Neo vs. Luke Skywalker

Originally posted by dadudemon
"Dodging"? No.

Lame joke? Absolutely. 😆 😆 😆

I was at work at the time and I was training a new employee. No body's computer was broke, all servers were up, and no one needed their password reset so I figured I would "wtf pwn" a newb on the internetz. We had a good laugh about it. 😆

I think you are taking this a weee bit too seriously, though.

I can't remember if this was stated already...but...Neo can do that because they are plugged into the Matrix and they are programs running on the Matrix. Neo's mind acts like some sort of uber software inside of the matrix.

If Neo was to have all of his powers in a fight with Luke, it really wouldn't work because Neo's powers are dependent upon being "plugged into the matrix". So an alternate universe would have to be created that gave Neo all his powers and allowed Luke to retain his powers. That doesn't make much sense because Neo's powers are incumbent upon being in an interface that allows him to "see" the code and be one with the "Matrix OS". (I just made that phrase up...I know, bare with me.)

If Neo was the God of the Matrix as some tout him to be, a fight with ANY agent would end faster than it takes Bardock to eat a bowl of cereal. Neo isn't "wtf pwning" in the Matrix like that because his limitations are his mind. He can only manipulate the matrix so much. By manipulate, it means he is reprogramming the matrix on the fly with his mind.

I made that point to come to another one.

Neo is THE best "The One" to be born among humans. We know this because the Architect said that there were 5 others before him AND his realization in the word games came "faster" to Neo than the others.

Recall "that was faster than the others" -Architect.

We have definite proof that Neo posses an uber mind among humans.

However, it can be determined that Luke's mind far surpasses Neo's in ability. (Ability to learn new techniques mixed with the force as it relates to the mind.)

If they were to retain all their powers and fight in a separate universe away from their own, it would be an interesting fight indeed. Also, I wouldn't put it past NJO Luke to pull a "Reloaded" move like Neo did where he stopped all the bullets in mid air...shouldn't be a problem for him or any well trained force user.

Oh, Bardock, Luke wouldn't even have to touch Neo to send him flying faster and further than one of those punches that make your vagina wet. Neee...........Nars. 😐

I was all over the place with this post and I apologize for no organizing my thoughts.

Bards, that cereal comment was not intended to hurt your feelings: I am almost sure that I eat more each day than you do...so it was the pot calling the kettle black basically.

and neo cant learn any new techniques seeing he knows all known martial arts, in terms of fihting he surpasses luke

Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
the problem with that though is that luke I dont think has really came up against bullets, Im not sure he'd be able to see them or "feel" them like neo does

We've been over this already. A blaster bolt, though not as fast as a bullet, is pretty damned fast. I think we ended up with a bullet being 5-6 times as fast as a blaster bolt. Considering a Jedi can react to a blaster bolt enough to block it is pretty good....but not only can they block it, they can block it precisely enough to reflect it back onto the person who fired it. We never once saw Neo "fire" the bullets back at his attackers because he simply can't do that...even in the matrix. Wouldn't it have been useful if he would have done that?

Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
and neo cant learn any new techniques seeing he knows all known martial arts, in terms of fihting he surpasses luke

Where is it established in the movies or from the Wachowski Bros. that Neo knows all forms of martial arts? Regardless, that makes it worse off for Neo. What happens if Luke rips those memories from his mind and assimilates them? What happens if they are erased?

Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
the problem with that though is that luke I dont think has really came up against bullets, Im not sure he'd be able to see them or "feel" them like neo does

and neo cant learn any new techniques seeing he knows all known martial arts, in terms of fihting he surpasses luke

And Luke is a master of Teras Kasi, a style that Neo has never encountered, a style Neo might not be able to counter.

Neo has all of his Matrix powers, including limited precognition, so it doesn't matter if he knows the fighting style or not, he can still counter the moves.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
For the last time, NEO HAS NO BULLETS. He is not in the Matrix, so he doesn't have access to all that shit.

