EVANGEL94's Final Slugfest Tournament: Round 2-3; Papa Smurph vs King Kandy

Originally posted by King Kandy
You didn't draft him though, you can't get him on your team.

Yeah I did, I drafted Dr. Fate Hector Hall similar to someone drafting Hulk and having Banner do most of the prepping. Nabu lives in Fate's helmet, gives him advice and has even taken control of him and sided with Black Adam for believing heroes are too soft nowadays for not killing.

Which is illegal, you can't detect ANYTHING without spying

I'm not spying, I'm detecting a high level mage is my next opponent. Don't know your name, your magical speciality, any of your weaknesses or limitations, just that you are a stupidly strong mage.

So you drafted multiple characters in the place of one? Illegal.

I'm not drafting multiple people, hence you only being attacked by one person. I'm drafting Fate and his standard equipment. Of which is a helmet with people who live in it and routinely give him advice all of the people, however, are extensions of Fate's power.

This is an insult to me and all tourney members who paid for the things they use.

Not really, I put Hector Hall out there, even looking at his wiki would tell you that Nabu is a part of his helmet, much like cosmic awareness was to Quasar at a point.

Dude, you're asking ME to prove a negative.

A negative which you brought up.

You have to prove that magic uses physical stamina.

Okay, when Mages cast spells they become physically drained, like how Strange was PHYSICALLY exhausted from casting low level teleportation spells

Okay, what's that got to do with anything?

You saying something about powerful mages not being huge like World War Fate

Originally posted by King Kandy
Okay I admit that if you had Nabu, it would be legal to let him possess you. But anyway, Aggamoto has helped in all of Strange's fights, and you don't see me trying to argue he gets drafted along with Strange.

I don't really know much about Aggamoto and Strange's relationship but does he live in a piece of Strange's standard equipment and give him advice in EVERY fight he gets in whether he asks for it or not and has he opperated at herald levels (like Nabu has when he was with Kent)?

Kandy instead of bringing up non issues you should be trying to counter a 5 mile tall World Breaker Fate.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah I did, I drafted Dr. Fate Hector Hall similar to someone drafting Hulk and having Banner do most of the prepping. Nabu lives in Fate's helmet, gives him advice and has even taken control of him and sided with Black Adam for believing heroes are too soft nowadays for not killing.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I'm not spying, I'm detecting a high level mage is my next opponent. Don't know your name, your magical speciality, any of your weaknesses or limitations, just that you are a stupidly strong mage.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I'm not drafting multiple people, hence you only being attacked by one person. I'm drafting Fate and his standard equipment. Of which is a helmet with people who live in it and routinely give him advice all of the people, however, are extensions of Fate's power.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Not really, I put Hector Hall out there, even looking at his wiki would tell you that Nabu is a part of his helmet, much like cosmic awareness was to Quasar at a point.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Okay, when Mages cast spells they become physically drained, like how Strange was PHYSICALLY exhausted from casting low level teleportation spells

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
You saying something about powerful mages not being huge like World War Fate

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I don't really know much about Aggamoto and Strange's relationship but does he live in a piece of Strange's standard equipment and give him advice in EVERY fight he gets in whether he asks for it or not and has he opperated at herald levels (like Nabu has when he was with Kent)?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Kandy instead of bringing up non issues you should be trying to counter a 5 mile tall World Breaker Fate.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Well Banner is the same character as Hulk. Nabu=A different guy from Hector.

No Banner and Hulk are different characters, they've had various conversations with each other and IIRC are even legally acknowledged as different people (hence Banner's immunity to the death penalty).

What I'm doing is no different then having Insane Genis talk to Rick Jones about life during his prep.

I don't mean they aren't big, I mean they don't tend to have a high degree of physical strength relative to their size. You are making it sound like you think Hank Pym would be a better magician after he grows.

Oh that's not it, I'm saying because I'm in Hulk's body now I'm not going to be drained using big time spells like I normally would in Hector Hall's body, essentially making any big time feat that might have killed Fate if he even tried a low level magic spell after casting it a legit weapon to be used in my arsenal with ease.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Okay. I slam him into the forcefield at 1,000,000x lightspeed like was always my plan.

That's going to be pretty hard to do given me being as big and wide as the battlefield. You could hurt yourself, literally.

I have to vote now because I have to turn a work for tomorrow, sorry if its too early.

I vote for Kandy.

