"spiderman has his own style which is not hand to hand thus steve has the advantage. If Spidey fights his own style then hed be ok"
What?
Anyway, Cap is one of marvel's greatest martial artists. In every other way Spidey is superior...
One problem for Spidey -Spidey looks up to cap... hero worship... that could be a major psychological factor and the ONLY reason cap could win
Originally posted by FOOM
"spiderman has his own style which is not hand to hand thus steve has the advantage. If Spidey fights his own style then hed be ok"What?
Anyway, Cap is one of marvel's greatest martial artists. In every other way Spidey is superior...
One problem for Spidey -Spidey looks up to cap... hero worship... that could be a major psychological factor and the ONLY reason cap could win
Originally posted by Metalmanx
You didn't like that? Okay, fine.You know, Shadowcat/Nightcrawler/M/Luke Cage/Surge/Dust/Sabretooth/Venom/(any of the) Fantastic Four/do you want me to keep going?/etc. will also never be as good as Cap in martial arts ability, but I'm pretty sure Shadowcat/Nightcrawler/M/Luke Cage/Surge/Dust/Sabretooth/Venom/(any of the) Fantastic Four/do you want me to keep going?/etc. would still win.
It really doesn't matter. There are plenty of characters with inferior martial arts ability who can take out Cap with their abilities alone.
Oh definitely possible. For some of the ones you listed. Anyways those characters have nothing to do with this thread
But we've seen what happens with Spidermans fights with Cap.
And we've especially seen what happens to Beast when he fights Cap, DD, and BP.
Yet you go on that Beast wins in the other thread.
As the evidence does not side with you at all. One who doesn't go by the comic evidence shows its more just your fan opinion not backed up from a reasonable conclusion from the books.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Oh definitely possible. For some of the ones you listed. Anyways those characters have nothing to do with this threadBut we've seen what happens with Spidermans fights with Cap.
And we've especially seen what happens to Beast when he fights Cap, DD, and BP.
Yet you go on that Beast wins in the other thread.
As the evidence does not side with you at all. One who doesn't go by the comic evidence shows its more just your fan opinion not backed up from a reasonable conclusion from the books.
Quoted for the absolute truth. 👆
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Oh definitely possible. For some of the ones you listed. Anyways those characters have nothing to do with this threadBut we've seen what happens with Spidermans fights with Cap.
And we've especially seen what happens to Beast when he fights Cap, DD, and BP.
Yet you go on that Beast wins in the other thread.
As the evidence does not side with you at all. One who doesn't go by the comic evidence shows its more just your fan opinion not backed up from a reasonable conclusion from the books.
I can go that route, too, if you'd like.
If we go by comic evidence of particular scuffles and NOT what they're abilities/other feats have shown, we assume that:
-Deadpool is superior to Wolverine
-Spider-Man is superior to Firelord
-Cap is superior to Iron Man
-Pumpkin bomb >>> Wonder Man
I'm sure I can keep going.
But hey, you can keep calling me a fanboy if you want. You'd be wrong, but I can't stop you.
You rely solely on comic evidence. Personally, I prefer to use an amalgamation of feats, fights (if any) between the two characters in question, and their defined abilities.
Originally posted by MetalmanxQuoted for inexorable truth. 👆
I can go that route, too, if you'd like.If we go by comic evidence of particular scuffles and NOT what they're abilities/other feats have shown, we assume that:
-Deadpool is superior to Wolverine
-Spider-Man is superior to Firelord
-Cap is superior to Iron Man
-Pumpkin bomb >>> Wonder Man
I'm sure I can keep going.
But hey, you can keep calling me a fanboy if you want. You'd be wrong, but I can't stop you.
You rely solely on comic evidence. Personally, I prefer to use an amalgamation of feats, fights (if any) between the two characters in question, and their defined abilities.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
I can go that route, too, if you'd like.If we go by comic evidence of particular scuffles and NOT what they're abilities/other feats have shown, we assume that:
-Deadpool is superior to Wolverine
-Spider-Man is superior to Firelord
-Cap is superior to Iron Man
-Pumpkin bomb >>> Wonder Man
I'm sure I can keep going.
But hey, you can keep calling me a fanboy if you want. You'd be wrong, but I can't stop you.
You rely solely on comic evidence. Personally, I prefer to use an amalgamation of feats, fights (if any) between the two characters in question, and their defined abilities.
Thats not comic book logic that using circumstantial fights and using ABC logic which does not apply for fights.
The fact that your ignoring the circumstances for the Spiderman vs Firelord fight shows you'll using anything as evidence.
A. Firelord wasn't in peak-performance
B. Firelord even wanted just to rest on Earth.
C. Firelord specifically stated he was holding back from incinerating the areas.
D. Spiderman in black suit went "all" out on him.
Even for real fights like in MMA for example Wand, Rampage, Chuck. Wand beats Page twice. Page beats Chuck twice. But Chuck beat Wand.
