Gladiator vs Wonder Woman

Originally posted by kgkg
It has the have Marvel Universe imprint.

What if's , Marvel Adventure , Zombies , Ultimate etc are none canon imprints

Originally posted by chomperx9
still don't get why you cant use them as evidence.

If you use evidence in a good feat kind of way than low feat would also be allowed and there are lots of stupid "low" feats for many characters in what ifs etc which contradicts with 616 universe.

Wonder Woman Curbstomp, faster, stronger and more durable

She moved 1/3 of the freaking Earth

Originally posted by quanchi112
It is about matchups. WW might be able to hang with someone out of her league, but that still doesn't change the fact she can't hang with Superman.

Glads beat Hyperion. Glads is capable of beating Thor.

and Supes is much stronger and faster then Glad is

Black Bolt was going toe to toe with a full confidence Gladiator in War of the Kings

Diana curbstomps Glads

Gladiator rapes.

Gladiator gets raped, Diana moved one third of the entire Earth

1 hit from WW, and Gladiator is in the after life

WW moved the Earth with 2 other people, that does not mean they each moved equal parts...

Also Gladiator crushed planets with his fists how he is les strong?
Plus if Dianna was capable of moving i/3 of the earth she wouldn't have problems with Azrael's ship.

Wonder Woman.

Gladiator and easily

Originally posted by Xzpunisher
Black Bolt was going toe to toe with a full confidence Gladiator in War of the Kings

You say that like Black Bolt isn't a bad ass mother ****er.

He is.

Gladiator in a stomp. We now have wonder Woman as KMCs poster girl.

heh. okay, i'll be your huckleberry. 🙂

Originally posted by Enyalus

Striking power would be, yes, three-shotting a world. Also nearly beheading Classic Wonder Man with a punch, and since you actually read comics I don't need to tell you about his durability. 🙂

first, that 'world' was of an unquantified size. so, who knows how big it really was. either way, i'm sure it was pretty big, but breaking a body the size of mercury or smaller isn't nearly as impressive as breaking something earth-size or even larger. so that feat doesn't really say much. as far as wonderman--that was his best feat, imo. but he never ko'd wonderman using multiple shots. he simply drove him into the earth. and wonderman's lack of speed and skill are notorious. that wouldn't happen in this fight.

i'm not even really arguing the point. let's say he CAN hit harder. he CAN'T hit harder than the likes of superman or cap marvel, neither of whom have ever one-shotted her. hell superman's punch while they were in space--without holding back--wasn't enough to keep her down. even assuming he can hit harder, the difference isn't enough to matter in this.

Strength would include easily moving an asteroid large enough to block starlanes and lifting/moving a moon-size starship almost faster than Thor could see. If you don't go solely by on panel feats, he said he's powerful enough to move planets from their orbit, his fight with Supreme could have destroyed the entire Solar System they were so equal, his fight with Hyperion said each had 'planet pulverizing force', and LT's assistants said he could crush stars with his bare hands.

yeah, but we DO use on panel. 🙂 and on panel, none of the things he's done in battle would indicate that level. destroying a planet in battle with another near-herald leveller isn't that meaningful. herc and thor in an arm wrestle (silly as it is, it was on panel heh) threatened to do the same thing. as you know. 😄

Solo feats for WW that come anywhere close?

solo feats are hard to come by. i'm sure you're aware of the spectre feat, of the holding the earth feat. it's hard to determine what she contributed in those cases, but the allusion is/was clear--she may not be as strong as supes, but she is certainly in that class. both of those are planetary level feats. and again, even assuming glads IS stronger, the difference isn't so great that it would give him an overwhelming edge. no more than it's given cap marvel an overwhelming edge.

Pushed Supes when? She gets her ass kicked solidly every time going against Kal. She'd do nearly so poorly against Glads.

the best example is sacrifice of course. but during that battle it could be said she held back the whole time while kal was trying to kill her. glads is NOT superman.

In the last issue of Nova he got hit in the back by a Nova Centurion's gravinemetic (**** the spelling tonight) blast, and all he said was "Ow." He's pretty consistantly at a high level. And when he isn't, its usually PIS.

but he has been beaten down with physical force, and she wouldn't have to ko him with physical power. she could unquestionably harm him with force, but she could use her tiara if she had too, and even her lasso can be used as an offensive weapon, akin to a whip. her own durability has allowed her to take bolts from the skyfather zeus, dozens of hits from zoom, strikes from a bloodlusted superman. again, even if he has the higher level high end feat, his other feats clearly indicate he is not that far above her. not enough that she can't hurt him--badly.

