Sagat's power is deadly. If he hits her he will hit her hard and Ayane is going to feel it.
However her speed is a big asset and it combined with her teleportation can keep her in the fight for a long time.
But eventually he IS going to nail her. And I don't see Ayane getting back up after he does.
And like I said earlier I give Ayane 2 wins with Nimpo by setting Sagat up.
It's a good fight IMO.
6/10 Sagat.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Oh yeah.I don't see him winning 10/10 though.
He will still have to deal with Ayane's teleportation and her superior combat speed. Not to mention I give her 1-2 wins via Nimpo if Ayane plays it smart and sets Sagat up for the Nimpo.
Sagat didn't get to where he is by being rash. He could use Ayane's teleport against her.
Ayane's fast, but given Sagat's strength and power, she will annoy him to the point that when she teleports again, Sagat can telegraph it and punish her with a Tiger Cannon, Raid or Genocide.
I done it many times in CvSNK when a person using a teleport move came out of it. Only when coming out of a teleport move is the opponent most open for attack.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Her fight with Genra was ambigous.
Genra had to be put down with melees. Genra's nimpo was more powerful than Ayane's. Not to mention in gameplay powerful long-range priority attacks are his greatest strength, keeping the player in a defensive position and unable to attack. He also features a shockwave attack that activates whenever knocked down. His throws feature a low damage ratio and his attacks have a noticeable wind-up time frame and can be blocked normally.
I do believe she had to melee him for the win. And that melee fight might not have been easy with Genra's dual lightsaber ripoff.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Genra had to be put down with melees. Genra's nimpo was more powerful than Ayane's.
Genra having powerful ninpo's doesn't really mean he has to be put down by melee. Besides, Ayane has demonstrated a much more powerful ninpo.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Not to mention in gameplay powerful long-range priority attacks are his greatest strength, keeping the player in a defensive position and unable to attack. He also features a shockwave attack that activates whenever knocked down. His throws feature a low damage ratio and his attacks have a noticeable wind-up time frame and can be blocked normally.
I do believe she had to melee him for the win. And that melee fight might not have been easy with Genra's dual lightsaber ripoff.
True, but that's your speculation, and even if it's likely. There isn't really anything that is logically solid to back it up. So, I don't believe it's applicable as a feat for Ayane against Sagat.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Genra having powerful ninpo's doesn't really mean he has to be put down by melee.
Genra being her superior with Ninpo means it is not likely she outpowered him. The fact Ayane has shown us she has a start-up time delay while Genra does not strengthens this.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Besides, Ayane has demonstrated a much more powerful ninpo.
She demonstrated a more powerful ninpo in a game that took place after the events of DOA3. In all likelyhood she has just grown stronger.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
True, but that's your speculation, and even if it's likely. There isn't really anything that is logically solid to back it up. So, I don't believe it's applicable as a feat for ayane.
I know it's speculation, but I don't think I am being irrational. I don't think it should be simply tossed aside, but I can understand you not buying it.
---
One more thing I wanted to point out is that Ayane is a very unpredictable fighter. Sagat perfectly predicting Ayane is wishful thinking.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Genra being her superior with Ninpo means it is not likely she outpowered him. The fact Ayane has shown us she has a start-up time delay while Genra does not strengthens this.
Superior start up time=Superior ninpo?
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
She demonstrated a more powerful ninpo in a game that took place after the events of DOA3. In all likelyhood she has just grown stronger.I know it's speculation, but I don't think I am being irrational.
There's no evidence suggesting that she is inferior to Genra in the ninpo department. But, that's irrelevant since we do not know how the fight went down.
So, how can we use it as a feat for a versus?
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
One more thing I wanted to point out is that Ayane is a very unpredictable fighter. Sagat perfectly predicting Ayane is wishful thinking.
I disagree, Sagat and others could easily telegraph her. Sagat has the tools needed to punish Ayane's teleport and in my opinion is better at H2h in certain area's.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Superior start up time=Superior ninpo?
Superior start up time = better chances of successfully performing ninpo without getting interrupted.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=omikKbnYLME
At 00:52 Genra meets Hayabusa and shoots a fireblast that destroys that village.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Bx3ujJL4kWU
At 04:22 Ayane encounters Genra in a forest covered in snow. Before they engage in battle he burns everything.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Z2TUFWLOKCw
At 03:15 Ayane uses Ninpo to blast Kasumi. Do note the long ass time it takes her to pull it off...and the fact it did nothing but show us flashy light.
That is the only time Ayane has used Ninpo besides DOA4. In DOA4 she took less time and she was able to bring forth more destructive power. She has indeed grown stronger over the course of DOA's history.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
There's no evidence suggesting that she is inferior to Genra in the ninpo department. But, that's irrelevant since we do not know how the fight went down.
I do think there is enough evidence to say he was indeed more powerful than her by DOA3. Not to mention she only became the most powerful Hajinmon ninja after killing Genra.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
So, how can we use it as a feat for a versus?
The feat is Ayane taking Genra down, or are you going to take that away from her? My speculation on how she took him down is just me explaining the reason I believe she can put Sagat down without ninpo. Fact of the matter is it's up to you and anyone else reading this to agree with me or not.
There's no need to tell me you agree with me. I know you don't.
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
I disagree, Sagat and others could easily telegraph her. Sagat has the tools needed to punish Ayane's teleport and in my opinion is better at H2h in certain area's.
