Darth Bane vs Darth Vader

Originally posted by Proteus

I can see why you wouldn't want me to 'go there and use some logic and reasoning skills.'

That's great, any moron can claim random shit, but until I see quotes and the like, which Gideon has been kind enough to provide, I'm not believing any of this.

To the same degree as Palpatine? No way, that only truly started with Bane's Ro2 lineage.

Never said he didn't, but to the degree that Exar did? Or Nihilus? Or Nadd? Highly doubt it.

How elaborate. 🙄

Very nice. Nihilus was able to play around with someone who could effortlessly do the same.

Are you asking me or are you telling me? If you're telling me, you're wrong. It doesn't matter that they're sith, greatness is always measured through achievements. It speaks for intelligence more than anything else, when looking at the achievements in question.

Those are some very black and white statements there, and even if they're true, it's not necessarily because they're weak that they fail or that they're viewed as such.

No, it means that you tone down its destructive nature. Assuming otherwise displays a clear lack of understanding of the english language.

They really don't. I've already mentioned some of Exar's, and Nihilus? The guy that can drain millions of force sensitive beings effortlessly in what can be deduced as a very short amount of time is more effective than Palpatine is in a hypothetical versus match. hell, we don't even know if Palpatine has a defence to Nihilus' ability.

You seem to misunderstood the argument, what I was saying, and what Gideon agrees with, is that power in the force isn't directly proportional to effectiveness in combat.

Not that such was being said, you're clearly wrong. It's up to the people who put forth these quotes to fully explain them. Aside from that, it's a very narrow minded approach to automatically assume that power always refers to combat prowess. As far as power goes in Star Wars, military and personal combat situations both appear as frequently as the other. You're arguing this in a very illogical manner.

Oh wow, a force user possessing great precision, I'm impressed. I guess AotC Anakin Skywalker is a god then, giving he displays precision in pretty much its most extreme form when slicing that poisonous creature off of Padme.

Which is clearly not beyond people like Exar and Nihilus. In case I wasn't clear, I'm not denying that Sidious is extremely powerful, or even one of the most powerful Sith Lords ever, but I just don't see him as being the most powerful, and nothing you've said has swayed me in any way. Really, nothing you've said is beyond people like Exar, Nadd or Nihilus.

Mentioned in numerous sources as 'most powerful'
Oh, I forgot the Dark Empire sources that establishes him as the most powerful as well...'the most powerful Sith who has ever lived has returned.'

Could I have a quote? You strike me as the type to make these things up.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree. [/B]

Originally posted by Proteus
Manslayer, you're undeniably mad. Trying to put Vader's slightly unfamiliar [to Bane] form in the same light as Kas'im's, which consisted of every single move and sequence there is for all 7 forms of lightsaber combat which was said to be numbered in the millions, and which was completely unfamiliar to Bane is crazy.

As for the battle, Bane shits on Vader.

The point is bane gets thrown off if he never even sees a paticular style before and there are styles which he hav yet to see

THIS alone will get bane owned and we have the fact that vader is an exceptional duelist

Its the same case for vaders different, Its just as unpredictable as it was never shown to bane before.

As for a force fight? Vaders strong enough to even take a shit on bane

Let me guess proteus, bane > vader because bane performs feat X and vader doesnt?

Originally posted by Proteus
Bane absolutely outclasses him in the force. Using strength in the force attributed as being greater than that of hundreds of force users combined (Source: inside flap of PoD), and utilising that strength with force control that was adequate in directing power strong enough to wipe out an entire planet without getting blown apart in the process, he'd absolutely demolish Vader.

Just so we can clear up this semantic debacle:

Main Entry: 2tame
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): tamed; tam·ing
transitive verb
1 a : to reduce from a wild to a domestic state b : to subject to cultivation c : to bring under control : HARNESS
2 : to deprive of spirit : HUMBLE, SUBDUE <the once revolutionary...party, long since tamed -- Times Literary Supplement>
3 : to tone down : SOFTEN <tamed the language in the play>
intransitive verb : to become tame
- tam·able or tame·able /'tA-m&-b&l/ adjective
- tam·er noun

Notice 1. C. - to bring under control or harness. And being that it is under number 1, it would take precedence over the number 2 and 3 definitions, although they are also correct in certain contexts. However, logic would point to the phrase meaning that Palpatine took control of the darkside rather than letting the darkside control him.

