Torn Between Worlds

Originally posted by mr.smiley
I think the idea of hell is terrible.The idea that those who don't belive in the big man are going to hell is ridiculous.A Buddhist monk who has lived in peaceful solitude for all his life will burn in hell,yet a child molester or murderer can commit terrible crimes and ask for forgiveness and he becomes better than the Buddhist monk?Because he fears god?

Clearly such a god would at best,be considered delusional.Christians think they are safe from the terrors of hell,but to other religions this is only a fleeting delusion.If your Christian,Muslim fundementalist will claim your going to hell.If your a Christian,everyone else goes to hell,etc.It doesn't matter what you belive because your never safe.According to some other religous tradition you are going to burn in hell no matter how good your are.

I understand why people belive in hell.It justifies that bad people are punished for their earthly crimes.It falls apart when we look at good people who don't follow a certain religous tradition still will sufer.It's as if a god put guilt by association on everyone else besides his followers because he is too lazy to sort through the good in people with other belifes.

Am I a Christian and I can assure that the Christian belief is that non-Christians can be saved and that not all Christians will be saved.

Dont judge Christianity because of the fundamentalists.

I understand not all Christian belive this.Most actualy get quiet about the subject and say,'only God can judge'.

I didn't exclude this to Christianity.I pin pointed to many religions.This point can be debated in almost any religion group.I think it would be better to adopt the idea that all good people,regardless of faith will be honored in some sort of after life.

I personally belive in a God,or some sort of force that governs everything.While I would never claim its nature could truly be known to man,I belive everyone of us 'IS' the divine conscience.I belive we are all the mind of god.Living out experinces so this divine nature can understand itself better.At the end,all will be made over perfectly and we will experince oneness in perfect harmony.

That's just my belife though.I'm not saying it's right or trying to convert people or attempting to make political gain.It just makes the most sense to me.

Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
Well, I don't think chewing up and eating a bible is something a good kind person would do...that could really upset allot of people. I know the whole "its just a book" thing will no doubt come up here but its what it symbolises, which is very important, like when people invade a nation they destroy its symbols to break the people.

However, sadly I don't have God's ear when it comes to judgement so I couldn't tell you what will happen to you...if revelations is true.

I know, its not something I would do now, but I was in my ragey teenage years 🙂

I hear what you are saying, which is very humble of you😛

Originally posted by darkfan76
Perhaps a little sad, Who knows? But they will respect the decision of the condemed, as God does, but What about the infinite joy of being with God?

About "If the saints are truly filled with love, then they will suffer for those who suffer" is just your opinion, your own conclusion. Respectable, but only that.

"That is how love works; someone who is happy cannot be happy is someone else is sad" I guess you realize that this is only your opinion, since you assume that the happiness in Heaven is like the happiness, . as we know it right now.

Truth is that we do not really know heaven or hell are. Haven't been there, 😛 We all have is figures and metaphores, since eternity,infinity are ideas that are unimaginable for us right now, finite beings and limited in time.

Then they will not be filled with love, or they will suffer.

To those of you who actually beleive in Heaven and Hell

Thank you for NOT answering my initial question.....very cowardly of you guys

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
I've got a scenario for any and all of you who beleive in the realms of Heaven and Hell...

Let's say that you, being a good Christian, Jew, Muslim, etc. follower of God end up in Heaven, to stay for all eternity, and be with God.

But, someone you love dearly, more than anyone else on Earth (your lover, your mother, your father, brother, best freind, etc.) ended up in Hell ....

You ask God to forgive them, and bring that person with you in Heaven, but he says No. That they had thier chance on Earth, and now they are damned to an Eternity in Hell, while you are here with God in the Glory of Heaven.

What would you do?

How would you feel ?

To those of you who beleive in Heaven and Hell, quit avoiding the question, and answer it.

How could you POSSIBLY be happy in Heaven knowing that the person you love most is in Hell ???

Originally posted by debbiejo
I'd eat a donut.

I would eat a donut too.........then I would stay with God. He would erase my memories of that lover, Heaven is supposed to be bright and cheery, so I would not remember that person. So obviously I would feel nothing.

Originally posted by darkfan76
Perhaps a little sad, Who knows? But they will respect the decision of the condemed, as God does, but What about the infinite joy of being with God?

thats sick, very sick

you would ignore your mother or father, brothers, wife all burning in torment in eternity for the love of God? "sigh"

Originally posted by Charmed_Phoebe
I would eat a donut too.........then I would stay with God. He would erase my memories of that lover, Heaven is supposed to be bright and cheery, so I would not remember that person. So obviously I would feel nothing.

To erase your memory of that person is to hide the Truth. Since when does God hide the truth from someone, when the Bible preaches about the value of truth all the time?

Secondly, if you could be happy despite the fact that your loved one is suffering for eternity, then you are selfish. That happiness is selfish, that "bright and cheeriness" is superficial, and that's not the kind of Heaven I ever want to enter. A "fantasy" world disconnected from the people who took care of me in Life.

Originally posted by darkfan76
Perhaps a little sad, Who knows? But they will respect the decision of the condemed, as God does, but What about the infinite joy of being with God?

Like I said above, that is very selfish. You care more about your own happiness and connection with this God, then someone else's suffering.

To love another person is to care more for thier happiness and suffering than your own. If you care more about your own rewards and happiness than a loved one's suffering, then you never truly loved that person.

Secondly, how can you possibly have "infinite joy" with God if your mother, father, brother, sister, son, daughter, or loved one is burning in Hell forever ?

Originally posted by darkfan76
About "If the saints are truly filled with love, then they will suffer for those who suffer" is just your opinion, your own conclusion. Respectable, but only that.