I will agree to disagree then. Ayane is top tier in DOA. It is a fact she is the most unpredictable character in DOA and that she has the biggest movelist in DOA.
Wow. How did I miss a debate involving Ayane?
In any case, regardless of how much I like her, Ayane is being overrated a bit lately.
At the same time, Sagat isn't going to put her down with just one attack.
Strength: I'll give Sagat this one. However, Ayane has demonstrated a rediculous amount of leg strength when she traversed a canyon by leaping from wall to wall to get to Kasumi.
Speed: Ayane.
Durability: Initially I was going to say Sagat, but Ayane did take a debatably mountain leveling blast directly and was unscathed. I'll still give Sagat the edge here for the sake of argument.
Skill: Same.
Weapons/Ki/Ninpo: Ayane has more powerful ninpo but some of it takes a bit to charge. She also has weapons though. She has the advantage here.
Fight assessment:
Ayane can take this IF she plays this smart. Sagat is a dangerous opponent. She needs to fight very counter-offensively and pick her shots. Making full use of her teleportation will allow her to avoid any serious damage. She needs to use her akward fighting style and throwing weapons to keep Sagat from launching a fully committed assault. If she can avoid too many Tiger Waves, she'll be able to wear him down. After he is worn down, Ayane can do of her signature finishes. I recommend she use the energy ball instead of the ground punch though for distance purposes.
Of course if she rushes in like she so brazenly did against Raidou, she'll probably bite it.
If Ayane plays it safe, she could take a 5.5-6/10
If she doesn't, Sagat will land one too many tiger uppercuts on her and I'll be forced to kick his ass.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Superior start up time = better chances of successfully performing ninpo without getting interrupted.http://youtube.com/watch?v=omikKbnYLME
At 00:52 Genra meets Hayabusa and shoots a fireblast that destroys that village.http://youtube.com/watch?v=Bx3ujJL4kWU
At 04:22 Ayane encounters Genra in a forest covered in snow. Before they engage in battle he burns everything.http://youtube.com/watch?v=Z2TUFWLOKCw
At 03:15 Ayane uses Ninpo to blast Kasumi. Do note the long ass time it takes her to pull it off...and the fact it did nothing but show us flashy light.
Genra's flame abilities are more destructive than ayane's, so I'll concede that point.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
The feat is Ayane taking Genra down, or are you going to take that away from her? My speculation on how she took him down is just me explaining the reason I believe she can put Sagat down without ninpo. Fact of the matter is it's up to you and anyone else reading this to agree with me or not.There's no need to tell me you agree with me. I know you don't.
I don't have a problem with ayane taking Genra down, but I don't believe we should give her stats of an ambigous fight. It's the same way with people giving Ryu durability because he fought with Gouki.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
I will agree to disagree then. Ayane is top tier in DOA. It is a fact she is the most unpredictable character in DOA and that she has the biggest movelist in DOA.
Where is it stated that she is an unpredictable fighter?
Originally posted by shin_remyHm, it's hard to say. The ninja's in doa are known for using weapins during fights, So, I personally doubt it's the same as Ryu fighting Gouki. But, I also doubt ryu in alpha could take an island sinking hit and survive. Also, gouki was going easy on Ryu.
well i did in the Ken vs Paul thread
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Genra's flame abilities are more destructive than ayane's, so I'll concede that point.I don't have a problem with ayane taking Genra down, but I don't believe we should give her stats of an ambigous fight. It's the same way with people giving Ryu durability because he fought with Gouki.
Where is it stated that she is an unpredictable fighter?
Problem with SF fans claiming Ryu can withstand island shattering points is that it is non-sense. Who is to say Gouki did not employ all his might to destroy that island?
On Ayane's case I am simply stating she should hit hard(though not as hard as Sagat) considering Genra was fully armored. That is why I think that her speed and evasive maneuvers can be useful in eventually taking him down even without Ninpo.
Ayane's style unorthodox. When you play her at high level competitive play she is very hard to read. She is even more dangerous when she exposes her back to her opponent. In-gameplay her speed, high list of moves and her ability to evade hits are a real pain in the ass.
I still think Sagat takes 6 out of ten because all it takes for him to win is for Ayane to screw up.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Problem with SF fans claiming Ryu can withstand island shattering points is that it is non-sense. Who is to say Gouki did not employ all his might to destroy that island?
Because Gouki with all his might is Shin Gouki.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
On Ayane's case I am simply stating she should hit hard(though not as hard as Sagat) considering Genra was fully armored. That is why I think that her speed and evasive maneuvers can be useful in eventually taking him down even without Ninpo.
I believe she can hit hard regardless if the opponent is wearing armour becase in the martial arts there are ways to hit an armored opponent. I'm just wooried someone will use it for A>B>C logic.
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Ayane's style unorthodox. When you play her at high level competitive play she is very hard to read. She is even more dangerous when she exposes her back to her opponent. In-gameplay her speed, high list of moves and her ability to evade hits are a real pain in the ass.I still think Sagat takes 6 out of ten because all it takes for him to win is for Ayane to screw up.
Well, ninjustsu is an unorthodox method of fighting, but Ayane's hard to read mostly during rush downs. I doubt she can do that to sagat easily.
True about Shin Gouki being his not held back might...but it still does not mean Gouki will be pounding on Ryu with island shattering points. And I'll stop discussing about Ryu. It is clear you agree with me on not using that to prove Ryu's durability...and Ryu is a dangerous character here with his ability to kill threads. So...I'm banning him from this thread...!