The Presence against The Heart of the Infinite

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes,and in that story the real person chose to represent himself. He doesnt exist in the marvel u only in tha story because he chose to exist in that story because he is real while the ff 4 arent.

TOAA is the writer and he can interact with the fictional universe if he or she chooses to do so.

TOAA is not the writer, he is the fictional representation of the writer: a fictional avatar. The writer/artist is the one that draws TOAA, TOAA itself is just a fictional avatar.

You don't seem to know the definition of fiction. If I draw myself interacting with fictional characters, that interaction that I'm drawing only takes place in fiction, the interaction is purely fictional.

The moment I draw something within and about a fictional universe all I'm doing is drawing fiction. As the writer I'm outside of fiction but anything I draw is fiction, as it's all made up. So TOAA is purely fiction, the writer doesn't actually interact with those characters, he is only drawing someone drawing characters.

The character that is the "artist" and the characters that he is "drawing" are both pure fiction.

Originally posted by Mr Master

Still below the avatars of the writers.

In principal and in scope.

Because the avatar of the writers gives the drawing called the Presence meaning,
they speak for the Presence, they make the Presence look how they wish,
they make the Presence do what they wish,
everything/anything of significance concerning the Presence,
is based on the whim of the Writer.

See the difference?

There's no difference. The avatar is merely the made up representation of the writer. The avatar TOAA is just a made up fictional element, no different from the Presence in concept.

The real artists aren't actually in the fiction, they can't actually be on panel since they are the ones drawing everything on panel. Everything on panel is merely what the actual artist/writer made up.

Even a movie about a real life event is just a fictionalized depiction of what happened. Unless you have footage of the real life historical event, everything else is just fictionalized. You people have problems with the definition of fiction.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I was talking about Marvel.

Way ta go on the complete fallacious interpretation concerning the HOTI.

And after I just posted the proof no less. 🙂

So, your unsupported opinion > Marvel Comics ... nice.

THOTI is what TOAA would be withIN a Marvel comic book story.

The contents within a Marvel comic book,
the story and the characters,
are all created by TOAA.

TOAA placed its authority withIN the Marvel comic book story called "The End: Marvel."
That authority withIN the Marvel comic gives you power over all things within the comic.

Why?

Because that's TOAA's status as writer/artist of whatever is taking place in the comic,
power over all things within it.

That's it, that's the story.

The only difference is,
instead of Thanos being given a pencil and drawing board,
which would be dumb for us to enjoy,
Thanos was given a power source called THOTI,
which basically made Thanos what TOAA is:

And WHAT is TOAA?

The Author of the comic book, the WRITER/Artists.

Thanos says:

"Eternity, you must sense that [B]Everything the Almighty was I now am,

did you ever dare demand anything from Him"

Eternity responds,

"No, but" .... (Eternity is actually acknowledging that Thanos speaks the truth)

..................................................................................................

"And I, like He was, am now the Author of All That Will Be ...

my Will is Supreme ...

I will not demand worship, as my predecessor expected"

..................................................................................................

"How dare these cretins defy their Supreme Being?

Was I not Now the End-All and Be-All of Reality?

Their very existence was by My Whim"

...............................................................................

"Everything the Almighty was I now am"

And I, like He was, am now the Author of All That Will Be

"the End-All and Be-All of Reality"

srugdoped

And?

Who said otherwise?

Still below the avatars of the writers.

In principal and in scope.

Because the avatar of the writers gives the drawing called the Presence meaning,
they speak for the Presence, they make the Presence look how they wish,
they make the Presence do what they wish,
everything/anything of significance concerning the Presence,
is based on the whim of the Writer.

See the difference? [/B]

That post, and the one before it proving Thanos' omnipresence, were beautiful. Thanos was clearly all-powerful and all-being. He erased the entire MU, including every abstract and the LT, at his whim. And then recreated it all. On panel. That's >> anything The Presence has done on panel, and yet some people still want to b*tch?

Thanos w/HOTI = The Presence. Get over it.

Originally posted by Enyalus
That post, and the one before it proving Thanos' omnipresence, were beautiful. Thanos was clearly all-powerful and all-being. He erased the entire MU, including every abstract and the LT, at his whim. And then recreated it all. On panel. That's >> anything The Presence has done on panel, and yet some people still want to b*tch?

