DMC(Heroes/Villains)Vs Nosgoth

Originally posted by Estacado
None of those videos show impressive speed feats......😬

you obviously didnt watch them all, their each about 5-6 mins long and youve posted within 10 mins of me....

the first one shows a feat just as fast as virgil cutting those things in half and they show a lot of other feats such as other kain/Raz attacks, more than enough to beat the twins

even with just his claws kain would beat the twins because the twins cannot kill kain. The guy can survive his heart torn out for heavens sake and can be disintegrated and still reform and thats if they can get past his various TK and magic powers.

what are they going to do to possibly survive blood gout...it instantly sucks out all blood in their bodies and theyll drop cold dead, and id like you to show me evidence of their "immunity" to soul sucking AND soul destruction please

Originally posted by Burning thought
you obviously didnt watch them all, their each about 5-6 mins long and youve posted within 10 mins of me....

the first one shows a feat just as fast as virgil cutting those things in half and they show a lot of other feats such as other kain/Raz attacks, more than enough to beat the twins

even with just his claws kain would beat the twins because the twins cannot kill kain. The guy can survive his heart torn out for heavens sake and can be disintegrated and still reform and thats if they can get past his various TK and magic powers.

what are they going to do to possibly survive blood gout...it instantly sucks out all blood in their bodies and theyll drop cold dead, and id like you to show me evidence of their "immunity" to soul sucking AND soul destruction please

Oh you mean that crappy fight with the dimension power?
Seems like you never played DMC 3 SE if you think Kain is faster then Vergil.

Originally posted by Estacado
😆 😆 😆 😆
OMG What a fanboy!!!!!
Also if you have noticed time slowed down around Vergil when he fought those creatures that means he was moving much more fast we just saw things from his point of view....

Oh you mean that crappy fight with the dimension power?
Seems like you never played DMC 3 SE if you think Kain is faster then Vergil.

...you fail

and there is no dimension power in the first video....you obviously have not played LOK..unless you mistook kains TK with dimension

as i said before, kain is faster and if he "is" slower then the brothers will still be dead before they can take him because hell simply cast blood gout and they will instantly drop down blood drained....you..are the fanboy 😄

Originally posted by Burning thought
...you fail

and there is no dimension power in the first video....you obviously have not played LOK..unless you mistook kains TK with dimension

as i said before, kain is faster and if he "is" slower then the brothers will still be dead before they can take him because hell simply cast blood gout and they will instantly drop down blood drained....you..are the fanboy 😄

Originally posted by Estacado
I'm not the one who said that Kain could beat LT who is 2nd to God.
Also there is a dimension reaver fight scene in the 1 st video....

that was when i didnt even know what the living tribunal really was, so i admit i was foolish when i said that....

what time on the video is the dimension reaver used? when Kain fights those void things he doesnt use the dimension reavers powers, hes just got the dimension emblem selected, hes using the sanguine sensher move

Originally posted by Burning thought
the video doesnt show bullet stopping speed, the one where Virgil can spin his swords stopping bullets is a good one

heres a few of Kain
shows that he can move just as fast or faster than Virgil in parts of it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yg_DVWDN6gQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y75dFzHoclk&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0-B-hdSG6A&mode=related&search=

and heres a pretty cool anime version, okie its not canon but its quite funny and i had to add it, besides its moves are very accurate

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wde04B7Xh1E&mode=related&search=

Originally posted by Burning thought
none of the brothers show teleportation....ive played DMC 1-3 to the end and ive not seen them teleport once, air trick and trickster abilities is not true teleportation, Kain can teleport great distances wheras the brothers air trick is very limited and only allows short distance movements.

also disarming Kain is usless, the brothers would only end up getting killed by the reaver, the reaver does not work on kain, it is a soul AND blood draining weapon, so even if the brothers do have the power to survive this at all which i have seen no evidence of in the games..where are you getting this 15 minutes of soul immunity from?...regardless of wether i belive you on this since i havnt played it for a long time id like you to show me where they have any kind of resitence and especially immunity to having their souls completly shattered, not drained as well as ripped from their bodies.