ABC logic does not apply and is looked down upon, as anyone considering circumstances can be>>>>> or <<<<<< and does not help the focus of the match. Plus to do so your focusing on different characters that are a outside topic. Inside top for this thread is just Spiderman vs Cap. Others need not apply if these two have confronted.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Thats not comic book logic that using circumstantial fights and using ABC logic which does not apply for fights.The fact that your ignoring the circumstances for the Spiderman vs Firelord fight shows you'll using anything as evidence.
A. Firelord wasn't in peak-performance
B. Firelord even wanted just to rest on Earth.
C. Firelord specifically stated he was holding back from incinerating the areas.
D. Spiderman in black suit went "all" out on him.
Even for real fights like in MMA for example Wand, Rampage, Chuck. Wand beats Page twice. Page beats Chuck twice. But Chuck beat Wand.
ABC logic does not apply and is looked down upon, as anyone considering circumstances can be>>>>> or <<<<<< and does not help the focus of the match. Plus to do so your focusing on different characters that are a outside topic. Inside top for this thread is just Spiderman vs Cap. Others need not apply if these two have confronted.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Thats not comic book logic that using circumstantial fights and using ABC logic which does not apply for fights.The fact that your ignoring the circumstances for the Spiderman vs Firelord fight shows you'll using anything as evidence.
A. Firelord wasn't in peak-performance
B. Firelord even wanted just to rest on Earth.
C. Firelord specifically stated he was holding back from incinerating the areas.
D. Spiderman in black suit went "all" out on him.
Even for real fights like Wand, Rampage, Chuck in mma. Wand beats Page twice. Page beats Chuck twice. But Chuck beat Wand.
ABC logic does not apply and is looked down up. Plus to do so your focusing on different characters that are a outside topic. Inside top for this thread is just Spiderman vs Cap. Others need not apply if these two have confronted.
doh
Wait, where did I use ABC logic? I didn't say anything along the lines of "Spider-Man >>>>Pumpkin Bomb>>>>Wonder Man; therefore Spider-Man is able to defeat Wonder Man", did I?
And if you've noticed, I ALWAYS get on other debators about using ABC logic. 🙂
And yes, I'm aware that the Firelord example is PIS/CIS. That's not the point. The point is that you don't seem to realize how much CIS was in the Civil War Spidey/Cap fight, since that seems to be the issue here.
By the way, why aren't you getting on Phantom Zone then? He keeps using the example of a robot clone Spidey saying he couldn't take Cap in hand-to-hand. Well, it's not actually Spidey, so it shouldn't even be recognized, correct?
Originally posted by Metalmanx
I can go that route, too, if you'd like.If we go by comic evidence of particular scuffles and NOT what they're abilities/other feats have shown, we assume that:
We don't just go by comic evidence but obvoulsy that is a main factor you just blantantly ignore it.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
-Deadpool is superior to Wolverine
Wolverine HF was messed up
Originally posted by Metalmanx
-Spider-Man is superior to Firelord
Er not it doesn't. Firelord was exhausted and holding back.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
-Cap is superior to Iron Man
What on earth are you talking about? I think Cap only beat classic Iron man.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
-Pumpkin bomb >>> Wonder Man
Er Wonder Man currently isn't as tough as he used to be. These things happen.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
I'm sure I can keep going.But hey, you can keep calling me a fanboy if you want. You'd be wrong, but I can't stop you.
You rely solely on comic evidence. Personally, I prefer to use an amalgamation of feats, fights (if any) between the two characters in question, and their defined abilities.
Thats not what you're doing is it though? What the hell has Deadpool beating Wolverine got to do with Spiderman vs Cap? Wolverine had a messed up HF. Firelord was exhausted and was holding back. Whats the explantion for Cap vs Spiderman? All your doing is giving examples that are not relevant to this thread. Hey Professor X can beat Cap and hes doesn't know as much H2H as Cap does. Spiderman wins the majority!!!! ❌
That still does not change the fact the evidence is not in your favour. If non-holding back robot of Spiderman (of comparable ability) says that it cant take Cap in H2H AND Spiderman says it as well the evidence indicates that Cap will win and spouting out examples that are irrelevant aren't going to change that.
You also can't use the fact that Cap worships Spiderman in the civil war fight as an excuse. Cap is friends with Spiderman and admires, Cap also stated that Spiderman knew that he didn't want to fight him, so Cap was just as conflicted as Spiderman was. Cap is probably oen of the nicest superheroes in the MU how do you think he felt about punching a friend who he admires in the fact. They were both conflicted but who was winning?
Originally posted by Marvelknight
If someone made a Superman vs Darkseid thread. Superman fan can just say that Supes wins because he beat him already. And then there would be no point in ever making a thread with characters who have battle before if you can't takes out the circumstances of the plot.
Well then go debate that with the Superman vs Darseid thread.
This is Spiderman vs Cap..............stay on topic. 😛 😉
Originally posted by Daredevil1
By your logic MetelmanxI can say Batman>>>>>>>>>Spectre
But only if I ignore the circumstances that occurred in there fight.