Originally posted by Proteus
Along with his inferior strength in the force, inferior non-force aided strength, inferior non-force aided speed, and the healing abilities and protection that the orbalisks provide.

-Using the force to take down a massive tree(One which is bigger than the pillar dooku took down and the same size as the jedi temple status which he lifted prior to mustafar) and crushing the dark woman

- Having massive TK abilities
Being able to wtf pwn the emperors medical room by merely getting pissed off

-Send tark flinging like a ragdoll against the flow of gravity up into the star destroyers ceiling causing a massive dent

-Diverting the flow of a waterfall to try to drown the dark woman

Originally posted by Proteus

Given his power was stated as being greater than that of the entire BoD,

These are the kind of JOKES that are made DARK LORDS.

The Sith students on Korriban were supposedly the best of the best, yet most were made Lords after MONTHS of training just to fill numbers

Githany a Jedi Knight after a few months is promoted to Lord.

Revan alone held more knowledge then their ENTIRE Academy.

Originally posted by Proteus

I'd say Bane could be well stronger than Palpatine in the force. His incredible displays despite his lack of age and experience in comparison would certainly suggest as much. Either way, nothing indicates that Palpatine (and thus, the weaker Vader) are on that level in force potential, so the burden of proof is on you.

Page 109 from the Dark Empire sourcebook:

Palpatine has risen from the dead. The most powerful Sith Lord who ever lived had returned."

Empire's End, one of the Sith spirits: He gave up everything to the Dark Side long ago. He has become the greatest who ever lived. He is the strongest who ever lived....I say we give what he wishes.

Star Wars Insider, Kevin J. Anderson, upon asked if he ever intended his Sith to be stronger than the OT sith: "No. Exar Kun, Naga Sadow and the others are on a firmly lower tier than Emperor Palpatine."

On TFN.net, official response to the strongest Sith: "Palpatine at his peak."

Essential Chronology: the most powerful Sith who had ever lived, Emperor Palpatine had returned from the grave."

The New Essential Chronology

Yoda was unable to defeat the most poweful sith lord in history

Star wars databanks The most powerful practionar of the sith ways in modern times

Originally posted by Proteus

Firstly, all the evidence points to Bane being stronger in the force as explained above. Neither Sidious or Vader have displayed anything to make one believe that they possess the power equivalent to that of hundreds combined, and by comparing their learning rate which is very much correlated to strength in the force, Bane has either beat by a large margin.

Originally posted by Proteus

Secondly, you really want to compare Vader's talent to Bane's. LMAO!! The guy was only capable of mastering force lightning in less than an hour, and an entire holocron's worth of sith rituals in a few days. Vader doesn't come close to Bane, talent wise.

Originally posted by Proteus

Thirdly, you label Palpatine as the most powerful Sith Lord in history, which is quite a claim to make. Could I have some proof? I'd certainly put Exar and Nihilus above him personally.

Originally posted by Proteus

Finally, since when does powerful force user equate to powerful teacher? That's a ridiculous notion to make. You'd firstly have to consider the fact that it's very likely that Palpatine held Vader back;

Originally posted by Proteus

he's certainly never produced anything which would suggest that he was being taught some extraordinary stuff in terms of knowledge, and we know that it's the way of a Sith Master to hold back their students so that they would never become powerful enough to challenge them. Burden of proof is again on you.

Being able to break every bone in a thug who harrased him by merely force pushing him into a wall also disproves your claim that vader is weak.

Or

Originally posted by Proteus

I was referring to the storm like ritual that Bane and the BoD performed. The entire BoD focused their power through Bane (Bane also appears to have been draining them), and Bane directed all of their power onto Ruusan. The attack was described as consuming everything in its path, and was said to eventually destroy the whole of Ruusan. Now before you point out that the power wasn't entirely Bane's, I know that, I'm just pointing out his exceptional control and mastery over the force.

