Let's look at a list of who Hulk has fought and won against that can move faster than light:
Thor - can swing his hammer at twice the speed of light, and fly FTL. Even though currently Thor has the higher win / loss ratio at the moment, a weaker form of the Hulk has taken him down before pre-WWH.
Gladiator - fast enough to catch a ship in Hyperspace that had a head start. Easily flies many times the speed of light, has shown speed blitzing before, such as here:
and to those who think that Superman is vastly stronger than Hulk, here is an example of Gladiator's strength / speed, note how they are fighting at planet-crushing force and attacking in nanoseconds:
This is someone that Hulk beat to a pulp in just a few pages, less than his fight with Sentry.
In regards to Superman vibrating so fast, Hulk has defended against that before as well, when he trapped Vision inside of him. His body literally becomes dense enough to affect even pure energy.
Hulk has fought Hyperion as well, who was very fast and strong, another character similar to Superman:
http://img24.exs.cx/img24/2548/hulkhype27zg.jpg
http://img148.echo.cx/img148/162/hyperion1b6vt.jpg
He's won against Sentry, who as shown above can react in nanoseconds.
High Evolutionary why not as fast or strong as Superman was super durable in his armor, Hulk rips it to shreds like it's cotton:
http://img159.exs.cx/img159/3331/evolutionary29fu.jpg
http://img159.exs.cx/img159/3531/evolutionary39yq.jpg
Hulk has also defeated Hercules numerous times, who's strength and durability are on par with Thor's:
http://img24.exs.cx/img24/6620/hercules5zx.jpg
Punches into WonderMan (showing that he could affect a phased Superman):
Here's a scan showing that Hulk can in fact move very fast when he wants to:
As per Zeeder:
I’ll quote the source of the scan also, since Zeeder actually does the calculations of how fast Hulk’s speed is here:"The Hulk has banner's brain due to Modoks attacks. Modok has a virus. In order to make the antidote, the vials must be placed in a centrifuge for 40 hours at 40,000 rpm's.
You can buy a centrifuge online that does 6000 rpm and produces 6000 g's. The comic centrifuge would be doing about 12000 g's easily.
The Hulk does in 8 minutes, what the centrifuge would do in 40 hours. He would be producing 6 million 500 thousand(6,500,000) g's. His hands would have to vibrate at 1/9 the speed of light.
He does it with strength. He isn't even mad."
In regards to the people saying that Superman's heat vision was immeasurable, yet they could measure All Star Superman's strength, well put this into perspective:
In regards to the people saying Hulk is too slow to do anything:
Hulk is a lot faster than people give him credit for here, and his accuracy combined with that is more than enough to keep up with top tier FTL brawlers.
Now let's take a look at the power difference of WWH versus the Hulk shown in the scans above.
This is what Sentry would be capable of doing to Hulk pre-WWH:
http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/6323/hulkvoidsentryfo0.jpg
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/9804/voidhulkdq7.jpg
Now in WWH 5 we all see that Hulk defeats Sentry (or at the bare minimum the Hulk haters will say they stalemated, whatever). The point being is that in WWH #5 he was easily strong enough to resist a much more powerful attack by Sentry than what the Void did, and overcome it. So you can amplify the fights above by that much increased level of strength, cunning, and to an extent, speed.
Through this I have shown how Hulk has matched Marvel's equivilant of Superman type characters and defeated them. Whether you are a DC fan or not, Hulk has many times defeated characters that can bust planets, and that can move faster than light. The above battles, with the exception of Sentry, were all pre-WWH fights, where he was weaker than he was during WWH, especially at the end of #5 where his power was so overwhelming that had Sentry / Thor / Silver Surfer fought him at that point they would have gotten stomped even quicker.
I rest my case. Let the flaming / Hulk hate-fest begin.
Originally posted by snoopdogg
Becasue in DC the dials go to 11. 😄
ooh, zing.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Ok first things first who the hell are you? Ok second thing just becuz someones favorite character is from marvel it doesnt mean that he doesnt underrate marvel characters now does it?
first things first. there are very few if ANY characters i intentionally under or overrate, including hulk. you think im underrating them? from my pov, you are overrating them... you actually said PIS couldnt be taken into account in WWH... thats lunacy... seriously.
i could sit here and go on about how i'm not anti marvel, but honestly, i dont have to prove a damn thing to anyone on this forum... i read the comics i want to read, i ike the comics i want to like...
if this ENTIRE forum wants to think i'm anti marvel, then fine, knock yourselves out...
i know different, and thats good enough for me...
