superman vs Beta Ray Bill

Originally posted by UniOmni
You're reaching man if you're trying to pass off that feat as an example of planet busting strength.

Superman does have moon busting capabilities, when he can focus his speed and durability into a super tackle, which is exactly what he did in that comic.

To pass that off as proof that he can punch apart a planet is a whole 'nother ball game tho.

And to Jun, we take characters words as law now?

Until he throws that punch that splits a moon in half, he hasn't the power, despite what he said to the contrary.

Superman is still the most consistently strong top tier in comics.

I don't see the need to reach at feats.

Reaching is what you're trying to pull in this thread. Your whole "comic scenario" is ludicrous.

The moon got busted in 1 shot. Run at full speed into a city block full of jell-o and see if you can 1 shot it. 😉

And dude, if you like CBR that much and dislike this sites rules...then stay over there.

Originally posted by Validus
I'm not even sure why you're bothering to argue if you're only giving Bill 1/10. You might actually be the biggest Superman supporter in this thread.

KMC Superman vs KMC Bill = KMC Superman 10/10.

A few years ago, comic Bill vs Comic Superman would've likely been a split down the middle.
But a tangible push has been behind Superman since about '99, and when pushing from behind, people in front tend to get knocked to the wayside. See Darkseid, Despero, and others.

93-98 Bill vs Superman would've been great.

Nowadays, the alien from a dead world full of aliens like him is the greatest in his neck of the universe, which makes you see how smart DC was to destroy said planet full of aliens like him.

Busiek/Johns would probably handle a new character in the vein of a godling like Bill vs Superman scenario very nicely, whereas others would mangle it beyond repair.

I don't think Bill would only get 1/10 in comics.

Once he got that good initial showing, after a few beatings from braindead writers, he'd probably get a rebirth from a good one, only to get a few more beatings/humiliations. Rinse and repeat.

Comics? Superman 7/10

Originally posted by Tyrant
I was just talking about the one time he actually did it, and it's taken as though he punched right through it, when he actually flew through it.

Wait, isn't Pluto believed to be a moon from Neptune?

Plus, if you're implying that one of Saturn's moon, is comparable to average planets...

Nice try at backpedalling.

Originally posted by Tyrant
Cough... a moon is not a planet.
Plus, he it was a durability feat, not a strength feat.

The difference between a moon and a planet is entirely semantic. A planet orbits a star. A moon orbits a planet. That's pretty much it.

Originally posted by UniOmni
KMC Superman vs KMC Bill = KMC Superman 10/10.

A few years ago, comic Bill vs Comic Superman would've likely been a split down the middle.
But a tangible push has been behind Superman since about '99, and when pushing from behind, people in front tend to get knocked to the wayside. See Darkseid, Despero, and others.

93-98 Bill vs Superman would've been great.

Nowadays, the alien from a dead world full of aliens like him is the greatest in his neck of the universe, which makes you see how smart DC was to destroy said planet full of aliens like him.

Busiek/Johns would probably handle a new character in the vein of a godling like Bill vs Superman scenario very nicely, whereas others would mangle it beyond repair.

I don't think Bill would only get 1/10 in comics.

Once he got that good initial showing, after a few beatings from braindead writers, he'd probably get a rebirth from a good one, only to get a few more beatings/humiliations. Rinse and repeat.

Comics? Superman 7/10

How do you know this? How can you be sure that Bill wouldn't defeat him every time because Stormbreaker happens to emit radiation that severely weakens Superman?

Originally posted by UniOmni
KMC Superman vs KMC Bill = KMC Superman 10/10.

A few years ago, comic Bill vs Comic Superman would've likely been a split down the middle.
But a tangible push has been behind Superman since about '99, and when pushing from behind, people in front tend to get knocked to the wayside. See Darkseid, Despero, and others.

93-98 Bill vs Superman would've been great.

Nowadays, the alien from a dead world full of aliens like him is the greatest in his neck of the universe, which makes you see how smart DC was to destroy said planet full of aliens like him.

Busiek/Johns would probably handle a new character in the vein of a godling like Bill vs Superman scenario very nicely, whereas others would mangle it beyond repair.

I don't think Bill would only get 1/10 in comics.

Once he got that good initial showing, after a few beatings from braindead writers, he'd probably get a rebirth from a good one, only to get a few more beatings/humiliations. Rinse and repeat.

Comics? Superman 7/10

Originally posted by UniOmni
The last guy who got that KO was likely Khyber, or the big Aryan looking guy from the Next miniseries.

Both new villains/rivals who got that good showing.

And i already admitted that in KMCs laughable rulebook, Superman gets the win, since it's cbrlite here.

