OneDumbG0
Find Your Own Fire
Originally posted by h1a8
But it's also speculation to think that a fire looking blast is going light speed. Read the captions again. It says nothing of the blast moving at instananeous speeds. I already know what it says and means, I just want to give you a chance to interpret it correctly. Telepathy isn't the same as a telepathic blast. Thus you can't equate the two. She still telegraphed.It can't be proven that the blast is lightspeed. Only speculation at best. Bad logic. Your hands can move much much faster than your legs can. Think about it. Also, one doesn't need to move their arms as fast as the beam in order to block it. This is because the beam moves a larger distance than your arms do in the same amount of time. I used the word canon to mean acceptable. Crossovers are not valid here on this forum since they usually ignore common sense.
A telepathic bolt instantaneosly races towards Thor. As far as I've seen, a telepathic bolt attack from an entity like Phoenix is going the speed of light. The fire has nothing to do with the speed of the bolt, that's just the way the Phoenix manifests her power. It isn't actual fire and considering her cosmic power, I think it's less arguable that the fiery nature of the telepathic bolt is indicative of a slower speed. It's your opinion that Phoenix's telepathic bolt is moving at the speed of Human Torch's fire bolt. I don't think it's a particularly good one considering Phoenix's cosmically powered nature, the telepathic nature of the attack and the caption that describes it as instaneous.
And telegraphing only helps when you have read the person's attack BEFORE it was fired and got yourself intoa defensive position BEFORE it was fired. I can telegraph someone raising a gun at me and raising my shield to block it before it was fired. But no amount of telegraphing is going to help me raise my shield AFTER the bullet was fired unless my arms move faster then the bullet. What don't you get about this? Telegraphing has nothing to do with the Thor/Phoenix scan. AFTER the telepathic bolt was fired, Thor had his hands down. He had to raise them quickly enough AFTER it was fired to defend himself and he did. Which makes his reflexes faster than the telepathic bolt and FTL. Telegraphing has nothing to do with the feat.
Originally posted by h1a8
I use handbooks all the way friend. And if there is an error then I don't use that specific info but I still use the rest of the handbook. Comics have errors too. So by your logic we shouldn't use comics either. I accept both comics and handbooks as the absolute truth [B]until proven false. Kinda like innocent until proven guilty.[/b]
That's your standard. That's fine. I merely don't accept it for aforementioned reasons. And since a Marvel handbook references JLA/Avengers, then you should accept that crossover as truth whether or not you believe it involves common sense. If handbooks are truth to you, then so is JLA/Avengers until it is proven false. You haven't proven it false by your standards. If you continue to reject JLA/Avengers simply because you don't like it, then that's your biased opinion. But you can't legimately expect me to accept any of your arguments when the basis for validity of proof is your personal bias. Debating is about what is more reasonable, not about what is more akin to your personal bias.
Originally posted by h1a8
Yet you seen him not come short. Faulty logic here. A black hole slows you down. Superman wouldn't face this restriction in his battle with Thor.SS can't achieve light speed instanteously. It takes him at least second to reach lightspeed. There is one exception though (the IG saga). I take that feat as PIS since there was several times SS used all his strength to travel as fast as he can and only achieved light speed after a second. Also, I don't infer travel speed to battle speed. One must have the necessary reflexes, instant burst speed (from rest), and the ability to move limbs (arms, legs, torso, etc.) fast as well. Superman has performed many very complex tasks seemingly FTL (from rest). That's why I say we can substitute these complex tasks into simple zips and punches.
Oh ho. I can show you plenty of times that Superman has come up short with speed. I can show you multiple examples of him failing to save innocent lives because he couldn't accelerate fast enough to save them. He's come up short... a lot EVEN when he's explicitly stated to go all out and not holding back.