on a side note, even if they do have this so called 15 mins immunity and supposing kain doesnt simply drain the whole team dry of blood with blood gout and they die instantly from that. What makes you think they could defeat Kain in 15 mins, he still has other reaver abilities, your underestimating the time and dimension reavers since with time he can basically freeze time as well as speed himself up to counter them, he can turn his body into mist form and theyll hit nothing but air as well as its also a point Kain may actually be faster than the brothers. The Dimension power of the reaver can also allow kain instant teleportation instantly to up to 4 enemies and hit them with warp energy powered hits which could effectively slice the brothers in half or cause tremendous damage. Kain can also go Immaterial/ethereal and using a combination of teleport and his floating can almost fly.

now onto Kains TK. he could simply stick the brothers or one of them in place, Raziel to do the same to the other using his chains of telekeneisis and they wouldnt be able to move, not even use their weapons, at the same time kain could use a kind of darth vader style choking move with TK or even remove their weapons from them before cutting them down. Kain could solo all of these DMC characters using a combination of all his moves, without TK he can use incapacitate which is a magic spell, combine that with TK chains and he can freeze both brothers by himself and then battle mundus and sparda

Originally posted by Burning thought
you obviously didnt watch them all, their each about 5-6 mins long and youve posted within 10 mins of me....

the first one shows a feat just as fast as virgil cutting those things in half and they show a lot of other feats such as other kain/Raz attacks, more than enough to beat the twins

even with just his claws kain would beat the twins because the twins cannot kill kain. The guy can survive his heart torn out for heavens sake and can be disintegrated and still reform and thats if they can get past his various TK and magic powers.

what are they going to do to possibly survive blood gout...it instantly sucks out all blood in their bodies and theyll drop cold dead, and id like you to show me evidence of their "immunity" to soul sucking AND soul destruction please

Originally posted by Burning thought
...you fail

and there is no dimension power in the first video....you obviously have not played LOK..unless you mistook kains TK with dimension

as i said before, kain is faster and if he "is" slower then the brothers will still be dead before they can take him because hell simply cast blood gout and they will instantly drop down blood drained....you..are the fanboy 😄

Originally posted by Burning thought
that was when i didnt even know what the living tribunal really was, so i admit i was foolish when i said that....

what time on the video is the dimension reaver used? when Kain fights those void things he doesnt use the dimension reavers powers, hes just got the dimension emblem selected, hes using the sanguine sensher move

Originally posted by Estacado
😆 😆 😆 😆
OMG What a fanboy!!!!!

...prove me wrong then..i am unconvinced kain loses this....ive stated facts

Kain CAN cast TK shackles to freeze enemies in place.Kain CAN move people,objects including weapons with his TK as well as choke life out of them

he can survive being dissolved and his heart torn out of his body as well as having enhanced vampiric strength as well as the strength of several other vampire souls and vampiric reflexes combined with thousands of years of experiance

Kain can call lightning, teleport, turn into mist as well as transform into both bats and a werewolf. Kain without the reaver can rip souls from his enemies bodies as well as drain all the blood from up to four beings making them dry.

with the Reaver blade the strikes hit with the power to blast enemies into pieces with a single stroke, ripping their souls as well as blood draining powers and also has the power to launch soul destroying blasts, allow kain to warp dimensions to instantly attack enemies with increased force through dimension energy, make enemies go mad and kill eachother has its own chain lightning attack and time control which speeds up kain while freezing enemies.

yes Icejaw your right, its madness ime even bothering to debate, its blatently obvious to anyone who is not a DMC fanboy that Kain alone could defeat the two, let alone with Raziel and his vampire leautenants

Air Trick is true teleportation (unlike Dash and Sky Star, which are merely evasive speedups...though sometimes evasive speedups are shown in games as "teleportation", but they are easy to tell from true teleportation because of after image). Vegil's Darkslayer style is based purely on teleportation.
That's pretty much the same combat teleportation as Kain's Dimension Reaver ability. Deflecting attacks with help of Dimension Reaver? Well, how about Royalguard which allows Dante to do pretty much the same?

