League of Champions Semi-Finals: #2 Digi Vs. #3 Leo/Scoob

Digi Post #5

Originally posted by Scoobless
Hey, not been available much over the weekend, I'll make this a response only post and add newer stuff next time.

Np, good to see you. I'm glad leo isn't floundering on his own. Now you guys can flounder together.

😉

Originally posted by Scoobless
Midnighter's abilities aren't mental, they are a strange combination of genetic manipulation and technological implants. As you no longer have MN on your team you don't have the tech as that stuff doesn't carry from one match to the next

I specified in the match where I assimilated MN'er that it included assimilating his implants. Minion is just as adept at assimilating tech, having assimilated an automated robot (the original Death's Head) as well as the database of Reed Richards' computer.

Should he not have Death's Head's skills because it's a machine, even when he clearly encases his entire personality? Same applies to MN'er.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Even if you could recreate MN's tech parts, they wouldn't register us due to Mr Terrific's abilities.

Once again, Minion's a cyborg. I could see you just fine. Out of only one eye, perhaps, but it's more than enough to see you. Not to mention BK's ability to see past any and all deceptions (scans in earlier posts).

Originally posted by Scoobless
Bit of a large stretch to say that a simple electrical stunner is equivalent to a meta human with poorly defined electrical powers.

A bit, perhaps. But no more a stretch than ignoring the vulnerability, and the fact that I can exploit it.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Havok absorbs cosmic radiation, Firehawk has some heat based radioactive output (which you jump to the conclusion makes her a mini star)

I won't play semantics between cosmic and solar radiation. Fact is, a sun's energy amps Havok. Firehawk's powers work exactly like a sun's, with a nuclear reaction to create her heat powers. End of story. And I have Havok at his peak for the entire fight (all kinds of scans showed earlier).

Originally posted by Scoobless
Has no plane as vehicles aren't permitted in the league (which is why Fangirl couldn't use the batplane)

Judges, you can go ahead and ignore any mention of Moon Knight's plane.

Actually no, they can't. The plane falls under the "transportation vehicles are allowed" ruling, which I checked with delph. Though Scoob's ruling is actually what banned BK's winged pegasus, which I'm not using, because it can fight for itself.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Which half(s)?

The half that's not robot?

srug

Look at any scan of him that I've shown, or just glance at my signature. One eye is robotic, the other human. He was made from a human base.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Regardless, Mr Terrific renders us invisible to your tech/targeting and Spiral renders us invisible to your organics (if he even has organic eyes)

BK's ability to see through illusions doesn't see to fit, we're not casting illusions, we're just invisible.

So Minion can still see you with half of himself, no one else on my team uses tech to see. And techincally, after the amalgamations, he's far more human than robot.

And when did I say BK only sees through illusions? The scans specifically showed him seeing through any deception....anything from a physical illusion to a verbal lie. Don't make things up.

So you argue that this bio-chem memory is a soul, then you transform Minion into one of the Marvels (which, as shown with your Superman scans, does cause the body to transform into a regular Marvel, regardless of who has been co-opted by Freeman & Co)

Originally posted by Scoobless
This means that you are no longer a cyborg, therefore you don't have the bio-chem memories of anyone, which means you lose the captured "souls", which means you lose the power of Shazam (and possibly get smited for your effort) and you end up back as base Minion with zero stored minds (including his regular ones form pre-tourney)

That's a lot of baseless speculation. Got anything to back it up except shoddy logic?

Btw, did Billy "lose" Superman's consciousness when he co-opted his body? Yeah, didn't think so. Kinda shoots your theory to hell.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Starktech means we can easily use his heat absorption tech:

http://img386.imageshack.us/my.php?image=absorptionnovablastpx8.jpg

Basically, whatever heat gets through our shielding is only going to make us more powerful, thanks.

Yet another piece of tech you expect us to believe that you'd build?!

But Havok's powers aren't heat, so it's a moot scan. Firehawk's powers are, but she's just the amp, not the actual offense. Havok's powers are close, but not the same: he super-heats subatomic particles that take the form of plasma in his attacks. So unless Tony has a scan of absorbing omni-directional plasma (And that scan is a directed attack, btw) it means nothing.

Also, you can't say this about many energy wielders at this level, but Havok's best blasts >>>>> Johnny's Nova Blast. And he's amped. He's just that good, and every scan I've shown displays that.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Well ... Techno is a computer ... so .... (I don't know where else to go with that)

Which still doesn't make you Flash. MNer thinks like a computer, and my reflexes are faster than yours (KK, Marvels, etc.). Do you see me saying I could build nukes in mere minutes? Super-computers are impressive, and I'm sure he operates like one. But it still means you're builing about a dozen pieces of ridiculously high-tech machinery, some in configurations they've never been in before and meshed with foreign tech. In 4 minutes.

We did away with a lot of prep to avoid stupid plans like these, judges. They continue to try to squeeze it through, however, because they know they're boned otherwise. A few items, perhaps, but not likely. All of them? Lulz.

Originally posted by Scoobless
By "keep up" are you referring to the part where Flash stood perfectly still and let himself get sucker-punched?

It's a comic. They're always perfectly still.

😛

Aside from that, I fail to see what you're referring to. They were both battling the whole time, no one else on the Legion could touch him, and KK tagged a Flash multiple times.

PC feats are valid for KK, and he's still that fast. So I'm not sure what else to say. Reinterpreting a scan only works if it corroborates your opinion.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Aurora (same way we got Jeffries powers ... which you already conceded)

I happily conceded Jeffries because it was shown on-panel as Techno having access to his power set (which, judges, doesn't give him Madison's experience with it nor his feats). You have yet to prove the same for Aurora, or ANYONE besides Jeffries.

So judges, maybe those powers are there. Hell, maybe Silver Surfer's are too. So let's just assume that Scoob and leo are right, instead of making them justify their plan with evidence.

🙄

Originally posted by Scoobless
We have the minds of a few experts in nano-technology ... size isn't an issue.

Maybe it isn't for you. But I assure you, size always matters.

😎

Digi Post #6

Originally posted by leonidas
kane DL'ing multiple powers in mad-battle:

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/3051/dl2ht6.jpg

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8481/dl1ld4.jpg

Sub-zero gas and some strength? Cool. I'll happily add them to your powers. Which does nothing toward any of the 5-6 that you haven't proven.

By your partner's admission, you have Aurora, which lets you do your silliness in prep (4 minutes is still just 4 minutes, though, even to a speedster). Without proof of that you have...what, exactly? You're back to square 1, having to average about 1 piece of insanely intricate tech every 10 seconds in a non-speedster body, most times without any of the proper materials, and not knowing how to splice together Stark Tech, Forge Tech, Kang Tech, etc. etc. into these mythical T-spheres that do everything but make coffee.

You've passionately debated against far less ridiculous plans than these, leo. Don't be surprised when you fall on your face with it.

Btw, sub-zero gas gives me an opportunity to post this:
http://img119.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cmj2kg0.jpg
or this:
http://img142.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vswerewolf4ey1.jpg

Heh.

Originally posted by leonidas
so now he knows we have it, so he says experience is a problem.

I'll concede what you prove, happily so. The rest (i.e. the vast majority of the plan) is still BS, however.

And yes, experience is a massive problem. Your scans were Jeffries high-end feats. As before, it would be like giving me or you Magneto's power set and then using his best showings to argue what we'd be capable of. It's dur-worthy, at best.

Originally posted by leonidas
for techno, schematics=tech
http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/876/10schematicsun8.jpg

Tell me, where's the schematics for building a black hole bomb into a t-sphere? That particular gem is so ridiculous as to make me laugh. Or at least I would if you weren't serious about it. The bomb itself is many times larger than a t-sphere. And you don't have the materials for it. How the HELL does that get made in 4 minutes?