Might go to Glads? No. It does go to Glads. Use more declaratives in your posts. 😛 And reaction times, etc? Glads was fast enough to bullrush a Thor who was moving at relativistic speeds via tech amp. After being exhausted from hours of hyperspace travel under his own power.

no way it clearly goes to glads. she has entered the speed force on her own and this feat is enormously impressive:

http://www.picamatic.com/view/1228691_WW194-2/

multiple lightspeed attacks and she deflects them all and does so for a couple panels. she's raced flash, DEFEATED zoom (after taking a beating and multiple hits, even saying that zoom hits harder than SUPERMAN!) her ability to react to attacks is perhaps her strongest suit. speed is at least a wash. combat speed feats go to her, though again, the edge isn't enough to be overwhelming.

Skill is probably about equal, but Gladiator has been Praetor of the Imperial Guard for 400+ years. Lotta wars and battles during that time.

nah. in this area she's in batman's class. he's a solid warrior, no doubt. but in this she has the far better feats.

At full capacity she'd never touch him.

😂

seriously?? she's kept up with flash in certain instances. gone superluminal, reacted to light speed attacks. in speed strength and durability she is superman-lite. below him, but not THAT far below him. if she can defeat a white martian 1on1, figure out how to tag ZOOM, she will certainly 'touch' gladiator.

unfortunately, he'll be touched with the lasso, at which point the battle is over.

http://www.picamatic.com/show/2008/10/23/12/36/1228385_600x921.jpg

(replace martian with mohawk) 😄

this battle is still a pick em' imo.

Typical level Glads wins but he has to work very hard for it.

Glads running at PC supes level would beat WW 8-9/10.

Originally posted by Xzpunisher
Gladiator gets raped, Diana moved one third of the entire Earth

1 hit from WW, and Gladiator is in the after life

She wouldn't one-shot Gladiator

Good to see that with Fangirl leaving, there's somebody else bothering to throughoutly back Wonder Woman. 🙂

Originally posted by Philosophía
Good to see that with Fangirl leaving, there's somebody else bothering to throughoutly back Wonder Woman. 🙂

meh. i like her. i think she's being underrated here, and eny is a good, fair debating partner.

and i'm bored. 😄

Originally posted by leonidas
first, that 'world' was of an unquantified size. so, who knows how big it really was. either way, i'm sure it was pretty big, but breaking a body the size of mercury or smaller isn't nearly as impressive as breaking something earth-size or even larger. so that feat doesn't really say much.

Go ahead and assume it was Mercury-sized. He still destroyed it in three hits from a standing position (zero momentum, meaning it was entirely his strength at work and nothing else), which is far superior to any striking power displayed by Wonder Woman. Leagues above it, in fact.

Originally posted by leonidas
as far as wonderman--that was his best feat, imo. but he never ko'd wonderman using multiple shots. he simply drove him into the earth. and wonderman's lack of speed and skill are notorious. that wouldn't happen in this fight.

Ah, and then there's one-shotting Vulcan out of the fight (and using another one to KO him.) Vulcan's a team wrecker who easily solo'd the X-Men and then solo'd the Imperial Guard. Vulcan gets underrated a lot here. Which is why I'm pointing that particular thing out.

Originally posted by leonidas
i'm not even really arguing the point. let's say he CAN hit harder. he CAN'T hit harder than the likes of superman or cap marvel, neither of whom have ever one-shotted her. hell superman's punch while they were in space--without holding back--wasn't enough to keep her down. even assuming he can hit harder, the difference isn't enough to matter in this.

Originally posted by leonidas
yeah, but we DO use on panel. 🙂 and on panel, none of the things he's done in battle would indicate that level. destroying a planet in battle with another near-herald leveller isn't that meaningful.

Originally posted by leonidas
solo feats are hard to come by. i'm sure you're aware of the spectre feat, of the holding the earth feat. it's hard to determine what she contributed in those cases, but the allusion is/was clear--she may not be as strong as supes, but she is certainly in that class.

The Spectre example is even worse. "Eternity" isn't a weight in the first place. And she had help from not only Supes again, but GL.

Originally posted by leonidas
and again, even assuming glads IS stronger, the difference isn't so great that it would give him an overwhelming edge. no more than it's given cap marvel an overwhelming edge.

By feats, Gladiator has higher striking power. By feats, Gladiator is stronger. And by feats is what you want to go by, so...of course they'd make a difference.

Originally posted by leonidas
the best example is sacrifice of course. but during that battle it could be said she held back the whole time while kal was trying to kill her. glads is NOT superman.

Superman also thought he was fighting Doomsday. And DD fights entirely different than Diana does. Had he known he was fighting Diana, he clearly would've taken a different approach.

Even so, he broke her arm with ease once he got a hold of her. Gladiator may or may not be as strong as Supes, but he's in that class. Unlike Diana.

Originally posted by leonidas
but he has been beaten down with physical force,[/qiuote]
...So has she. So has Supes, for that matter. This has to do with what?

