If Surfer doesn't know about superman's Two plot device weaknesses, He'd Lose or only stalemate Superman. NO Energy wielder alone has the goods to put Supermand down unless they are Entitly lvl or better. Superman's Durability is legendary and rediculous. It's really probably up there with Thanos'. I know I"ll get called nvr had aclue. But that is how it seems. If WonderWoman can take a tech black hole to the dome, Superman is far superior to her in Durability. just my two cents.
Originally posted by batdude123
If the writers meant for a joke to be in there… then I didn’t get it. 😕
Originally posted by batdude123
That whole feat was done off-panel. My statement is just as justified as yours, because you have nothing to go off of from that scan considering it doesn’t actually show Surfer doing anything.
Originally posted by batdude123
🤨This hardly proves anything. First of all, where’d you get the idea that Surfer was traveling “FAR” faster than light in that instance? There’s absolutely NO point of reference for one to come to the conclusion that Surfer was traveling at faster than light speeds there. Second of all, you’re giving me an instance where Surfer was unable to grasp it… so that doesn’t really help your case either.
Originally posted by batdude123
Fair enough, however current Thanos (pre death) never gave me the impression that he was what he used to be. And to be honest, I’ve [B]never seen anything from Thanos to make me believe that he was out and out more powerful than the Surfer… at least from an energy and versatility stand point. It was his physical superiority to Surfer that allowed him to pwn Norrin.[/B]
Are you kidding? Before he dies Thanos was doing stuff like this...
http://img227.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img227&image=beyonder6ve.jpg
http://img225.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img225&image=beyonder29wk.jpg
http://img222.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img222&image=maker11qu.jpg
http://img215.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img215&image=maker26di.jpg
http://img214.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img214&image=maker38et.jpg
http://img208.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img208&image=maker49bp.jpg
http://img204.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img204&image=maker54bp.jpg
I don't think he was powered down at all seeing as how that was the evolved form of the Beyonder he beat.
Originally posted by batdude123
Saying Superman’s heat vision compares to the heat of stars is the understatement of the century. Many people even tougher than Surfer have fallen victim to Superman’s heat vision. And using a comic arc that may, or may not have been canon doesn’t do Superman’s heat vision justice because we’ve seen from him FAR more impressive accomplishments. I think his HV would affect Norrin… hell I could even see it doing damage against him if he cuts loose with it. He’s shown some pretty amazing things recently with it.
I'm not trying to downplay Supes heat vision, I just don't see it being all that effective against Surfer who's all but immune to heat.
Originally posted by batdude123
If the writers meant for a joke to be in there… then I didn’t get it. 😕
Originally posted by batdude123
That whole feat was done off-panel. My statement is just as justified as yours, because you have nothing to go off of from that scan considering it doesn’t actually show Surfer doing anything.
Originally posted by batdude123
🤨This hardly proves anything. First of all, where’d you get the idea that Surfer was traveling “FAR” faster than light in that instance? There’s absolutely NO point of reference for one to come to the conclusion that Surfer was traveling at faster than light speeds there. Second of all, you’re giving me an instance where Surfer was unable to grasp it… so that doesn’t really help your case either.
Originally posted by batdude123
Fair enough, however current Thanos (pre death) never gave me the impression that he was what he used to be. And to be honest, I’ve [B]never seen anything from Thanos to make me believe that he was out and out more powerful than the Surfer… at least from an energy and versatility stand point. It was his physical superiority to Surfer that allowed him to pwn Norrin.[/B]
Are you kidding? Before he dies Thanos was doing stuff like this...
http://img227.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img227&image=beyonder6ve.jpg
http://img225.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img225&image=beyonder29wk.jpg
http://img222.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img222&image=maker11qu.jpg
http://img215.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img215&image=maker26di.jpg
http://img214.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img214&image=maker38et.jpg
http://img208.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img208&image=maker49bp.jpg
http://img204.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img204&image=maker54bp.jpg
I don't think he was powered down at all seeing as how that was the evolved form of the Beyonder he beat.
Originally posted by batdude123
Saying Superman’s heat vision compares to the heat of stars is the understatement of the century. Many people even tougher than Surfer have fallen victim to Superman’s heat vision. And using a comic arc that may, or may not have been canon doesn’t do Superman’s heat vision justice because we’ve seen from him FAR more impressive accomplishments. I think his HV would affect Norrin… hell I could even see it doing damage against him if he cuts loose with it. He’s shown some pretty amazing things recently with it.