Thanos w/HOTI = The Presence. Get over it.

Number two, The presence ate heaven and swallowed the arc angel michael who literally is the power of God. So the presence literally ate something just like the heart for dinner.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I was talking about Marvel.

Now name me a single character who is above The Presence, in DC.
Just one will do me justice.

Originally posted by Mr Master

Way ta go on the complete fallacious interpretation concerning the HOTI.

And after I just posted the proof no less. 🙂

Originally posted by Mr Master

And WHAT is TOAA?

The Author of the comic book, the WRITER/Artists.

You see, the difference between TOAA and The Presence is that The Presence has NO avatar. Because how would you depict the real world GOD in a comic, if It is omnipresent?
DC borrowed the principle from the Judeo-Christian belief, that God is eternal, has no form or shape, and exists everywhere in everything. And no other being/object is greater than The Presence in DC, similar to the GOD that Christians worship to.

It's really simple.
Over at DC, Presence is the last stop.

Over at marvel TOAA is the last stop.

THOTU is below TOAA. At all times. Always. All this real world crap is just that. TOAA is a fictional name for Marvel's Supreme Being.

The Presence is the Fictional name for DC's supreme being.

Both are supreme. Anyone who is under them in any aspect is not supreme.

Thanos had alot of power. But he wasn't onicient. He wasn't all knowing. He wasn't even Omnipresent. If he were, then he'd have know where death and warlock were. They escaped him. so um yeah. there you go.

Originally posted by Enyalus
That post, and the one before it proving Thanos' omnipresence, were beautiful. Thanos was clearly all-powerful and all-being. He erased the entire MU, including every abstract and the LT, at his whim. And then recreated it all. On panel. That's >> anything The Presence has done on panel, and yet some people still want to b*tch?

Thanos w/HOTI = The Presence. Get over it.

The Presence is more than HOTI conceptually. Within his own universe he was never created, never subject to be used by something else, he is his entire universe. Conceptually The Presence>> HOTI. When the concept of the character is that it's its entire universe, you don't need feats, you're all that is a universe.

When you're the one that created everything in your universe (which is the ultimate feat by itself). The Presence birthed the DCU fiction and is the fulcrum of it's existence down to every character, nothing in the DCU can exist without his influence. The Presence is the perpetual God of the DCU, feats just don't apply to him.

And Mr Master has said that plenty of characters in Marvel have purportedly ended existence like Thanos did with THOTI.

Originally posted by fangirl101
That's the dummest crap i've read so far. Thanos wasn't all knowing. thus he wasn't TOAA. That's number one.

Number one: the "dumbest" crap I've read is any one of your posts. Did I ever say he was All-Knowng? Anywhere? Point it out. You've been told before that he wasn't TOAA. Repeatedly. Your argument that "lulz he wasn't toaa so he wasnt supreme" is bullshit, too, when his bio says he was the Supreme Being, Eternity recognizes he's replaced TOAA as the Almighty, and Thanos talks about him replacing the previous Almighty. No where does anyone - Mr. Master, myself, or the comics, say that Thanos is TOAA. He does replace him as Supreme Being, though, and that makes him equal to The Presence's power.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Number two, The presence ate heaven and swallowed the arc angel michael who literally is the power of God. So the presence literally ate something just like the heart for dinner.

Number two, eating Heaven does not equal eating the entire Marvel Universe. If The Presence literally ate the entire DCU at once, you'd have a case. But since he doesn't, you don't.

Secondly, what kind of crap is saying, "he ate Michael who is Gods power thats impressive lulz"? The Presence is God. If he wanted to, he can depower Michael at any time, with ease. It's his freakin' power he swallowed. Big deal. You get no points here. Your attempts have failed again.

Originally posted by Enyalus

Number one: the "dumbest" crap I've read is any one of your posts. Did I ever say he was All-Knowng? Anywhere? Point it out. You've been told before that he wasn't TOAA. Repeatedly. Your argument that "lulz he wasn't toaa so he wasnt supreme" is bullshit, too, when his bio says he was the Supreme Being, Eternity recognizes he's replaced TOAA as the Almighty, and Thanos talks about him replacing the previous Almighty. No where does anyone - Mr. Master, myself, or the comics, say that Thanos is TOAA. He does replace him as Supreme Being, though, and that makes him equal to The Presence's power.

