Where was God on 9/11?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
However, remember the quote "kill them all and let god sort them out". Arnaud-Armaury, the Abbot of Citeaux, and "spiritual advisor" to the Albigensian Crusade.

You will never hear an Atheist use a god to rationalize their killing. They will use some other excuse, but the trump card of "god told me to" is not there.

They have one less way to rationalize murder. So what? They can still say "It sounded like fun" which is just as perverse.

Also, few people actually believe god specifically told them to do something.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
and i never claimed they did{infact i think that is what the example of a christian is there for} . but WHEN they kill or harm due to relegious beleifs, than you can and SHUD blame the relegion.

No, you should still blame the person. When billions of people have a set of beliefs but only a handful kill because of them the fault is in the person not the beliefs.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
but u cant blame ATHEISM if an atheist kills beause "atheism" has no doctrines.

Except not believing in God. Theists can (and do) argue that because they lack that moral guidance.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You will never hear an Atheist use a god to rationalize their killing. They will use some other excuse, but the trump card of "god told me to" is not there.

It's the fact that they were Atheists that allowed them to commit all those senseless murders.

"Atheism is not caused by reason but by a kind of cowardly moral escapism."

-Dinesh D'souza

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
They have one less way to rationalize murder. So what? They can still say "It sounded like fun" which is just as perverse.

Also, few people actually believe god specifically told them to do something.

However, if you are trying to convince those around you that you are right, god told me to is very compelling and cannot be disputed easily. All other rationalizations fall under law, but god does not.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
It's the fact that they were Atheists that allowed them to commit all those senseless murders.

"Atheism is not caused by reason but by a kind of cowardly moral escapism."

-Dinesh D'souza

Atheism is not the reason they killed people. Power was the reason.

I do not respect Dinesh D'souza. He is just a propagandist.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
However, if you are trying to convince those around you that you are right, god told me to is very compelling and cannot be disputed easily. All other rationalizations fall under law, but god does not.

If you claim god told you to do it you won't get off because it's suddenly justified. You'll simply be institutionalized.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
If you claim god told you to do it you won't get off because it's suddenly justified. You'll simply be institutionalized.

Not if you are a leader in the church or any other religious structure. Those people speak for god.

no you shud not. u shud blame the relegion. because it is the relegious teaching that LED to a negetive act as opposed to the person's entirely personal choice. hence relegion is to blame. ofcourse you can blame WRONG INTERPRETATION of relegion but that is another thing. u cant just blame the individual.

the fact that sum1 is ATHEIST doesnt allow or disallow a person from doing anything. moral guidelines as ive mentioned many times before are not based on relegion alone, humanitarianism and logic can be used to come up with morals. as such, ATHEISM is not to blame but the negetive philisophy that the PERSON has which led to the act. just like moral guidelines{sumwhat} are available in relegion, yet if a relegious person chooses to not follow them and spill the blood of an innocent family for reasons OTHER than relegion than relegion isnt to blame for those acts even if the person is christian or muslim or watever.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Not if you are a leader in the church or any other religious structure. Those people speak for god.

Manson started a religion. He didn't get off.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
no you shud not. u shud blame the relegion. because it is the relegious teaching that LED to a negetive act as opposed to the person's entirely personal choice. hence relegion is to blame. ofcourse you can blame WRONG INTERPRETATION of relegion but that is another thing. u cant just blame the individual.

It is the responsibility of the individual to make that interpretation. If the religion was to blame all of it's followers would be killers.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Manson started a religion. He didn't get off.

And so did Jesus. Sometimes it's not the person who starts the religion, but the power hungry person who finds himself in position to do great harm.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
And so did Jesus.

He didn't kill anyone. Nonetheless even he didn't get off for his crimes.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Sometimes it's not the person who starts the religion, but the power hungry person who finds himself in position to do great harm.

You keep changing your position. A power hungry person that is willing to kill, will kill whether they find a position in a religious organization or not.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
He didn't kill anyone. Nonetheless even he didn't get off for his crimes.

You keep changing your position. A power hungry person that is willing to kill, will kill whether they find a position in a religious organization or not.

How am I changing my position? 😕 Maybe you are assuming something.

God doesn't intefere any longer in the things happening here on earth

Originally posted by Utrigita
God doesn't intefere any longer in the things happening here on earth

That is too convenient.

Giving the martyrs in the planes the strength to do his holy work?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
That is too convenient.

why is that???

I find it logical to assume that since God used his Son jesus to save mankind, because mankind constantly sins, God doesn't see a reason to interact actively with earth more because no matter what happens we are all saved in the end.

Originally posted by Utrigita
why is that???

I find it logical to assume that since God used his Son jesus to save mankind, because mankind constantly sins, God doesn't see a reason to interact actively with earth more because no matter what happens we are all saved in the end.

You make extraordinary claims, but then you say, god doesn't do that any more, that way no one can prove you wrong. That is what I mean by convenient.

Jesus was just a man. He had a revolutionary teaching, but it was not a new teaching.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
How am I changing my position? 😕 Maybe you are assuming something.

It seemed to me that you went: Theists -> Religious Leaders -> People in Positions of Power

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
It seemed to me that you went: Theists -> Religious Leaders -> People in Positions of Power

My only point is: evil is a path that humans take. Religion can lubricate this path by supplying rationalizations. This is true for a lot of organized human activity like politics. However, Atheism is not organized, therefore to say that it serves the same function as other organizations is ridicules.