How did Christ handle rejection?

Originally posted by Grand_Moff_Gav
I was being sarcastic, let me rephrase- you Devil King are bullying the guy for no reason.

Let me guess, you suffered homophobic abuse and were seriously depressed but dealt with it on your own thus you are the Supreme Authority on the matter and you demand that everyone else keep their problems to themselves and solve them by themselves because you were capable of doing that... 🙄

Oh or is it deeper?...do you hate the idea of people asking for help when they're low because you had no one to turn to when you felt down? Thus you abhor seeing other people helped through their troubles because you somehow feel that you have been neglected? 😕

No, I have suffered very little homophobia in the real world. In fact, if you were to engage in an honest character study of me based on my comments on this very forum, you'd know why the annonimity you address in your post is exactly why this is the only place I've experienced homophobia; because people are much more open about their homophobia when there is no real consequence to their expression of it. Most people are cowards in real life. And by the way, being saracstic is totally different than saying exactly what you mean.

I don't think it's laughable because I dealt with anything on my own. I find it laughable because rather than seeking the advice of a professional or the input of his obviously non-existant friends, he's turned to an internet forum and veiled it under a religious pretense. It goes hand in hand with my experience that people who think that a fairy tale god is going to be the answer to all their human problems. 🙄

I wish I was a deep as you want me to be with your comentary on my personality. And even more than that, none of your heart-felt adivce is going to change a single thing about this guy. He's not going to suddenly get laid or find his soulmate because you toned in with a god loves you, things will get better, hang in there type comment. I see it for what it is; a method for getting attention.

Hey, I have an idea. Pay less attention to how Jesus handled rejection and focus more on how he handles it. Because clearly he responds to it by running to the internet and asking a group of strangers he couldn't give a shit about for their opinion.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Thus proving my point.

😄

Be careful not to make the objectivism fallacy, however. Opinions are subjective. Like what "perfect" is, for example. Empirical facts can be treated as objective, as there is a basis for analysis and comparison.

Also, how did he feel this burden? Was it knowledge of every sin throughout time, which would shatter a physical mind into incoherence? Or was it simply the concept of it, which of course could be tiring, but would be uplifting when one knows the eternal heavenly payoff at the end.

No, Christ, within a Christian paradigm, had it easy. If I knew beyond a doubt that I was the Son of God, I'd happily accept all that Jesus suffered and more, and not consider it a burden in the least.

Originally posted by Devil King
And mine don't seem to even slow me down. It's funny how two people expereince the same thing two different ways, isn't it?

Originally posted by atv2
I am a Christian and being a follower of Christ I know that he went through rejection. They preferred to follow idols over him. They chose to hang on to what they had instead of following him. The woman that I was pursuing told me twice that even if it was the perfect man, she wouldn't go out with him. Christ was perfect in what he did and even then, a lot of people in the world did not accept him. Seeing that he went through rejection, I can follow him. The problems I thought I had weren't the real problem(i.e.,independence). The only answer that I have is to keep moving forward. I am going to continue to work on myself, but I have to trust him. I can't give up on him, he put something great in me and I can't give up now. I got find out what it was all about. I have been dealing with this issue for a long time and I was trying to see if anyone could relate to what I have.

maybe one day my ship will come back again and beam me up. they put me on the wrong planet. Why would they do this? Entertainment purposes? Damn them.😠

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
No, you don't feel your sins because, to you, there is no such thing as a sin. Unless it violates your own relativistic worldview where X is good because you say so whereas Y is bad because you say so. Or because you've been raised in a culture that has indoctrinated you into believing that X is good and Y is bad, so you say judge X/Y based upon these ingrained beliefs and claim that this is somehow a form of logic and reason when there is no ground upon which your moral judgments can stand because, to you, there is no such thing as a moral firmament.