And Luke is a master of Teras Kasi, a style that Neo has never encountered, a style Neo might not be able to counter.

What does this fighting style entail? I assume punches, kicks, knees, elbows etc. I am fairly certain being a master of every (or just about) form of martial art as Neo is, he's capable of countering.

It's not like a student of Karate couldn't block or counter an attack thrown by a student of Muy Thai. You SW fanboys are hilarious.

Edit: Do tell me, if your reasoning is "Neo can't counter, because he doesn't know that one particular style", then how would Luke counter when he doesn't know any of the styles Neo is trained in? Seems Luke would be severely gimped by your reasoning.

Originally posted by Robtard
What does this fighting style entail? I assume punches, kicks, knees, elbows etc. I am fairly certain being a master of every (or just about) form of martial art as Neo is, he's capable of countering.

It's not like a student of Karate couldn't block or counter an attack thrown by a student of Muy Thai. You SW fanboys are hilarious.

Edit: Do tell me, if your reasoning is "Neo can't counter, because he doesn't know that one particular style", then how would Luke counter when he doesn't know any of the styles Neo is trained in? Seems Luke would be severely gimped by your reasoning.

Doesnt matter that luke doesnt know Neos style, because he will know what Neo is gonna do BEFORE he does it. Luke has the wonderful gift called PRECOG, which I am getting sick of throwing back in your face.

Screw his saber, screw everything slowing down around him as he moves normal speed, those and his other force powers which are so vast it's not even funny take a back seat to his PRECOG powers......PRECOG.....get it? got it? GOOD......

But I know you'll ignore it or twist it around so his precog doesnt matter, when it's actually his greatest weapon.

You call us fanboys, I say we only see cold hard facts.

You make this "precog" out to be way more powerful than it is, remember, the clones killed Jedi by the score, so precog isn't the end all be all in a fight, sure it's useful, but not the pair-of-aces you want it to be.

Another failing of precog, if the attack is faster than your ability to counter, it doesn't matter.

Do tell me, how are Jedi killed if they "see everything before it happens"?

And how many clones did it take to kill Ki Adi Mundi? How many for Adi Gallia? Even that little Padawan took out quite a few.

And thats a bullshit example, for the clones were fighting on the side of the Jedi, the Jedi werent focusing on them. If Luke were to face Neo, he'd have Lukes full attention.

Between many and a few clones, but clones aren't superpowered, they're just really good humans. He wasn't so little, he was a teen, but still, they did kill him despite his precog Jedi abilities.

Jango killed Jedi by himself and just with his pistol, despite the precog.

So, they "see everything before it happens", according to you. They should have seen it coming "before it happened", no?

They were facing multiple enemies, all rapid firing at them, enemies that were moments before their allies. Of course they were taken by surprise. Yoda sensed it, remember?

Jango killed ONE Jedi, who was engaging Dooku. The Jedi had a choice, Jango or Dooku, and he chose to split between the two, his mistake.

Tyr again.

That would all be irrelevant, if the precog is as powerful (fight winner) as you make it to be, they should have seen it "before it happened", remember?

When Jango killed him, the Jedi was completely focusing on him at the time. I'd need to see it again, maybe it's on youtube.

Edit: Found it. You'll notice that after the first shot, the Jedi is fully focused on Jango and desperately trying to block the shots, which do kill him after the 5th shot., despite his end-all-be-all "precog". Dooka isn't even moving.

YouTube video

Its not all powerful, if it were, no Jedi would ever die. But it is an advantage that would give Luke the edge.

Yes, watch it again. He was blocking, but you can tell his attention is still partially on Dooku.

Glad you finally agree, and the point I've been trying to make. Yes, it's an advantage.

I did, he was fully focused on Jango after the first shot, Dooka isn't threatening him at all.

For the sake of us fanboys, it's Dooku, Rob.

well I am glad we are in agreement then.

Originally posted by Robtard
Between many and a few clones, but clones aren't superpowered, they're just really good humans. He wasn't so little, he was a teen, but still, they did kill him despite his precog Jedi abilities.