Originally posted by leonidas
speaking of . . . that scan we showed of A RECORDING summoning the power of shazam, speaks once again to the importance of SPEAKING the word. now everyone needs to understand what digi is doing. he's absorbing the souls of the marvel's then saying shazam--ONE TIME--and expecting to get all the powers of EACH MARVEL. but it has been stated over and over in comics, on websites and in handbooks that for each to gain the power, [b]EACH must SPEAK the name.

http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=voicesm4.jpg

(since digi used kingdom come in our first match, thought i'd continue--there are other continuity scans, but it is common knowledge the word must be SPOKEN for the power to be called)

clearly (as our scan shows irrefutably) it is FREDDY'S VOICE that is of primary importance. the recording played FREDDY'S VOICE, the lightning came and struck FREDDY'S body.

so, with that in mind, i once again ask--how does MINION'S VOICE summon the power of all 3? what proof is there that ONE lightning bolt would be enough to empower all THREE beings inside digi? and if ONE lightning bolt isn't enough, how it is that when a SECOND lightning bolt is summoned by the next marvel to say shazam, that the FIRST power isn't removed?

he seems to want to say all 3 speak at once in his mind and WITH MINION'S VOICE, and with one bolt all THREE get their full power. proof?? or he might be saying that each subsequent bolt is somehow different and thus would NOT negate the previously summoned power. again, proof?

over and over it has been shown that if they can't SPEAK THE WORD, they can't GET THE POWER.[/B]

First, I never used Kingdom Come scans, in this or any other match.

Second, because that scan you used IS from KC, an entirely different universe, it's not canon to the versions I'm using, and is worthless.

Third, Superman's voice called down the power in the scan I showed earlier. It doesn't need to be their particular voice, they just need to be present in the body. That lone fact shoots your idea to sh*t. Perhaps the power can be called down in multiple ways. I don't know for sure. But I do know that my scans show everything I'm claiming, without exception.

Originally posted by leonidas
oh, and since we can do it--robogod for the hell of it, will search through his databases (blessed multitasking) to see if he can find a recording of freddy's or mary's voice then BROADCAST it as loudly as he can . . . heh it's possible the t-spheres (via the checkmate database) would HAVE these recordings, as batman did. if we find a recording, he even more screwed than he ALREADY is.

A throwaway suggestion, yes? No one will believe this or take it seriously. It's not even worth refuting.

Originally posted by leonidas
it demonstates processing speeds. i love how when you had him it was used to show reaction speed though . . .

heh. digi's own words.

I used this scan for reaction times:
http://img176.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imreaction1sr7.jpg
Not this one:
http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/8977/impico1ty3.jpg
...which is all I was saying. The latter isn't reaction times, it's a processing thing while analyzing a signal.

Even the former is a moot point, though. You didn't build Extremis, you don't have the Extremis virus in you...the two things that constitute his reactions times. So yeah, I had those reactions when I had Tony in his Extremis armor. You most certainly DON'T when all you have is his technical knowledge.

Originally posted by leonidas
wow . . . that will do . . . nothing at all. we are all shielded and we are 0.5km away. you'd have to find us first then shoot. we are shielded and have ludicrously fast computer reflexes.

Computer reflexes so, what, you can analyze the gigantic blast as it comes toward you?

You don't have Aurora. Bye-bye flight, physical reaction time, and speed. You're entirely vulnerable to Havok's blasts. Once again:
http://img143.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nexus2vr0.jpg
or
http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j105/Rewmac/Scans/Havok/xfactor_v1_101_12_rougher.jpg
But really more like this:
http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan0001hj0.jpg
http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan0002tc1.jpg
http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan0003wl8.jpg
http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scan0004df3.jpg

*Also, judges, I have yet to see a scan of anyone on their team surviving any kind of high-powered offense. None whatsoever. You'd think they'd use a little but more than idle hype to provide defense against me.

Speaking of defense, I might as well show mine so that I'm not a hypocrite:

Minion's insane durability before the Marvel upgrade:
http://img361.imageshack.us/my.php?image=h1xu6.jpg
http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=h2ap1.jpg
http://img361.imageshack.us/my.php?image=h3xa4.jpg
http://img178.imageshack.us/my.php?image=h4tj8.jpg
http://img178.imageshack.us/my.php?image=h5in7.jpg
So, he can survive gigantic nukes unharmed before his upgrade.

Originally posted by leonidas
i know, that's like your favourite thing to say. but, who cares? in general, planet's don't have you completely out-planned and usually don't fight back.

Planet's are also usually harder to destroy than a bunch of would-be techno-gods. I could pound the ground and throw up mountains of sand and earth against you, then fly underground, come up in the middle of your team and either punch you all to oblivion, stab you to death, thunderclap you into space (or just throw you there), and all of your precious gadgets would be worthless.

Notes

- They haven't proved half of what they said they would, including the part about T-spheres being able to target or hit someone with my speed, or their team having physical reflexes near mine. In the time it would take for the t-spheres to cover the distance between us in order to attack, I can kill them 10 times over. Teleport? Cool, it just puts them closer to my anti-metal and energy fields.

- No clue why they're hammering a single scan home about Minion like it proves anything. One odd scan vs. mountains of evidence. They grasp at straws, and ignore my proof, while I show and tell you exactly why I'm right....which sounds like this match, actually.

You've passionately debated against far less ridiculous plans than these, leo. Don't be surprised when you fall on your face with it.

that first part is true. THIS plan however is nothing CLOSE to ridiculous and i'd actually be quite surprised if it fell on its face. you keeping harping on meshing tech, but it's all just TECH. and t-spheres are EASILY adaptable. this one becomes a friggin wormhole! creating a stable hole in spacetime so he can broadcast signals into the past and future>creating a microscopic singularity . . .

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb260/DarkCrawler90/JSA6013.jpg

as for precision--they can create precisely the kind of grid we need. they are commanded, they perform. s'all we need:

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb260/DarkCrawler90/Tourney/24lasergrid.jpg

it's getting a bit tedious going over this again and again. so, last time: we have shown ON-PANEL PROOF of all major components of this plan:

can we create instant tech? yes. can we create things we've never seen if we have schematics in our minds? yes.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p68/DCHawks_photo/AlphaFlight36-14.jpg

http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight57-15.jpg

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/AlphaFlight16-08.jpg

"HE CHANGES THE MATERIALS' FORM AND FUNCTION"--and he had no idea what he was doing with his powers yet! that was near his first appearance.

and of course, techno can do the same thing:

http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/876/10schematicsun8.jpg

do we have access to ludicrous processing speeds and the ability to multitask? yes.

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9686/29multitaskfb4.jpg

attending 24 monitors WHILE performing 14 000 operations. and you think we CAN'T do what we've set out to do??

are the t-spheres easily adaptable and can they be reconfigured? yes (shown above)

do we have 5 of the greatest minds in comics to work on solving any tech-meshing problems? yes (kang, stark, terrific, fixer, forge)

can each of those minds (stored in techno's hard-drive) work at super-computer speeds? yes.

so, what is ridiculous is the fact that digi is actually postulating (DESPERATELY BEGGING YOU TO BELIEVE) that those 5 minds, given all their knowledge, experience and access to the BEST TECH IMAGINEABLE and herald-level transmutation, would have trouble meshing together tech that each of them knows intimately! and digi says WE are underestimating MINION! c'mon . . .

he harps on the 4mins. ask yourself how many calculations and permutations a super-computer could run through in 4mins. look at that 4mins from FORGE'S perspective. relatively it would be HOURS or even DAYS in length. again, not tournament-speak, but FACT. that's not us manipulating time at all. that's just how many things he could accomplish IN that 4mins span.

he harps on experience--we've ALREADY USED JEFFERIES' POWERS IN PREVIOUS MATCHES!

and please--let's not overlook the irony here: who is digi relying on to pull his "no-plan-making" fat out of the fire? MIDNIGHTER. and HOW does he propose MN accomplishes this miracle? by running through all possible scenarios the INSTANT he arrives on the battlefield, sorting through all possible options and choosing the best one. and he wants you (and us) to believe he can do all that BEFORE THE T-SPHERES TARGET AND DEPOWER HIM.

beyond that, perhaps even MORE ironic is the fact that while he says WE'LL have trouble meshing OUR tech, he wants you to blithely accept that DHII and MN can easily and without difficulty mesh tech MADE SPECIFICALLY FOR MN's GENETIC STRUCTURE!