So X&Y become my own versions of sin and virtue. The secret fact that you don't want to get out is that our versions rarely deviate from each other. It's not like I have no sense of right and wrong. I think it's a cop-out to espouse the realization of the absurdity of the christian versions of right and wrong aren't based on a culture that is on one hand professed to be founded on christianity and on the other held out to have no moral barometer because it has chosen not to bend knee to the christian perspective. Even you have to realize the absurdity of saying that a cuture observes no morals because they've been tempted into not doing so. There are some very realistic morals espoused by the christian faith, but they aren't the end of it. In fact, they aren't the beginning of it. That is one of my major reasons behind dismissing it as a valid reason for subscription to the faith. It only answers the questions it chooses to and prohibits the actions the offend that sensability. I'm sorry, but the real world exists and it has little to do with what rights and wrongs have been picked and choosen by your religion. Just because you think that pedophilia is looked down upon by many people who subscribe to your religion doesn't mean that it is accepted by people who haven't drunk the same kool-aid. If I sound dismissive, it's because I absolutely am. In fact, that illustrates a major point in my position; that what is considered right and wrong is dictated more by your culture than it is by a religion that was formulated based on that culture. To you, that sounds like I'm buying in to some satan-inspired plot that has formed modern culture. But to me it sounds like an observation of the common themes in every culture. You don't have the market corned on moral certainty, you just think you do. Your religion allows you the arrogance to think it's original to your religion. Sorry, right and wrong existed long before your creation of the christian religion. And it will be around long after it's gone the way of Zeus or Ra. Humanity goes on, even if it's self-serving creations do not.

I only wish I could live long enough to see humanity get over your particular version of this fairytale.

there are no X and Y. There are only variations of that. It's subjective. When does evil on a scale become okay, good, better or best? When does cold become luke warm, warm, hotter and hot or hottest?

Were is the line drawn between evil and good. Also, who determines what is evil and good, besides the collective majority.

And when is a collective majority correct. past history shows us that it is not. Otherwise we would not have burning and torturing people alive because they thought different thoughts that were different from the majority.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
there are no X and Y.

Sure there are. That's why we create them.

in formulas of scientific values.......not in human reasoning's...imo

Originally posted by Deja~vu
in formulas of scientific values.......not in human reasoning's...imo

soley because of human reasoning. Or human need....imo.

And doesn't it all really come down to that: opinion.

Originally posted by Devil King
Sorry, right and wrong existed long before your creation of the christian religion. And it will be around long after it's gone the way of Zeus or Ra. Humanity goes on, even if it's self-serving creations do not.

I only wish I could live long enough to see humanity get over your particular version of this fairytale.

So you see Christian and Greek concepts of right and wrong on the same footing? "Turn the other cheek" and the Golden Rule isn't [apparantly or logically] better than leaving infants perceived to be weak on the side of a mountain to die?

Originally posted by Devil King
So X&Y become my own versions of sin and virtue. The secret fact that you don't want to get out is that our versions rarely deviate from each other. It's not like I have no sense of right and wrong.

I think it's a cop-out to espouse the realization of the absurdity of the christian versions of right and wrong aren't based on a culture that is on one hand professed to be founded on christianity and on the other held out to have no moral barometer because it has chosen not to bend knee to the christian perspective.

Even you have to realize the absurdity of saying that a cuture observes no morals because they've been tempted into not doing so.

Just because you think that pedophilia is looked down upon by many people who subscribe to your religion doesn't mean that it is accepted by people who haven't drunk the same kool-aid. If I sound dismissive, it's because I absolutely am. In fact, that illustrates a major point in my position; that what is considered right and wrong is dictated more by your culture than it is by a religion that was formulated based on that culture. To you, that sounds like I'm buying in to some satan-inspired plot that has formed modern culture. But to me it sounds like an observation of the common themes in every culture.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
Stop trying to be perfect. There isn't any perfection, not even in Christian stories. Stop trying to be like Jesus that you believe that perfection will cure all your ills. We all know we are not perfect we just , or at least I try to treat others like I would like to be treated. that doesn't make people treat you any better, it just makes you a target at times. If youre strong enough you can indure it, if not then you'll become like everyone else. Sometimes I wonder if it's not better becoming the shark instead of the goldfish, myself. But for some reason I just can't. I've tried.

maybe one day my ship will come back again and beam me up. they put me on the wrong planet. Why would they do this? Entertainment purposes? Damn them.😠

I'm not perfect. He's the best guy for me. I'll continue to strive to be like him.

I have to ask then, atv2, did you know that all along, or did you really come here for sympathy rather than advice? I hardly ever agree with Devil King, but he makes a valid point. Few members of this forum are Christians, so by asking a question so specific to Christianity, you had to expect some secular responses, helpful or not.

Now that you've gotten some advice and some responses, I hope you've realized how important it is to gain some confidence.

Originally posted by Devil King
soley because of human reasoning. Or human need....imo.

And doesn't it all really come down to that: opinion.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Really? They don't deviate? I'm pretty sure that they do. And I'm not the one who is going to strain himself trying to justify why killing is wrong. After all, we're merely animals in nature, and killing is something that animals do.

What in the world makes you think I think killing is not wrong and how would I get a hernia explaining why it is? "It just isn't right" are just as many words as "because god said so".

