Will Heath Ledger's Joker top Jack Nicholson's?
Jack Nicholson portrayed an awesome Joker but if you get down to it, he basically played himself if he had gotten drunk on Halloween. Still, he's the best live action Joker to date but Heath Ledger is bringing something totally new to the role. He's going to bring in a darker version of the character and I don't see many people hating his Joker.
I post this in another thread but I am gonna post it here as it is relevent to the thread. (Warning Long Post)
I have three main problems with Jack`s performance as The Joker.
1. Too big of a name for the role- His casting meant huge number of people were going to pour into cinemas just to see the movie thats all fine and well. But I feel he was too big a name for the role and people see him as a big legend that they wanted to preserve this because of what they think of "Jack" outside of his acting. And if you don`t believe me all you have to do is watch the extras for on the Batman DVD when doing the makeup for Jack they said they wanted to preserve as much as Jack as possible now in my exprince as a Drama student you are supposed to sink into a role that you almost become unregoniseble thats like acting 101. Ledger did this perfectly but unforuntnly the people working on the movie did not see it this way because of Jack`s name and they wanted to preserve that which was just wrong.
2. Joker in the comics is Batman`s arch nemesis and in the movie it did not feel like that at all and they had to dramatically change the source material to make it this way which was just wrong imo. Now from what I have seen from Ledger he seems more of the joker from the comics he seems to have really caused Batman troubles and looks like he will become Batman`s arch nemesis in the movie unfourtnaly the way Jack`s Joker was written he did not come across as the arch nemesis that has caused batman so much pain like in the comics.
3. Jack did get the sick twisted humor of the Joker down to a t in this movie but from interviews with Burton I think thats all he understood of the Joker character this dark sick twisted sense of humor and Jack`s joker did not come across as threatening really.
In conclusion I don`t think Jack`s Joker was all that bad he had some pretty good moments in the movie but it was not consistent with the comic book Joker which I think Ledger has already played so successfully from what I have seen. I think if Jack played Joker like he played his role in The Shinning he would have been a much better and scarier Joker+ if he was written better without him killing Batman`s parents angle and just hurt Batman in a way or really caused Gotham City chaos then he would have been better. Jack is not a bad actor imo it was just how The Joker was written and how he performed him left much to be desired imo and imo really overrated.
As for Heath Ledger`s Joker okay his look might not be 100% to Comic Book Joker but to me he is still regonisble as The Joker. But as from what I have seen so far he has beaten Nicholson, Ledger`s Joker is the Joker from the darker Batman stories such as Arkham Asylum, The Killing Joke and his early apprences. To me Nicholson was an extension of Ceaser Romero`s Joker for the 80s but with a bit more of a dark humor added in there, Ledger`s Joker is gonna push the envlope he is dark, scary and still has that twisted sense of humor but most importantly of all in this movie people are gonna realise why he is Batman`s arch nemesis which in the previous incarnations apart from TAS series they have never really gotten right.
Jack was very good and so was the original Batman '89. Just because I'm in the Nolan camp now doesn't change that. I loved that film as a kid, and still appreciate it today.
The Jack performance was as many have said, "Jack playing Jack." More often then not, he comes off as this goofy fat uncle type of guy.
That said, he has 4 or 5 truly awesome "Joker moments in the film"
1.) When the doc tells him he can only do so much and he smashes the mirror, rips the bandages off and leaves cackling. 👆
2.) When he zaps the mob boss and sings and cackles again. 👆
3.) When he asks Bruce if he's ever danced with the devil and then shoots him in the apartment very casually. 👆
4.) When Batman is on the ledge and he's stomping the bricks and laughing. 👆
But.....(not having actually seen all of Ledgers performance yet) it appears that rather than 4 or 5 great Joker moments what we'll be getting from Heath is a performance that is complete. An entire new character from beginning to end. This character, different from the comics in some ways, will be what we'll have to decide on. Is it a better version of Joker or not?
My money is on it being better.
i saw Batman '89 yesterday and i constantly keep asking myself this (thread) question. And honestly i don't know. Both are incredibly good actors. Jack Nich won a best actor Oscar before and Heath was the youngest dude to be nominated for best actor by the Oscars for BareBack Mountain.
I think both may be on par with each other. The only thing that i think would be the determining factor would be looks. And Heath would win that contest kinda. Cause of the slim factor. But the new grungy look is something i haven't gotten used to yet, but a slim joker is what i grew up with, but Jack Nich had the kinda perfect Joker face. Like facially, Jack Nich looks more like a Joker that Heath's facial Joker. I think Jack Nich's laugh is better too, but a fat Joker? Never got over that, my take.
Originally posted by Mr Shindiggery
I post this in another thread but I am gonna post it here as it is relevent to the thread. (Warning Long Post)I have three main problems with Jack`s performance as The Joker.
1. Too big of a name for the role- His casting meant huge number of people were going to pour into cinemas just to see the movie thats all fine and well. But I feel he was too big a name for the role and people see him as a big legend that they wanted to preserve this because of what they think of "Jack" outside of his acting. And if you don`t believe me all you have to do is watch the extras for on the Batman DVD when doing the makeup for Jack they said they wanted to preserve as much as Jack as possible now in my exprince as a Drama student you are supposed to sink into a role that you almost become unregoniseble thats like acting 101. Ledger did this perfectly but unforuntnly the people working on the movie did not see it this way because of Jack`s name and they wanted to preserve that which was just wrong.