heh. good one, digi. 😄

one more point of irony (and because i don't want anyone thinking we're letting digi's plan go scot-free . . .): for whatever reason, digi (despite everything we've shown) STILL seems to say we have provided no proof for our plan. but . . . take a look at HIS proof for HIS "marvel plan". NEARLY EVERY SCAN SHOWS BILLY! billy, who has:

(a) far more power than any other marvel
(b) far more EXPERIENCE with his power than any other marvel
(c) better demonstrated CONTROL with his power (BILLY is the one who SHARES HIS POWER). there is precisely zero evidence to suggest that feddy or mary or whoever the other one is, could replicate billy's feats. and the power is still SHARED! for all of his 'cap marvel power', he would likely have only a fraction of it at most anyway . . .

and while i'm on the subject--you never answered my main point which revolved around how you summon all 3 marvel powers by calling shazam only once. or do you call it out 3 times? if so, explain how each successive bolt doesn't negate the previously gained power, or prove the lightning bolts are actually different and so would NOT negate the previously gained power. please. 🙂

A throwaway suggestion, yes?

not at all, actually. freddy and mary have been in the spotlight for a number of years. it is in no way at all illogical to say they would have been filmed and recorded many times, on TV or internet, or in sessions with their various groups. not something i can definitively prove, but certainly nowhere near an illogical supposition. if we find a recording, we could easily broadcast it in EXACTLY the same way batman did. you'd have exactly zero defense against it.

as far as OUR defense:

adaptive shielding:

http://img520.imageshack.us/my.php?image=shieldiv4.jpg

in the event you are wondering, that was thor, quasar, iron man, captain marvel, the presence, jack of hearts and starlight (among others) who were trying to penetrate the shielding--simultaneously. we've seen an enraged thor hammering away PHYSICALLY on the shielding as well. nothing you can do will get through it. add to that kimura's indestructible skin, kane's OWN ability to ABSORB KINETIC ENERGY, stark's tech to absorb heat and if deadpool is illegal, we can always call down WOLVERINE'S HEALING FACTOR in mid-battle.

there are many other scans showing the power of kang's forcefields. if any judge needs more proof, just chime in and ask. 🙂

bottomline: we're AT THE VERY LEAST as durable as you are--far more so if you remove your marvel powers.

onto something different--in his last post digi said he had a counter for jefferies powerset, but . . . the counter was mysteriously absent from his post . . . 😖hifty:

why?--he HAS no counter for jefferies power. even if you somehow believe he can find us physically, blitz ALL OF OUR T-SPHERES (WHICH ARE SURROUNDING HIM AT A DISTANCE OF 0.5KM) get through ALL 6 FORCEFIELDS and destroy ALL OF THEM BEFORE THE SPHERES CAN SIMPLY TARGET AND SHOOT HIM (and if you believe that, i'll really need that explained . . .) we can still simply teleport, use our OWN speed and senses (spiral made a mockery a speedster in the scan i showed earlier)

http://img460.imageshack.us/my.php?image=senses1co9.jpg

http://img522.imageshack.us/my.php?image=senses2dm9.jpg

to get ahead of him and rip him apart with jefferies power.

digi is in a death trap with no escape and even if he does he can never touch us (teleportation+shields+various other powers) and we can STILL rip him apart.

Computer reflexes so, what, you can analyze the gigantic blast as it comes toward you?

no, so we can THINK about and therefore ACHIEVE teleportation. we think at near-lightspeed, remember?

You don't have Aurora. Bye-bye flight, physical reaction time, and speed.

first, we've already USED her powers in previous matches, but regardless--spiral ON HER OWN has laughed at a speedster. her power would ensure you NEVER hit us, and our shields would ensure that even if you did, it wouldn't mean a thing.

oh, and for crying out loud--WE CAST A POWER REVERSAL SPELL IN PREP

havok blasts us and . . . is ko'd. 😐

http://img357.imageshack.us/img357/4041/phoenixkoaf2.jpg

http://img120.imageshack.us/my.php?image=powerreverse1xg7.jpg

NOTE: angie is no longer IMMUNE to her own abilities once they've been returned at her. she can't absorb them or control them. havok is ko'd by his own power! 😂 and that would apply to his anti-metal pulse as well! how would minion do against the anti-metal pulse . . .?

then fly underground,

i know, i said that in the opening. but we track you at near lightspeed--you move at mach 10 and not until you've figured out what's happening and where we are. do the math. you're dead before you figure things out or i teleport the spheres to you and THEN they depower you.

and he wants to throw sand at us, punch us and stab us. he ko's himself. we still have a 2000' kang and a guy that scares GLs.

you really are screwed. seriously judges--he's f'd.

Digi Post #7

Phew! Getting there, kids. Leo, what do you say we call this at maybe 9 posts a piece? I'm tired as sin (though enjoying myself nonetheless). At this pace, you'd still get the last post, since we've been trading off but I went first.

Originally posted by leonidas
this one becomes a friggin wormhole! creating a stable hole in spacetime so he can broadcast signals into the past and future>creating a microscopic singularity

With Atom's help, and undoubtedly days worth of time. And also not what you need. Yes, leo, you have the brains and resources to eventually figure out how to splice together all the different things you claim. You even amped your thought speed a little bit. My issue was never, and still isn't, that you could eventually pull it off. But it's 4 minutes.

Let's take your scan here, the one you need to convince the judges that he can perform things so fast that you can actually do some of this:
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9686/29multitaskfb4.jpg
Multi-tasking, no doubt. It uses the term "24 different view screens." But what's a view screen? To me, it seems like he's viewing 24 things at once. Impressive, but it's a far cry from 24 separate mental operations. A far cry.

If they knew exactly what they were doing from the start, they might have a chance. But Kang isn't meshed with Techno, so he doesn't have mental schematics. Furthermore, and more importantly, they have to figure out how to get about 4 separate techs to work together inside a tiny t-sphere. The black hole bomb alone is larger than a t-sphere, so it's physically impossible for that to work. Physically impossible. The rest is just as suspect.

Originally posted by leonidas
as for precision--they can create precisely the kind of grid we need. they are commanded, they perform. s'all we need:

Pointless. You can't get them to me until well after I attack, it takes time for them to get coordinated, and I could pinpoint each one and destroy it with ANY of my team before that happens.

Or Havok could melt them instantly as soon as they're anywhere near him. Or the anti-metal could disintegrate them as soon as you're close.

Still waiting on that "tracks them at lightspeed" scan, btw. Seriously, are t-spheres analogous to Flash? I doubt I'm alone in my scepticism.

Originally posted by leonidas
and please--let's not overlook the irony here: who is digi relying on to pull his "no-plan-making" fat out of the fire? MIDNIGHTER. and HOW does he propose MN accomplishes this miracle? by running through all possible scenarios the INSTANT he arrives on the battlefield, sorting through all possible options and choosing the best one. and he wants you (and us) to believe he can do all that BEFORE THE T-SPHERES TARGET AND DEPOWER HIM.

That's exactly what MN'er does, dude. He runs millions of combat scenarios a second. You want to talk about processing times, picoseconds, and reactions? I just put a dude who can think of something every millionth of a second inside a body that can throw mountains, with the reaction speeds near Flash. He'd think of thousands of tactics in the opening picoseconds that I haven't thought of in this days-long battle with you. He's that good.

Originally posted by leonidas
beyond that, perhaps even MORE ironic is the fact that while he says WE'LL have trouble meshing OUR tech, he wants you to blithely accept that DHII and MN can easily and without difficulty mesh tech MADE SPECIFICALLY FOR MN's GENETIC STRUCTURE!

Yes, just like he fully assimilated all skills without difficulty from a being who was entirely technology-based (Death's Head).

Also, try not to make things up about Authority. I'm not the guy for that. Mner isn't the only guy with tech implants in Wildstorm. They aren't specific to his DNA, nor is there ever any mention of that. I can't post evidence, because the evidence is that there IS no evidence to prove that.

Originally posted by leonidas
one more point of irony (and because i don't want anyone thinking we're letting digi's plan go scot-free . . .)

I'd be disappointed if you did.

Originally posted by leonidas
for whatever reason, digi (despite everything we've shown) STILL seems to say we have provided no proof for our plan. but . . . take a look at HIS proof for HIS "marvel plan". NEARLY EVERY SCAN SHOWS BILLY!