Doppelganger is pretty much useless against Light Reaver, but I don't think Dante will need it.
Draining high demonic lords dry of blood? Good luck in trying to perform that. Nevan was a vampire of the same rank as Kain (vampiric goddess), as well as lesser vampires. No one of them was successful in that. I don't think Kain will be lucky in performing that.

There're no fanboyish claims. If you ask for video, I can give you them.

I'll start with gameplay videos done by master players to stop some noobish claims about what is Darkslayer and what is Royalguard.

http://www.devils-lair.org/tourney/Marty-Darkslayer.wmv
That's what can be done with Darkslayer.

http://www.devils-lair.org/tourney/Pokey-Royalguard.wmv
The best of Royalguard

http://www.devils-lair.org/tourney/Dantelink-Trickster.wmv
Trickster style

http://www.devils-lair.org/cutscenes/dmc3/low/20%20-%20M7%20-%20Family%20Reunion.avi
http://www.devils-lair.org/cutscenes/dmc3/low/21%20-%20M7%20-%20Devil%20Trigger.avi

Famous Dante\Vergil first encounter.

As for swordsmanship... I'm sorry but despite "uber" experience, Kain does nothing with his sword (though the sword itself is great and probably the most powerful weapon in videogames) that Dante, Vergil or their father can't do better.

That's not immunity, that's resistance. But resistance for 15 minutes is enough there.

Originally posted by Burning thought
...prove me wrong then..i am unconvinced kain loses this....ive stated facts

Kain CAN cast TK shackles to freeze enemies in place.Kain CAN move people,objects including weapons with his TK as well as choke life out of them

he can survive being dissolved and his heart torn out of his body as well as having enhanced vampiric strength as well as the strength of several other vampire souls and vampiric reflexes combined with thousands of years of experiance

Kain can call lightning, teleport, turn into mist as well as transform into both bats and a werewolf. Kain [B]without the reaver can rip souls from his enemies bodies as well as drain all the blood from up to four beings making them dry.

with the Reaver blade the strikes hit with the power to blast enemies into pieces with a single stroke, ripping their souls as well as blood draining powers and also has the power to launch soul destroying blasts, allow kain to warp dimensions to instantly attack enemies with increased force through dimension energy, make enemies go mad and kill eachother has its own chain lightning attack and time control which speeds up kain while freezing enemies.

yes Icejaw your right, its madness ime even bothering to debate, its blatently obvious to anyone who is not a DMC fanboy that Kain alone could defeat the two, let alone with Raziel and his vampire leautenants [/B]

They have even repeated themselves for you, why? 'Cause you didn't read their first posts and what is it you NEED to do when you're having a debate over the internet? To read, GOD that's basic and incase you really are reading them I suggest reading them again and again and again if need be. Just look at the first argument in your post, that's already been debated, *UPDATES*, there you go BT, you got proved wrong again with an repeated argument, again.

And you're calling ME a fanboy? You claim you've played DMC when you clearly haven't.

Wow, just...Wow.

Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
There're no fanboyish claims.

Actually, when Kain's fanboys start scaring desent people with BS "facts" that Kain can toss mountains with his TK or other stuff, someone needs to stop that madness. Kain's combat teleportation avaliable with dimension reaver is no different from Air Trick or Darkslayer- teleportation next to enemy.
Vergil, Dante and their great father all have shown much greater combat speed overall, and they are mystical warriors, not spellcasters- that means that their abilities are activated with mere thought, without any hand gestures (unlike Kain's overrated TK).

And I'm not hater...for example, when Lionhearrtmm was ruining the image of reasonable Dante fan with claims that Dante can kill Living Tribunal, I was willing to kill him. People start to hate characters because of their rabid fanboys.

By the way, a friend of mine gave me a funny idea about countering Kain's mist form with Rudra by simply blowing it away...that should look really funny and it's entirely possible by performing either Whirlwind or Agni&Rudra Combo III (I use Devil's Lair classification of combos)... Not to mention that Dante (as well as his father and brother) is able to kill immaterial creatures.
Also an interesting thing to see would be "a bat-fight" between Kain's bats form and those electrically-charged bats summoned with Nevan...

