WWH w/Gem of Cyttorak vs Thanos

Originally posted by CaptainStoic
This is not Cain Bentley, if WWHulk effortlessly shrugged off Xavier's attempt to mind rape him, which resulted in a psychic backlash that nearly did in the rest of the X-Men, I have a feeling that Thanos' mindrape would result in failure as well. Does that make any sense to you?

Thanos' only option is bfr, or to run through the nearest portal gateway to escape the beatdown.

I did say arguably didn't I? What makes so many people think that Thanos is invincible? He is powerful, but he can be defeated, just the fact that he lived through WM Thor and the power gem proves he's not a feather weight type of villain (I also believe that fight was pure bs however and filled with PIS/CIS but whatever). As for you other question of whether or not I believe that King Hulk could beat Thanos... not unless they slugged it out, but I would love to see it.

Yeah but how can you even say that based on one fight. I saw in that fight nothing that puts him near or at Thanos level.He knocked around Hulk for a bit then Strange regained some control stopped himself and Hulk then punched him a few times and the fight was over.I mean Zom jumped into Cho in Hulk #111 and all angel had to do was kick him to the back of the head and the fight was over.

As for wwh the problem I have when people debate hulk is that they try to reduce his opponent to hulk's level.Why the hell would Thanos get into a slugfest with hulk and not use his multitude of other powers to fights not that he cant fight him h2h because he has in my opinion proved he is strong enough to do it.I mean come on the guy can fight WM thor with the power gem h2h and hold his own against odin but hulk can beat him

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Yout can try spinning this however u want, still doesnt change the fact that Thanos has no way of harming juggurhulk physically or even mentally for that matter.

Please prove this because Juggernaut has been harmed before with the gem.

Originally posted by Nihilist
looks like thanos gains the gem of cyttorak then.

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
Yeah but how can you even say that based on one fight. I saw in that fight nothing that puts him near or at Thanos level.He knocked around Hulk for a bit then Strange regained some control stopped himself and Hulk then punched him a few times and the fight was over.I mean Zom jumped into Cho in Hulk #111 and all angel had to do was kick him to the back of the head and the fight was over.

As for wwh the problem I have when people debate hulk is that they try to reduce his opponent to hulk's level.Why the hell would Thanos get into a slugfest with hulk and not use his multitude of other powers to fights not that he cant fight him h2h because he has in my opinion proved he is strong enough to do it.I mean come on the guy can fight WM thor with the power gem h2h and hold his own against odin but hulk can beat him

Truthfully there is no proof that zom strange is thanos level but the cho thing happened after zom had bin depowered from the hulk fight so it is not a good measure of power.

And a normal WWH loses horriblyto thanos but i think this fight depends on whether the gem will multiply the hulks already existing strength by the same ratio it multiplies normal cain . If it does and the hulk receives the full power of it ( unstoppability, invulnerability) etc, then barring BFR he can win. I also read something here about the gem being able to teleport him but im not sure how accurate it is

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Truthfully there is no proof that zom strange is thanos level but the cho thing happened after zom had bin depowered from the hulk fight so it is not a good measure of power.

And a normal WWH loses horriblyto thanos but i think this fight depends on whether the gem will multiply the hulks already existing strength by the same ratio it multiplies normal cain . If it does and the hulk receives the full power of it ( unstoppability, invulnerability) etc, then barring BFR he can win. I also read something here about the gem being able to teleport him but im not sure how accurate it is

I really have not commented on who I think would win the fight in this thread my post was geared towards the fact that he thinks hulk has a chance of beating Thanos even without the gem.I could be wrong but I believe the cain used the gem to teleport where the X-men where fighthing the hulk in wwh x-men.

Originally posted by celestialdemon
Please prove this because Juggernaut has been harmed before with the gem.

when was he hurt without magic.

Originally posted by ultimatethor

And a normal WWH loses horriblyto thanos but i think this fight depends on whether the gem will multiply the hulks already existing strength by the same ratio it multiplies normal cain . If it does and the hulk receives the full power of it ( unstoppability, invulnerability) etc, then barring BFR he can win.

I absolutely agree with this. Until we know for sure how the gem will affect someone like the Hulk, there's no way we can assume it will power him up to the ratio it powered up Cain. If it did, then I agree that Thanos would be in trouble. If it just turns him into a normal Juggernaut with Hulk's strength, that's not enough to beat Thanos.

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
I really have not commented on who I think would win the fight in this thread my post was geared towards the fact that he thinks hulk has a chance of beating Thanos even without the gem.I could be wrong but I believe the cain used the gem to teleport where the X-men where fighthing the hulk in wwh x-men.

Originally posted by carver9
when was he hurt without magic.

Off the top of my head, Onslaught and Bishop come to mind.

Originally posted by celestialdemon
Off the top of my head, Onslaught and Bishop come to mind.

Bishop never physically hurt juggernaut during the onslaught saga. He hit juggernaut with a bolt of electricity that powered the city, a juggernaut that just got pummeled by onslaught but there was still no physical damage. Juggernaut has never been physically harmed except only by beings that possess magic and even during that time he was still on his feet.

Onslaught hurt him and I cant argue with that since onslaught was stated as being a being on the level of celestials and even during that time onslaught could have used magic.

Again when has juggernaut ever been hurt because to my knowledge it always took a plot device to cause him pain.

Originally posted by celestialdemon
I absolutely agree with this. Until we know for sure how the gem will affect someone like the Hulk, there's no way we can assume it will power him up to the ratio it powered up Cain. If it did, then I agree that Thanos would be in trouble. If it just turns him into a normal Juggernaut with Hulk's strength, that's not enough to beat Thanos.