2. Joker in the comics is Batman`s arch nemesis and in the movie it did not feel like that at all and they had to dramatically change the source material to make it this way which was just wrong imo. Now from what I have seen from Ledger he seems more of the joker from the comics he seems to have really caused Batman troubles and looks like he will become Batman`s arch nemesis in the movie unfourtnaly the way Jack`s Joker was written he did not come across as the arch nemesis that has caused batman so much pain like in the comics.
3. Jack did get the sick twisted humor of the Joker down to a t in this movie but from interviews with Burton I think thats all he understood of the Joker character this dark sick twisted sense of humor and Jack`s joker did not come across as threatening really.
In conclusion I don`t think Jack`s Joker was all that bad he had some pretty good moments in the movie but it was not consistent with the comic book Joker which I think Ledger has already played so successfully from what I have seen. I think if Jack played Joker like he played his role in The Shinning he would have been a much better and scarier Joker+ if he was written better without him killing Batman`s parents angle and just hurt Batman in a way or really caused Gotham City chaos then he would have been better. Jack is not a bad actor imo it was just how The Joker was written and how he performed him left much to be desired imo and imo really overrated.
As for Heath Ledger`s Joker okay his look might not be 100% to Comic Book Joker but to me he is still regonisble as The Joker. But as from what I have seen so far he has beaten Nicholson, Ledger`s Joker is the Joker from the darker Batman stories such as Arkham Asylum, The Killing Joke and his early apprences. To me Nicholson was an extension of Ceaser Romero`s Joker for the 80s but with a bit more of a dark humor added in there, Ledger`s Joker is gonna push the envlope he is dark, scary and still has that twisted sense of humor but most importantly of all in this movie people are gonna realise why he is Batman`s arch nemesis which in the previous incarnations apart from TAS series they have never really gotten right.
I agree with everything in this post.Jack was pretty much just being Jack in that god awful Burton/Schumacher Batman franchise.Where Ledger from what we know,really sunk into and immersed himself in the role and became the joker from the comics.Yeah writing it so that he killed his parents,really hurt the idea that he was Batmans arch enemy,especially after that idiot Burton had Joker killed. 😠 at that point,Batman might as well have hung up the cape and cowl because thats whats motivates him to keep fighting crime is the fact that he CANT get revenge for the person that killed his parents.
I wont say until I see the movie, but I agree with everyone saying that Jack's Joker was still Jack, its hard to see Heath in this new Joker. I can imagine people who havent been keeping track of the new movie, may be surprised when
Spoiler:
the scene of him without his makeup comes on, and they go "hey thats Heath Ledger!".
While i like Jacks role, he never got that deep into the villains mind or habits, if it is indeed the case with HL, i believe we will get a more accurate representation of the Jokers madness and cruelty, where jacks joker had the madness it lacked that serious, threatening demeanor, he seemed more like the trickster Joker of the 60's, 70's era.
HL was dedicated to the role and many of his co-stars have backed up claims of his spectacular performance, i see no reason to doubt it, i will like many batman fans enter the theatre with high expectations and i believe like so many of us our confidence is not misplaced.
herez a few of my favorite things from jack's joker in 89 and wat ive seen of heaths joker from trailers and junk...
jackz:
1the scene wher the dr shows him his face and the joker laughs...FOREVER! his laugh throughout the entire movie is wonderful..its always full, ya know?
2 the joker makin jokes bout dead people that were actually funny (it allowed me to feel evil rite along wif the joker!)
3 the joker messin up that girls face and causin her to kill herself (thats an underplayed effed up aspect to the movie which i loved)
4 the joker invading peoples tvs and tellin them they probably already are going to die from his joker poison cuz his tampered material is already released to the public.
5 the part where the joker is edgin away from batman and then pulls some glasses out of nowhere and goes "you wouldnt hit a guy wif glasses wouldja?!" (actually a lil gud and bad cuz the joker would never run away from batman..but the scene waz hilarious)
6 wher the joker starts laughing super loud and then looks at the gargoyle and goes "WHAT ARE YOU LAUGHING AT?!!" that cracks me up every.. single. time i see it.
7 the joker lying dead with a smile on his face and a prerecorded laugh still goin strong..
now for heath:
1. his entire presence, how hez all hunched over and sorta twitches his mouth and liks his lips every 5 seconds...its creepy.
2. his voice, it sounds funny, like an unhinged cartoon (which is puuurfect)
3. his laugh.. its different than jacks, but still sounds full. if i heard that laugh from a painted faced clown wif a chelsea grin, id prolly never get over it.
4. his degenerating make up (lotz of people dont seem to like it, but i think it just adds to his scary factor.. he starts lookin more and more messed up.)
5. his self established purpose to make batman "break his one rule". thats sooo straight up joker! super evil for no gud reason..
6. that one scene in the imax featurette where batman confronts the joker in the interrogation room, he says "you wanted me, here i am" or something along those lines and then the joker just starts laughin super hard..
7 his smile... wen hez not actually smilin the make up and chelsea grim give him this ominous dark smile and then wen he really smiles it just looks gleeful..in a messed up way..like he seriously enjoys wat he does, which is exactly wat he shud look like.
i cant wait for this movie!