Palpatine learned a Force Storm. It is is an attack that rips apart the fabric of existence and space-time. It can do everything from create a wormhole to move a person lightyears to ravage the surface of a planet to annihilate starfleets.

Palpatine uses Force lightning with enough power to kill 100 augmented Strormtroopers effortlessly. Same lightning reduced 3 dark siders strong enough to resurrect Darth Maul to charred skeletons.

His battle with Luke in Dark Empire, according to the audio, had enough energy sent off to kill nearby Stormtroopers. He also can drain planets of their energy.

Sorry Noobaris 2.0, but Manslayer is right. While Bane's mastery of the force is great, Vader's is apparently greater, ESPECIALLY after 20 years of tutelage under Sidious.

Originally posted by Gideon
Accusing me of being narrow minded is all well and good, Proteus, but it can't change the facts. Sadly, you've only listed one possible definition of taming. Given the context of the statement, taming is synonymous with mastey and domestication. You're suggesting that Sidious somehow "toned down" the destructive nature of the Force, which is a tall claim, and would require proof -- especially since Sidious is responsible for the application of some of the most destructive Force techniques ever used. I'm afraid that logic isn't with you on this one.

Firstly, burden of proof is on you. You provided the quotes in an effort to prove that Sidious was the most powerful ever, so, I'd suggest proving up.

Secondly, I agree with you that taming implies some sort of mastery or domination over something, but that's achieved by toning down its destructive nature. To someone like Nihilus, that would be something he'd never wish to achieve. Exar is also displayed to be a straight out fighter, that doesn't care to much for the subtleties of the force (except his senate trick).

Thirdly, I'm not saying that Sidious couldn't use the force with its very destructive nature, but he's the only sith shown to truly excel at using it with subtlety, which is all that quote supports.

You've, again, yet to provide any proof. You made the claim that Darth Nihilus is combat oriented. You're now rerouting your claim and making it that Nihilus would be better equipped to win in a fight, which -- again -- you've yet to prove.

Actually, I never once changed my stance. Notice how originally my choice of words was that he excelled in combat. You don't have to focus on it to excel at it. Now Nihilus is better equipped to win a fight than Sidious is Gideon; his feeding ability, which Sidious and nearly all probably don't have a defence for, is shown to be more destructive than pretty much anything in the SWU, killing millions in quick succession with no real effort needed. Aside of that, he's displayed the ability to telekinetically lift up giant ships and toss around force titans like Traya. Nothing would indicate that Sidious would last against someone like that in combat.

^ That is the claim that Lightsnake and I are addressing. Power. Not combat oriented skill (though, in any case, you've yet to prove Kun or Nihilus are better). We've proven Palpatine is more powerful and now you want to make the issue about who would win in a fight.

You've proven no such thing. The only reason I was arguing the force power/combat effectiveness issue was if Sidious was more powerful: a claim which I've yet to see proof for.

Palpatine drained Byss for years, sustaining his health -- which was compromised due to the raw dark side energies within him.

So he drained an unknown amount of energy from a non sentient being over years? Nihilus did the same to millions of force sensitives, effortlessly in quick succession. His feat is more impressive.

Exar did the same, though on a smaller scale (to thousands, not millions).

He could create Force Storms, "capable of demolishing fleets and tearing the surfaces off worlds".

Yet sadly the power's not exclusive to him (derived from the Ancient Sith, could be performed by Ancient Jedi, and Nadd has been stated as being able to do it) so in terms of putting him at the top of a hierarchy? It doesn't.

He could destroy lightsabers by gesturing,

Oh wow, so he could utilise a very small amount of TK to crush a crystal and some metal. What a god.

shrug off a "ton of machinery" dead weight that Leia Skywalker dropped on his head.

He's very impressive.

According to the audio sourcebook, during his fight with Luke, Palpatine generated dark side waves that killed nearby Imperial units.

Not to be rude Gideon, but I would find it extremely difficult to believe that this is the truth and not a lie. Firstly, it's not shown in the original source material, secondly audiobooks never usually give such new information, and thirdly, I can't even understand why you would even bother getting the audiobook. Who would? Not being rude, but naming an obscure source that hardly anyone is likely to have would be pretty convenient of you were being dishonest here. Anyways, I straight out don't believe this.

