What are your thoughts on downloading copyrighted stuff?

Originally posted by Darth Jello
My charges against the music and film industry, evidence of which you can find on many sites and from many sources such as public citizen is that they are a consortium of companies which conspire to influence and set prices on their products in order to destroy market competition. They are involved in drug trafficking to their employees in order to keep them obedient and on the principle that a dead artist is always more valuable than a live one. They keep their front as legitimate organization through activities that can best be described as bribery as evidenced by the Fair Use music controversy in 1999, and they threaten anyone who crosses them through extortion by threat of exhorbitant lawsuits which imply that EVERY download is a lost sale and usually equal to 10,000% of the actual financial loss. They knowingly and willfully conspire with their lawyers and legal council to fabricate charges and occasionally argue cases on behalf of property they don't own against many in the population, including students, children, the deceased, and the innocent and have even set up a website and a program to extort money from students they suspect of downloads.

Now, how RICO works. There are are series of laws, about 36 i believe which include racketeering, extortion, murder, bribery, etc. which if a company is guilty of any two, are considered to be a part of organized crime. Rico charges may also be brought up against any company using malicious lawsuits in order to stifle legal activity. Under this definition both the RIAA and MPAA can be considered Racketeering Influenced and Corrupt Organizations, therefore, mobsters.

With all due respect, this is like the Al Gore of posts on downloading.

Most of it is you filling in gaps as you see fit and villanising an industry more than you have any reasonable grounds to. Whether or not they do some less than ethical things is of course questionable, but actually supplying their artists with drugs to keep them docile, or dead?

Are you actually sitting there with tin foil on your head or better yet, do you genuinely expect me to take this post seriously or something?

Corrupt does not equal being a mobster, what's wrong with you?

-AC

I download on occasion. Not proud of it, but its a good way to discover new artists.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
With all due respect, this is like the Al Gore of posts on downloading.

Most of it is you filling in gaps as you see fit and villanising an industry more than you have any reasonable grounds to. Whether or not they do some less than ethical things is of course questionable, but actually supplying their artists with drugs to keep them docile, or dead?

Are you actually sitting there with tin foil on your head or better yet, do you genuinely expect me to take this post seriously or something?

Corrupt does not equal being a mobster, what's wrong with you?

-AC

Do you ever wonder why so many clean people seem to get heavily into drugs once they sign to major labels? And i'm not villainizing an industry, i'm villainizing a cartel that's monopolizing an industry

Originally posted by Darth Jello
Do you ever wonder why so many clean people seem to get heavily into drugs once they sign to major labels? And i'm not villainizing an industry, i'm villainizing a cartel that's monopolizing an industry

That's a leap of idio...faith, that I'm not willing to make.

-AC

Originally posted by Darth Jello
Do you ever wonder why so many clean people seem to get heavily into drugs once they sign to major labels? And i'm not villainizing an industry, i'm villainizing a cartel that's monopolizing an industry

Is that your justification for stealing?

I still can't believe he seriously claimed that.

-AC

Originally posted by Darth Jello
Do you ever wonder why so many clean people seem to get heavily into drugs once they sign to major labels? And i'm not villainizing an industry, i'm villainizing a cartel that's monopolizing an industry

its a dodgy theory. im sure many artists feel disgusted with themselves for abandoning their own hearts and selling out by allowing producers to cowrite their songs and tell them what they can/cant do, but they make their own decision to become junkies.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
The only artist I've ever really notice that happen with, at least so rabidly and fairly recently, is Muse.

They were more or less a cult band, from '98 onward, then they were just viewed as a really good English band. Their third album was released in '03 I think, but then it got put out in the States and they just skyrocketed.

Fair enough in some cases you can't find music from abroad due to distribution or popularity or whatever, but some people were just crazy over it.

That said, I don't think any of the US releases were that chopped up.

I know Japan usually get two bonus tracks or different ones, UK usually get a couple, and the standard release is what the country of origin gets.

It's weird, I always thought if they aren't good enough to be on an album, just leave em off. Though some are good in some cases.

I realise I've gone somewhat off your point, but yeah.