In comic presentation?

Bill goes for the throat way before the thought crosses Superman's mind.

Superman dominated him for a time in strength, and who Superman flat out defeated in a previous encounter. Khyber was strong enough to take a power depleted Superman and throw him so hard into the Earth's core that:

"The crust cracks like an egg, a gash thousands of miles long. And gravitic forces slam it closed almost instantly.

But the molten rock below the crust shudders in underground tsunamis of superheated lava.

And the Earth convulses. Tectonic plates crack. Continents ripple like a scarf in the wind. Billions dies in the global earthquakes that follow. But they too are just beginning.

Tidal waves scour coastal lands -- and even more inland regions -- clean of life, taking the lives of millions more. And it still doesn't end. That initial tear in the planetary crust sens unimaginable tons of rock, earth and water -- all vaporized by heat and impact -- into the upper air.

The thousands of volcanoes created thereafter continue the process. What follows, you call 'nuclear winter.' Permanent, heavy cloud cover, blocking the Sun. Cyclonic winds. Storms that make your Biblical flood seem insignificant."

Think about that for a minute.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
How do you know this? How can you be sure that Bill wouldn't defeat him every time because Stormbreaker happens to emit radiation that severely weakens Superman?

Because Superman has a major push behind him, and he's survived magic before.

Plus, i get the feeling you dislike me as a poster, so why respond to me?

And to Avy-

I don't like Cbr.

I made the reference to CBR, because that's where this boards rules come from.

We don't debate characters here, we debate powersets. Which is a pissing contest, basically.

To Vally -

Originally posted by UniOmni
We don't debate characters here, we debate powersets. Which is a pissing contest, basically.

Originally posted by UniOmni
Because Superman has a major push behind him, and he's survived magic before.

This radiation bypasses that. Bill wins every time.

Now what?

Originally posted by UniOmni
Plus, i get the feeling you dislike me as a poster, so why respond to me?

Nah, I just like that you claim the rules here are ridiculous while pushing an form of match up that requires one to have psychic powers.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Nice try at backpedalling.

The difference between a moon and a planet is entirely semantic. A planet orbits a star. A moon orbits a planet. That's pretty much it.

Plus, the moon orbiting a planet kind of says it all, doesn't it?

Also, what I meant by that was, that planets are usually bigger than moons.

And especially the one Superman went through.

Originally posted by Validus
If thats true then why do none of the other characters with Superman's powerset get the same respect he does?

I made a blunder in choosing my words.

I should've said we debate feats, which is basically a pissing contest.

Zod doesn't have the feats of Superman, so he doesn't get the leighway Superman does.

And SC, i only push that form of debate, because it makes sense.

Superman vs Thanos = Speedblitz.
Superman vs Hulk = Speedblitz.
Superman vs Darkseid = Speedblitz.

Superman vs Nate Grey = Speedblitz?
Superman vs Franklin Richards = Speedblitz? Superman speedblitzes an eight year old child?

Really?

That's why KMC rules(which are cut and pasted from CBR) are so silly.

You take the character out of the debate, and we're left with people posting "Superman drops a hundred planest busting punches to the towheaded dome of an eight year old child ftw".

Shit's ridiculous.

Real debate = Superman sees reality warping in conjunction with childs emotions, so he taps him in the forehead to drop him.

Cue the debating of shields and punches then, but at least keep the characters in the debate.

Originally posted by UniOmni
I made a blunder in choosing my words.

I should've said we debate feats, which is basically a pissing contest.

Zod doesn't have the feats of Superman, so he doesn't get the leighway Superman does.

And I don't really think pretending to know how various writers would portray a Superman/Beta Ray Bill clash makes an assload of sense either.

Originally posted by UniOmni
And SC, i only push that form of debate, because it makes sense.

Except when you somehow predict an entire run of comics and somehow use that to draw a conclusion.

Thats just really f*cking stupid.

Originally posted by UniOmni
Superman vs Thanos = Speedblitz.
Superman vs Hulk = Speedblitz.
Superman vs Darkseid = Speedblitz.
Superman vs Nate Grey = Speedblitz?
Superman vs Franklin Richards = Speedblitz? Superman speedblitzes an eight year old child?

Really?

That's why KMC rules(which are cut and pasted from CBR) are so silly.

You take the character out of the debate, and we're left with people posting "Superman drops a hundred planest busting punches to the towheaded dome of an eight year old child ftw".

Shit's ridiculous.

Real debate = Superman sees reality warping in conjunction with childs emotions, so he taps him in the forehead to drop him.

Cue the debating of shields and punches then, but at least keep the characters in the debate.