I could just as well say that Palpatine "owned at everything he did", which is unsubstantiated, much like your claim with Kun.

Well it's true. Lightsaber combat, he invented his own style and was considered Vodo's greatest student in his 600 years of teaching the order. With the force, he pretty much owned everyone he came across, whether it was blasting Sith Witches across the room or killing Ancient and Powerful jedi Masters. In terms of knowledge, he appears to have learnt a hell of a lot in a very small time, and he certainly displays this. Hell, in less than a year of studying sith magic, he arguably becomes its greatest ever user. He pretty much did own at everything he did.

This is ignoring the fact that Palpatine's mere presence unbalanced the Force

Since when? Most sources that I've come across indicate that it was the coming of the Chose One that caused the unbalance. In fact, the unbalance was detected way before Palpatine was even born.

and emitted a shroud over the Jedi that dulled their senses and precognition.

That was something he actively did, not a product of his mere presence, and like I was saying, palpatine truly did excel at using the force with subtlety.

I don't have my copy of the Dictionary on hand, but I've posted the quote numerous times. If you'd like, I'll do my best to hunt for the whole thing for you.

Cheers, we'll continue it until then.

@ Lightsnake: Until you learn to stop committing the burden of proof fallacy, start to read my arguments properly, and learn how to provide quotes and sources together rather than dropping a random quote or source every here and there, I'm not wasting my time with you.

Originally posted by Manslayer
Im sorry but vader isnt inferior to bane in the force, He has performed incredible feats through out his life.

-Using the force to take down a massive tree(One which is bigger than the pillar dooku took down and the same size as the jedi temple status which he lifted prior to mustafar) and crushing the dark woman

Oh wow, so he began the fall of the tree by slicing across the bottom of it, and then used an unknown amount of force power to accelerate its fall. This proves... what? That he would make a great lumberjack?

- Having massive TK abilities
Being able to wtf pwn the emperors medical room by merely getting pissed off

So in an uncontrolled rage (which essentially unleashes most of if not all your raw power), he tore up some medical equipment. I'm impressed.

-Send tark flinging like a ragdoll against the flow of gravity up into the star destroyers ceiling causing a massive dent

Sending one non force sensitive (who has no defence against TK) up into the air? Wow, I guess Obi-Wan would make Vader his b1tch then, given he did something undoubtably greater with Grievous.

-Diverting the flow of a waterfall to try to drown the dark woman

So he used TK to control the flow of water at some pretty fast currents? Tell me Manslayer, are you actually trying to make a case for Vader here? The Tk rwquired really wouldn't need to be that impressive.

"Bane recognized him as one of the lesser students from the Academy on Korriban: so weak in the Dark Side, it wasn't even worth learning his name." pg276

These are the kind of JOKES that are made DARK LORDS.

This is beyond a joke. So you're attempting to argue against the order as a whole by focusing on one of the weaker members who's only measurement of power is that he's weak in comparison to the order. That would be like saying that the PT Jedi suck because one of the weakest jedi in the order wouldn't possess a tenth of Yoda's power. See how silly that is? Comparisons within an order of force users cannot form a basis for the strenth of the order as a whole.

The Sith students on Korriban were supposedly the best of the best, yet most were made Lords after MONTHS of training just to fill numbers

Know what you're talking about, they're stated as having trained for years, not months. And again, going back to my original point, this is entirely irrelevant given one of the key reasons that they were made Masters was because the BoD desperately needed them on the battlefield, and Quordis had retained his status in the order for long before that took place.

Githany a Jedi Knight after a few months is promoted to Lord.

This is false. She had been a jedi Knight her entire life. It was as a Sith Lord that she had been for a few months.

Revan alone held more knowledge then their ENTIRE Academy.

No, the lore within his holocron contained more than that of the largely ignored archives. Nothing to do with the knowledge that you're clearly speaking of (of techniques).

I got proof palpatine > bane

Take note that I never once said Bane was more powerful; all I said was that he was probably stronger in the force.

