnir creating life on an entire planet, almost overpowering MM, releasing the energies of the Crunch (which G said he could barely withstand), resurecting BRB (with help of course) I doubt that statement's validity.

ALso didn't SS recreate stormbreaker in that scene. I think Odin didn't even know if was possible.

Wait, so because i made the thread i cant post in it? Is that what you're saying? Cause if so, that doesnt make any sense whatsoever.

And Surfer i believe has admitted that the power of Mjolnir is greater than his power. And the Godblast is more impressive that anything Surfer's PC has done. Remember, the Godblast has scared away Galactus himself, the master of the Power Cosmic. The Godblast has also hurt Exitar, and momentarily stopped the classic Juggernaut. As well as killing Those Who Sit Above In Shadow, who are basically the Skyfathers of the Skyfathers, aka theyre more powerful than Odin and the strongest pantheons.

And Surfer didnt recreate Stormbreaker. Odin did it, and Surfer just helped a little bit. It was like 75% Odin's doing, 25% Surfer's.

Originally posted by hush
Genis>>>>>Silver Surfer>>>>Stardust>>>>Sentry>>>Firelord.

No.

Genis >> Sentry >> Surfer >> Firelord >> Stardust

Originally posted by Photon009
No.

Genis >> Sentry >> Surfer >> Firelord >> Stardust

Originally posted by Photon009
So you're holding it against Sentry that instead of turning Terrax into gravel in one panel, Sentry was nice and gave him a chance to leave the planet? That doesnt make any sense. Sentry's feat against Terrax is far more impressive that Surfer's.

Originally posted by Photon009
Another feat that solidly puts Sentry above Thor/Surfer types is against the Absorbing Man. Absorbing Man has effortlessly absorbed the power of Mjolnir, which has proven to be stronger than Surfer's power cosmic, yet when he tried to absorb Sentry's power, Sentry easily overloaded him.

Originally posted by Photon009
No it's not Surfer's own power to do so. He absorbed that being and let it out in a big burst of energy. He got an external powerup, therefore it isnt under his own power. That's like Absorbing Man stealing the Power Cosmic from Surfer and then beating the shit out of the Hulk with it. It happenned, but only because Absorbing Man got an EXTERNAL powerup. And i asked for on-panel evidence of Surfer destroying multiple planets under his own power, aka WITHOUT AN EXTERNAL POWERUP.

Absorbing Man needed Surfer's powers, Surfer just needs a big energy source.

It shows what Surfer's capable of, when he releases the energy he absorbs.

Although, Surfer can easily destroy planets anyway, plus his vow that he would never take a life, might have something to do with him not destroying multiple planets... Or maybe, because Surfer has only destroyed worlds with no life on them...
Maybe.🙄

Originally posted by Photon009
I dont know what you're trying to prove saying Sentry wasnt outputting any energy so it mustve been Genis doing all the destroying. No, both of them were destroying multiple planets on their own, and they were both spitting out massive amounts of energy. And they were both holding back on top of that. If they didnt hold back theyre wouldve be galaxy-wide or maybe even universe-wide collateral destruction.

Wow... universally wide...
God, I wondered why some of these comments are so dumb...
Now I find out that Sentry can take part in affecting the universe, with the destruction he can dish out...

Originally posted by Photon009
And i didnt ignore Surfer creating a black hole. It's just useless thats all. Genis has created black holes through not only space, but also time as well, and far easier than Surfer ever has. Hell, Genis once even did it subconsciously/accidentally. When it comes to creating portals and black holes, Surfer is even further out of his league against Photon than he is in overall power.

I really don't care what the f*ck Genis does from anywhere in a comic, with regards to Surfer.

A black hole trumps what Sentry did.

Originally posted by Photon009
And Genis had lot more things to worry about than Purple Man putting pheromones in the water. He cant look at everything at once, just the most important things because if he looks at everything at once, thats what drives him insane and obviously he doesnt want that. See purple man wasnt Genis' #1 priority (probably not even top 10 because Purple Man is nothing compared to Genis in power). But for example, in his figt against Sentry and the New Avengers, fighting them was his #2 priority (his #1 priortiy throughout his entire time as "Photon" was tuning his cosmic awareness so he could see everything without going insane, which he was never able to do), so he was able to use it effectively to predict Sentry and the Avengers' moves. And thats what will happen against Surfer. Since this is a VS Forum battle, Genis doesnt have to worry about going insane, so he can make beating Surfer's ass his #1 priority if he wants, and then Surfer's royally screwed, fighting an Insane Photon Genis who knows Surfer's moves before even Surfer does.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I really don't care about the rest, as you basically just admitted that his awareness doesn't work like it is said to in the forum.