Yeah, so what? Really, explain to me why the hell this matters. Because I'm happy to cover legit gripes, but this is just an f-ing reach. Billy's power is from the same source as Mary and Freddy. And him using his powers in a different body isn't an experience feat, it's a capability feat for the power, to prove that it's not dependent on the host body.

Sometimes judges will doubt a plan simply because it's been attacked for so long that there must be something amiss, right? Only if the arguments work. Please judge these on their merit (or lack thereof) not because they keep harping on it. I'll post the evidence again in a second.

But if you understand everything I've shown, you'll believe my plan without question. These are the same gripes that have been brought up and shot down before. Judges, don't buy the bull.

Originally posted by leonidas
and while i'm on the subject--you never answered my main point which revolved around how you summon all 3 marvel powers by calling shazam only once. or do you call it out 3 times? if so, explain how each successive bolt doesn't negate the previously gained power, or prove the lightning bolts are actually different and so would NOT negate the previously gained power. please.

Gladly. They all have different call words:
Freddy: Cpt. Marvel
Mary: Shazam
Osiris: Black Adam
...so there's no conundrum there.

And unlike your non-canon KC scan, not all lightning turns them back:
http://img142.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cmj6or8.jpg

Originally posted by leonidas
freddy and mary have been in the spotlight for a number of years. it is in no way at all illogical to say they would have been filmed and recorded many times, on TV or internet, or in sessions with their various groups. not something i can definitively prove, but certainly nowhere near an illogical supposition.

not something i can definitively prove

i.e. baseless speculation

Moving on.

Originally posted by leonidas
adaptive shielding

Adaptive pwnage?
http://img118.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p3zz4.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p4su1.jpg
+
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y92/silicondream/Legionnaires-022-08.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y92/silicondream/Legionnaires-022-15.jpg
+
http://img254.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dh16rt9.jpg

RAWR muthaf-rs!

Originally posted by leonidas
bottomline: we're [b]AT THE VERY LEAST as durable as you are--far more so if you remove your marvel powers.[/B]

Until your shields go bye-bye. Oh, and if you want your t-spheres to do anything, they'll have the leave the forcefield, where I can then destroy them easily.

Originally posted by leonidas
onto something different--in his last post digi said he had a counter for jefferies powerset, but . . . the counter was mysteriously absent from his post . . .

Heh. I didn't say it outright, but it was there. I take you out with Havok from a distance, or as soon as you're close enough to do harm anti-metal disintegrates your body or sun-level sub-atomic plasma melts your face off.

Originally posted by leonidas
oh, and for crying out loud--WE CAST A POWER REVERSAL SPELL IN PREP

False. Point out where you mention this at all in your writeup during prep and I'll happily concede the point.

You can't make things up for your prep once debates start. It destroys the purpose of the writeup and just lets you make up whatever you need in prep time to help your team. Can I go back and add things to my team's 10 minutes? Nyet, comrade.

So no power reversal. At all. During the battle, sure. But it's a dance. By both team's account, the battle will be over before Spiral begins the first gyrations.

Notes

- He seems to have given up on Aurora and the others. Remember judges, he lost 6 out of 7 power sets that he claimed to have because of lack of evidence. And they were originally using Aurora's powers to justify their tech creation in such a fast time. And also to be able to keep up with my team, or even track them, which they sure as hell can't do. Don't let them ignore that.

- New Tactic
Remember the t-spheres vulnerability to electrical power:
http://img380.imageshack.us/my.php?image=terrificxz0.jpg

Scoob complained that I didn't have that kind of electrical output with MK's truncheon. A fair complaint. But that's not my only source of electricity.
http://img137.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc24&image=11655_capbolt_batman1.jpg
http://img142.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc24&image=3ae65_capbolt_batman2.jpg
Or if you're listening to leo and want to see less Billy, here's Osiris:
http://img225.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dc52week25008dp8.jpg

Giant magic electrical attack for the win, yo. How the hell will the t-spheres, which are vulnerable to electricity, counter THAT?! Forget the grid, forget the bombs...I can take them out whenever I want. Shazam, b*tches. Shazam.

Digi Scans-Only Post #1

i'd say 9 is fine, but scoob might want more time. if he thinks we've covered everything, then that's fine with me. anyway, onward!

and let's start with a big ole 🤨

spiral dances and turns us invisible and casts a power reversal spell over us.

someone IS tired.

havok=kotfo'd as soon as he blasts us . . .

With Atom's help,

atom was PRESENT. you have no proof he helped. and even if he did--terrific has even BETTER help this time (kang, stark, forge) round AND uber-speed thinking.

undoubtedly days worth of time

unfounded, AND we'd have a similar amount of time--relatively.

And also not what you need.

lol

no, it's far MORE complicated then what we need as it's something NEW he had to DEVELOP. everything we are doing is PRE-EXISTING and simply needs to be incorporated. again, how many operations can a supercomputer perform in 4mins? BILLIONS.

Impressive, but it's a far cry from 24 separate mental operations.

not if he's ATTENDING each monitor. our job becomes that much easier when we can create and ALTER THE FORM AND FUNCTION of whatever material we are manipulating. i really don't think he understands the extent of jefferies' transmuting powers or the brains we're using to do all this.

If they knew exactly what they were doing from the start, they might have a chance. But Kang isn't meshed with Techno so he doesn't have mental schematics

oops. again. though kang is not meshed, we DO have a copy of his MIND so yes, we DO have all the schematics we need. which is good--cuz now even digi himself says our plan has a chance to work. nwoot

The black hole bomb alone is larger than a t-sphere,

proof? it was in a missile with a SMALL warhead. the delivery system is large since it has to travel so far. the size of the equipment needed for the weapon itself? utterly unknown. and call me crazy, but i think stark and the others could pretty easily resize the sphere or the weapon . . . if not--then instead of depowered and smooshed, you're just depowered. 😄

You can't get them to me until well after I attack, it takes time for them to get coordinated, and I could pinpoint each one and destroy it with ANY of my team before that happens.

lol

no one will believe that. we programmed them in prep to surround you and fire. they are SUPERCOMPUTERS. you are giving off enough energy to wipe out a small city. they find you--INSTANTLY. then depower you.

and there are SIX of them.

they don't have to move, they don't have to cover the distance at a measly mach 10. once they depower you, you are finished. minion can't block all three beams from 3 different directions. he's screwed. there is no way to avoid it.

Or Havok could melt them instantly as soon as they're anywhere near him. Or the anti-metal could disintegrate them as soon as you're close.

he's even slower than minion! judges, havok truly is useless in this (not as useless as MK, but ALMOST . . .) he can't react to being depowered, and even if he DOES attack us, his own power ko's him!

Still waiting on that "tracks them at lightspeed" scan, btw. Seriously, are t-spheres analogous to Flash?

they don't have to be flash. they just have to be supercomputers capable of tracking a STATIONARY target. stark-tech can analyze in PICOSECONDS. that's all the spheres need to do. analyze the surrounding and find you. then they fire. it would happen in tiny fractions of a second! and if you move, they just need to track a ridiculously slow (by computer standards) MACH 10!

That's exactly what MN'er does, dude. He runs millions of combat scenarios a second.

disregard all MN'er stuuf. even if dhII COULD assimilate TECH, digi, BY RULES OF THE TOURNAMENT, can NOT. so while you could have had MN's tech/abilities while he was meshed, you must RECREATE SAID TECH to use it here.

you didn't. ergo, anything he is trying to accomplish with MN=FAILZZZ! :thumbdown:

guess there won't be any deux ex machina around to pull your fat out of the fire afterall . . . heh

Yeah, so what? Really, explain to me why the hell this matters.

but billy has a larger SHARE of the power. that COULD change things. and what about MIXING the powers? what proof is there that the egyptian powers and the shazam powers could exist simultaneously?? beyond that, what proof is there that they could actually AMPLIFY each other?? the powers are OPPOSITE, they come from VASTLY different sources, but you want to merge them and call it a day, like it's at all clear what would happen if you did!? it seems as likely to me that the 2 powers would simlpy cancel each other out!

i know he WANTS you to think he has all his bases covered, but he really has surprisingly little proof that osiris/freddy/mary could all use their powers simultaneously in one being. ESPECIALLY in light of the fact that BILLY possesses the largest portion of that power AND has demonstrated the most USE of it.