Page 109 from the Dark Empire sourcebook:

Palpatine has risen from the dead. The most powerful Sith Lord who ever lived had returned."

Simply not true, I have the source on me.

Empire's End, one of the Sith spirits: He gave up everything to the Dark Side long ago. He has become the greatest who ever lived. He is the strongest who ever lived....I say we give what he wishes.

Fallible third parties.

Star Wars Insider, Kevin J. Anderson, upon asked if he ever intended his Sith to be stronger than the OT sith: "No. Exar Kun, Naga Sadow and the others are on a firmly lower tier than Emperor Palpatine."

On TFN.net, official response to the strongest Sith: "Palpatine at his peak."

Appeal to authority. An opinion of a random SW writer is not official, sorry.

Essential Chronology: the most powerful Sith who had ever lived, Emperor Palpatine had returned from the grave."

LMAO. This seems remarkably similar to the one from the Dark Empire Sourcebook, which turned out to be false... Yeah, I'm choosing to label this as a likely lie.

The New Essential Chronology

Yoda was unable to defeat the most poweful sith lord in history

The whole concept behind the NEC is that it's made to be a book that would exist within the Star Wars Universe. Meaning that the author, in this case, is not omniscient, but actually a character within the universe.

Star wars databanks The most powerful practionar of the sith ways in modern times

1000 years prior =! modern times.

Refuted

Firstly, even if your ramblings above were actually valid, they weren't even talking about force potential, but actual strength, which is not the comparison that I was just making.

Big deal and vader used the force crush technique for the first time when he got angry in the medical room and thus wtf pwning just about everything in it

Dealt with.

You just got it

No, you just don't get it.

RODV states that palpatine makes vader more powerful and trains him in the dark side to become very powerful, just that palpatine does it enough not to make him supremely powerful as the omniscient narrator states

Which essentially proves my point. As great a teacher as Sidious may possibly be, Vader isn't receiving the full benefits if Palpatine largely holds him back.

Well being able to choke somebody while not even there is impressive especially considering the distance between the bridge deck and the meditation chamber.

Which is indicative of refinement of the force, not any exceptional knowledge, which Vader clearly didn't receive from Palpatine.

Being able to break every bone in a thug who harrased him by merely force pushing him into a wall also disproves your claim that vader is weak.

Haven't actually come across that, but even still, it's really not very impressive. A mere portion of the attack that Bane released on Lehon against Kas'im (the part that hit Kas'im) would have been able to disintegrate Kas'im if not for the fact that he could defend himself, which is far more impressive. Either way, come to me when Vader can actually dominate powerful force users rather than some random non force sensitives, and you may have an argument.

Or

Is this actually supposed to mean anything? So he sent some wild dogs flying, Bane would have freaking disintegrated them with a small portion of his power.

Big deal, as you yourself pointed out bane couldnt do it himself.

Way to miss the point, which is that the fact that Bane could control it rather than get torn apart from the power speaks volumes.

Palpatine learned a Force Storm. It is is an attack that rips apart the fabric of existence and space-time. It can do everything from create a wormhole to move a person lightyears to ravage the surface of a planet to annihilate starfleets.

Yet sadly it doesn't put Palpatine at the top of the hierarchy when you have many people being able to do the same. And again, just to clarify, it is my opinion that Palpatine is more powerful than Bane. But not Exar, Nihilus or Nadd, and certainly not stronger in the force than Bane.

Palpatine uses Force lightning with enough power to kill 100 augmented Strormtroopers effortlessly.

Impressive indeed, but largely put to shame by Exar's draining of the Massassi, or Nihilus' destruction of Katarr.

Same lightning reduced 3 dark siders strong enough to resurrect Darth Maul to charred skeletons.

Unbelievable. So because they were somewhat adept at some obscure branch of the darkside, they somehow have greater resistance to lightning than anybody else? Don't be ridiculous.

His battle with Luke in Dark Empire, according to the audio, had enough energy sent off to kill nearby Stormtroopers.

I find it very hard to believe that this is true personally. Could I ask where you heard this from?

He also can drain planets of their energy.