Number two, eating Heaven does not equal eating the entire Marvel Universe. If The Presence literally ate the entire DCU at once, you'd have a case. But since he doesn't, you don't.

Secondly, what kind of crap is saying, "he ate Michael who is Gods power thats impressive lulz"? The Presence is God. If he wanted to, he can depower Michael at any time, with ease. It's his freakin' power he swallowed. Big deal. You get no points here. Your attempts have failed again. [/B]

Originally posted by fangirl101

Number two, The presence ate heaven and swallowed the arc angel michael who literally is the power of God. So the presence literally ate something just like the heart for dinner.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer
What proof?
The scans and explanations are so vague.
It is an energy of physical and metaphysical [insert noun here]

Lemme make it simple: HOTI was the source of ALL energy (power) in the Marvel Universe (omniverse). HOTI gave Thanos infinite power. HOTI made Thanos one with the omniverse (omnipresent) and yet above it (as he destroys it, yet still has the same power.) Clear as day.

Originally posted by fangirl101
THOTU is below TOAA. At all times. Always.

Stop lying. You're wrong. THOTU replaces TOAA as the MU's Supreme Being. Proven on panel. Stop lying.

Originally posted by fangirl101
The Presence is the Fictional name for DC's supreme being.

Both are supreme. Anyone who is under them in any aspect is not supreme.

Stop lying. You're wrong. THOTU was Marvel's Supreme Being. Marvel said so. Your opinion means nothing. You have no power to tell Marvel who their Supreme Being is and is not. Thanos became God over the MU. Proven on panel. Stop lying.

Originally posted by fangirl101
He wasn't even Omnipresent.

Stop lying. You're wrong. Thanos was one with the MU. Thanos was bonded to the omniverse. Thanos became everything and yet existed outside of it. Thanos was omnipresent. Proven on panel. Stop lying.

Originally posted by Allankles
The Presence is more than HOTI conceptually. Within his own universe he was never created, never subject to be used by something else, he is his entire universe. Conceptually The Presence>> HOTI. When the concept of the character is that it's its entire universe, you don't need feats, you're all that is a universe.

Find me one quote saying the HOTI is a created object. HOTI is the source of all power in the MU. Period. And Thanos bonded with it became the entire omniverse, just like you're saying with regard to The Presence. So no, they are equal.

Originally posted by Allankles
When you're the one that created everything in your universe (which is the ultimate feat by itself). The Presence birthed the DCU fiction and is the fulcrum of it's existence down to every character, nothing in the DCU can exist without his influence. The Presence is the perpetual God of the DCU, feats just don't apply to him.

That's nice. But Thanos w/ HOTI also created the entire MU, along with every character - abstract, skyfather, and otherwise. And before that, he destroyed all of it. Thanos states "their existence was at my whim."

Originally posted by Allankles
And Mr Master has said that plenty of characters in Marvel have purportedly ended existence like Thanos did with THOTI.

No, he didn't. No one else has destroyed the entire MU and recreated it from nothing. No one.

Originally posted by fangirl101
He didn't depower Michael nor did he depower the spectre. it's evident he just literally pwned them both.

Michael is powered by The Presence. The Spectre is powered by The Presence. He defeated two beings that he's responsible for giving his power to. WOW WHAT A FEAT!!!!

Originally posted by fangirl101
Michael's power sustains the DCU. the Presence swallowed him whole.

If Michael's power sustains the DCU then he's the Supreme Being. Michael has no power. Michael is God's power. God is The Presence. The Presence ate his own power. Congrats. WOW WHAT A FEAT!!!!

Originally posted by fangirl101
And what kind of dumb ass statement that eating heaven is less than eating the dcu is that? heaven>>>>>>>>>The DCU.

Heaven is a part of the DCU. Otherwise it wouldn't be featured in the stories. Like Hal visiting there. Or angels coming and going. Heaven is one aspect of the DCU. Congrats, he ate a portion of the DCU and that apparently is ">>>>>>>>>>" the whole DCU.