I don't care really, I'm not patriotic about artists by any means. Artists generally have the ability to make me proud I chose music as my main interest, but it's never really about nationality. Most of the British acts that seem to succeed over there are ones I hate anyway, haha.

-AC

Aqualung, Ben's Brother are the most recent examples I've seen.

It isn't about being musically patriotic, it's about American labels being sold the rights to release the albums and hacking them up. If you're interested in artistic integrity, whether you like the band or not, it should bother you.

Were I someone that spent more time in England, I might notice the same thing being done by English labels. But, as it is, I don't.

Yeah, it's a shit thing, especially now with the labels making more and more of an attempt to reap the benefits to everything, not necessarily just sales.

Most labels actually require ownership, or majority ownership of recording masters now, which sucks, but then again...if you're dumb enough to sign...

Trent Reznor made that mistake with TVT Records all those years ago, back in the very late 80s and he only just cleared all the legal issues up as of '05.

-AC

Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
Is that your justification for stealing?

again, i don't steal i usually buy the album and usually its on a label that isn't part of the RIAA (or erroneously listed as part on their website), i just think that stealing from thieves isn't morally bankrupt

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
And you're a terrible grammatical proprietor, Deano.

-AC

only cos im lazy 🙂

Originally posted by Darth Jello
again, i don't steal i usually buy the album and usually its on a label that isn't part of the RIAA (or erroneously listed as part on their website), i just think that stealing from thieves isn't morally bankrupt

Two wrongs and rights?

dude, I don't even own/use file sharing software and the only illegal music i have is on vinyl. And in this situation, what people are doing is wrong but the people who are suing them (unless it's a single record company, an artist, or a LEGALLY defined trade group) don't have the right to sue. It is against american legal ettiquette and law for an illegal organization to sue someone. It is also illegal to sue someone over something you don't own. In these situations, i believe that two wrongs do make a right because they can be defined as civil disobedience and a from of protest.
For examples of the latter crime, I had a friend in college get a threatening letter from the RIAA for downloading a song by The Joykiller. Joykiller are on epitaph records that has no connection to the RIAA other than distribution in several countries and was therefore listed as an RIAA member on their website despite not actually being one. He challenged and the decision was thrown out. An even more heinous example, another friend is in a local band and was victimized by Sony Records' infamous copyright virus when he burned a cd to his itunes and never bothered to get fixed, hence allowing sony access to his computer. He was sent a notice for trading a song on AIM...a song HE WROTE. luckily, he also had the balls to fight and received a hefty settlement for wrongful and malicious suit. Now doesn't this and many of the examples of their activities sound like extortion, violation of privacy, filing of malicious lawsuits, and...TERRORISM?

Wait, accusing record labels of being mobsters was funny, saying they make their artists drug addicts was humourous but slightly worrying considering the fact that you meant it, but saying they are committing terrorism?

I just hope you don't expect to be taken seriously.

-AC

Here is my justification for downloading music:
A band or artist makes most of their money touring etc. Record companies take a large percentage of profits from album sales. Thats why you rarely (if ever) see the actual artists sueing anyone for illegally downloading. I have a hard time believing that a band or musical artist is terribly detrimented by music downloads. They should just be glad people are listening to their music in the first place.

Originally posted by Kumar
Here is my justification for downloading music:
A band or artist makes most of their money touring etc. Record companies take a large percentage of profits from album sales. Thats why you rarely (if ever) see the actual artists sueing anyone for illegally downloading. I have a hard time believing that a band or musical artist is terribly detrimented by music downloads. They should just be glad people are listening to their music in the first place.

Silly argument.

It's called personal responsibility and respect, in my opinion, people should pay that respect, by paying money. Either way, they aren't getting money they deserve if you don't pay.

As for the truly stupid argument that artists SHOULD be thankful in spite of you owning something of theirs without them getting something of yours that they are owed...well...it's just a stupid, ignorant argument.

Some artists are ok with it, but the default should be that you assume they aren't and respect them.

-AC

My justification is that I'm an immoral rapist and downloading music is the least of my evil deeds.

Hello, oim Alph-o, I do my part to stop illegal downloading.

*Pointing at BackFire*

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeahhh.

-AC

i download music illegally, to piss off AC.

What are my thoughts on it? Thinking is for the weak, I say who gives a shit.