An unknown amount of energy over many years. This in no way compares to Exar or Nihilus' usages of the technique.

Originally posted by Darth Sexy
Sorry Noobaris 2.0, but Manslayer is right. While Bane's mastery of the force is great, Vader's is apparently greater, ESPECIALLY after 20 years of tutelage under Sidious.

The tutelage in question means little, and no, nothing Vader has done compares to the mastery Bane displays by directing the sith storm ritual onto Ruusan. And even then, in pure strength, Bane has him beat by an even larger margin. For instance, when he lashes out at the powerful Quordis and wipes away at his force defence as if it wasn't even there, or when he hurled a wave of darkside energy at Kas'im, the middle of which was capable of disintegrating kas'im, and the rest of which was able to collapse the entire Rakatan Temple in seconds, or when Kaan's force persuasion (which could bend any Sith in the BoD completely to his will), when used against Bane, was described as having 'no more effect than a rusted knife scraping against the hide plates of a Halurian ice-boar.' Bane was simply leagues above anybody in his era in the force, and his strength, which I'll repeat, was described as being greater than the entire BoD's combined, would demolish Vader.

Originally posted by Darth Subjekt
Just so we can clear up this semantic debacle:

Main Entry: 2tame
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): tamed; tam·ing
transitive verb
1 a : to reduce from a wild to a domestic state b : to subject to cultivation [b]c : to bring under control : HARNESS
2 : to deprive of spirit : HUMBLE, SUBDUE <the once revolutionary...party, long since tamed -- Times Literary Supplement>
3 : to tone down : SOFTEN <tamed the language in the play>
intransitive verb : to become tame
- tam·able or tame·able /'tA-m&-b&l/ adjective
- tam·er noun

Notice 1. C. - to bring under control or harness. And being that it is under number 1, it would take precedence over the number 2 and 3 definitions, although they are also correct in certain contexts. However, logic would point to the phrase meaning that Palpatine took control of the darkside rather than letting the darkside control him. [/B]

No, that's not how it works. You can't just pick one definition over another simply because of the order that they appear in. Now Gideon brought up the quote, so the burden of proof is on him, meaning he has to absolutely substantiate it. He can't just pick a definition over another. Really, you're all displaying a clear ignorance of the English language. When you tame something, you reduce its wild or destructive qualities. It's not up for debate.

What a hypocrite..."YOU can't pick one defin-"
That's what you're doing, you dolt.

Look who it is! Lies, fanboyism, twisting of logic and truth....hey, it's that idiot Sith'Ari!
Welcome back, enjoy your stay! Now get out of my sight and go away again. Forever. Thanks.

And just to show he's a lying fool: I do have the DE sourcebook...hm...

And name a single Sith Lord who has used a Force Storm to destroy fleets...and again, moron: Kun didn't drain the Massassi himself

Firstly i know its you nebaris, seeing how you enjoy downplaying other sources which tear your claims to shits.

Originally posted by Proteus
Oh wow, so he began the fall of the tree by slicing across the bottom of it, and then used an unknown amount of force power to accelerate its fall. This proves... what? That he would make a great lumberjack?

Firstly so what if he slices the bottom of the tree? It just demonstrates his ability to able to use his telekenesis effectively to bring down large objects, tell me bane fanboy what has bane done with telekenesis?

Oh thats right NOTHING. This simply proves his TK is effective and on a higher level than bane

Does it only have to be done on a force user for it to at the least impressive? Your an idiot nebaris,

Ohh lets see, You know NJO dont you? Most of the feats he did like his instant death emerald lightning and vast TK were on all NON force users, I guess Luke using TK to manipulate a black hole doesnt mean shit

Originally posted by Proteus

So in an uncontrolled rage (which essentially unleashes most of if not all your raw power), he tore up some medical equipment. I'm impressed.

While a clear minded "teh zone" anakin he was able to tool count dooku in a matter of minutes. My point? Prove up that getting angry unleashes your full raw power

Originally posted by Proteus

Sending one non force sensitive (who has no defence against TK) up into the air? Wow, I guess Obi-Wan would make Vader his b1tch then, given he did something undoubtably greater with Grievous.