Also, did I say anything about Surfer or Genis? No, I don't believe I did, so you can stop hyping him up.

Originally posted by Photon009
Oh, and Stupid Rookie, in Annihilation, Surfer created a moderately sized Black Hole, yes, but it obviously didnt have enough pull to destroy multiple planets as not even Thanos who was watching close by was pulled in. So it obviously didnt have much pull.

rarely has a thread sounded so twatty from all corners.

Originally posted by manorastroman
rarely has a thread sounded so twatty from all corners.

regardless.

Originally posted by Photon009
Wait, so because i made the thread i cant post in it? Is that what you're saying? Cause if so, that doesnt make any sense whatsoever.

And Surfer i believe has admitted that the power of Mjolnir is greater than his power. And the Godblast is more impressive that anything Surfer's PC has done. Remember, the Godblast has scared away Galactus himself, the master of the Power Cosmic. The Godblast has also hurt Exitar, and momentarily stopped the classic Juggernaut. As well as killing Those Who Sit Above In Shadow, who are basically the Skyfathers of the Skyfathers, aka theyre more powerful than Odin and the strongest pantheons.

And Surfer didnt recreate Stormbreaker. Odin did it, and Surfer just helped a little bit. It was like 75% Odin's doing, 25% Surfer's.

Read my post.

I think this thread is spite because within like 2 responses you called a guy an idiot who thought SS was above Genis.

You started a thread comparing these 5 characters, and then say that SS is nowhere near the level of Sentry and a fly to Genis.

So if that is true what the F is the point. As I stated: "Eternity and Thanos vs SS Stardust and Firelord." That is the equivalent of this thread according to you.

All I did was suggest that this is spite, and that if you wanted to start a thread just to call people idiots you need a new hobby. If Sentry and Genis are so far above SS, who is in most people's opinion measurably stronger than the other heralds, what is team 2 going to do?

Also I don't see how Odin did it if he had no idea what was going on. He told SS he had been trying to revive BRB for a while and it was impossible. He was insulted that SS thought it was possible. Also when the hammer was ripped from his hand he was like WTF. Are you kidding me. Yeah Odin did all the work. he had no idea what SS was doing. he knew that SS was not being totally truthful, but didn't have any idea what he was doing, least of all that the hammer was going to be reborn.

More importantly. Show me a feat the level of 1) almost overpowering MM, who is so far above even Insane Genis it is "Insane", or 2) harnessing the powers of the Crunch, to defeat to beings of similar power to other Cosmics like Galactus.

Basically there are two feats that are so far above Anything Mjolnir has done it is insane.

Also in regard to SS saying M was more powerful that counts for Doo Doo. SS fired a warning shot that Thor himself said could have killed him and the Avengers.

Face it, in terms of raw power, SS > Mjolnir. Mjolnir is vastly superior in regards to magic, but not "raw power"

Until you find 2 instances of "POWER" greater than mine, I don't even think you have an argument.

Originally posted by Photon009
Try and prove it. Your (dumb) opinion means nothing. I just proved Photon is superior to Surfer.

Has Surfer ever destroyed more than one planet at once? Nope. All he's done is destroyed one planet once with the help of Morg, and one (obviously small) planet recently against Ravenous, but Ravenous wasnt even fazed, just pissed.

Has Surfer ever owned an Elder of the Universe? Nope. The only time i can reall Surfer fighting an Elder of the Universe it was against the Runner, and Surfer got owned hard. And Grandmaster > Runner.

Thor's power isnt beyond R-Man's comprehension, and therefore Surfer's isnt either because Thor is slightly superior to Surfer. But Photon's power IS beyond R-Man's comprehension, R-Man admitted it himself.

This is your second response to your thread, and the fact that someone said Photon was greater than SS made you call him/her dumb. That is was pissed me off.