Show me these "several times" where Silver Surfer requires at least a second to reach lightspeed. Because I've got scans where Superman had a second to reach a target with his speed and failing. I also have scans of Superman speedblitzing an opponent and starting out at hypersonic speeds before reaching light speeds. So I have proof that contradicts Superman being able to instaneously achieve light speeds. I'd like to see your proof that contradicts Silver Surfer being able to instantaneously achieve light speeds.
And I quote, "Superman has performed many very complex tasks seemingly FTL (from rest)." So he seemingly does it at FTL speeds and that is enough evidence to convince you that he can not only do it at FTL speeds, but also speedblitz at FTL speeds. Whereas, in your mind... we have Phoenix, who seemingly shoots a telepathic bolt at light speed and Thor blocking it AFTER it was shot... but that's not enough evidence to convince you that Thor has FTL reflexes? Smells more like personal bias. If you like to extend certain freedoms to Superman and not Thor... that's your opinion, but it weakens your arguments considerably. Either it's clear or it's not. If it reasonable to assume, then apply that same "reasonableness" fairly across the board otherwise you're not debating, you're just expressing personal and biased opinions.
Originally posted by h1a8
This is PIS by statistics. That scan only shows SS speaking in figurative language. There was no nanosecond anything as it contradicts his entire history. Thus it was hyperbole or PIS. Again you wasted time typing here. The feat was PIS. But I understand what you mean about nanosecond and light. I already knew this a long time ago. I just wanted to see if you can figure it out. Good job!
I don't see why it contradicts Silver Surfer. I don't see why it is PIS. It's clear. It's on-panel. You like Superman's
seemingly FTL scans but you don't Silver Surfer's clear FTL scans? You already don't like his Infinity Gauntlet scan, now this one has to go too? Well, just FYI... I like em. And when I take the entire history of Silver Surfer, those scans make much more sense to me and are not contradicted by anything. If you have scans that clearly contradict them, show em to me. I'll be willing to accept clearly contradictory scans and reassess my positions.
The real questions are: 1) Do you have any or are you just expressing your personal bias as argumentative proof? and 2) Will you accept the clear scans which I have, that contradict Superman's instantaneous light speed capabilities? Answer yes or no to these questions.
Originally posted by h1a8
PIS okay. Also, Gladiator and Hyperion have nothing to do with Thor. Otherwise I can say that Hulk can move faster than light since he struck Thor, SS, etc. I can also say that since a gas station seemingly koed Superman then gas stations>>>Superman. And I already shown you that arms move a lot faster than feet and waists.Good try but Superman is faster and will beat Thor to the punch. Thor must begin on the defensive. Especially if Superman instant appears behind him.
You like to throw PIS around a lot. Let me just tell you something. PIS refers to a character's ability to fight to the fullest of his capability. The plot he's in makes him stupid and therefore he does not do things he should be able to do. Surfer instantly going FTL in 'Infinity Gauntlet' is not PIS. Surfer with his nanosecond reaction times is not PIS. If you tryt ot apply PIS to this, it makes no sense. Silver Surfer was made stupid because of the plot and he instantly reached light speed? Silver Surfer was made stupid by the plot and he reacted with nanosecond reaction times? You misunderstand what PIS is. A lot of people do. Most of the time, I understand what you're saying, but let's get it straight. Between you and me, you are questioning the reasonableness and validity of a high-end feat. Not whether the plot made the character stupid. So just say it, because I'm tired of seeing you label these things as PIS as if it means anything. Until you can contradict these clear scans with your own, you can't argue PIS or your version of PIS anyway. Only that it is your personal bias that informs you to reject the scans.
Originally posted by h1a8
Note: Superman needs only 1 hit on Thor to win. And since Superman is faster he has a great chance of hitting Thor first. Thus he must win the majority.
Superman needs one hit to win against Thor? Sounds like your personal bias just got elevated to fanboyism. Let me ask this question: Would Superman one-shot Wonderwoman, Equus, Subjekt-17, Mongul, Captain Marvel, Black Adam, the General, etc?