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Just because America was founded by Christians for the express purpose of glorifying God and "advancing the Christian faith" does not mean that those original ideals have been held to.

I would be pleased as peaches for you to point out where in any of the founding documents there is a reference to christianity as being the motivation for the founding of this country.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Seeds of corruption bear fruit for many years.

But see, you think it's corrupt simply because everyone hasn't decided to believe what you believe. The whole world isn't corrupt just because they aren't you.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Okay. I'll go ahead and keep on thinking that child prostitution is wrong. You can go ahead and support foreign dictators torturing people because it's right in their own culture.

Or, we can come to the conclusion that I don't support child prostitution and I don't support foreign dictators killing their citizens and neither do you. Like I said, our conclusions are rarely that far off from each other. The only think keeping you thinking they are is because I am not a christian. Sounds kind of muslim to me.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
So you see Christian and Greek concepts of right and wrong on the same footing? "Turn the other cheek" and the Golden Rule isn't [apparantly or logically] better than leaving infants perceived to be weak on the side of a mountain to die?

I hear that example all the time. But I'm not sure it happened as often as most people would like for it to have to strengthen their argument. Many times, people who could have no children came and took the babies left in the wilderness and raised them as their own. If we were to go point by point through what most christians believe to be their moral code, we would end up finding counterparts for all of them in other religions and cultures. And we would find examples of christians breaking their own moral codes too. There are ups and downs to any culture's actions. How many christians get abortions? How many of them consider it murder?

Originally posted by Devil King
What in the world makes you think I think killing is not wrong and how would I get a hernia explaining why it is? "It just isn't right" are just as many words as "because god said so".

I would be pleased as peaches for you to point out where in any of the founding documents there is a reference to christianity as being the motivation for the founding of this country.

But see, you think it's corrupt simply because everyone hasn't decided to believe what you believe. The whole world isn't corrupt just because they aren't you.

Or, we can come to the conclusion that I don't support child prostitution and I don't support foreign dictators killing their citizens and neither do you. Like I said, our conclusions are rarely that far off from each other. The only think keeping you thinking they are is because I am not a christian. Sounds kind of muslim to me.

Originally posted by Devil King
What in the world makes you think I think killing is not wrong and how would I get a hernia explaining why it is? "It just isn't right" are just as many words as "because god said so".

Not good enough. Explain to me how its wrong, with out god.

This is one religous rule that Atheist/seculars like to hang on to, but scoff at others.

Originally posted by Devil King
I hear that example all the time. But I'm not sure it happened as often as most people would like for it to have to strengthen their argument. Many times, people who could have no children came and took the babies left in the wilderness and raised them as their own. If we were to go point by point through what most christians believe to be their moral code, we would end up finding counterparts for all of them in other religions and cultures. And we would find examples of christians breaking their own moral codes too. There are ups and downs to any culture's actions. How many christians get abortions? How many of them consider it murder?

I really can't think of too many cultures around the world that say to turn the other cheek, or to treat your enemies as yourself. But I'm listening.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Because you, as the secular humanist, are supposed to do logical contortions trying to decide why killing a human being is wrong.

But since it's not so hard for me, then you must not be right.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
Try reading the Mayflower Compact.

Try giving an example of a document that governs the United States of America. And if anyone who wrote or agreed to the Mayflower Compact was still around to sign the constitution or the delcearation on indepedence, then I'd love for you to point them out.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
And yet...I'm still going to say that the Thai child prostitutes and the sandmonkey savages are badwrong and corrupt.

And on many levels I would agree with you. I somehow managed to come to that conclusion without god. I'm not going to say the "savages" are wrong and corrupt because they have a different religion though. And I'm certainly not going to call them savages simply because they aren't christians. I'm going to say you're both wrong for letting it control how you both think and how you both act, but I'm not going to selectively choose which religion is more or less silly.

Originally posted by Zeal Ex Nihilo
But you can't logically justify those things. From a relativistic standpoint--by your own words, where culture defines morality--those things are not wrong.

You mean I can't logically do it with out pointing to god.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Not good enough. Explain to me how its wrong, with out god.

This is one religous rule that Atheist/seculars like to hang on to, but scoff at others.

I really can't think of too many cultures around the world that say to turn the other cheek, or to treat your enemies as yourself. But I'm listening.

It's not really that difficult. As a human being I enjoy rights. You say those rights come from god, while I say they simply exist by virtue of my existence. It's a lot like you're saying that the golden rule can only exist because of god. Well it doesn't. Rights and existence are not concepts that srung out of the christian religion. The christians and the jews called it religion. But many other cutures called it philosophy.