Execpt that if you actually look at the forums as a whole rather than just the poster you want to look at you'll see that doesn't always happen. You might also note that people frequently do mention character personalities and how they would react (sometimes in the form of giving multiple outcomes based on how the character fights)

Against Richards it would still be a blitz because he'd have to do it before Franklin could react.

Unless . . . wait . . . I know! DC loves Superman so much that reality warping would have no effect on him the second time! Now that is sane rational debating.

Originally posted by Validus
That doesn't work either because Green Lantern isn't unbeatable here. Not unless you're talking to me.

And I don't really think pretending to know how various writers would portray a Superman/Beta Ray Bill clash makes an assload of sense either.

And yet you predicted a page ago that Bill would likely be beaten in an even more humiliating manner than Thor?

I drew my conclusion from reading comics for this past year and a half.

Read enough comics, and the patterns become clear as day.

I don't think it's stupid to say how most comics would go, when most comics follow the same formula.

I'll admit i went to far when i go into the subsequent appearances and etc, but for the initial comic?

Par for the course.

The image below is in response to you saying i'm reaching by saying what would happen in comic.

Originally posted by UniOmni
The image below is in response to you saying i'm reaching by saying what would happen in comic.

Ya know what's so interesting about that? The pot isn't wrong in the slightest 😬

Originally posted by UniOmni
And yet you predicted a page ago that Bill would likely be beaten in an even more humiliating manner than Thor?

Originally posted by UniOmni
I drew my conclusion from reading comics for this past year and a half.

Read enough comics, and the patterns become clear as day.

I don't think it's stupid to say how most comics would go, when most comics follow the same formula.

And that a ninja would get the best of Dr. Strange.

And that Captain America would be shown KO'ing Hulk in 3 blows.

Yes, all that sounds rather predictable based on previous comics. This must be why whenever a new comic comes out that features Hero A Vs Hero B, various folks on message boards across the net are crying bullshit because the fight didn't go as expected.

It's not how you think writers would portray Beta Ray Bill Vs Superman but rather how you would portray Beta Ray Bill Vs Superman while attempting not to appear biased.

And yet i am?

And didn't you just say that Superman would have to blitz an 8 year old child?

Originally posted by Validus
Done so in mocking fashion.

So I'm sure you accurately predicted that Superman would KO Thor while sitting on his ass?

And that a ninja would get the best of Dr. Strange.

And that Captain America would be shown KO'ing Hulk in 3 blows.

Yes, all that sounds rather predictable based on previous comics. This must be why whenever a new comic comes out that features Hero A Vs Hero B, various folks on message boards across the net are crying bullshit because the fight didn't go as expected.

No, i didn't predict that since i wasn't reading comics at the time.

I just started reading comics again at the end of 2005, having last read one in 95.

But i could've told anyone that it'd either be a stalemate or a definite loss for Thor, with stalmate being the best he could hope for.

Characters occupying two very different positions in their companys overall scheme.

But i could've told you that if Strange joins a team of midlevelers and streets, he'd be significantly depowered to make the story work.

And i wouldn't have told you that Cap would beat the Hulk at his own game, but i would've told you that when two heroes team up, they always wins.

Not the stupid manner that Loeb wrote, but end of the day same results.

Nevertheless, this is all meaningless since my main point of contention was always that in a comic setting, Superman would get dropped first, only to take the second round.

I merely outlined a pretty standard new potential rival scenario, which happens in pretty much every form of entertainment media.

It shouldn't be this hard Vally.

Originally posted by UniOmni
No, i didn't predict that since i wasn't reading comics at the time.

Originally posted by UniOmni
But i could've told anyone that it'd either be a stalemate or a definite loss for Thor, with stalmate being the best he could hope for.

Originally posted by UniOmni
But i could've told you that if Strange joins a team of midlevelers and streets, he'd be significantly depowered to make the story work.

The Sentry wasn't depowered for New Avengers.

Big Barda hasn't been depowered for Birds of Prey.

Ya know, more than a few people thought Strange would be the big gun needed for the inevitable clash the Mighty Avengers.

Originally posted by UniOmni
And i wouldn't have told you that Cap would beat the Hulk at his own game, but i would've told you that when two heroes team up, they always wins.

Not the stupid manner that Loeb wrote, but end of the day same results.

Originally posted by UniOmni
Nevertheless, this is all meaningless since my main point of contention was always that in a comic setting, Superman would get dropped first, only to take the second round.

I merely outlined a pretty standard new potential rival scenario, which happens in pretty much every form of entertainment media.

It shouldn't be this hard Vally.

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