Originally posted by fangirl101
He says he made it all. he can destroy and create as he wishes.

That begs for proof, considering he's never done it. And Thanos has. So by feats, HOTI > The Presence.

Originally posted by Allankles
TOAA is not the writer, he is the fictional representation of the writer: a fictional avatar. The writer/artist is the one that draws TOAA, TOAA itself is just a fictional avatar.

You don't seem to know the definition of fiction. If I draw myself interacting with fictional characters, that interaction that I'm drawing only takes place in fiction, the interaction is purely fictional.

The moment I draw something within and about a fictional universe all I'm doing is drawing fiction. As the writer I'm outside of fiction but anything I draw is fiction, as it's all made up. So TOAA is purely fiction, the writer doesn't actually interact with those characters, he is only drawing someone drawing characters.

The character that is the "artist" and the characters that he is "drawing" are both pure fiction.

Originally posted by fangirl101
No you fail. He didn't depower Michael nor did he depower the spectre. it's evident he just literally pwned them both. Michael's power sustains the DCU. the Presence swallowed him whole. And what kind of dumb ass statement that eating heaven is less than eating the dcu is that? heaven>>>>>>>>>The DCU. He says he made it all. he can destroy and create as he wishes.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer
That was how The Spectre perceived The Presence, but not the actual form of The Presence.
Thus The Presence says "You can't begin to conceive what I am."

Originally posted by Enyalus

No, he didn't. No one else has destroyed the entire MU and recreated it from nothing. No one.

I thought that's what Mr Master told me earlier in this thread. He also talked about different levels of "omnipotence" in Marvel.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Lemme make it simple: HOTI was the source of ALL energy (power) in the Marvel Universe (omniverse). HOTI gave Thanos infinite power. HOTI made Thanos one with the omniverse (omnipresent) and yet above it (as he destroys it, yet still has the same power.) Clear as day.

Stop lying. You're wrong. THOTU replaces TOAA as the MU's Supreme Being. Proven on panel. Stop lying.

[/b]

Stop lying. You're wrong. THOTU was Marvel's Supreme Being. Marvel said so. Your opinion means nothing. You have no power to tell Marvel who their Supreme Being is and is not. Thanos became God over the MU. Proven on panel. Stop lying.

Stop lying. You're wrong. Thanos was one with the MU. Thanos was bonded to the omniverse. Thanos became everything and yet existed outside of it. Thanos was omnipresent. Proven on panel. Stop lying.

[/b]

Find me one quote saying the HOTI is a created object. HOTI is the source of all power in the MU. Period. And Thanos bonded with it became the entire omniverse, just like you're saying with regard to The Presence. So no, they are equal.

[/b]

That's nice. But Thanos w/ HOTI also created the entire MU, along with every character - abstract, skyfather, and otherwise. And before that, he destroyed all of it. Thanos states "their existence was at my whim."

No, he didn't. No one else has destroyed the entire MU and recreated it from nothing. No one.

[/b]

Michael is powered by The Presence. The Spectre is powered by The Presence. He defeated two beings that he's responsible for giving his power to. WOW WHAT A FEAT!!!!

[/b]

If Michael's power sustains the DCU then he's the Supreme Being. Michael has no power. Michael is God's power. God is The Presence. The Presence ate his own power. Congrats. WOW WHAT A FEAT!!!!

[/b]

Heaven is a part of the DCU. Otherwise it wouldn't be featured in the stories. Like Hal visiting there. Or angels coming and going. Heaven is one aspect of the DCU. Congrats, he ate a portion of the DCU and that apparently is ">>>>>>>>>>" the whole DCU.

That begs for proof, considering he's never done it. And Thanos has. So by feats, HOTI > The Presence. [/B]

Originally posted by quanchi112
The point is that the character doesnt exist in the story itself and that he only chose to represent himself in that story. TOAA is the writer.

And my point is that reprenstation is fictional, no more real than if I wrote or drew myself drawing another character. The image I draw isn't really doing the drawing, so he is only a fictional representation of myself. Key word here being fictional, because it's all made up.

Fiction:

a. An imaginative creation or a pretense that does not represent actuality but has been invented.
b. The act of inventing such a creation or pretense.

