Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Doesn't make it any less correct. You seem to have trouble when people point out that your beliefs are just that, beliefs.
...and you missed the point. I was so hoping you would get it.
The fact is the people who point out that what I have said was just a belief, are them selves promoting a belief that I am countering with a belief. They are often too blind to see this fact, and continue down the road of pointing out the very thing that they are doing. They can see it in me, but are blind to what they have just said. As if it was something more then just a belief. I do this on purpose to try and get them to see it from the other side.
Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
So... let me make sure I've got it... Your saying that we are only citing a belief when we say that you are citing nothing more than a belief?Or are you saying that we are promoting a belief, which you are countering with a belief...
In general: some people state a belief as fact, which is fine by itself. Then when someone counters that belief with their belief, they return with the denouncement that your counter is just a belief. They ignore the fact that both people are stating beliefs.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
In general: some people state a belief as fact, which is fine by itself. Then when someone counters that belief with their belief, they return with the denouncement that your counter is just a belief. They ignore the fact that both people are stating beliefs.
Not necessarily, it's quite possible for the first person to assume that the second is making the mistake you assume the first is making and attempt to point out that comical level of ignorance to them. Then when someone decides to try being a smart ass things are made needlessly confused.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
In general: some people state a belief as fact, which is fine by itself. Then when someone counters that belief with their belief, they return with the denouncement that your counter is just a belief. They ignore the fact that both people are stating beliefs.
Ok, I think I get what you are trying to say.
So, as it stands (From the point of view of an outside observer that holds neither of our beliefs) I stated something that was nothing more than a belief, which you countered with nothing more than a belief.
But from our point of view the particular belief that we hold to is fact.
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Not necessarily, it's quite possible for the first person to assume that the second is making the mistake you assume the first is making and attempt to point out that comical level of ignorance to them. Then when someone decides to try being a smart ass things are made needlessly confused.
😂 Ya, I could happen. 🙄
Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
Ok, I think I get what you are trying to say.So, as it stands (From the point of view of an outside observer that holds neither of our beliefs) I stated something that was nothing more than a belief, which you countered with nothing more than a belief.
But from our point of view the particular belief that we hold to is fact.
Is everything always about you? 😛 😆
Originally posted by Kapton JACCorrect me if I'm wrong, but didn't the ancients refer to the sky as the heavens and believe that the clouds etc. were the kingdom of the gods?
That is deplorable logic, which you clearly didn't research before you began to jump to conclusions, so allow me to educate you.1. This is an english TRANSLATION of the original Hebrew text.
2. The word to which you refer to which is translated into Heaven in the KJV can be beter translated into "Sky".
3. The first time it uses heaven, it uses a different word, which refers to the location of Heaven and not the Heavens as in Sky.
(I had posted the actual word, but unfortunately KMC doesn't support Hebrew text.)Infact other translations, such as the NIV have it translated into sky.
If you're going to preach learn the material.
It wasn't a Hallucination.
Originally posted by lord xyz
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the ancients refer to the sky as the heavens and believe that the clouds etc. were the kingdom of the gods?
Not the hebrews.
Even the greeks beleived that the gods lived on Mt. Olympus, and that the sky was held the sky on his shoulders.
Originally posted by THE JLRTENJACThe top of Mt. Olympus, which is in the clouds.
Not the hebrews.Even the greeks beleived that the gods lived on Mt. Olympus, and that the sky was held the sky on his shoulders.
Do you have any evidence to back up your claim that the hebrews definately did not refer to the clouds as the heavens (and hell as a place deep within the Earth) like everybody else?
Originally posted by lord xyz
The top of Mt. Olympus, which is in the clouds.Do you have any evidence to back up your claim that the hebrews definately did not refer to the clouds as the heavens (and hell as a place deep within the Earth) like everybody else?
Oh, and not everyone even had a hevan or hell in their respective religions.
And Mt. olympus: Among the clouds, not the clouds themselves.
And as I think about there may have been refrences that would lead people to believe that heaven is among the clouds, however that is under the english translation, and would need to be referenced back to the original hebrew... but the point still stands either way that the sky itself is not heaven.
And even at that, there had to be a point of refrence that the humans could understand.
As far as we know heaven may not even be on this plane of existance, or in another galaxy, or even be in or be another universe. But the Jews would have written it as if it were among the clouds just because that's how humanity thinks, especially at that time when space was not thought of in terms such as it is today.
I can, however honestly say that there is no point when God himself stated that heaven is in the sky. Now, even if the Jews infered that heaven was litterally among the clouds would have come from the simple need for the scriptures to be understandable to the people of that time.
Originally posted by THE JLRTENJAC
(If you don't accept biblical sources it will take alittle longer.
Couric: I'm just going to ask you one more time - not to belabor the point. Specific examples in his 26 years of pushing for more regulation.
Palin: I'll try to find you some and I'll bring them to you.