Prove to me obi wan is a weak force user? As far as i know he is exceptionally good in the force for a lightsider.

You also fail to notice that vaders force wave/push kills its victims, like the thug who harrased him and the last time i remember bane using the force wave, it severely drained his energy to a point where he had to lie down and couldnt go on

Originally posted by Proteus

So he used TK to control the flow of water at some pretty fast currents? Tell me Manslayer, are you actually trying to make a case for Vader here? The Tk rwquired really wouldn't need to be that impressive.

Originally posted by Proteus

This is beyond a joke. So you're attempting to argue against the order as a whole by focusing on one of the weaker members who's only measurement of power is that he's weak [b]in comparison to the order.
[/B]

Then what have the other so called dark lords done which at the least hints them to be exceptional?

How powerful was the order nebaris? Seeing that kaan their greatest and strongest leader is a mere piece of shit when compared to the likes of bane, vader, sidious revan and just about every force user from the kotor era, PT and TOTJ

And look here you dolt, why in the hell is a LESSER student being made a DARK LORD OF THE SITH? Supposidly the best of the best?

I wasnt merely focusing on just one paticular member of the BOD, Dont you get it? Dark lords are the best of the best and jokes like him get promoted to dark lords in a matter on months or years? Tell me nebaris what have the other students done which is impressive in the force or at the very least something to speak about?

We havnt seen them do shit on the level of vader and before your rants of BOD sith lord > PT jedi, theres a quote of lucas which will disprove that

Heres a quote you should consider

Those with greater ability are sent to worlds to that have allied with out cause destroy the republic

Right the lesser student that bane met and stepped on was with "greater ability that the rest" that was sent to fight against the jedi and republic

Sirak hasnt done shit, Githany too for that matter, what about kaan or quordis? The so called "Strongest of the order"?

Originally posted by Proteus

That would be like saying that the PT Jedi suck because one of the weakest jedi in the order wouldn't possess a tenth of Yoda's power. See how silly that is? Comparisons within an order of force users cannot form a basis for the strenth of the order as a whole.

Originally posted by Proteus

Know what you're talking about, they're stated as having trained for years, not months.

Originally posted by Proteus

And again, going back to my original point, this is entirely irrelevant given one of the key reasons that they were made Masters was because the BoD desperately needed them on the battlefield, and Quordis had retained his status in the order for long before that took place.

Originally posted by Proteus

This is false. She had been a jedi Knight her entire life. It was as a Sith Lord that she had been for a few months. .

Right, shes the best of the best

Originally posted by Proteus

No, the lore within his holocron contained more than that of the largely ignored archives. Nothing to do with the knowledge that you're clearly speaking of (of techniques).

Originally posted by Proteus

Take note that I never once said Bane was more powerful; all I said was that he was probably stronger in the force.

Originally posted by Proteus

Simply not true, I have the source on me.

Originally posted by Proteus

Fallible third parties.

Originally posted by Proteus

Appeal to authority. An opinion of a random SW writer is not official, sorry.

Did he do that? No

Originally posted by Proteus

LMAO. This seems remarkably similar to the one from the Dark Empire Sourcebook, which turned out to be false... Yeah, I'm choosing to label this as a likely lie.

1) Your nebaris
2) Your in denial

Originally posted by Proteus

The whole concept behind the NEC is that it's made to be a book that would exist within the Star Wars Universe. Meaning that the author, in this case, is not omniscient, but actually a character within the universe.

An in universe character IS NOT alive,An in universe character CANNOT dictate galactic history simply because the character isnt alive, Again daniel wallace confirmed it in his emails to janus and lightsnake and the NEC is written BY DAN WALLACE, NOT an universe character in reality.

Originally posted by Proteus

1000 years prior =! modern times.

Originally posted by Proteus

Firstly, even if your ramblings above were actually valid, they weren't even talking about force potential, but actual strength, which is not the comparison that I was just making.

Anakin had the most potential of any character, And that potential equates to be twice as powerful as sidious.

Sorry, your wrong again banehumper

Originally posted by Proteus

Dealt with.

