Originally posted by Gideon
I've already acknowledged Darth Revan's superiority in terms of the spectrum of techniques that he is likely to know. And yet that still doesn't guarentee him victory, unless you can prove that Revan is more powerful than he is.
I didn't say it guaranteed him victory but based on the fact that Revan is indeed the superior tactician, regardless of Starkiller's battle with Kota, and the fact that his overall mastery of the force and broad spectrum of techniques exceed those of Starkiller, it's more likely than not. In a saber duel it would be much difference, especially since Revan is an unknown.
Originally posted by Gideon
Darth Revan was something of a scholar, Starkiller was not. Despite his more limited techniques, however, he has demonstrated feats well in excess of Revan's own.- He dominated General Rahm Kota in combat, an experienced and seasoned Jedi Master who was capable of casually reflecting Sith lightning, deflecting telekinesis, and even partially deflecting Starkiller's Force grip. Kota was also, by the way, revered as a tactical genius.
- He dominated and killed Kazdan Paratus, whom Vader initially considered to be "far more powerful" than Starkiller. Paratus, by himself, was capable of "destroying legions of Confederacy droids," creating an entire replica of the Jedi Temple, and creating and empowering a vast droid army through the Force.
- He, from the novelization, stood against Shaak Ti, a Jedi revered for her incredible lightsaber skills, despite the fact that she also manipulated the mind of a native Sarlaac (one of the largest in the galaxy) to aid her in her battle against Starkiller. Granted, the novelization depicts that she nearly killed him due to superior lightsaber.
- He gripped an Imperial-class Star Destroyer, turned it around, lifted it up, and then tugged the entire thing down on an Imperial ore cannon.
- He battled through armies of Force empowered droids and militant Force empowered Felucians.
- He immobilized an AT-AT with Force lightning and then shoved it over with the Force.
- He defeats Darth Vader in single combat.
- Becoming one with the Force, he destroys the Emperor's observation tower and leaves a megafugging dent in the Death Star.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
I didn't say it guaranteed him victory but based on the fact that Revan is indeed the superior tactician, regardless of Starkiller's battle with Kota,
Erm, what? You cite Revan's superior abilities as a tactition as a reason for why you believe he'd emerge victorious and yet disregard the fact that General Kota was also considered a "military genius"? That's not going to fly.
and the fact that his overall mastery of the force and broad spectrum of techniques exceed those of Starkiller,
Can you substantiate it? List some of the great Force techniques that Darth Revan is known to possess?
The fact of the matter remains that while he may be more knowledgeable than Starkiller, nothing suggests that his power is greater.
it's more likely than not. In a saber duel it would be much difference, especially since Revan is an unknown.
He's a virtual unknown in both. It can be safely assumed that his knowledge exceeds Starkiller. But that's it.
@ MY, it is in the novel, during the raid on the Death Star.
Originally posted by Gideon
Erm, what? You cite Revan's superior abilities as a tactition as a reason for why you believe he'd emerge victorious and yet disregard the fact that General Kota was also considered a "military genius"? That's not going to fly.
Can you substantiate it? List some of the great Force techniques that Darth Revan is known to possess?
The fact of the matter remains that while he may be more knowledgeable than Starkiller, nothing suggests that his power is greater.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
We've seen Revan's military genius. What have we seen from Kota besides the fact that he was called a "military genius"? Try being a military genius with an exceptional command of both sides of the force.
General Kota had been raiding Imperial targets for months and quickly took control over one of the Empire's "most critical shipyards."
An impressive accolade given that the Empire is far more dangerous and well equipped than any and all of Revan's foes. Combined.
Revan plundered Korriban and Malachor V. Listing the techniques is irrelevant. His knowledge and command of the force is shown to be greater than Starkiller's.
Yes, but you haven't proven how that is going to make a difference against a foe who, by all accounts, has demonstrated superior power compared to Revan.
Nothing suggests the opposite either.