But I guess to you this is logical.
🤨 ...The hell are you smoking? Did you even read that post? I said if we went by YOUR logic, this stuff would make sense.
Thanks. Try again.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
dohWait, where did I use ABC logic? I didn't say anything along the lines of "Spider-Man >>>>Pumpkin Bomb>>>>Wonder Man; therefore Spider-Man is able to defeat Wonder Man", did I?
No you didnt but the examples you gave are not relevant.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
And yes, I'm aware that the Firelord example is PIS/CIS. That's not the point. The point is that you don't seem to realize how much CIS was in the Civil War Spidey/Cap fight, since that seems to be the issue here.
There was CIS with both Cap and Spiderman but guess who was still winning.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
By the way, why aren't you getting on Phantom Zone then? He keeps using the example of a robot clone Spidey saying he couldn't take Cap in hand-to-hand. Well, it's not actually Spidey, so it shouldn't even be recognized, correct?
Duhhhhhh the robot was an accurate representation of Spiderman. You also got the excuse that Spiderman has got better in H2H but Cap has had much much much more experience than Spiderman to this very day. FFor god sake Cap has at least 100 of years of experience in training, but just because Spiderman said he got better at H2H its gonna make a difference? Are you getting any of this? 🤨
Originally posted by Metalmanx
🤨 ...The hell are you smoking? Did you even read that post? I said if we went by YOUR logic, this stuff would make sense.Thanks. Try again.
No it does not because there is an EXPLANATION behind those examples.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
We don't just go by comic evidence but obvoulsy that is a main factor you just blantantly ignore it.Wolverine HF was messed up
Er not it doesn't. Firelord was exhausted and holding back.
What on earth are you talking about? I think Cap only beat classic Iron man.
Er Wonder Man currently isn't as tough as he used to be. These things happen.
Thats not what you're doing is it though? What the hell has Deadpool beating Wolverine got to do with Spiderman vs Cap? Wolverine had a messed up HF. Firelord was exhausted and was holding back. Whats the explantion for Cap vs Spiderman? All your doing is giving examples that are not relevant to this thread. Hey Professor X can beat Cap and hes doesn't know as much H2H as Cap does. Spiderman wins the majority!!!! ❌
That still does not change the fact the evidence is not in your favour. If non-holding back robot of Spiderman (of comparable ability) says that it cant take Cap in H2H AND Spiderman says it as well the evidence indicates that Cap will win and spouting out examples that are irrelevant aren't going to change that.
You also can't use the fact that Cap worships Spiderman in the civil war fight as an excuse. Cap is friends with Spiderman and admires, Cap also stated that Spiderman knew that he didn't want to fight him, so Cap was just as conflicted as Spiderman was. Cap is probably oen of the nicest superheroes in the MU how do you think he felt about punching a friend who he admires in the fact. They were both conflicted but who was winning?
Doesn't anyone read anymore?
I'm not saying this was my logic. I was your own and Daredevil1's logic. But I'm the one that's always ignoring comic book evidence... 🙄
By the way, Cap beat Iron Man to end the Civil War. 😉
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Doesn't anyone read anymore?I'm not saying this was my logic. I was your own and Daredevil1's logic. But I'm the one that's always ignoring comic book evidence... 🙄
Your FAILING its not our logic.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
By the way, Cap beat Iron Man to end the Civil War. 😉
WTF has that got to do with anything? Who, what, were, when? Cap had help from Vision therefore what? Cap had help from Vision therefore its my logic and Spiderman wins the majority? This is completely irrelevant.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
dohWait, where did I use ABC logic? I didn't say anything along the lines of "Spider-Man >>>>Pumpkin Bomb>>>>Wonder Man; therefore Spider-Man is able to defeat Wonder Man", did I?
And if you've noticed, I ALWAYS get on other debators about using ABC logic. 🙂
And yes, I'm aware that the Firelord example is PIS/CIS. That's not the point. The point is that you don't seem to realize how much CIS was in the Civil War Spidey/Cap fight, since that seems to be the issue here.
By the way, why aren't you getting on Phantom Zone then? He keeps using the example of a robot clone Spidey saying he couldn't take Cap in hand-to-hand. Well, it's not actually Spidey, so it shouldn't even be recognized, correct?
I apologize for the ABC logic I thought that was the route you were heading. You see the difference here is the fight that you mentioned had Firelord not at his true power level from "outside" circumstances. This is not involved for debates here.
The Spiderman vs Cap fights no outside circumstances affected there regular power ie being sick, mind unstable, them hurt severely from another fight or the powers going out of wack.
In KMC they have to be in character and that they were in there fights. As they were.
There was no PIS considering major martial artists like Shang Chi and Steel Serphent have also given Spiderman problems so it is not the first time. So your just using it as a cop out IMO. But those characters are no Cap anyhow.
You can conclude all you want that Beast or Spiderman wins. But my opinion at least is shown and backed by the books. I'll take the former over the ladder.