Originally posted by Proteus

No, I just don't get it.

Originally posted by Proteus

Which essentially proves my point. As great a teacher as Sidious may possibly be, Vader isn't receiving the full benefits if Palpatine largely holds him back.

Originally posted by Proteus

Which is indicative of refinement of the force, not any exceptional knowledge, which Vader clearly didn't receive from Palpatine.

Originally posted by Proteus

Haven't actually come across that, but even still, it's really not very impressive. A mere portion of the attack that Bane released on Lehon against Kas'im (the part that hit Kas'im) would have been able to disintegrate Kas'im

Originally posted by Proteus

if not for the fact that he could defend himself, which is far more impressive. Either way, come to me when Vader can actually dominate powerful force users rather than some random non force sensitives, and you may have an argument.

Then i guess banes just as weak as he kills weakling force users and in the end only fought one true force user in a saber duel with kasim where he nearly gets his ass handed

Vader was merely trying to get that thug away from him, what happens if he was actually trying to kill him?

Originally posted by Proteus

Is this actually supposed to mean anything? So he sent some wild dogs flying, Bane would have freaking disintegrated them with a small portion of his power.

Actually the fact weather he sent a pack of dogs is ambiguous, he could have choked 10 of them at once and instantly killed them seeing that their corpses are just a few feet away, Him blowing them back with the force would send them dozens of feet away rather than af ew

Originally posted by Proteus

Way to miss the point, which is that the fact that Bane could control it rather than get torn apart from the power speaks volumes.

Originally posted by Proteus

Yet sadly it doesn't put Palpatine at the top of the hierarchy when you have many people being able to do the same. And again, just to clarify, it is my opinion that Palpatine is more powerful than Bane. But not Exar, Nihilus or Nadd, and certainly not stronger in the force than Bane.

Originally posted by Proteus

Impressive indeed, but largely put to shame by Exar's draining of the Massassi, or Nihilus' destruction of Katarr.

And nihilus only drained what? A few jedi on the planet unaware to his presence? Palpatine has drained the planet of byss over the years to replenish his energies

Originally posted by Proteus

Unbelievable. So because they were somewhat adept at some obscure branch of the darkside, they somehow have greater resistance to lightning than anybody else? Don't be ridiculous.

Originally posted by Proteus

I find it very hard to believe that this is true personally. Could I ask where you heard this from?

Originally posted by Proteus

An unknown amount of energy over many years. This in no way compares to Exar or Nihilus' usages of the technique.

Oops n00baris got banned again

Damn.

Perhaps next time, Nebaris.

What a pathetic tool...

Well, at least we only have about a week until he comes back...

Can someone please tell me why vader is even thought of as powerful? the only powers ive ever seen him use are force pull and choke, plus he can barley walk, how can he hope to face off against someone as ruthless and powerful as Bane? Plus Bane did much more then Vader ever could.
By the way, George Lucas just says Sidious is the most powerful Sith, and that Vader can defeat everyone and BS like that to promote the movies, it doesnt mean us star wars fans have to accept everything he says.

Originally posted by Sith Dude

By the way, George Lucas just says Sidious is the most powerful Sith, and that Vader can defeat everyone and BS like that to promote the movies, it doesnt mean us star wars fans have to accept everything he says.

Um whenever the creator something makes a statement it is canon you can pick and choose what is want isnt just because you don't like it.

Originally posted by Sith Dude
Can someone please tell me why vader is even thought of as powerful? the only powers ive ever seen him use are force pull and choke, plus he can barley walk, how can he hope to face off against someone as ruthless and powerful as Bane? Plus Bane did much more then Vader ever could.
By the way, George Lucas just says Sidious is the most powerful Sith, and that Vader can defeat everyone and BS like that to promote the movies, it doesnt mean us star wars fans have to accept everything he says.

What lucas says is canon, get over it. And sorry, its been prove vader > bane, he doesnt have TK and choke only, he has force crush and shown the ability to choke being lightyears away, most notably the time he choked zixor when zixor was on coruscant and vader on the devastator

Originally posted by Thiru
made the most stupid statement i have ever seen in this forum.

Look harder.