What are Darth Revan's most impressive feats in regards to combat? Traya drains three Jedi Masters and kills them simultaneously. Darth Nihilus can rip an interdictor out of a gravity well and drain a planet. Darth Sion is semi-invincible. Those are some KotOR Sith Lords whom we do have working knowledge of their feats and abilities. Name something that can contend with Starkiller manipulating an Imperial-class Star Destroyer, defeating opponents who have demonstrated remarkable prowess with the Force, including Darth Vader, managing to 'defeat' Palpatine himself (though, granted, his priority was to convert Starkiller), and unleashing the Force in such a manner that he put a tremendous dent in a planetoid space station.
However, since he has more mastery of the force and a broader spectrum of techniques, there's little going for Starkiller here.
There's quite a bit going for him, actually.
Originally posted by Gideon
General Kota had been raiding Imperial targets for months and quickly took control over one of the Empire's "most critical shipyards."An impressive accolade given that the Empire is far more dangerous and well equipped than any and all of Revan's foes. Combined.
Yes, but you haven't proven how that is going to make a difference against a foe who, by all accounts, has demonstrated superior power compared to Revan.
Originally posted by Darth Sexy
It's not but we're providing examples of force mastery. Obviously it won't. But I fail to see what Starkiller could do to Revan.
Maybe crush him with huge objects, blast him with force lightning, force throw him, and all the other things he did to his other foes. Galen has shown far more raw power than Revan, and also has a lot of control over it.
My question is what would Revan do to Galen?
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Maybe crush him with huge objects, blast him with force lightning, force throw him, and all the other things he did to his other foes. Galen has shown far more raw power than Revan, and also has a lot of control over it.My question is what would Revan do to Galen?
Revan was able to master force storm, which if I recall is much more potent then force lightning.
Then he went on to defeat Malak while he was empowered by the dark side.
Malak even said his former master (revan) was always powerful in the force.
During the mandalorian wars Revan fought mandalore the ultimate and defeated him in one on one combat, and they were wearing beskar armor wich is lightsaber resistant.
First, understand that there is only one Force Storm. And that would be the one conjured by Palpatine. The KotOR 'Force storm' is a more potent version of Sith lightning; not a separate attack. It was merely used to fit the game's level functions.
Understand that Starkiller has demonstrated remarkable potency in his Sith lightning, capable of immobilizing AT-AT walkers and overloading tremendous cannons.
Second, Starkiller defeated Darth Vader. And then held off Palpatine. More impressive, in my opinion, than beating any version of Darth Malak.
Third, no one is denying that Revan's powerful. But he might not be as powerful as Starkiller.
Fourth, see all those uber-Jedi whom Starkiller defeated. Not impressed with his scuffle with Mandalore.
Originally posted by Gideon
First, understand that there is only one Force Storm. And that would be the one conjured by Palpatine. The KotOR 'Force storm' is a more potent version of Sith lightning; not a separate attack. It was merely used to fit the game's level functions.
Ok i concede the force storm point but you did specify that his was more powerful
[/B][/QUOTE] Understand that Starkiller has demonstrated remarkable potency in his Sith lightning, capable of immobilizing AT-AT walkers and overloading tremendous cannons. [/B][/QUOTE]
In the game starkiller never fought an AT-AT he only fought AT-STs, but he also did fight Rancors
[/B][/QUOTE]
Second, Starkiller defeated Darth Vader. And then held off Palpatine. More impressive, in my opinion, than beating any version of Darth Malak.[/B][/QUOTE]
Starkiller knew his enemy very well, however Revan might have known Malak very well before he fought him, but in the time of the fight he knew very little of Malak.
the fight Sidious I got the felling that sidious was only teasing him, and then acting defeated, yes starkiller held off sidious but it ultimately claimed his life.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Fourth, see all those uber-Jedi whom Starkiller defeated. Not impressed with his scuffle with Mandalore. [/B][/QUOTE]
Karen Traviss would disagree ( 😘 )
When you talk to canderous about the battle of malicore V he talks about how many Jedi died trying to stop the madaloirians in that final battle, and we are talking about their leader the most powerful of the the mandalorians.
first: i have issue with anyone who says revan "mastered" force storm. There is no proof backing up what he did or did not master in KOTOR. THat was up to the choice of the user.
Second: Karen Traviss is Satan.
Third: Mandalore still couldn't use the force when he fought Revan, So revan held an insurmountable advantage right from the start.