The drawing itself is just an invention of the imagination, a fictional avatar like TOAA. TOAA is not the writer, merely a fictional avatar of said writer.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer

We are talking about The Presence, which belongs in DC.
Please do not enforce the Marvel cosmic hierarchy on DC's.

Again, in Marvel,
there are several characters that were exactly what the Presence is in DC.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer

Now name me a single character who is above The Presence, in DC.
Just one will do me justice.

Next.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer

What proof?
The scans and explanations are so vague.
It is an energy of physical and metaphysical [insert noun here]

It's as clear as can be.

Nice try on the fallacy.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer

I disagree.
TOAA is NOT the writers/artists.
It is merely an avatar of the writers/artists.

Originally posted by occultdestroyer

You see, the difference between TOAA and The Presence is that The Presence has NO avatar. Because how would you depict the real world GOD in a comic, if It is omnipresent?
DC borrowed the principle from the Judeo-Christian belief, that God is eternal, has no form or shape, and exists everywhere in everything. And no other being/object is greater than The Presence in DC, similar to the GOD that Christians worship to.

Please show me in what Bible does it state Lucifer, 🤨 or Michael 😂 is God's son?

Since when is Michael and Luficer more relevant than Jesus?

Get this out of here dogs.

TOAA creates cats like the Presence in Marvel.
The Infinity being is a good example amongst others.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I could care less about DC's cosmology.

Again, in Marvel,
there are several characters that were exactly what the Presence is in DC.

Why should I, when I never said there was one?

Next.

False.

It's as clear as can be.

Nice try on the fallacy.

That's what I said, so next.

DC borrowed the principal, and then raped it.

Please show me in what Bible does it state Lucifer, 🤨 or Michael 😂 is God's son?

Since when is Michael and Luficer more relevant than Jesus?

Get this out of here dogs.

TOAA creates cats like the Presence in Marvel.
The Infinity being is a good example amongst others.

Originally posted by Allankles

The Presence is more than HOTI conceptually. Within his own universe he was never created, never subject to be used by something else, he is his entire universe.

So the Infinity being or others beneath the HOTI = the Presence?

Same shit

"Within his own universe he was never created,
never subject to be used by something else,
he is his entire universe."

THOTI >>>> Infinity being.

Originally posted by Allankles

Conceptually The Presence>> HOTI. When the concept of the character is that it's its entire universe, you don't need feats, you're all that is a universe.

"I was Everything ... bonded to Omni-Reality"

"I was everything"

I know, let's continue to spin this around to mean something less. 🙄

Originally posted by Allankles

When you're the one that created everything in your universe (which is the ultimate feat by itself). The Presence birthed the DCU fiction and is the fulcrum of it's existence down to every character

sarcasticclap

Originally posted by Allankles

nothing in the DCU can exist without his influence.

Without them, there would be no existence.

And?

Originally posted by Allankles

The Presence is the perpetual God of the DCU, feats just don't apply to him.

Originally posted by Allankles

And Mr Master has said that plenty of characters in Marvel have purportedly ended existence like Thanos did with THOTI.

Originally posted by fangirl101

? thanos couldn't even find warlock?

Thanos erased all existence/reality/creation.

Warlock is that special Marvel character that's outside the influence of time/space,
so when Thanos absorbed all of time/space, Warlock was left out,
since he's disconnected from the Marvel Universe' life-force.

Death survived, because Warlock survived,
so long as there is life, there is Death.
(her realm is also outside of Actuality)

Also, it makes sense that Thanos would sub-consciously overlook Death,
because of his never ending love for her, after all, that's how Starlin ended the story,
by giving Thanos what he always wanted, Mistress Death's acknowledgement.

Originally posted by fangirl101

TOAA is a fictional character. the supreme being of marvel.

Originally posted by fangirl101

bringing real writers and artist into the equation goes against forum rules of summonion.

Tell it to Marvel,
who have depicted TOAA
as the creators of the same Marvel comics we (actually I/us, not you) read.
To then be published in the real world: 😬

Obviously a fictional illustrated representation of real people.

I've always maintained that TOAA is a fictional representative of the real world writers,
I have never said that the drawing of TOAA is a real person.

Nice try on yet again trying to lie your way into the truth.