Gladly. They all have different call words:
Freddy: Cpt. Marvel
Mary: Shazam
Osiris: Black Adam
...so there's no conundrum there.

so you don't think someone with shazam's powers calling out "BLACK ADAM" is a possible conundrum or conflict? 😑 and did darkseid hold a piece of mary's soul when he gave mary back her powers??

i'm thinking shazam might think a bit differently . . .

the soul link is thin to begin with. add on all possible complications and it is a MIRACLE it made it this far. but i think this is the end. 🙂

not something i can definitively prove

can't prove peter parker can bbq a steak, but i bet he can . . . it doesn't have to be proven to be logical and viable. finding a recording of them is just one more possible offensive option in a littany of them.

Adaptive pwnage?

lol

first, it took him pages to overcome it--didn't he get beat down in his first battle with that guy . . .? second--you want to compare THAT shield to one that friggin thor, quasar, et al., couldn't penetrate???

c'mon . . .

there are adaptive shields, then there are ADAPTIVE SHIELDS. flex

Until your shields go bye-bye. Oh, and if you want your t-spheres to do anything, they'll have the leave the forcefield, where I can then destroy them easily.

each has its OWN shield and you'd not have a chance to touch them. near-lightspeed analyzing, followed by energy beam>>>>>>>>>>>mach 10. it really does boil down to that simple fact . . . 😬

Heh. I didn't say it outright, but it was there. I take you out with Havok from a distance,

you mean havok ko's himself! lol

or as soon as you're close enough to do harm anti-metal disintegrates your body or sun-level sub-atomic plasma melts your face off.

even if you COULD get close, the power reversal redirects the energy and MINION is anti-metalled!! lulz

or we just port behind you and rip you apart via jefferies powers. his 'counter' is to kill us before we USE jefferies powers. not the best counter ever . . . specially since he can't touch us!

He seems to have given up on Aurora and the others.

lol

given up? hardly--we used her powers last match. just so happens we don't NEED her speed this battle. the spheres kill you and we don't need to do anything but watch. if we NEED it, it's there, or spiral's teleportation and senses are plenty to handle your mach 10 speed . . .

And they were originally using Aurora's powers to justify their tech creation in such a fast time.

now THAT is false. we build our tech with our MIND. we have a super-computer brain. aurora's powers are nice, but completely redundant. they can't help us build faster because the power was mental. we move around the prep site via teleporting. we would use her powers in the match if it was required to move ourselves around the battlefield--it's not. nor are any of the other abilities, though kimura's invulnerability combined with wolverine's healing makes us nigh un-killable . . .

New Tactic

. . . is too slow. we've SIX spheres, surrounding you at a distance of 0.5km (what's the range of that strike . . .?) it would need to penetrate force fields as well.

lightning strike=FAILZZZ!

Forget the grid, forget the bombs...I can take them out whenever I want. Shazam, b*tches. Shazam.

at "S" you are a depowered lump.

by "SH" you are ripped into quarks and leptons and it is no longer SHAZAM you are trying to say . . . 😄

unavoidable death trap ftw!

Scoob/Leo: Post #8

Yup, our 8th post (though I would swear it only feels like our 2nd...)

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Phew! Getting there, kids. Leo, what do you say we call this at maybe 9 posts a piece? I'm tired as sin (though enjoying myself nonetheless). At this pace, you'd still get the last post, since we've been trading off but I went first.

Not agreeing to that at the moment, I know I've been absent (unavoidably) but I do still have a few things I want to add before this is finished.

________________

We have, working in unison, the minds and technologies of Tony Stark, Kang, Mr Terrific, Techno, Peacemaker, Amadeus Cho, Magik, Kane (Weapon X) Alfred Pennyworth, Maya Hansen, Spiral, Forge ... and due to our victory in the previous match, we also have access to the OMAC tech.

This is all Techno needs to move a mind from a human to a machine:

1. http://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=upload1kl7.jpg
2. http://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=upload2jl0.jpg
3. http://img392.imageshack.us/my.php?image=upload3ds5.jpg
4. http://img255.imageshack.us/my.php?image=upload4yv4.jpg
5. http://img392.imageshack.us/my.php?image=upload5ln2.jpg

So a basic cable-like connection is all we need to absorb the consciousness of every character we encounter.

Our mind back ups are completely legit (that's how Robo-Techno was born)

>>>>>>>> <<<<<<<<

This is a question of speed!
Speed of thought, speed of movement and speed of self-conversion.
This will show why we are more than capable of keeping up with,
and adapting to, any attack Digi (or anyone else) can dream up.

>>>>>>>> <<<<<<<<

First, and most basically, we downloaded (via the memories and technologies we acquired through Weapon X's Kane) the speed of Aurora, which instantly takes our basic physical motion speed to the tourney cap.

Second is the human vs machine calculating question (or even human vs machine vs extremis enhanced human interfaced into a machine)

Here's Tony's view on this issue:

http://img115.imageshack.us/my.php?image=01fastslowhs5.jpg

This is what happened when a second rate copy of Tony's consciousness took control of the armour (nothing to do with the Ultron sentient armour story arc)

1. http://img101.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast01ad3.jpg
2. http://img101.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast02gt3.jpg
3. http://img101.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast03pf5.jpg
4. http://img113.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast04vq6.jpg
5. http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast05ob1.jpg
6. http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast06bx1.jpg
7. http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fast07ic6.jpg

This basically shows that Tony's mind working without biological constraints >>>>>> regular Tony.

Applying this upgrade to the overall Techno multi-mind then multiplying the accelerated consciousness by Aurora's processing speed and even another tourney cap speedster will appear to be moving in slow motion, giving Robogod the equivalent of hours to envision and implement any attack or defence that is required for the situation.

The relatively slow human version Techno could reconfigure his tech-pac in instants:

http://img254.imageshack.us/my.php?image=human01bo6.jpg

http://img201.imageshack.us/my.php?image=human03xq0.jpg

This pack was the original basis for his robot body and has since been improved upon many times over:

1. http://img410.imageshack.us/my.php?image=26weaponscu6.jpg
2. http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=27resultqq1.jpg

Given the additional powers/resources this tourney has provided, there's virtually nothing this character cannot create in the blink of an eye.

Digi's defence against Terrifics cyber-invisibility is that one of Minion's eyes is human, no problem, a basic high intensity light flash (such as Iron Man's uni-beam or any other bright light) will easily blind that human eye ... even if Minion's healing can eventually deal with that it'll still be a prolonged period where our enemy can't detect us, giving us a virtual eternity to scan every facet of his being and use our Forge powers to come up with the perfect counter measure.

May seem like Cheap, but if your power is the ability to invent anything you can imagine, you just gotta roll with it:

1. http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hulk1wa8.jpg
2. http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hulk2fz6.jpg
3. http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hulk3cr9.jpg

Less than the space of one issue to concoct and construct a weapon to take out the Hulk ... given that he now has super-speed processing, the minds of multiple geniuses and a body that can create any device he can imagine in instants ... do you find it difficult to believe that this guy can take down a rogue cyborg that was built by a few AIM scientists?

What you have to keep in mind is that we have not only every weapon (literally) that has been invented/used by Forge, Iron Man, Techno, Kang or any of the component minds of our guys, but also any weapon they could possibly conceive of, all boosted by Forge's mutant power to be able to build any tool for any job.

In addition to this, we have access to the schematics and database for a REACH Scarab - as in "that thing that powers Blue Beetle"

1. http://img60.imageshack.us/my.php?image=01zo2.jpg
2. http://img60.imageshack.us/my.php?image=02zv0.jpg
3. http://img150.imageshack.us/my.php?image=03yv8.jpg
4. http://img101.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pm05programming2gb7.jpg

"But you don't have the Scarab" some might say, frankly, we don't need it.