Ok Ill try to make this simple so that you can understand ok. Maybe Pr's favorite character is cyclops but for him to back up the claim that Kryptonians are all greater than Sentry and WW Hulk makes me think he has little respect for these marvel top tiers.
then you'd be wrong.
i didnt say 'any' kryptonian, but if you put superman or any of the phantom zone criminals (and thats alot), or even supergirl, in a fight with hulk or sentry, they'd tend to get the vote most of the time, because of their three main attributes, strength, durability and travel/reaction speed that outclasses most top tiers...
hulk seriously lacks speed, and sentry is nowhere near proven enough for him to hang with a high end kryptonian...
Lets think about it. Basically anything Hulk and Sentry have done is ok but just falls short to what any old kryptonian could do. I guess any old kryptonian could come down to earth crush the xmen,xforce,get rid of Juggernaut,beat the avengers,take a whisper from Blackbolt,take a pounding from Dr. Strange and Zom and then physically crush him, and then take on the Sentry who was going all out.
any old kryptonian? no.
superman, phantom zone criminals or supergirl?
x-men? yes, and easily unless the x-men have a headstart to try and get a psychic attack in.
x-force? name a roster.
juggernaut? seriously? any of the kryptonians i named are little more than a blur to him, and thats being optimistic...
pick an avengers roster, and ill answer...
a whisper from a skrull blackbolt? please. sure they'd be knocked back, but then they'd get up, dust themselves off, and bfr his ass...
Yeah if they thinks that any old Kryptonian I think hes underrating marvel top tiers that were involved in that story.
then again, you'd be wrong.
The funny thing is that Im not even a big fan of the Hulk but all this hate and shit he receives here has caused me to champion this character.
superman gets more hate than anyone on this forum, why not defend him?
Originally posted by Alfheim
If thats what you think i'll go with that. Im not going to respond to any of your othert posts because its getting irritating now.
likewise.
Originally posted by pr1983
i didnt say 'any' kryptonian, but if you put superman or any of the phantom zone criminals (and thats alot), or even supergirl, in a fight with hulk or sentry, they'd tend to get the vote most of the time, because of their three main attributes, strength, durability and travel/reaction speed that outclasses most top tiers...hulk seriously lacks speed, and sentry is nowhere near proven enough for him to hang with a high end kryptonian...
So even though Sentry, Gladiator, Thor, Terrax and Hyperion can all fly faster than light on-panel, and can all react in nanoseconds or less, they are automatically slower than any Kryptonian why again? Hulk has matched all 5 of them and their speed wasn't a huge advantage. I showed a scan where Hulk would have been vibrating the sample at 1/9th the speed of light, and Hulk has surprised even fast characters before because they think he's slow.
I don't get how everybody keeps bringing up speed as the main factor against Hulk when he's fought FTL beings throughout his history with no trouble at all.
In regards to strength, Sentry, Gladiator, Thor and Terrax are all more than capable of busting planets. Beta Ray Bill was busting up planets, so I don't doubt that Thor could as well, so I count him on that list. When Sentry and Genis fought they destroyed multiple planets. What makes just the average Kryptonian so much stronger than that? Gladiator busted up a planet in like 3 punches, and Hulk was stronger than him. Sentry was far stronger than Terrax, who also destroyed a planet.
To be honest I don't see why this board thinks that the average Kryptonian can beat the likes of Sentry or Gladiator. It just doesn't make sense, and it smacks of favoritism.
Originally posted by pr1983
Did i mention gladiator, thor or terrax?also, where those characters hulk fought actually using their speed, or did they just try to slug it out with him?
Gladiator, Thor and Terrax are implied through your blanket statement about Hulk and Sentry, since they are all characters that either Hulk or Sentry has fought and taken a majority against with the exception of Thor.
Plenty of characters have tried to use their speed against Hulk before, but as I showed in the scan above, Hulk can vibrate an object at 1/9th the speed of light, he isn't that friggin' slow that everybody makes him out to be. The only thing that gives him the appearance of being slow is that he's big and looks bulky, and cannot fly. He has easily caught up with Superfast characters before though, such as catching someone that can move FTL like Gladiator (as shown in his fight with Hyperion the attacks were moving in terms of nanoseconds) and Silver Surfer or the like.
Sentry has done the same when he countered Terrax. People say that Terrax is a jobber, but he still is a herald and has the powers and abilities that it implies, including faster than light reaction time (which Sentry proved to be faster) and planet busting force (Sentry proved to be stronger).
Originally posted by Kutulu
Gladiator, Thor and Terrax are implied through your blanket statement about Hulk and Sentry, since they are all characters that either Hulk or Sentry has fought and taken a majority against with the exception of Thor.
not implied by me intentionally, considering i think thor and gladiator could actually take superman...
Plenty of characters have tried to use their speed against Hulk before, but as I showed in the scan above, Hulk can vibrate an object at 1/9th the speed of light, he isn't that friggin' slow that everybody makes him out to be.
shaking his hand really fast doesnt mean he can fight and react to the faster chars using their speed, imo...