[QUOTE=11839119]Originally posted by leonidas
and she wouldn't have to ko him with physical power. she could unquestionably harm him with force,

Originally posted by leonidas
dozens of hits from zoom,

Originally posted by leonidas
no way it clearly goes to glads. she has entered the speed force on her own and this feat is enormously impressive:

http://www.picamatic.com/view/1228691_WW194-2/

How fast do you have to go in order to enter the Speed Force? I heard two answers: Light speed. And then another answer was 'Infinite Speed.' If its the latter, its PIS. If its the former, good for her...that means Gladiator is only 100x faster than her.

Originally posted by leonidas
multiple lightspeed attacks and she deflects them all and does so for a couple panels.

Originally posted by leonidas
she's raced flash,DEFEATED zoom (after taking a beating and multiple hits, even saying that zoom hits harder than SUPERMAN!)

And tagging Zoom with her lasso was PIS. Hal Jordan's also done it. And its PIS for him, too. We're not going to argue that he can do such a thing on a regular basis, are we?

Originally posted by leonidas
her ability to react to attacks is perhaps her strongest suit. speed is at least a wash. combat speed feats go to her, though again, the edge isn't enough to be overwhelming.

Originally posted by leonidas
nah. in this area she's in batman's class. he's a solid warrior, no doubt. but in this she has the far better feats.

Originally posted by leonidas
seriously?? she's kept up with flash in certain instances. gone superluminal

Originally posted by leonidas
no way it clearly goes to glads. she has entered the speed force on her own and this feat is enormously impressive:

http://www.picamatic.com/view/1228691_WW194-2/

multiple lightspeed attacks and she deflects them all and does so for a couple panels. she's raced flash, DEFEATED zoom (after taking a beating and multiple hits, even saying that zoom hits harder than SUPERMAN!) her ability to react to attacks is perhaps her strongest suit. speed is at least a wash. combat speed feats go to her, though again, the edge isn't enough to be overwhelming.

nice. now let's see . . .

Originally posted by Enyalus

Go ahead and assume it was Mercury-sized. He still destroyed it in three hits from a standing position (zero momentum, meaning it was entirely his strength at work and nothing else), which is far superior to any striking power displayed by Wonder Woman. Leagues above it, in fact.

even assuming you're correct, the point is moot since he's not ko'ing her with a single shot, which means she'd have a chance to reply and inflict damage of her own. again, if colossus and hulk can rough him up, she certainly could do so. even black bolt gave him a match in the physical department.

I was referring to before that, when Glads bullrushed him and punched him once. Simon remarked that he barely was able to roll with it in time, and if he hadn't, it would have taken his head right off. Hell of shot.

all well and good, but if WM could roll and react to a blitz from him, clearly she would be able to do the same, only far more effectively.

Ah, and then there's one-shotting Vulcan out of the fight (and using another one to KO him.) Vulcan's a team wrecker who easily solo'd the X-Men and then solo'd the Imperial Guard. Vulcan gets underrated a lot here. Which is why I'm pointing that particular thing out.

i happen to like vulcan a lot and haven't seen that. i'd be interested in seeing that scan if you've got it.

I never argued he could one-shot Diana. And of course superior striking power makes a difference. It's why Supes constantly beats her.

that's just it--where has superman categorically defeated her? gotten the better of? had the upperhand? i'll grant that, but she's only a notch below him. there's even a scan (i'd need to search for it) that says that, while she was on a rampage, superman himself was the only being capable of physically restraining her.

He's already destroyed a planet in three shots while depressed and conflicted. Which means he'd be much weaker than when he's confident. Its not a stretch at all to say he could destroy a planet with one blow. No other herald-leveler needed.

meh. i'd argue the reverse of that. the planet can't move or fight back. and he was enraged. i'm sure he was pretty confident he could take that pile of rock.

Yeah, not buying it. Especially the Earth feat. Superman has proven capable of moving it himself with assistance from a GL harness, so WW and J'onn helping out means nothing. They could've contributed 1/3rd of the power that takes, or they could've contributed 5%. Besides that, pulling something isn't an accurate measure of strength. You ever see the Met-Rx World's Strongest Man competition? They've got guys pulling 52 ft. long semi trucks for 30 ft. Could they lift that semi-truck? Hell no.

the spectre one was the more impressive. at least there is mention of her as being one the mightiest beings in the multiverse. but i already said finding solo strength feats were difficult. her best strength feats are her battles.

Captain Marvel's fighting skill is ridiculously poor compared to either Gladiator or WW. It's why she can hang with Captain Marvel, and why she beats Lobo. Both of whom are stronger than her.

ha! i was going to mention lobo. still, her skill is certainly an asset, but she is pretty damn close in the strength department. since her strength was granted by gaea, she has been said to be STRONGER than hercules himself. that would make her stronger than marvel as well . . . stronger than marvel would mean she is pretty damn close to superman and neck-and-neck with the likes of glads.