I'm not trying to downplay Supes heat vision, I just don't see it being all that effective against Surfer who's all but immune to heat.
Originally posted by batdude123
Yet, it’s worked on opponents that make Surfer look like an unborn fetus.
And Surfer's resisted it from people who make Supes look like an unborn fetus, so I don't really see your point.
Originally posted by darthgoober
The joke was Strange saying that he hoped Surfer accomplished his task quickly, and Surfer getting back before he finished saying two sentences. I myself took that to be an(albeit) small joke(but I guess I could be wrong about that).
Oh... 😕
Originally posted by darthgoober
But we do know what he did. He searched the surface of the entire planet before Strange could finish two sentences. That means that his thought process HAD to have been going pretty freakin fast to complete the task in that amount of time.
What he did was scan the planet to see if that schmuck was still there... a number of things he could have done. But there's no indication to suggest that he searched every square inch of the planet and was trying to visually spot the guy.
Originally posted by darthgoober
We have EVERY indication though. In the prior issue, it's established that Warlock and Surfer where just over a light year away from Thanos. Now just to be safe, let's assume that Thanos was taking his time to mess with Cap(say his hand was raised for 10 seconds) AND just say Surfer went a lightyear(instead of just over), That means that Surfer traveled a lightyear in 10 seconds which would mean that Surfer was going at MILLIONS of times the speed of light. So he was going that fast, and still managed to nearly grab the gauntlet off of Thanos's hand. To me that indicates super speed AND reactions.
If you look about two posts down, I already said "my bad" about this one. However, the feat was clocked at 350x the speed of light, he missed the guantlet, and after he missed it, he just kept on going without stopping.
And, once again, I'm NOT saying Superman would speedblitz the Surfer, all I'm merely saying is that he will use his combat speed to make the majority of Surfer's exotic powers void.
Originally posted by darthgoober
Are you kidding? Before he dies Thanos was doing stuff like this...
http://img227.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img227&image=beyonder6ve.jpg
http://img225.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img225&image=beyonder29wk.jpg
http://img222.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img222&image=maker11qu.jpg
http://img215.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img215&image=maker26di.jpg
http://img214.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img214&image=maker38et.jpg
http://img208.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img208&image=maker49bp.jpg
http://img204.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img204&image=maker54bp.jpgI don't think he was powered down at all seeing as how that was the evolved form of the Beyonder he beat.
Surfer has beaten Uni-Lord.
Thor has made a fool out of Galactus.
Superman has beaten Darkseid.
Captain Atom has beaten Nekron.
Dr. Strange has one-shotted Galactus.
Deathstroke has beaten Flash.
Spider-man has beaten Firelord.
My point is... shit happens in comics.
Oh, and if you want to use that as a basis of comparison as to how powerful current Thanos was then Norrin doesn't compare from a power standpoint.
Originally posted by darthgoober
I'm not trying to downplay Supes heat vision, I just don't see it being all that effective against Surfer who's all but immune to heat.
It's easy to say something like when Surfer hasn't faced Superman's heat vision before.
Originally posted by darthgoober
And Surfer's resisted it from people who make Supes look like an unborn fetus, so I don't really see your point.
T-Vo isn't just reality warping/manipulation... and coining it as such would be a false statement anyways.
Batdude123, it's odd to see you concede that Surfer would take the majority of fights against Superman and then turn around and argue that anything Surfer could and would do, would be ineffective. So here's my question: How does Surfer take the majority in your opinion?
Because if red sun radiation won't work cuz it never does anyway, and Surfer's (travelling???) speed doesn't give him an advantage, and Surfer's transmutation powers wouldn't work, and Superman has better reflexes, better strength, better durability and better fighting skills and could nullify his more exotic powers... and he's got T-Vo... wtf???
Your arguments appear to be disingenuous.
Originally posted by batdude123
Oh... 😕What he did was scan the planet to see if that schmuck was still there... a number of things he could have done. But there's no indication to suggest that he searched every square inch of the planet and was trying to visually spot the guy.
That is an off panel scan all the way... you're correct to question it...there are a number of ways SS could have searched off panel with the PC. It's not a fighting feat anyway.
Originally posted by batdude123
If you look about two posts down, I already said "my bad" about this one. However, the feat was clocked at 350x the speed of light, he missed the guantlet, and after he missed it, he just kept on going without stopping.