Techno's body is fully capable of reforming itself in the same way the Blue Beetle armour does, all that was missing were the specs on the various REACH weapons systems, with those now taken from Peacemaker's mind we have unlocked a whole powerset of technological wonders that are on a par with Green Lanterns

http://img165.imageshack.us/my.php?image=reachlanternsfm8.jpg

"Blue Beetle never seems that powerful though"

True, simply because Jamie (the guy in the armour) constantly holds the Scarab back from going all out, in fact, the Scarab isn't supposed to hold back:

1. http://img371.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lethal1aw6.jpg

2. http://img442.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scarab1uv6.jpg
3. http://img442.imageshack.us/my.php?image=scarab2ok6.jpg

And when it doesn't, even Superman foes go down quickly:

1. http://img201.imageshack.us/my.php?image=parasite1zd6.jpg
2. http://img181.imageshack.us/my.php?image=parasite2zu6.jpg
3. http://img201.imageshack.us/my.php?image=parasite3sn9.jpg
4. http://img444.imageshack.us/my.php?image=parasite4zb2.jpg

And I'm not saying it can take out the Spectre (that would be stupid) but it isn't without a few ideas on how to try it:

1. http://img233.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spectre1rc7.jpg
2. http://img258.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spectre2vh3.jpg
3. http://img167.imageshack.us/my.php?image=spectre3eb4.jpg

"Anti-Magic bubble" ... bet that would screw with Black Knight's senses to no end ... might even depower his weapons.

The Scarab also adds nicely to our stealth plan:

http://img514.imageshack.us/my.php?image=undetectablezv3.jpg

Virtually no one on DC Earth could find Brother Eye, including a ton of uber magic users, the Scarab gives us the exact same ability.

As our basic premise in this match is our ability to adapt to various opponents, this feat is extremely relevant:

http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?image=adapt1kq0.jpg

Kryptonite on command, if a Scarab can come up with that with zero prior warning of facing a Kryptonian, imagine what it can add to Robogod when it has massively increased reaction and calculating times.... seriously ... go imagine, this post will still be here when you get back.

And, as we're sending Peacemaker in with a duplicate Scarab, we can have him invisibly tackle Minion with a move that disrupts magical powers/items ... such as BK's sword/shield:

1. http://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=magic1mf9.jpg
2. http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?image=magic2kn9.jpg

Meh, random shield scan:

http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=14tx5.jpg

So, like I said, Speed is key, even if we can't physically travel around faster than the tourney limits, we can sure as hell think and adapt ourselves faster than anyone else, we're faced with a problem, it gets scanned, solved and eliminated ... that's our power, it may not look flashy like zapping ourselves with lightning to increase our brickhood, but it's far more versatile and effective.

In our last match, where we got access to an OMAC, that gives us knowledge of this:

http://img183.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mary1zd5.jpg

So, even if Digi does convince the judges of his Minion Prime plan (again) we can simply depower him every time he comes in for a hit, or every time we wish to strike him ... effectively taking the Marvel's powers completely out of the equation.

And since everyone loves healing factors:

http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=30regenpb3.jpg

Digi Post #8

Originally posted by leonidas
someone IS tired.

havok=kotfo'd as soon as he blasts us

D'oh! Can't believe I missed the line. My apologies.

However, the latter certainly isn't true. Havok can reflect energy just as well:
http://img329.imageshack.us/my.php?image=reflectfy9.jpg

And I absorb energy with BK, remember? So it's really doing nothing except keeping the energy all over the place, thus destroying your t-spheres.

So I can play ping pong with you as long as is needed. Spells wear off, and dances and spells give me time to enact my plan, while you're busy not being fast enough to enact yours. Also, with all that energy flying about, anything you try to do with your t-spheres is moot. They will be destroyed, as the entire battlefield will be ensconced in epic amounts of energy

Originally posted by leonidas
atom was PRESENT. you have no proof he helped. and even if he did--terrific has even BETTER help this time (kang, stark, forge) round AND uber-speed thinking

unfounded, AND we'd have a similar amount of time-relatively

You'd have relative days?! 4 minutes x even the ludicrous 24 screens that may or may not help justify Techno's speeds, only equals about an hour. Though it's still figuring out how to do Reed Richards+ tech, about 5 separate times, in 4 minutes

Believe what you will, judges. I've always said I think they'll manage some of it (like Kang's stuff, whose energy blasts just help me btw), but not all of it (like fitting a black hole bomb into small t-spheres that were never meant to contain them, and still keeping their functionality. AND depowering rays. AND whatever else I'm forgetting (there was tons more)

Some, but not all. And certainly not enough to win

Originally posted by leonidas
disregard all MN'er stuuf. even if dhII COULD assimilate TECH, digi, BY RULES OF THE TOURNAMENT, can NOT. so while you could have had MN's tech/abilities while he was meshed, you must RECREATE SAID TECH to use it here

No, not really. Would assimilating Nimrod in a match be illegal? Or X-51? I wouldn't get their powers but their knowledge and processes, and whatever abilities came along with that. This is a bit silly. The rule is covered under the assimilation rules for Minion. I'm not trying to recreate anything. It's a mental process, just like KK's or anyone's else's. The fact that it's a tech's mental processes changes nothing. It's the same as you guys using Tony's armor's processes to create new weaponry. Only with MNer, recreation isn't necessary because the processing is the actual power

If there really is a rule that covers this, cite it, talk to ill, make sure I'm in the discussion, then get back to me. Until then, I have MNer in force

And for the record, I have enough even sans MNer to win, imo, but I can't let these kinds of things slide, just on principle

If you feel the need to pursue this, let's do it in the discussion thread or PMs, then we'll inform others of any changes

Originally posted by leonidas
proof? it was in a missile with a SMALL warhead. the delivery system is large since it has to travel so far. the size of the equipment needed for the weapon itself? utterly unknown. and call me crazy, but i think stark and the others could pretty easily resize the sphere or the weapon. if not-then instead of depowered and smooshed, you're just depowered

So Tony built a black hole bomb that can fit inside a pack of cards? They use airplanes to deliver bombs, you know. Really, you'll have to move on to plan B

And hell, this still requires matter transmutation that you don't possess. Fission reactors need more than rearranging plastic and metal. Jeffries powers are cool, yes. But they have limits

Originally posted by leonidas
he's even slower than minion!

Anyone this side of Wally West is. That's hardly an insult to Havok. He doesn't have to be fast, though. His output, directional or omni-directional as needed, is MORE than enough to vaporize anything within striking distance. He can lay waste to miles of land, so the 0.5 km starting distance will be continually flooded with energy.

So if your spheres ever come out from behind your forcefields (or once I take those fields down with Minion) they will be vaporized. As soon as they could conceivably attack, they'll be well inside his blast radius. Havok's a walking nuke that never stops. To attack him, to even get close to him.

So even IF you think the spheres can do everything leo says, their durability is equivalent to a small metal ball. To a man who is a living, breathing miles-wide ball of psychotic energy, metal is like tissue paper. Either they're shielded, and thus useless, or they're trying to attack but already within the blast radius and thus vaporized. Period.

Originally posted by leonidas
so you don't think someone with shazam's powers calling out "BLACK ADAM" is a possible conundrum or conflict? and did darkseid hold a piece of mary's soul when he gave mary back her powers?

I have classic Mary and Freddy, to avoid controversy over possible recent powerups. It's been this way since I first drafted them. Current DC continuity regarding the Marvels has no bearing on this match

And the former has already been ruled on. One of the sources of power (BA, Shazam, etc.) blocking access to their power would be considered outside intervention, and is thus illegal to argue on behalf of. They have access to their power under normal circumstances, so that couldn't change without outside intervention, which again is illegal

Originally posted by leonidas
finding a recording of them is just one more possible offensive option in a littany of them

If you think the t-spheres have a recording on file of Mary and Freddy saying their words of power, go ahead and believe this. Mind you, they didn't do this during prep, so they'd have to be in the standard database since they won't have time in the match to program the spheres.

Leo, I'm not quaking in my boots on this one. We should both realize that the judges might believe aspects of the others' plan that we find ludicrous. But this, well, this is just a new level

Originally posted by leonidas
lol

lol

Originally posted by leonidas
you want to compare THAT shield to one that friggin thor, quasar, et al, couldn't penetrate?

Judges have seen how I can down your forcefields. As if Herald-level punches with an adamantium-esque blade, backed with KK's skill and Minion's tech-shield override aren't enough.....I could also, ya know, stick my shield into the field and just absorb it

Heh. Ingenuity.