Jango killed Jedi by himself and just with his pistol, despite the precog.

So, they "see everything before it happens", according to you. They should have seen it coming "before it happened", no?

Specially designed clones, clones designed specifically to take be able to take out Jedi, started to take out the Jedi when Order 66 was switched on.

In a fictional universe, you can write stuff like that into your story. 😉

Originally posted by Robtard
That would all be irrelevant, if the precog is as powerful (fight winner) as you make it to be, they should have seen it "before it happened", remember?

When Jango killed him, the Jedi was completely focusing on him at the time. I'd need to see it again, maybe it's on youtube.

Edit: Found it. You'll notice that after the first shot, the Jedi is fully focused on Jango and desperately trying to block the shots, which do kill him after the 5th shot., despite his end-all-be-all "precog". Dooka isn't even moving.

YouTube video

Also, we are not basing our judgment on other Jedi's performances. We are basing this on Luke's performances.

Doopeedoopeedooo....Oh my!! What do we have here?????!!?!?!

YouTube video

What happens starting at about 0:36?

My my...how you conveniently selected a video that DOESN'T show how easily Mace takes out Jango.

You throw around this fanboy crap a bit too much...you just committed fanboyism to prove an invalid point.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Specially designed clones, clones designed specifically to take be able to take out Jedi, started to take out the Jedi when Order 66 was switched on.

In a fictional universe, you can write stuff like that into your story. 😉

Also, we are not basing our judgment on other Jedi's performances. We are basing this on Luke's performances.

Doopeedoopeedooo....Oh my!! What do we have here?????!!?!?!

YouTube video

What happens starting at about 0:36?

My my...how you conveniently selected a video that DOESN'T show how easily Mace takes out Jango.

You throw around this fanboy crap a bit too much...you just committed fanboyism to prove an invalid point.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Specially designed clones, clones designed specifically to take be able to take out Jedi, started to take out the Jedi when Order 66 was switched on.

In a fictional universe, you can write stuff like that into your story. 😉

Also, we are not basing our judgment on other Jedi's performances. We are basing this on Luke's performances.

Doopeedoopeedooo....Oh my!! What do we have here?????!!?!?!

YouTube video

What happens starting at about 0:36?

My my...how you conveniently selected a video that DOESN'T show how easily Mace takes out Jango.

You throw around this fanboy crap a bit too much...you just committed fanboyism to prove an invalid point.

Where does it state that those were "special clones"; what special abilities do they have? But to the point that RJ was making, if the Jedi always see something before it happens, they should have seen it, regardless of how "special" the clones were.

Here we go again... my point is that the precog doesn't always work to win a fight, not that it is completely useless as there are several instances (the Jedi blocking all the droid fire) shown besides the one you posted that prove it is indeed useful.

Try and pay attention before you make stupid claims and say shit like "doopeedoopeedooo".

Originally posted by Robtard
Where does it state that those were "special clones"; what special abilities do they have? But to the point that RJ was making, if the Jedi always see something before it happens, they should have seen it, regardless of how "special" the clones were.

Here we go again... [b]my point is that the precog doesn't always work to win a fight, not that it is completely useless as there are several instances (the Jedi blocking all the droid fire) shown besides the one you posted that prove it is indeed useful.

Try and pay attention before you make stupid claims and say shit like "doopeedoopeedooo". [/B]

If Luke faces Neo, he is gonna give Neo his FULL attention.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Special or no, they were fighting ALONGSIDE the Jedi, the Jedi were focused on battling the Seps, not on the mindset of their clones.

If Luke faces Neo, he is gonna give Neo his FULL attention.

And that would be irrelevant, if as you say, 'Jedi see everything before it happens'. Which we already covered and you agreed that precog wouldn't be the end-all in this fight; just a very good advantage.

Still, with Neo's speed and uber-strength, I doubt it will be enough. One punch or kick and Luke would be dead or severely injured, I'm fairly certain Neo could land at least one punch.