Originally posted by leonidas✅
in ss's case he can actually MANIPULATE time. nothing ss does is illogical based on his ludicrous powerset.and while relativity holds true SOMETIMES for flash, sometimes it doesn't. infinite speed?? einstein would have an aneurysm . . .
it's still comics at the end of the day, but (at least in this case) the art and text confine the same thing.
Originally posted by Starscream M
just curious, but how do you square with applying STR in comics with characters without speedforce fix going faster than light? ie gladiator, surfer
i agree with soljer. and in in ss's case his powerset ALLOWS for manipulation of matter AND time. he can do whatever the hell he wants . . .
superman and gladiator fy via willpower--basically they can achieve whatever they BELIEVE they can achieve. similar to a GL.
i think most comic characters who can achieve ftl travel have at least some sort of explanation for the feat that allows for the usual amount of suspension of disbelief. is there a character who you can think of who achieves ftl WITHOUT at least some marginally "plausible" (in a comicbook sense) way of explaining it?
Originally posted by leonidaswell actually once soljer said he doesn't apply the theory of relativity, I was fine with the issue.
i agree with soljer. and in in ss's case his powerset ALLOWS for manipulation of matter AND time. he can do whatever the hell he wants . . .superman and gladiator fy via willpower--basically they can achieve whatever they BELIEVE they can achieve. similar to a GL.
i think most comic characters who can achieve ftl travel have at least some sort of explanation for the feat that allows for the usual amount of suspension of disbelief. is there a character who you can think of who achieves ftl WITHOUT at least some marginally "plausible" (in a comicbook sense) way of explaining it?
you really don't even need an explanation...since it is comics.
My point was that you shouldn't apply real science to comics because then it requires 'explanations' to square the two.
But if you accept comics as a place where our laws of physics and such don't apply, then you don't need special explanations.
Originally posted by Starscream M
just curious, but how do you square with applying STR in comics with characters without speedforce fix going faster than light? ie gladiator, surfer
Gladiator and Surfer do this stuff in Marvel. I don't recall Marvel applying the STR, but they probably do. It's very clear that DC does. Oh, and, Surfer has the PC. Which is like the Speedforce in the way it allows people to ignore physics.
Let's look at the points against Flash going multiple times faster than light speed:
1. The writer states he didn't go light speed.
2. The writer reiterates it.
3. Writers of Flash comics use the STR all the time. See any issue with the Infinite Mass Punch for examples.
4. In that very picture, the writer uses STR: 'Eyes of almost infinite mass turn towards the blazing...'
5. Time dilation is used in Flash comics all the time. Anytime Flash enters 'Speed mode.' For example, between Flash 202-206 (forget exactly) Flash goes into speed mode and rescues a bunch of people out of their cars. He sees them as not moving at all. Even the raindrops are moving slowly. This is again demonstrated in Flash 230 (I think), when the Flashes attempt to take down Vandal Savage w/ The Summoner.
6. Time dilation is predicted by the STR. So once again, writers of Flash comics use it.
Points for Flash going multiple times light speed in that issue:
1. One blogger with no connection to DC at all miscalculating how fast Flash was going (as Mindship showed) and used the entirely wrong formula (as Astner showed.)
Flash proponents: Are you serious?
Originally posted by Starscream M
well actually once soljer said he doesn't apply the theory of relativity, I was fine with the issue.you really don't even need an explanation...since it is comics.
My point was that you shouldn't apply real science to comics because then it requires 'explanations' to square the two.
But if you accept comics as a place where our laws of physics and such don't apply, then you don't need special explanations.
yeah, the issue of 'real' science in comics always leads to problems. fact is, writers do it to add a sense of realism to their stories. and as cool as it sounds at times, it can create problems. the forum was built to debate minutiae. part of the problem with the forum is that is carries these illogical debates to ludicrous and irremediable ends.
Originally posted by leonidaschurch!
yeah, the issue of 'real' science in comics always leads to problems. fact is, writers do it to add a sense of realism to their stories. and as cool as it sounds at times, it can create problems. the forum was built to debate minutiae. part of the problem with the forum is that is carries these illogical debates to ludicrous and irremediable ends.
You can use comic book logic or you can use Science 🙂
and good luck if your going to use scientific theory trying to explain some of these stuff that occur in comic books.
In my opinion science should only be used if the writers has given hints or using those theory to explain a characters powers and only than.
and you have to remember writers don't know their own characters limit and abilities{most of the time}. Or chooses to ignore it to make a better story
Also different writers doing the story at time will change "facts" about the character.
Originally posted by Enyalus
You wrote, "1. Assuming Flash carried two people at once, he made 250,000 70-mile roundtrips. That's 17,500,000 miles (so far so good). Now the blogger makes his first mistake: 17,500,000 miles x 100,000 x 3600 = 6,300,000,000,000,000"Why the 'x 3600'? I haven't attempted to do the math. Looks like Astner already did so.
"Multiply that by one hundred thousand to get the distance he can run in one second, and then that by sixty by the distance he can run in one minute, and then that by sixty again to get his mph."
Originally posted by Mindship
The blogger wanted to convert the speed figure into mph (totally unnecessary, I thought). He wrote:"Multiply that by one hundred thousand to get the distance he can run in one second, and then that by sixty by the distance he can run in one minute, and then that by sixty again to get his mph."
Ah, yeah...Same here. Especially considering c is usually calculated as mps, not mph.
One thing that hasn't been pointed out yet, is how he could have travelled at such a speed in that amount of time...
grabbing that many people without them just exploding in his hands.
In the Eternals miniseries, there was a speed feat by Makkari, catching all the bullets fired by dozens of gunmen, then disarming them - but worrying about the physical impact he was going to make once he touched any of them, going at the speed he was at.
Flash grabbing the entire population of a city two at a time, in THAT timeframe? How many of them should have just has their atoms scattered by being suddenly grabbed at the speed of light? Or at the very least, died of heart failure at the shock of being suddenly transported 30 miles away?
Originally posted by roughriderSimple answer to your question.... Speed Force.
One thing that hasn't been pointed out yet, is how he could have travelled at such a speed in that amount of time...
grabbing that many people without them just exploding in his hands.In the Eternals miniseries, there was a speed feat by Makkari, catching all the bullets fired by dozens of gunmen, then disarming them - but worrying about the physical impact he was going to make once he touched any of them, going at the speed he was at.
Flash grabbing the entire population of a city two at a time, in THAT timeframe? How many of them should have just has their atoms scattered by being suddenly grabbed at the speed of light? Or at the very least, died of heart failure at the shock of being suddenly transported 30 miles away?