Originally posted by jinzin
actually their histories for both characters have two good showings for wolverine and one backdown in wolverine's favor.... it would be ignoring the histories to say that namor wins easily despite never having done so before in his respective history...
"Plot Induced Stupidity, or PIS, is when characters don't use their abilities or skills to the fullest extent as shown before, even within their personality ranges, for the sake of the story plotline. It makes lesser powered characters an actual challenge against higher powered characters in the comics. Examples of PIS include Flash stories lasting longer than three panels, or Toy Man as a threat to Superman."
In forum fights, Namor will actually use the abilities that he has shown hundreds of times in his appearences. If you take the abilities of both characters, Namor outclasses Wolverine in pretty much everything except fighting skills. He is literally hundreds of thousands of times stronger. One punch from him will send Wolverine fllying, like it has done to so many characters.
Namor is fast enough to easily dodge Wolverine's blows. He has catched missiles that come with speed well over Mach 1, dodged an Mach 1 attack with ease, and has dodged bullets and lazers among other things. Unless Wolverine's hands move with Mach 5 or something it's not very probable that he will lay hands on Namor fighting with his full potential. Meanwhile, Namor (whose hands move fast enough to propel himself with Mach speeds through water) will be hitting him with dozen times in less then a moment. Namor will also have the option to fly around him in manner to something like this. Namor can fly fast enough to catch on Japanese (top speeds go over 370 MPH) and German (top speed: 460 MPH) WWII airplanes. The guy here also comments that he is faster then any American plane he has ever seen. And here, while weakened by water, he outspeeds Human Torch I (top speed at least 150 miles per hour). I would put his speed somewhere aroud 250 MPH-350 MPH. Classic Quicksilver's speed was perhaps 175 MPH. So, Namor can also speedblitz Wolverine on this fight. Namor is faster.
And let's not even go into durability...
http://img523.imageshack.us/my.php?image=namorfeat889cy.gif
There would be smoldering pile of adamantium left of Wolverine if he would be dropped from space. Namor is more durable.
What is left to Wolverine? Greater fighting skills, which won't help when the opponent is better then you in every physical attribute, and healing factor that can be overloaded.
speed feats? wolverine cut's bullets out of mid air... in berserker mode they appear to be in slow motion to him... he's also dodged his own fare share of lazers... his senses picked up on a lazer about to fire and kicked rogue out of the way before it went off... he's cut the cape off storm in mid flight... he's stopped quicksilver and speed demon in midrun. he's killed northstar... he's caught ogun on a number of occasions who's a damn 7 on the speed stat...
strength.. wolverine's been taking class 100 shots since his first appearance..
nothing new..
healing factor and admantium put endurance, damage soak, and possibly even durability in his favor..
you've already admitted he has superior fighting skills to namor...
he's still winning or at the very least killing namor in the process of being Koed...
sorry but if his feats vs. namor weren't consistent you may have a point about pis..
Originally posted by jinzin
fight takes place in central park.. he tries this they both automatically lose by ringout... goodluck grabbing wolvie without getting cut though...
oh, come on now, he's been grabbed loads of times. and how would namor lose on a ring out? he wouldn't necessarily have to follow him.
Originally posted by leonidas
oh, come on now, he's been grabbed loads of times. and how would namor lose on a ring out? he wouldn't necessarily have to follow him.
and he's cut down those who've attempted such a load of times too...
that's the thing.. why is it considered to be less probable when logan does something more than he does not? why is this standard of logic only admissible to wolverine's character? seems pretty subjective to me...
Originally posted by jinzin
speed feats? wolverine cut's bullets out of mid air... in berserker mode they appear to be in slow motion to him...
Namor laughs at bullets. The man captures missiles who go lot faster then bullets.
Originally posted by jinzin
he's also dodged his own fare share of lazers... his senses picked up on a lazer about to fire and kicked rogue out of the way before it went off...
Hmm? Someone fired lazer and he was able to get Rogue out of it's way before it hit her? Show scans about that, or him dodging lazers, now that you mentioned it..
Originally posted by jinzinNothing Namor could not do if you gave him something sharp...
he's cut the cape off storm in mid flight...
Originally posted by jinzin
he's stopped quicksilver and speed demon in midrun.