Originally posted by leonidas
there are adaptive shields, then there are ADAPTIVE SHIELDS

YouTube video

To Scoobless

I won't spend forever breaking down each scan. And I can't spend an entire post on it, because of what I'm planning for one of my final posts. But I do have a few general observations, as well as a few specific rebuttals

Observations

- The Techno scans were sorely needed to prove at least parts of their plan. So kudos. There's still a lot missing, however.
A. Nowhere is there matter manipulation that would be required to create the fission reactor for the black hole bomb. They have skirted this issue the entire match, wanting you to believe some rearranged metal would suffice. It would not. It's not even speculation, it's a simple fact. Metal-only tech, perhaps. That, hell no.
B. He's still trying to press the Aurora angle, without realizing that nowhere has Techno been shown to have her power set on file. Don't let repetition of it fool you. It's as ludicrous as if they were saying he suddenly downloaded Havok's power set, Silver Surfer's, anyones.
C. With that being the case, they have no enhanced reflexes. To Minion, with the Marvel's raw speed and reactions, KK's insane reactions, MNer's calculative ability, their entire team is moving in slow motion to me. Processing speed means nothing when you can't react physically as fast.

Originally posted by Scoobless
This is what happened when a second rate copy of Tony's consciousness took control of the armour (nothing to do with the Ultron sentient armour story arc

Convenient. You never built his armor (check your prep), nor do you have anything but Tony's technical knowledge. So you have the slow, shaved ape (as Tony put it) not the technological dream

Originally posted by Scoobless
The relatively slow human version Techno could reconfigure his tech-pac in instants

The tech pac is cool, but nothing you're using, and nothing that will be useful. And it certainly doesn't justify mountains of sophisticated spliced-together tech in mere minutes

Originally posted by Scoobless
a basic high intensity light flash (such as Iron Man's uni-beam or any other bright light) will easily blind that human eye

If you're that close, all of your tech (and body) is disintegrated by anti-metal. So that's a worthless attack

Originally posted by Scoobless
And since everyone loves healing factors

Heh. I can regrow arms instantly too:
http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b1xo9.jpg
http://img183.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b2pi2.jpg

But my durability >>>>>> yours, so it'll never be an issue.

Forget the 9 post proposal, btw. My 10th will be short-ish, but we're getting there in a hurry, and will have a considerable break with how the other match is progressing. And welcome back to the party Scoob.

🙂

Yeah, rumours of my absence were greatly under-exaggerated.

We're not functioning under a time limit here ... are we?

(non match counting post ... obviously)

unofficial:

it's not a huge point in the match, but scoob and i have asked delph for a ruling regarding digi's use of his assimilation abilities to assimilate tech. without mn'er we believe he can't access mn'ers powers because they are tech-based and digi could ONLY assimilate knowledge--NOT powers. since he can't assimilate tech, he doesn't HAVE mn'ers powers unless he RECREATES his tech.

digi thinks . . . differently. i'll wait to post based on delph's ruling which hopefully will be forthcoming reasonably soon. 🙂

I actually have the ruling on the same question. I didn't try to sway him, I just referred him to the posts in question. I'll post it with my next official post tonight.

{edit} actually, I may just post it in an unofficial post to clear things up. Because at the moment I have the most recent post, and I'm not sure I have enough to work with to make an entirely new post.

Unofficial Post:

Concerning MNer:

illadelph12 wrote on Dec 10th, 2008 11:30 PM:
You're not bringing the tech itself, correct? You're just assimilating it's capabilities and replicating them. right? If that's the case it's legal. It's a bit dicey because it's a non-biological augmentation made to MNer via the implants, so it might not be logistically sound for you to be able to gain it's capabilities via the cranial siphon, but if Minion can assimilate schematics and produce the same results on his own you should be in the clear.

So what I'm doing is legal, because I'm replicating MNer's implants' skills that I assimilated in a past match, not bringing the tech itself to another battle.

The only issue is whether or not it would work logistically. I've stated that Minion has assimilated skills from technology before (the original Death's Head), so assimilating the skills of another tech-based skill set (MNer) would be the same process. I don't need to physically replicate the implants to replicate their skills, just like Minion doesn't replicate Death's Head's body to replicate his skills. If Scoob and Leo feel different, that's their choice, as is the judges.

But legality isn't an issue. It's cleared.

here's the response i got and why what you are doing is ILLEGAL:

He can't copy the tech. As I told Digi in an earlier PM on the topic, he can assimilate knowledge/information and recreate the results independently. In the case of Midnighter his combat assessment abilities are granted by the implants and artificial components, not by his biological brain. Those components couldn't be taken or copied legally outside of amalgamation, but downloading their schematics and recreating/replicating the results by one's own means (in this case, Minion's) would be legal.

dl'ing and REPLICATING/RECREATING are the only ways to make that legal. even in the post you referenced he said you need to REPLICATE THE TECH. what qualifies as 'skills' of a machine? if you assimilated the data of the black hole bomb, could you shoot black holes? dhi was a cyborg--he assimilated his knowledge and skills like any other biological entity. you are saying that if you stabbed nimrod, you'd gain all his adaptive powers? or if you stabbed amazo you could copy any power?

imo, it is against the rules. i'm going to drop it because imo it really doesn't play a big part in this match, but if we win, that would mean we could assimilate dhll's 'skills' and that would include his siphon abilities. or he could assimilate us and all our tech skills.

No, I wouldn't get powers, just skills and knowledge of those you mentioned (Nimrod, Black Hole Bomb, etc.). But MNer's fighting skill isn't a power, it's a skill. It's simply aided by tech, whose skills I also took. So it falls under skill assimilation, just like assimilating the skills from Death's Head's mind is converting technology-based skills for his own use.

Btw, you're arguing the wrong term. What I'm doing isn't illegal. It's been cleared 100%. You saying it wouldn't work like I'm saying is arguing feasibility, not legality. I realize you'll likely continue in your dissent, but I want to be on the same page here at least. The only way it would be illegal would be if I was claiming to have the actual physical implants carried from match to match.

Originally posted by Digi
No, I wouldn't get powers, just skills and knowledge of those you mentioned (Nimrod, Black Hole Bomb, etc.). But MNer's fighting skill isn't a power, it's a skill. It's simply aided by tech, whose skills I also took. So it falls under skill assimilation, just like assimilating the skills from Death's Head's mind is converting technology-based skills for his own use.

Btw, you're arguing the wrong term. What I'm doing isn't illegal. It's been cleared 100%. You saying it wouldn't work like I'm saying is arguing feasibility, not legality. I realize you'll likely continue in your dissent, but I want to be on the same page here at least.

it's illegal if you are assimilating tech. 😬

one of the 'powers' of mn'er is his calculative abilities. those powers are based on his tech. his fighting skills would be yours, no problem. how does 'tech'--inorganic metal pieces--possess 'skills'? 😕

and as regards nimrod--if you gain the "knowledge" on how to run through all these scenarios thanks to mn'ers tech, why WOULDN'T you gain the "knowledge" of how to perform all the adaptive functioning nimrod can do from HIS tech? where do you see a difference?

Originally posted by leonidas
it's illegal if you are assimilating tech. 😬

one of the 'powers' of mn'er is his calculative abilities. those powers are based on his tech. his fighting skills would be yours, no problem. how does 'tech'--inorganic metal pieces--possess 'skills'? 😕

and as regards nimrod--if you gain the "knowledge" on how to run through all these scenarios thanks to mn'ers tech, why WOULDN'T you gain the "knowledge" of how to perform all the adaptive functioning nimrod can do from HIS tech? where do you see a difference?

*sigh*

It has skills the same way Nimrod would. Would assimilating the experiences and skills of Nimrod be illegal as well? Or a cyborg, which is technically what MNer is (part man, part machine)? Of course not. They're equivalent.