Hardly a feat to get excited about. Warlock basically pointed out the object..he flew in a straight in and STILL missed with PREP time. Hardly a dazzling example of light speed reflexes.
I'd still compare SS on his board to Lobo on his bike. Light speeders on their vehicles but still unproven in combat.
Originally posted by batdude123
And, once again, I'm NOT saying Superman would speedblitz the Surfer, all I'm merely saying is that he will use his combat speed to make the majority of Surfer's exotic powers void.
If they both really were fighting at faster than light speeds it would probably end up physical seeing as they would be faster than any energy attacks. Edge goes to Superman in that dept.
Originally posted by batdude123
Oh, and if you want to use that as a basis of comparison as to how powerful current Thanos was then Norrin doesn't compare from a power standpoint.
He sure doesn't..and on top of that..for all the "amping" that SS can supposedly do...he's never amped up enough to physically be on Thanos or Superman levels anyway.
Originally posted by batdude123
It's easy to say something like when Surfer hasn't faced Superman's heat vision before.
If I remember correctly...Gladiators heat vision at normal levels did just fine hurting him. A pissed off Supes would surely do a lot more.
Originally posted by AvalonofthewindThe fact that Surfer left on his board physically + common sense = Surfer physically searched the planet. Superman has claimed and done this too. Just not that fast.
That is an off panel scan all the way... you're correct to question it...there are a number of ways SS could have searched off panel with the PC. It's not a fighting feat anyway.
Originally posted by AvalonofthewindConsidering travelling speed could easily be used as a weapon, I don't see how conceding he is faster works to your benefit. Surfer could simply start from light-years away, beyond Superman's vision range accelerate to 350X the speed of light and by the time any of Superman's senses could even register him, Surfer has probably blown right through him. And we should all know that Surfer's cosmically enhanced senses have far greater range than Superman's.
Hardly a feat to get excited about. Warlock basically pointed out the object..he flew in a straight in and STILL missed with PREP time. Hardly a dazzling example of light speed reflexes.I'd still compare SS on his board to Lobo on his bike. Light speeders on their vehicles but still unproven in combat.
Originally posted by AvalonofthewindOnly people that have roughed up Surfer physically have been Thanos, WM Thor, Tyrant and Champion. Then there are the dozens of Surfer fanboys who swear that he's never been fazed without an energy backed hit, whatever the hell that means. I've seen Superman kroughed up by Mongul, Despero, Repo-man, Subjekt-17, among others.
If they both really were fighting at faster than light speeds it would probably end up physical seeing as they would be faster than any energy attacks. Edge goes to Superman in that dept.
Originally posted by AvalonofthewindSince when does Superman get mentioned in the same sentence as Thanos? SS has amped himself physically to be on Hulk's and Thor's level. Also, anybody remember that classic Abomination H2H fight when Surfer was depowered? But his Power Cosmic is so formidable that he rarely needs to get into lifting contests. How does he fight the Hulk? He sucks the gamma radiation that powers him. All of a sudden, yellow sun radiation is so much more exotic that Surfer couldn't suck it out? I've seen him mess with Wonderman's ionic energy too.
He sure doesn't..and on top of that..for all the "amping" that SS can supposedly do...he's never amped up enough to physically be on Thanos or Superman levels anyway.
Originally posted by AvalonofthewindI don't remember Glads ever fighting Surfer. They fought together against Tyrant once. Supes heat vision is vastly outclasses the energy output of sun cores? Because that is what you'll need to begin fazing Surfer with heat. In fact, I've never seen Surfer fazed by heat at all. And it's odd how you like to point to heat vision when in several paragraphs above you just said that if they're fighting at faster than light speeds, energy blasts wouldn't mean anything anyway.
If I remember correctly...Gladiators heat vision at normal levels did just fine hurting him. A pissed off Supes would surely do a lot more.
Surfer 7/10. I give Superman credit because he's a scrapper and he finds a way to win, but Surfer would have to be written spectacularly retarded to lose to Superman for the majority.
Not that I'm going to bother debating with most of that, but the part of Surfer having better senses than Supes is difficult to prove at best. Especially the part where he goes past Superman's vision range. According to Lois, Clark can see where the ever expanding edge of the universe is, from Earth, if he squints. If you don't want to take her word for it, we've witnessed him peeking between galaxies without trouble. He's also been shown on panel hearing not only between planets, but lightyears away.