Classic Quicksilver? He's only able to run with 175 MPH. Was he even going with full speed? Scans? Issue? And if I recall he threw things at Speed Demon.
Originally posted by jinzin
he's killed northstar...
Lol yeah, I think Shadowcat had more to do on that then Wolverine.
Originally posted by jinzin
he's caught ogun on a number of occasions who's a damn 7 on the speed stat...
Scans. Issues. Anything. I am inclined to believe that Ogun is not going with lightspeed in any of those pictures.
Originally posted by jinzin
strength.. wolverine's been taking class 100 shots since his first appearance..nothing new..
Can he take them with speed of dozen blows in less then moment? And Namor has sent people like Hulk and Silver Surfer fly with his blows, and since basic laws of physics apply to even Wolverine, he will fly back. He comes back, casual blow and he is sent back again.
Originally posted by jinzin
healing factor and admantium put endurance, damage soak, and possibly even durability in his favor..
Damage soak, yes. He is able to survive in something that would be fatal to others. But durability?
http://img523.imageshack.us/my.php?image=namorfeat889cy.gif
Nope.
Originally posted by jinzin
you've already admitted he has superior fighting skills to namor...
And...they are not going to help him much...
Originally posted by jinzin
he's still winning or at the very least killing namor in the process of being Koed...
Not really. He's Koed and Namor has maybe few scratches. Wolverine can be knocked out, you know. He has brains inside that skeleton, which, if I can recall right, is made of adamantium, and not vibranium which can absorb impacts...
Originally posted by jinzin
sorry but if his feats vs. namor weren't consistent you may have a point about pis..
It's not Wolverine who bothers me, it's the actions of Namor.
He was fighting like a frigging ten year-old against Wolverine, when he does stuff like this against other opponents:
http://img306.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captnamor18vl.gif
http://img306.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captnamor26el.gif
http://img306.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captnamor31vu.gif
Originally posted by jinzin
and he's cut down those who've attempted such a load of times too...
You also realize that if Wolverine attempts to cut Namor, he can simply grab his hands and keep his claws away from him. Wolverine could spit on his face, kick him or anything, Namor would probably be just amused. Wolverine's strenght is pathetic compared to Namors, it would be like me keeping the hands of three-month old baby away from me.
no worries, bro. your secret is safe . . . 😆
stronger people than namor out of water have beat on wolverine in the past. i've no doubt he could catch his arms, but then what? fighting him in the water is the only sure way i see namor being able to win 10/10 in this scenario, and he could certainly chuck him into one of the rivers surrounding manhattan.
namor's problem is he would have to beat wolvie senseless with physical power while having to avoid getting sliced to shreds. that's tough to do. on land, and given their history and wolvie's history, i could see it going either way. namor needs to get him in water then he owns him.
Wha..?? Leo? Come on now, you actually think Wolverine could win (even if it's 1/10). Namor's reflexes are superhuman too, and a few good punches and Logan would be dazed as all hell. Namor's a smart enough guy to take advantage of that. And the fight would be over long before the out-of-water fatigue sets in.
I'm with DC here. Aside from blind luck or major PIS Namor owns this fight. I'd be willing to say something like 1/30 for Wolverine, since 1/10 seems too much. Logan gets way too much respect, though I'm sure it isn't beyond Marvel (or Bendis) to have Wolverine winning a fight like this.
{Edit} I just realized this thread is 28 pages....lol. Figures Jobberine would get this kind of attention.
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Wha..?? Leo? Come on now, you actually think Wolverine could win (even if it's 1/10). Namor's reflexes are superhuman too, and a few good punches and Logan would be dazed as all hell. Namor's a smart enough guy to take advantage of that. And the fight would be over long before the out-of-water fatigue sets in.I'm with DC here. Aside from blind luck or major PIS Namor owns this fight. I'd be willing to say something like 1/30 for Wolverine, since 1/10 seems too much. Logan gets way too much respect, though I'm sure it isn't beyond Marvel (or Bendis) to have Wolverine winning a fight like this.
wolverine has already won. and wolverine ahs dodged faster people then namor. wolverine needs one good slash and namor done but namor needs to beat wolverine out. wolverine sue to fist fight I guy who was consider only a little under hulk in strength all the time.