I agree that some of the prep is illegal and the shield is not deflecting a wide range attack that Strange can provide. Taking it from there I see that Kandy's strategy is more likely to succeed, even if he has only one hour of prep and I'm kind of hazy about him doing that many things.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Funny thing is, he lives inside the orb of Aggamoto, and Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight. He's also a match for Galactus. Under YOUR rules, he would be perfectly legal for me to summon. Under Evangel's rules, not so much. Come on, she specifically stated no outside help during prep, which is what you're trying to get.

Not at all, Nabu isn't outside help, he's a part of Hector Hall's equipment, much like his helmet. Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight, Nabu lives there even outside of battle. That's his home. Literally, they've had conversations in coffee shops (don't have access to the issues right now but it's in Fate volume 3 issue 3). When Hector Hall was killed by Curse, Nabu was there to taunt him and remind him that he's going to be alright.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Um dude I already said he has cast super-speed spells before, but anyway the speed of sound is a measurement of how fast the vibrations in the air will move to create sound.

Yeah but when has he cast super speed spells while moving greater then the sound barrier? How will his mind even adjust to going that fast?

Now, if he can talk in space and cast spells clearly his spells aren't dependent on Air vibrations, now are they?

Considering him talking is space was due to previous spells themselves (like in IG when he casted that breathing spell on the heroes) and various heroes have talked in space seemingly ignoring all logic, I seriously doubt it.

Dude Banner and Hulk are the SAME PERSON. OMG that's like saying you drafted Spider-Man without Peter Parker.

No it isn't, this just shows your lack of knowledge on the Hulk. Banner and Hulk are entirely different persona's, like Nabu and Hector Hall.

Remember how back in drafting, Evangel said if you sneaked a character in past draft, and then it was proved illegal in a match, it
would still be removed?

Yeah and you haven't proven anything illegal so.....

Anyway, being huge won't stop me from blowing you to atoms by smashing you against a wall.

Considering the spell you invoke will have to be battlefield size (which means yourself will be caught in it) and it's highly out of character for Strange to go in for the kill, it pretty much will.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
No Banner and Hulk are different characters, they've had various conversations with each other and IIRC are even [b]legally acknowledged as different people (hence Banner's immunity to the death penalty).

What I'm doing is no different then having Insane Genis talk to Rick Jones about life during his prep.[/B]

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Oh that's not it, I'm saying because I'm in Hulk's body now I'm not going to be drained using big time spells like I normally would in Hector Hall's body, essentially making any big time feat that might have killed Fate if he even tried a low level magic spell after casting it a legit weapon to be used in my arsenal with ease.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Not at all, Nabu isn't outside help, he's a part of Hector Hall's equipment, much like his helmet. Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight, Nabu lives there even outside of battle. That's his home. Literally, they've had conversations in coffee shops (don't have access to the issues right now but it's in Fate volume 3 issue 3). When Hector Hall was killed by Curse, Nabu was there to taunt him and remind him that he's going to be alright.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah but when has he cast super speed spells while moving greater then the sound barrier? How will his mind even adjust to going that fast?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Considering him talking is space was due to previous spells themselves (like in IG when he casted that breathing spell on the heroes) and various heroes have talked in space seemingly ignoring all logic, I seriously doubt it.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
No it isn't, this just shows your lack of knowledge on the Hulk. Banner and Hulk are entirely different persona's, like Nabu and Hector Hall.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah and you haven't proven anything illegal so.....

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Considering the spell you invoke will have to be battlefield size (which means yourself will be caught in it) and it's highly out of character for Strange to go in for the kill, it pretty much will.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Uh huh, what ever happened to Banner and Hulk changing back and forth?

Hulk and Banner had an AGREEMENT to allow Hulk to stay in the mortal world no matter what. Explain to me how Banner can make an agreement with himself to stay un-powered? Explain to me why Banner would make an agreement with himself?

What I'm doing with my prep is no more then me using Banner to plan when I drafted World War Hulk who doesn't have 1/1000th of the intelligence of Banner.

So basically, you are claiming that if you turn into a big strong guy, you will be able to perform greater feats of magic.

No, I'm claiming that it growing to that size will increase my durability and strength so I can tank whatever little magic spells you put on me and will increase the blast radius of my spells, Hulk's body will allow for greater magic spells because it can take more damage and has much more stamina then a human body.

I hope you and everyone else can see how stupid that sounds. But w/e, you aren't even Hulk anymore.

Duh it sounds stupid, you don't even get the point. 😂

Yeah, also Eternity can be accessed through the Eye of Aggamoto and Dr. Strange uses that ALL THE TIME. So am I allowed to summon Eternity to fight you now?