Though that's just funny ways to counter Kain's "sneak" abilities and nothing major.

And the soul suck resistance? DMC3, mission 12, as well as numerous encounters with soul-sucking demonic creatures during the said game.

FYI ive read all the opiinions and ideas of people in this thread, but i have played all the games, yes i know what revan is, rank means nothing either...many things during gaming have the rank of god and some of them are puny compared to some characters in other games with no rank at all before their names, Revan uses a form of kiss and bats, shes much more a seduction vampire rather. Revan hasnt been shown to drain from a distance the entiety of a beings blood, wheras Kain in BO does it to demons,humans as well as other beasts. The brothers are not demon lords, they are half demon and they would not have any protection against Blood shower unless you can show me undeniable proof of it.

no matter how many times you try to say it, Trickster is still very limited teleportation, id like to see a video of dante moving further than a few metres with it.

also blowing away Kains mist form?, he could change back immediatley if he felt it was a threat and thats if it worked at all considering in mist form kain is in control of his body like it is a solid form, if this blowing away tactic works then your helping kain by giving him distance to use his TK and magic from. Kain doesnt use hand gesteres for most of his BO spells and his TK needs a quick hand movement and the target is frozen, the brothers wont be able to do anything while in TK shackles.

yes i agree, Kain shows no flashy or cocky sword skills, he can move his bland like the wind shredding his enemies however both in air and on the ground, what else would he need, its enough to not allow the brothers to get a sword hit in half the time what with him going into mist and passing through them not to menstion the reavers powerful explosive force on every hit would send them back a good distance.

and ill have to repeat, soul sucking is diffrent from soul destroying, having your soul sucked from you is what the reaver does, however kain destroys your soul with the Soul death spell, instantly he could kill one of the brothers, vergil is probably the strongest of the two brothers so Kain would have to kill him to make the biggest diffrence

also Darkslayer is not the same as Dimension reaver, first it instantly moves to up to 4 enemies in quick succession between each kain cannot be hit since his moving through dimensions incredibly quikcly and each strike of his sword is empowered even further with dimension energy, considering Soul reaver blade is already powerful enough to blast a human into pieces with one strike, empowered with dimension energy to further the thing...the brothers are going to be in a world of hurt

ofcourse once again even if Kain just stood there, the brothers cannot harm kain, only the reaver is surposed to be able to do it, but since the reaver is now Raziel who is kains ally it doesnt harm kain anymore which is why Kain cannot lose this fight simply because the brothers cannot kill him.

Oh my dear...Dante was able to resist his blood being sucked from his body by vampires numerous times...his body is able to withstand loss of gallons of blood. The same can be said about Vergil and Sparda Senior.

As for demonic lords. Look at Dante at DMC2 or Vegil in his Nero Angelo form. Both are true heirs of their father power, and being halfblood gives them an advantage over pureblood demons rather than a disadvantage.

The point with Rudra was made to counter "sneak attack in mist form" point. I don't think it would be too helpful, but that would be stimul for Kain to stay solid.
As for examples of quick combat teleportation from Dante, look at the fight with Despair Embodied (true skyfather-level being) at the end of DMC2.
By the way, Dante and his father can PWN Kain via the same algoritm Dante did to that deity. It was ready for pure demonic energy blast and didin't except any danger from guns ("weapon of puny mortals"😉- so Dante pulled out trojan horse trick, using his charging ability to channel all his demonic energy into Ebony and Ivory and giving to Despair Embodied seemingly harmless shot.
Since Kain doesn't know what firearms are, he can be tricked in the same way, I think. In games Dante is able to shoot ghosts with bullets charged with demonic energy (he uses that energy for "infinite bullets" ability, making shots as strong as he wishes (depending on how much energy he puts into the weapon)- from simply moving snooker balls to killing skyfather-level entities).

http://www.dark-chronicle.co.uk/def/attackkain.php
http://www.devils-lair.org/w-rebellion.php

Kain's combat speed is not that overwhelming when you compare him to either Dante or Vergil.

http://www.dark-chronicle.co.uk/def/reaverkain.php
http://www.dark-chronicle.co.uk/def/reaverraz.php

Defiance reavers abilities...nice but not too overwhelming, I think. Nothing that can't be countered. And Blood Shower is good, but using that on three opponents with really great healing factor is not that big of an advantage to Kain.
Also, as IceJaw said, Dante can increase his combat speed by using Quickheart amulet. And once his reaction speed is greater than Kain's , he can easily activate Quicksilver before Kain activates Time Reaver, and then... it's going to bo one hell of the party.