I also like how you said SS never owned an Elder, which is just stupid. You used one encounter with an Elder to prove he couldn't hang with any, when he plainly can.

More importantly. Show me a feat the level of 1) almost overpowering MM, who is so far above even Insane Genis it is "Insane", or 2) harnessing the powers of the Crunch, to defeat to beings of similar power to other Cosmics like Galactus.

Tenebrous and Aegis never proved to be equal to Galactus. Tenebrous was having an extremely hard time with a hungry Galactus, and needed both Tenebrous and Aegis to put Big G down. I'd say Tenebrous and Aegis are each about 75% of a good portrayal Galactus, not equals. But yes, the Crunch feat is still massively impressive. But really, nothing Surfer has ever done comes close to killing Eternity.

Oh, and kid, stop ranting about how your pissed and this and that, because i really dont give two shits. And dont call me stupid, especially when you're trying to compare Black Hole feats saying Surfer has better ones than Genis who in the span of 10 or so issues trumped Surfer's whole career when it comes to Black Holes and Portals.

And im really sick and tired at this point of refuting other people's posts (successfully, but still it annoys me after a while) when im still waiting to see someone try and refute my post from a couple pages back. I proved everyone wrong, and i would really love to see someone try (and fail miserably) to refute it. So here you go, here it is again to refresh your memory:

Genis allowed himself to be beat by Zemo. Genis beat Sentry's ass all over the place, and destroyed multiple planets, all while holding back. And Sentry has owned Terrax easier than Surfer could ever dream of. Hell, Tyros (depowered Terrax) lasted pages upon pages against Surfer. Sentry put the real Terrax down in one page, easily. When Atlas beat Genis, it was because Genis was being controlled by Purple Man, who made him shut off his cosmic awareness. Genis even says later on that he wouldve seen Atlas' attack coming a mile away if his CA wasnt turned off. Genis' cosmic awareness is also so attuned that he sensed that the HoM universe was fake, and seemed to rip a hole right out of it, showing he was more powerful than HoM Scarlet Witch.

Rick Jones doesnt know jack shit about what Genis is actually capable of, that was clearly shown in the Walker arc, and even so, i dont remember Rick ever saying Surfer > Genis, i just remember Genis threatening Surfer and Surfer backing off. AND that was a much weaker, much more inexperienced version of Genis that's fighting here.

And Genis destroyed the multiverse. Entropy just brought him there. It was clearly shown and especially stated on-panel that Genis was the one that provided the energy to destroy the universe, which means he did it. He also did alot of the work recreating the universe as well. So it's more like Genis gets 99.99% credit for destroying the universe, and 50% credit for recreating it.

Also, as Mr Master pointed out, Genis is an omniversal telepath. He embarassed the Overmind in telepathy after breaking out of Purple Man's mind control, and the Overmind is so powerful he telepathically linked everyone on earth at the same time a few issues later. Surfer doesnt have anything against telepathy on that level.

And oh my god please dont say Surfer can dump Genis in the microverse. I saw someone say that and that's absurd. Genis uses access to the microverse by far better than anyone. That's his forte.

And you think Surfer creating a black hole is impressive? Dude, Genis was casually creating multiple black holes through not only space, but time, at the same time. Hell he accidentally sent Songbird to the future and the rest of the T-Bolts to the past. And all subconsciously on top of that.

And you're talking about being cheapshotted by Atlas, one of the strongest Marvel heroes to date, as if it's such a bad thing. You wanna bring up Surfer's bad showings? Karnak with a brick? Having a hard time with Spider-Man? Getting owned by Black Panther? Need i go on?

What Radioactive Man says actually does count for alot. I mean, the guy is a scientist, specializing in energy and everything, has fought Thor and Surfer level beings on multiple occasions and has done very well, and on top of all that, HE WAS STUDYING GENIS FOR WEEKS. And even though he's fought guys on Surfer's level of power before and done good, he still said Photon's power was beyond his comprehension. That counts for a lot.

And Rewmac, first off, im sorry for the personal attack. Sometimes i just get frustrated and i overreact and i apologize for that. But the feats in Surfer's respect thread, EVERYTHING there Genis could duplicate, and easier than Surfer did at that. And by the way, some of those things arent even worth mentioning...Rogue passing out from touching Surfer? Dude, Songbird who doesnt even absorb powers like Rogue touched Genis and it nearly gave her a heart attack, if Rogue touched Genis she'd probably explode.