And I wouldn't gain Nimrod's adaptive functioning because I don't possess the physical specs to replicate it. Minion's body isn't that versatile. I'd have the knowledge for it, but not the means. But MNer's calculating ability is simply calculation. Once I have the processes of the calculations assimilated, replicating it is the same as replicating a mind's skill set, or the skill set of a robot. Both are calculations.

meh. i disagree, but i'll drop it (don't be surprised if scoob weighs in though . . .)

like i said--i think the question is meaningless to the outcome of this match (i've been debating this whole time under the assumption you DID have his powers . . .), but you can bet i will be asking you to prove that he's assimilated and gained the abilities of 'tech' in the past though. hope you have some solid proof. 😉

Scoob/Leo: Post #9

Havok can reflect energy just as well:

The reversal OVERRIDES YOUR NATURAL IMMUNITY TO YOUR ABILITIES, EXACTLY as it did to angie and to phoenix in the scans i posted. havok wouldn't be able to reabsorb the attack anymore than angie.

And I absorb energy with BK, remember?

You're going to jump in front of havoc and try to absorb the reflected blast BEFORE you have minion attack us?? Sweet! that gives us even MORE time (not that we need it)

You'd have relative days?

Techno's speeds, only equals about an hour.

I’d LOVE to know how you came up with that ‘hour’.

It depends on how close to lightspeed you think we can process. even if we assume only process NEAR lightspeed (though with kang's 40th CENTURY tech, lightspeed processing should be assured) time dilation extends things (relatively) into hours, days or even years. looking at it another way--forge can perform at the rate of a supercomputer--BILLIONS of times faster than he normally could.

between forge and jefferies, our processing speed and our collections of minds, there really isn't anything we can't build almost immediately--ESPECIALLY IF WE'VE ALREADY BUILT IT!

It's a mental process, just like KK's or anyone's else's. The fact that it's a tech's mental processes changes nothing.

prove minion has assimilated, then EXHIBITED, any ‘tech knowledge’ in the past. I know you’ll say he assimilated dhi’s tech. But show me something dhii could do AFTER he assimilated dhi that he could NOT do BEFORE he assimilated dhi’s tech.

So Tony built a black hole bomb that can fit inside a pack of cards?

You really think if it were an issue we couldn't simply resize a sphere?? plan A alive and well.

And hell, this still requires matter transmutation that you don't possess. Fission reactors need more than rearranging plastic and metal.

You're wrong about the matter manip issue. The bomb is a simple NUCLEAR DEVICE:

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/...lackholeiq4.jpg

a fission reaction comes about as a result of TECH, which serves to CREATE the reaction by splitting a pair of atoms. are you saying we don't have a supply of hydrogen atoms to work with? or oxygen atoms? Fission coverts MASS (atoms) into ENERGY.

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f...a_Flight_58.jpg

There, Madison creates a reaction using NOTHING MORE THAN HIS OWN POWERSET!

And Tony has ALREADY figured out a way to CONTROL the fission reaction in the space of a small warhead.

The bombs are the very LEAST of his concerns. unavoidable power and magic neutralizing beams on the other hand...

the 0.5 km starting distance will be continually flooded with energy.

1) havok has NO WAY TO SEE US (we ARE invisble to him, regardless of what you think minion sees)

2) no CHANCE he can SEE THE SPHERES from 0.5km away

3) no logical way he would know that he needed an omniblast

4) no chance he can use an omniblast that would emit in a 0.5km radius without unleashing some MEGA blast that would kill MK outright and possibly harm (certainly stun) minion.

5) at least part of any omniblast would be reflected at him and ko him.

Havok=useless.

if your spheres ever come out from behind your forcefields

How do you disable all 6 spheres that have you surrounded before they target and depower you . . . mary wasn’t fast enough to avoid being ko’d by the omac in the scan below.

as he has done throughout, digi is VASTLY overestimating his travel speed. mach 10 is SLOW-MOTION compared to the ability of a supercomputer to target and fire. even if you think he somehows disables ONE sphere (purely impossible, imo)--he still needs to disable FIVE MORE before they simply target and shoot.

To even have a CHANCE to win, he NEEDS you to believe that he:

I) scans the area and realizes he's surrounded (without using tech scanners)

II) uses mn'ers powers to figure a way out of the mess he's in.

III) THEN takes out ALL SIX of our spheres moving at a measly mach 10 before our spheres (which don't have to move) simply target and fire!

Even if you DO believe he can do all that, we can still:

A) rip him apart with Jeffries powers

B) access the OMAC data we assimilated and ko him like this:

http://img183.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mary1zd5.jpg

spheres - their durability is equivalent to a small metal ball.

You're dead before their durability is ever an issue.

as ludicrous as if they were saying he suddenly downloaded Havok's power set, etc...

Havok was never a part of weapon x, from whom kane got his powers and the database he uses to dl his abilities:

http://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?i...databasefi5.jpg

processing speed means nothing when you can't react physically as fast.

spiral's speed, reflexes & teleportation would be PLENTY. but it's irrelevant because you're dead before we ever have a reason to move.

Convenient. You never built his armor

We don't need to build it, simply incorporate aspects of it's tech features into our rapidly evolving robotic form.

But my durability > yours,

indestructible skin+wolverine's healing+techno's healing+shields=i doubt it.

Originally posted by Digi
Havok's powers aren't heat...

...he super-heats subatomic particles that take the form of plasma in his attacks. So unless Tony has a scan of absorbing omni-directional plasma it means nothing.

Irrelevant, Havok's blasts aren't making past our shields (which are multi layered and comprising the various energy shield tech of Kang, Iron Man & the Reach's Scarab tech)

Originally posted by Digi
you're building about a dozen pieces of ridiculously high-tech machinery - In 4 minutes.

As Leo already pointed out:

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p68/DCHawks_photo/AlphaFlight36-14.jpg

We have the powers, the plans, the processing power and we have at least half a dozen super-geniuses working in concert at hundreds of times of human thinking speeds.

Originally posted by Digi
We did away with a lot of prep to avoid plans like these

We did, but the various teams (such as yours) powering up their characters from round to round finally forced us to get serious, we decided to go 'techy' and put together a core character who has the combined experiences of some of the best tech users in comics, along with the power to instantly transform himself and other materials into whatever additional tech he may need.

Even if the prep time expired before we finished, we could continue prepping while easily evading you in the opening minute or so of the match through dimension shifting, invisibility and teleportation.

The prep time limit is no "limit" to us at all.

Originally posted by Digi
without any of the proper materials

We have massive reserves of materials in our Damocles prep area, with Robogod linking directly into the system he can exist all throughout the station at once and easily locate and procure any materials that are required.

... or we just use a combination of Kang's home knowledge and Spirals instant teleportation to collect the stuff.

Originally posted by Digi
Tell me, where's the schematics for building a black hole bomb into a t-sphere?

Schematics of each device + 40th century knowledge + Forge's ability to merge/alter/improve tech in almost any way + Jefferies powers + immense processing speeds = T-BHBs (Terrific - Black Hole Bombs)

Originally posted by Digi
A throwaway suggestion, yes?

Maybe, but if you speak at all during the match we can record the voice, synthesize a "Captain Marvel" call and deactivate your powers whenever we choose.

or

We simply 'OMAC' your powers away, then if you speak to power up again we can "talk you out of it" any time we choose.

Originally posted by Digi
You didn't build Extremis, you don't have the Extremis virus in you

Extremis is little more than a way to mentally link Tony to his armour (or other machines) via a nanobot powered cybernetic interface.

Now that his mind is completely incorporated into a monstrously versatile & fast super-computer, with the mutant powers to instantly understand and reconfigure anything mechanical/tech related, he really has no need for Extremis ... hell, Extremis Stark is like Robogod's retarded step brother by comparison.

Originally posted by Digi
Computer reflexes so, what, you can analyze the gigantic blast as it comes toward you?

That's not what we intended it for, but yeah, we could do that - analyse, adapt, reconfigure ... if, for some reason, the analysis shows Kang's multi-Avenger stopping shield (including Thor and Quasar) can't handle the blast, we can always use Spirals power to teleport away, or the Scarab's ability to dimension shift to safety.

Originally posted by Digi
I have yet to see a scan of anyone on their team surviving any kind of high-powered offense.

Apart from scans of Kang's shields embarrassing an all out Thor? (and the rest of the Avengers)
______________

There's more to come, maybe Saturday, probably Sunday though.

.