By feats, Gladiator has higher striking power. By feats, Gladiator is stronger. And by feats is what you want to go by, so...of course they'd make a difference.

agreed. just not such a difference that her skills and weapons couldn't account for it. 😉

Superman also thought he was fighting Doomsday. And DD fights entirely different than Diana does. Had he known he was fighting Diana, he clearly would've taken a different approach.

different from punching her from the sun to the earth? 😑

i don't much care for that particular argument. requires too much supposition. he wanted to kill. he was cutting loose. he wasn't in the mood for strategy. can't see it would have made much difference if he knew who she really was. 😬

and at the end, when she sliced his throat, she could have lassoed him right there and been done with it.

Even so, he broke her arm with ease once he got a hold of her. Gladiator may or may not be as strong as Supes, but he's in that class. Unlike Diana.

again, she doesn't have to be to win this. she's close enough.

Sure, I wasn't questioning her ability to harm him. I'm stating that via striking power and a more versatile powerset, Gladiator would harm her far worse.

but she doesn't really need to do more than just stun him and take advantage of the opening. were she without the lasso and this a slugfest, i would agree with your 8/10. tactically she's brilliant and the lasso is a huge advantage for her since it means she does not HAVE to ko him. he does. she only needs to be able to deflect his beams, react to his attack, find an opening and finish it with the rope. he;d have hell trying to ko her when an enraged superman couldn't do it and again, all she needs is one opening and he's tied up and done.

Didn't Zoom hit her like, 4 times...knocking her across entire continents with each shot.

depends i guess on how you view the scans. their is one scan where it seems he's hitting her multiple times at once. he beat down an amazon and hit her 200x. it always seemed to me he hit her . . . a LOT.

And she looked like hell afterwards. Not the best to bring up, considering he was hitting her at light speed and Gladiator starts off far stronger than Zoom plus can bullrush to punch her at near or at those speeds.

glads has never blitzed at those speeds. simon reacted. even recently lilandra has time to ask him to stop while he was attacking. he knocked thor's hammer but that could hardly be said to have been at light speed or anywhere near. any on panel blitz he's tried she could match and react to.

How fast do you have to go in order to enter the Speed Force? I heard two answers: Light speed. And then another answer was 'Infinite Speed.' If its the latter, its PIS. If its the former, good for her...that means Gladiator is only 100x faster than her.

here i think i may have spoken too quickly. the SF barrier can be breached only at superluminal speeds. once inside the SF itself, there is apparently no limit to the speed that can be accessed. diana chased jesse to the barrier's edge, which would be c, as opposed to ftl, which i may have said. regardless, c would be plenty fast enough to deal with his blitz.

If you're referring to the Shattered God feat, there's no proof whatsoever that those pieces were going light speed.

well . . . it was light, coming from multiple directions at once.

And tagging Zoom with her lasso was PIS. Hal Jordan's also done it. And its PIS for him, too. We're not going to argue that he can do such a thing on a regular basis, are we?

why not? she's captured faux flash with it. tagged evil flash with a knee to the groin WHILE he was blitzing her. she took part in a search of the earth for white martians, along with superman and flash. she is fast enough to be invisible for a prolonged length of time. she can deflect laser fire with ease, has been shown on multiple occasions keeping up with or racing flashes . . . why pis when she has a lengthy history of speed feats?

http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ww212blindvsjla19qx.jpg

http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ww212blindvsjla25js.jpg

http://img24.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ww212blindvsjla30pe.jpg

http://img237.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ww212blindvsjla40wv.jpg

Granted.

👆

Glads has mastered every combat form (didn't specify unarmed or armed) in the Shi'ar Imperium...which spans multiple galaxies. He's got centuries of combat experience, just like her. They're about even, to be generous.

remove his powers and there is no way you can prove he's one of the most skilled fighters in marvel. without her powers diana is in batman's league in combat.

again, to be clear--i can really see this going either way. glads is at a disadvantage because he needs to ko her, and she does not ko easily--asked enraged superman, ask zeus, or ares. her strength (which is said to be greater than hercules, hence greater than marvel's) and speed (lightspeed, though neither her NOR glads have ever been shown to attack at those speeds--she can at least approach them in reactions, as can he no doubt) are close enough to him to allow her skills and weapons to make up the difference, not to mention the aegis she can summon and i've completely neglected the godwave which, while unlikely in most situations, IS still a weapon in her arsenal were she convinced the situation warranted it. all she'd need to do is cross her bracers and pray, at which point, with the power of the full pantheon of greek gods flowing through her, he'd be proper f*cked.

she only needs a tiny opening to tie him up, while he needs to work hard to avoid giving that opening, overcoming her skill AND ko'ing her.