Exactly. Has any already close to hulk level character ever used the gem?

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Exactly. Has any already close to hulk level character ever used the gem?

Not that I'm aware of.

Hmm, Thanos could drain all the gamma and then mindrape Bannernaut.

Originally posted by celestialdemon
I absolutely agree with this. Until we know for sure how the gem will affect someone like the Hulk, there's no way we can assume it will power him up to the ratio it powered up Cain. If it did, then I agree that Thanos would be in trouble. If it just turns him into a normal Juggernaut with Hulk's strength, that's not enough to beat Thanos.

The description of the gem and it's power imply it would work more as amp, essentially building upon WWH's current peak level with the portion of Cyttorak's power the gem grants. As a result all of WWH's current powers would mystically be amplified to the extent Cain/stevie were. WWH's already impressive physical strength,durability,speed and mental resistence would boast impressivly to a enormous level of power because of this. Not to mention aside from the default powers the gem grants it also appears to have other applications as seen by Stevie, what these other abilties could include we don't know but it's always good just to keep it in mind.

Essentially Juggerhulk would be operating on base levels which would equate to a Hulk/juggy hybrid powerset, this doesn't even include Hulks own unique ability to boast his strength with his rage. WWH already exceeds Thanos as far as physical strength is concerned so could Thanos really overcome a WWH/Juggy fusion. Plus once Juggurhulk gets extremly enraged he will futher amplify his power, a savage juggerhulk sounds like to big a foe for Thanos to handle IMO.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
The description of the gem and it's power imply it would work more as amp, essentially building upon WWH's current peak level with the portion of Cyttorak's power the gem grants. As a result all of WWH's current powers would mystically be amplified to the extent Cain/stevie were. WWH's already impressive physical strength,durability,speed and mental resistence would boast impressivly to a enormous level of power because of this.

How do you know it applies as an amp? When Stevie used it, he was able to do things Juggernaut couldn't do in addition to all the basic powers. By your logic, that would mean Stevie was just as strong as Cain plus had other powers. Was that the case? No.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Not to mention aside from the default powers the gem grants it also appears to have other applications as seen by Stevie, what these other abilties could include we don't know but it's always good just to keep it in mind.

Why could Stevie use those other powers when Cain couldn't even after possessing the gem for all those years? Is it because he had those powers to begin with, or because his imagination allowed him to, or because Cyttorak allowed it? Without knowing the reasons behind the differences in power, we can't assume that WWH would also have those powers.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Essentially Juggerhulk would be operating on base levels which would equate to a Hulk/juggy hybrid powerset, this doesn't even include Hulks own unique ability to boast his strength with his rage. WWH already exceeds Thanos as far as physical strength is concerned so could Thanos really overcome a WWH/Juggy fusion. Plus once Juggurhulk gets extremly enraged he will futher amplify his power, a savage juggerhulk sounds like to big a foe for Thanos to handle IMO.

Despite the fact that Thanos has stood up and survived confrontations with skyfathers, right?

Originally posted by carver9
Bishop never physically hurt juggernaut during the onslaught saga. He hit juggernaut with a bolt of electricity that powered the city, a juggernaut that just got pummeled by onslaught but there was still no physical damage. Juggernaut has never been physically harmed except only by beings that possess magic and even during that time he was still on his feet.

Onslaught hurt him and I cant argue with that since onslaught was stated as being a being on the level of celestials and even during that time onslaught could have used magic.

Again when has juggernaut ever been hurt because to my knowledge it always took a plot device to cause him pain.

Onslaught doesn't know magic, so no, that wasn't it. When Onslaught physically hurt Juggernaut, he hadn't absorbed either Nate or Franklin Richards, so he was nowhere near Celestial level.

Originally posted by celestialdemon
Onslaught doesn't know magic, so no, that wasn't it. When Onslaught physically hurt Juggernaut, he hadn't absorbed either Nate or Franklin Richards, so he was nowhere near Celestial level.

Originally posted by Creshosk
You mean the walking plot device that ignored established continuity in order to effect the events that shouldn't have happened? That Onslaught?

The same one that Hulk fans creamed themselves over when Hulk broke his armor? Yes, that one.

The inscription on the stone reads "Whosoever touches this gem shall possess the power of the crimson bands of Cyttorak! Henceforth, you who read these words shall become forevermore a human Juggernaut!" The stone can transfer a portion of the power of Cyttorak to anyone who touches it, giving them increased size and mass, incredible strength and an invulnerable forcefield. In this case, granting WWH a portion of Cyttorak's power in addition to WWH's existing power.

That certainly sounds like a amplification artifact to me, especially when you consider what occured with Black Tom. Now aside from the basic powers the Gem grants (which are universally distributed), the gem also had the ability to confer additional mystical powers. These powers appear to manifest in accordance to whom ever is wielding the gem, for instance the Hulk could harness his strength into pure energy projectiles or some type of telepathic energies.

Regardless of whatever the addtional abilites would become, Hulk with the aid of the gem would operate on base levels equivalent to a fused Hulk/juggy powerset. With the inclusion of Hulk's unique ability to increase his strength with rage, juggurhulk's strength/durability would rival skyfather level beings. A savage WWH with the gem of cyttorak is simply to powerful a foe for someone like Thanos...seriously what can Thanos do to harm him?

Originally posted by celestialdemon
The same one that Hulk fans creamed themselves over when Hulk broke his armor? Yes, that one.

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