The only thing that gives him the appearance of being slow is that he's big and looks bulky, and cannot fly. He has easily caught up with Superfast characters before though, such as catching someone that can move FTL like Gladiator (as shown in his fight with Hyperion the attacks were moving in terms of nanoseconds) and Silver Surfer or the like.
did he genuinely catch them, or where they jobbing/was PIS involved?
Sentry has done the same when he countered Terrax. People say that Terrax is a jobber, but he still is a herald and has the powers and abilities that it implies, including faster than light reaction time (which Sentry proved to be faster) and planet busting force (Sentry proved to be stronger).
but in context, sentry has had so few actual encounters with top tiers... he needs more, and if he keeps it up, then he deserves whatever respect he gets...
and c'mon, faster than light reactions only matter if the writer wants them too... was terrax actually stated to be using ftl attacks?
Originally posted by pr1983
not implied by me intentionally, considering i think thor and gladiator could actually take superman...
Not to avoid your other questions, but specifically why do you think Thor and Gladiator can take Superman when Hulk has beaten Thor on occasion and totally beat Gladiator to a pulp?
Originally posted by Kutulu
Not to avoid your other questions, but specifically why do you think Thor and Gladiator can take Superman when Hulk has beaten Thor on occasion and totally beat Gladiator to a pulp?
were those matches in hulk comics? genuine question, not being snarky or anything...
thor has the hammer, which gives him a hugely effective weapon to fight superman with... he's also, you know, a god... 😛
gladiator's abilities arent nearly shown to their potential often enough imo, but he definitely has what it takes to beat superman if his confidence is high enough... his powers as far as ive seen are pretty comparable...
Originally posted by Soljer
But what you fail to realize time and time again, Quan, is that the forum is not a comic book. There is no plot to preserve, no fans to please, no outside influences. It isn't about how it'd play out in a comic book, it's about how the fight would play out if both characters were operating a full efficiency.
The fly in the ointment in that theory is that in the books where Superman and Hulk have fought...Superman had Ko'd or beaten Hulk physically every time he's gotten tired of trying to reason with him.
He was more of a pest than an actual fight.
Originally posted by pr1983
were those matches in hulk comics? genuine question, not being snarky or anything...thor has the hammer, which gives him a hugely effective weapon to fight superman with... he's also, you know, a god... 😛
gladiator's abilities arent nearly shown to their potential often enough imo, but he definitely has what it takes to beat superman if his confidence is high enough... his powers as far as ive seen are pretty comparable...
I simply cannot agree. Fire and Human torch have the exact same abilities. But torch is on a whole other lvl when it comes to the limit of those same abilities.
Thor does have his hammer, but he's a clod when it comes to superman in terms of speed. And Thor likes to mix it up with physically superior specimans. One reason He gets his ass handed to him sometimes.
Originally posted by Avlon
The fly in the ointment in that theory is that in the books where Superman and Hulk have fought...Superman had Ko'd or beaten Hulk physically every time he's gotten tired of trying to reason with him.He was more of a pest than an actual fight.
Yeah, Venom did more damage than Hulk cry
Originally posted by AvlonYes I think Superman would beat Hulk physically. I never once said he wouldnt. he wouldnt one shot him for one. For two Dc would never allow him to lose to a single marvel character in a crossover. And three this is WW Hulk who is much much stronger and more powerful than regular Hulk.
The fly in the ointment in that theory is that in the books where Superman and Hulk have fought...Superman had Ko'd or beaten Hulk physically every time he's gotten tired of trying to reason with him.He was more of a pest than an actual fight.
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirlThor does fight with honor. This is very true but he doesnt do to bad without the hammer. He even admitted he relied on it to much when it was shattered and he beat Durok right before ragnarok. Thor could slug it out with Superman and wouldnt do to shabby but would lose. But Thor is back now and I bet hes going to be pulling some awesome feats here. Lets wait and see.
I simply cannot agree. Fire and Human torch have the exact same abilities. But torch is on a whole other lvl when it comes to the limit of those same abilities.Thor does have his hammer, but he's a clod when it comes to superman in terms of speed. And Thor likes to mix it up with physically superior specimans. One reason He gets his ass handed to him sometimes.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes I think Superman would beat Hulk physically. I never once said he wouldnt. he wouldnt one shot him for one. For two Dc would never allow him to lose to a single marvel character in a crossover. And three this is WW Hulk who is much much stronger and more powerful than regular Hulk.
Was he really stronger? He just seemed more dangerous because he was more pissed and far more cunning than usual.
Hulk doesn't usually offer choices and ultimatums, nor does he plan revenge amongst other things.
In that sense, he was more dangerous than usual. I didn't seen anything to show that he was more powerful than mindless Hulk.
