Originally posted by Silent Masterand his arms is attached to his body and his body to the car. So the car helped. Without the proper bracing of his feet he wouldn't had any leverage in which to pull. Why in the hell do you think the writer had Cap put his feet in such a position to pull? Also you ignored my statement on the glass wonkacopter. I would be surprised if that thing weighed more than a ton.
Sorry, but that scan shows that all of the force was applied by Cap's arms
Originally posted by h1a8
Of course it does, the car was moving in the direction of Cap's pull. Now if the car was still then you would have a point.
All of the force being applied to the helicopter is coming from the line, the line isn't attached to the car, it's in Cap's hand, if Cap wasn't strong enough to pull the helicopter down he would have lost his grip on the line.
Originally posted by Silent Master
All of the force being applied to the helicopter is coming from the line, the line isn't attached to the car, it's in Cap's hand, if Cap wasn't strong enough to pull the helicopter down he would have lost his grip on the line.
You know 0 physics.
The first inch of the line is connected to the second and all the way to the last inch. If cap pulls the first inch then he is pulling the last inch.
Cap is inside a car that's moving forward before he pulls. He braces his foot against the vertical part of the seat. The car is providing an extra pull since Cap is moving with the car inside of it and braced against it. If your durability was strong enough then you can pull a horse against his will if you were inside a train moving against the horse and braced against the wall.
If two forces are canceling each other out then all it takes is a minute amount of force to make the system move.
Assume Cap was in the car and didn't pull but rather held on. The helicopter would have still been pulled by the car.
Originally posted by Silent MasterStrength of pulling =/= strength of grip. All Cap needed was strength of grip (to prevent line from slipping).
If Cap didn't have the strength needed to pull down the helicopter, he wouldn't have been able to keep a hold of the line.
Try this and you would see what I'm talking about.
Tie one end of a rope to something heavy (not too heavy) and try to pull the object to feel how hard it is.
Now get in a car or truck (bracing your feet to something) and have the truck move slowly while pulling the object again with the truck moving.
Is it easier, the same, or harder to pull the object in the truck than outside the truck?
Originally posted by h1a8
Strength of pulling =/= strength of grip. All Cap needed was strength of grip (to prevent line from slipping).
As far as pulling is concern, the car supplied some force. Assume that Cap didn't pull but just held the line taut. The helicopter would have still been pulled by the car. Do you agree?Try this and you would see what I'm talking about.
Tie one end of a rope to something heavy (not too heavy) and try to pull the object to feel how hard it is.
Now get in a car or truck (bracing your feet to something) and have the truck move slowly while pulling the object again with the truck moving.
Is it easier, the same, or harder to pull the object in the truck than outside the truck?
Prove that Cap wasn't strong enough to pull down the helicopter.
Originally posted by h1a8
Strength of pulling =/= strength of grip. All Cap needed was strength of grip (to prevent line from slipping).
As far as pulling is concern, the car supplied some force. Assume that Cap didn't pull but just held the line taut. The helicopter would have still been pulled by the car. Do you agree?Try this and you would see what I'm talking about.
Tie one end of a rope to something heavy (not too heavy) and try to pull the object to feel how hard it is.
Now get in a car or truck (bracing your feet to something) and have the truck move slowly while pulling the object again with the truck moving.
Is it easier, the same, or harder to pull the object in the truck than outside the truck?
Not just strength of grip. As it shows his arm move to bring it down.
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/838/secretavengers016pg22.jpg/
This feats reminds me of classic Cap when Steve stopped a car from leaving by holding it.
Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove that Cap wasn't strong enough to pull down the helicopter.
I'm not claiming he can't pull down that helicopter on his own power, just that he received help.
I would be surprised if that helicopter weighed more than 1 ton though. So whether he can pull that glass contraption down with his own power is irrelevant since the feat is destroyed two ways.
Originally posted by Daredevil1I understand that, no one disputed that he didn't pull while the car was moving forward. Please read all the posts and not some of them, you would see I posted a huge ass scan of what you just posted. Strength of grip is to prevent the line from slipping.
Not just strength of grip. As it shows his arm move to bring it down.http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/838/secretavengers016pg22.jpg/
This feats reminds me of classic Cap when Steve stopped a car from leaving by holding it.
Originally posted by h1a8
I understand that, no one disputed that he didn't pull while the car was moving forward. Please read all the posts and not some of them, you would see I posted a huge ass scan of what you just posted. Strength of grip is to prevent the line from slipping.
Yes and the pull is strength of arm. If the car helped a lot he would not have had to pull the rope across to make it crash, if you think about it. Just hold on to the line. Cap even states stop the car.
That feat is probably around the 5-7 ton range considering the helicopters own resistant pull and the strength of Caps pull is very impressive, since the copter was at the back and ended up in the front of there car when it crashed.
Originally posted by h1a8
I'm not claiming he can't pull down that helicopter on his own power, just that he received help.I would be surprised if that helicopter weighed more than 1 ton though. So whether he can pull that glass contraption down with his own
power is irrelevant since the feat is destroyed two ways.
Then the feat stands. Cap is strong enough to pull down a helicopter.
Originally posted by Silent Master
Then the feat stands. Cap is strong enough to pull down a helicopter.
Not so fast, not claiming anything isn't the same as accepting the opposite (skepticism).
Just because I don't claim the non existence of God doesn't automatically make him exist.
In other words, I'm saying we don't know if Cap can do it on his own (maybe he can and maybe he can't) and thus the scan can't be used to prove it.
And certainly pulling that that toy copter doesn't mean he can pull down a real helicopter.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
H1a8, you forgot to add in the fact the copter was airborne. So whilst it may or may not have weighed 1 ton, there's still the matter of the copter engine push keeping it airborne (which Cap overcame).
The copter was chasing the car in vertical equilibrium (not rising or falling) and thus any amount of force in the downward direction would pull it downward.
Even if the copter was trying to rise before Cap's pull (fighting against being pulled down) then you would have to prove the lift strength of such a light copter.
Originally posted by h1a8
Not so fast, not claiming anything isn't the same as accepting the opposite (skepticism).
Just because I don't claim the non existence of God doesn't automatically make him exist.In other words, I'm saying we don't know if Cap can do it on his own (maybe he can and maybe he can't) and thus the scan can't be used to prove it.
And certainly pulling that that toy copter doesn't mean he can pull down a real helicopter.
You’ve already basically admitted that Cap is strong enough to perform the feat on his own, therefore there is no reason to try and downplay the feat using your version of “real life physics”.