Oh, and all these feats while he was Photon? There all while he was distracted, aka not able to show his true potential. And when you think about it, this is actually just Sentry and Genis vs Surfer and Firelord, cuz Stardust is made of energy, therefore his ass is getting dispersed all over the multiverse in the first second by Genis.

And just for the record, im not hating on Surfer or ranting about Genis. I like Surfer alot too, he's my 3rd favorite cosmic dude behind Photon and Firelord, he's just out of his league against Photon.

Genis >>> Surfer

And Genis and Sentry win.

Oh, and one more thing. What happenned the last time the Power Cosmic faced off against the Odinforce, aka Surfer vs Odin? Oh that's right, Surfer got owned in one casual backhand. Completely knocked the hell out. What happenned the last time Genis went up against the Odinforce, aka King Thor, Odin's equal? Genis embarassed his ass, took his shot laughing and dished out his own making KT scream out in pain and was down for the rest of the issue and the beginning of the next one. Yep yep.

Another thing i forgot to mention...in a Fantastic Four arc against Abraxas, Surfer was killed, while Genis (and Quasar) were doing just fine. Genis has also brought back the dead more times than i can remember, something i dont remember Surfer ever doing. Hell, as Legacy he even brought Surfer back from near death.

And Thanos, who has massive respect for Surfer's power, has also heavily alluded to Genis being more powerful and more resourceful than Surfer.

Originally posted by Photon009
Tenebrous and Aegis never proved to be equal to Galactus. Tenebrous was having an extremely hard time with a hungry Galactus, and needed both Tenebrous and Aegis to put Big G down. I'd say Tenebrous and Aegis are each about 75% of a good portrayal Galactus, not equals. But yes, the Crunch feat is still massively impressive. But really, nothing Surfer has ever done comes close to killing Eternity.

Oh, and kid, stop ranting about how your pissed and this and that, because i really dont give two shits. And dont call me stupid, especially when you're trying to compare Black Hole feats saying Surfer has better ones than Genis who in the span of 10 or so issues trumped Surfer's whole career when it comes to Black Holes and Portals.

And im really sick and tired at this point of refuting other people's posts (successfully, but still it annoys me after a while) when im still waiting to see someone try and refute my post from a couple pages back. I proved everyone wrong, and i would really love to see someone try (and fail miserably) to refute it. So here you go, here it is again to refresh your memory:

Ok so at no point in any of my posts have I claimed SS is above Genis. So learn to read.

I said T&A are similar in power to G. i think that is fair to say. They are certainly considered Cosmic level threats.

And once again with regards to Black holes, I neve said SS was above Genis, only that he could destroy more than one planet at a time.

At no point in any post have I argued SS>Genis

SS> Sentry I have, and you have yet to refute either of my two points. Even is T&A are 75% of G that is still a feat beyond anything Mjolnir has done, and that was my argument. I didn't say he was above Genis, in fact, in regards to this I wasn't even necessarily saying he was above Sentry. I was arguing again your claim that Mjolnir was more powerful than SS. I was arguing your absorbing man logic.

So in short nothing you have said has had anything to do with my argument.

Originally posted by Priest
Surfer>>Sentry

Originally posted by janus77
just 'cos I am a little pedantic, yes they could.
open enough black holes at various points in the universe and matter would be drawn in at such a rate that it would collapse the universe faster than the big bang aftermath is still expanding it... causing the eventual end of the universe.
(but that's ofcourse, not what you were meaning)

umm, how fast can photon end the universe, Surfer could easily dump photon in the microverse, if he gets to photon before the universe ends.

The Universe is infinite. So opening a finite amount of black holes could never destroy the universe no matter how fast and strong they act. Plus black holes are not created equal (some are very small in mass). In theory one can create a black hole from 100kg of matter in which would take quadrillions of years if not more to just destroy a solar system. Add that to the fact that SS can't create energy (he just absorbs it or converts matter into it) and we get that SS can only create a blackhole the magnitude of a star only if he absorbed a star (or caused the star to collaspe upon itself). Thus he can't even create decent black holes to even start to end the universe (not to mention it would take infinite time if he could). Plus black holes die out in time.