You can truly be happy knowing that your mother is being tortured in another world for the rest of eternity, and that that is what God condemned her to because of her life choices ?

You would want to spend Eternity with a God who didn't allow your mother or father, or beloved one, into Heaven, but instead judged them to Hell where they will suffer forever ?

I would pull up my middle finger at this God

Originally posted by darkfan76
"That is how love works; someone who is happy cannot be happy is someone else is sad" I guess you realize that this is only your opinion, since you assume that the happiness in Heaven is like the happiness, . as we know it right now.

Again, how can you possibly be happy in Heaven when someone you love dearly is being tortured in Hell for all eternity ?

Secondly, if you CAN be happy despite the fact that your loved one is suffering forever, then that makes you a truly selfish person, simply because you only care about your own happiness, and the other person's suffering means nothing to you.

Originally posted by darkfan76
Truth is that we do not really know heaven or hell are. Haven't been there, 😛 We all have is figures and metaphores, since eternity,infinity are ideas that are unimaginable for us right now, finite beings and limited in time.

But we do know that according to the mythology of modern Monotheism, Heaven is Joy and Hell is Suffering.

How can you be happy knowing that your loved one is suffering forever ? You never really answered my question, or atleast, I don't feel you have answered it honestly.

I feel you have been beating around the bush.

someone who can be content and happy in heaven and with Gods "love" when they know their wife and daughter/sons are in eternal torment and actually think they can stay happy for all eternity are not human, they are very less than human, they are less than the dribbling cow pat stuck to the bottom of a farmers boot

if this is God, then he can go **** himself with all the divine power he wants

Originally posted by Burning thought
someone who can be content and happy in heaven and with Gods "love" when they know their wife and daughter/sons are in eternal torment and actually think they can stay happy for all eternity are not human, they are very less than human, they are less than the dribbling cow pat stuck to the bottom of a farmers shoe

if this is God, then he can go **** himself with all the divine power he wants

👆

Coudn't have said it better myself.

How could you POSSIBLY be happy in Heaven knowing that the person you love most is in Hell ???

And how could god of ever loved lucifer knowing he would spend eternity in hell. They were best buds once.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I wouldn't.

And how could god of ever loved lucifer knowing he would spend eternity in hell. They were best buds once.

God and Lucifer were once Gay Lovers

Read "Lucifer's Halo" a Joseph Micheal Linsner Graphic Novel, and see the TRUTH !

Everybodys gay in your world...... 😂 🤣

This is why the concept of Christianities hell (along with other faiths) is severly flawed, and at best a shallow attempt to scare people without considerable thought into the subject matter.Alot of these ideas were being brought into the light when people didn't have the power to question the authority that was making the rules.Today we can openly question these loop holes and expose some very basic moral and ethical issues that surface when we are confrotned with the idea of hell.

Originally posted by mr.smiley
This is why the concept of Christianities hell (along with other faiths) is severly flawed, and at best a shallow attempt to scare people without considerable thought into the subject matter.Alot of these ideas were being brought into the light when people didn't have the power to question the authority that was making the rules.Today we can openly question these loop holes and expose some very basic moral and ethical issues that surface when we are confrotned with the idea of hell.

True True True, too bad no Christian or Muslim has honestly answered the question yet.

I guess this is one of these questions they just can't answer, because it would force them to open up to the probability that they are wrong.

Originally posted by Goddess Kali
True True True, too bad no Christian or Muslim has honestly answered the question yet.

I guess this is one of these questions they just can't answer, because it would force them to open up to the probability that they are wrong.

The lack of them answering the question gives proof that the rules of who gets into heaven are wrong,or at least extreamely flawed.It basicly comes down to the nature of God.Either he isn't all loving,or he is too lazy to sort out the good people from other faiths and sends them to hell for not beliving in him or disobeying his law.Which would be like a sick game of cosmic Russian Roulette.Choose a faith and hopefully it's the right one!If you choose wrong be prepared for an eternity of suffering.

Originally posted by mr.smiley
The lack of them answering the question gives proof that the rules of who gets into heaven are wrong,or at least extreamely flawed.It basicly comes down to the nature of God.Either he isn't all loving,or he is too lazy to sort out the good people from other faiths and sends them to hell for not beliving in him or disobeying his law.Which would be like a sick game of cosmic Russian Roulette.Choose a faith and hopefully it's the right one!If you choose wrong be prepared for an eternity of suffering.

I guess that is basically it. This is one of those "I have to ignore it" questions....It's been almost a week since I started this Thread, and so far not one Christian or Muslim have given me an extensive honest and direct answer.

Any Christian who has answered it, has just been beating around the bush

sigh. its really not very hard. god is omnibenevolent. reguardless of the newer explanations of hell being the PERSON'S choice to stay away from god and enter hell. if god truly is perfectly loving and all powerful.
he would disreguard man's supposed CHOICE to stay away from him and go to hell and use his power to make him/her enter heaven as a person who loves and knows better. his perfect love would not allow men to suffer reguardless of their foolish choices. furthermore, christians have made the point fairly clear that IN hell, people will mourn forever their choice to turn away from christ. they will hope and ask for forgiveness. and they will TRULY want to enter heaven and accept christ. why is it THEN that god's OMNIBENEVOLANCE/perfect love will ALLOW them to suffer when they have learnt their mistake and conciously asked for forgivnes why THEN will god not take them out of hell. if not for the sake of malice, punishment,getting what one DESERVES or egoism. i do not believe in{nor does the english language by the way} of any TRUE LOVE , let alone OMNI love/benevolance that would let the person continue to suffer forever or a very long time if a person does not want to.