Even though Kain is technically immortal, KOing him is still possible.

despair is no way sky-father level, its puny, where does it show anything comapred to a sky-father, the thing was puny to beat in-game....infact the combinaton of all the DMC bosses in that big mess was harder than despair, since its attacks were easy to predict.

Kains combat speed if not as good as Dante and Vergil will be more than enough to defend himself from them, what makes you think with quickheart he has faster reflexes than Kain, Kain has the reflexes of nearly 10 vampires who he drained of their essence and their strength, also despair embodied cannot reform after being vaporised wheras Kain can, so even if the brothers get he drop on Kain they will not be able to destory him.

KOing Kain is no simple feat either, the only time is when Kain had the heart of darkness ripped out of him, since he no longer has any true means of being knocked out anymore how will they manage such a feat..chopping his head off or his limbs and hell simply reform.

another note on Blood shower is that it doesnt drain some blood, it drains all of it instantly, the brothers are very fast at regenerating i know but they have shown no way of regenerating their bodies supply, their bodies will simply shut down and they will both die. Mist form would not be used as a sneak attack in this fight since the brothers would probably be able to sense kain, however kain can keep using it to simply evade any attack they send at him and their weapons would pass through the mist, the brothers have not been shown to shoot mist.....

also on the reaver abilties, how will the brothers counter flame reavers inspire hate, once cast the brothers will end up trying to kill eachother, that would be time for kain to just sit back and watch the fun

Despair Embodied was skyfather-level storylinewise (a creature that embodied all the despair in the universe), not gameplaywise. Judging by gameplay, Elder God also wasn't that "godly". Just friggin' mass of tentacles.

In Mist form, Kain could pass over water and swamps without injury. He could also pass through grated doors and other barriers that blocked his path. He had to be wary of the Mist Vortex traps while in this form, but they were fairly rare.

Fighting both Sparda brothers and their father would be trouble for Kain...all three can resist their lifeforce being drained from them and that's shown in all DMC games numerous time.
Inspire Hate would be difficult, though they have resisted vampiric mental manipulation based on "primary instincts",

Kain could use his Wolf form to jump over narrow hazards, like spikes. He also needed it to climb ledges in the landscape. He could move much faster in Wolf form than in his normal vampire form. Kain's Wolf form was particularly powerful during a full moon.

Kain has quite nice combat speed in his Wolf form, but he can neither perform spellcasting nor use Reaver in that form, if I'm not mistaken.

i admit it will not be "easy" for kain, but he wont lose this, even if he doesnt actually beat the brothers he wont lose the fight and his mist form as i said is quite solid, if it can be blown away he would end up all over the place when using it wouldnt he since hes outside in mountain ranges and blustery areas both in cutscenes and gameplay, he is too in control with his mist to end up getting blown away

the mist form your reading there is the old BO mist form, but by the time of the end of Defiance he had mastered it so he could use it with ease and little will. And yes elder god wasnt godly, although he wasnt really a God as such, he was false God but the Despairs endurance is not equel to kains since it cnanot come back from vaporisation.

i still say kain could solo most of this based upon looking at the facts, he still simply has so many cards up his sleeves, even if the brothers counter some of his moves they could not counter indefinatley and eventually Kain will be able to activate blood shower or the brothers will not be able to take him down in 15 minutes and he will reave their souls, thats considering he cannot perform soul death before hand which doesnt suck but destroys souls instantly. He will solo but not easily but since Raziel AND Kain as well as all the vampire lords are actually in the battle then i think Nosgoth has this in the bag in the end