Um, no, using the stunt I pulled in Hector's body only means a more brutal Hector (as Nabu was overpowered by Hector himself in JSA 58) and the feat in question is a Kent Nelson (which means Dr. Strange) level feat. It's the overall amalgam that puts him over the top. If I were to grow that big in Hector's body like that panel I'd only be able to maintain it for a few seconds

However using this stunt with Strange by himself makes Strange a 20 pointer.

Originally posted by King Kandy
He will adjust to being that fast because I have an hour of prep for him to practice, and practiced last match as well, both on and off the battlefield.

You do not carry knowledge or experience from previous battles.

Originally posted by Bentley
I have to vote now because I have to turn a work for tomorrow, sorry if its too early.

I vote for Kandy.

I agree that some of the prep is illegal and the shield is not deflecting a wide range attack that Strange can provide. Taking it from there I see that Kandy's strategy is more likely to succeed, even if he has only one hour of prep and I'm kind of hazy about him doing that many things.

Sorry, but it is too early to vote. The first twelve (12) hours are reserved for the competitors to debate.

Originally posted by King Kandy
He will adjust to being that fast because I have an hour of prep for him to practice, and practiced last match as well, both on and off the battlefield. Also, while in Astral Form Strange has casually gone a near-lightspeed without any problems, so he is well practiced with those speeds.

And your superspeed is banned from prep as those reflexes allow you to increase the hour. He went near light in astral form probably to travel in a straight line, show instances where he's pulling off multiple spells and reacting in battle at near light.

And like you said, heroes often go and speak in space, Strange is no different.

Yeah which goes to show comic books selective logic in applying sound, how does Strange invoke spells going faster then sound?

They occupy the same body, have been revealed as multiple facets of Banner's personality, and have shared the same mind numerous times. They are different forms/personalities of the same entity.

Exactly different forms and different personalities of the same entity like how Nabu and Hector Hall are different forms of Dr. Fate. They both have access to the same spell bank, but Nabu doesn't need to ask Hector which spell to cast in this situation and Nabu actively participates in ALL of Hector's battles.

I have been doing it the whole match, the voters we've had so far agree with me.

Only thing you've proven that might be illegal is me being able to sense another magician, big whup. Everything else, perfectly within reason.

In the VERY SAME Warlock fight he cast it, they were larger then planets.

What do you mean they were larger then planets? In the VERY SAME Warlock fight they weren't restricted to a shielded arena with a combatant the same size as the arena. You cast your wind spell you will envelop the whole arena, I'm wagering on my odds of surviving being slammed against the wall much better then your odds.

And actually Strange kills his enemies a lot, like Dracula for instance.

Yeah, he kills demons and abominations, not sentient people like the Hulk, Nabu and Hall.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Hulk and Banner had an [b]AGREEMENT to allow Hulk to stay in the mortal world no matter what. Explain to me how Banner can make an agreement with himself to stay un-powered? Explain to me why Banner would make an agreement with himself?[/B]

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
What I'm doing with my prep is no more then me using Banner to plan when I drafted World War Hulk who doesn't have 1/1000th of the intelligence of Banner.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
No, I'm claiming that it growing to that size will increase my durability and strength so I can tank whatever little magic spells you put on me and will increase the blast radius of my spells, Hulk's body will allow for greater magic spells because it can take more damage and has much more stamina then a human body.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Um, no, using the stunt I pulled in Hector's body only means a more brutal Hector (as Nabu was overpowered by Hector himself in JSA 58) and the feat in question is a Kent Nelson (which means Dr. Strange) level feat. It's the overall amalgam that puts him over the top. If I were to grow that big in Hector's body like that panel I'd only be able to maintain it for a few seconds

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
And your superspeed is banned from prep as those reflexes allow you to increase the hour. He went near light in astral form probably to travel in a straight line, show instances where he's pulling off multiple spells and reacting in battle at near light.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah which goes to show comic books selective logic in applying sound, how does Strange invoke spells going faster then sound?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Exactly different forms and different personalities of the same entity like how Nabu and Hector Hall are different forms of Dr. Fate. They both have access to the same spell bank, but Nabu doesn't need to ask Hector which spell to cast in this situation and Nabu actively participates in ALL of Hector's battles.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Only thing you've proven that might be illegal is me being able to sense another magician, big whup. Everything else, perfectly within reason.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
What do you mean they were larger then planets? In the VERY SAME Warlock fight they weren't restricted to a shielded arena with a combatant the same size as the arena. You cast your wind spell you will envelop the whole arena, I'm wagering on my odds of surviving being slammed against the wall much better then your odds.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah, he kills demons and abominations, not sentient people like the Hulk, Nabu and Hall.