Originally posted by Brutacus
So Cage can K.O. someone that can take class 100 ton punches???
So that means he hit's harder than someone with 100 ton strenght??
She-hulk has one shoted IronClad. She doesnt have class 100 strength. Again peoples feats vary just because Ironclad can take class 100 shots one day doesnt mean he can on another.
No characters are always portrayed the same. According to your logic Crossbones whouldnt be able to hurt Captain America.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
She-hulk has one shoted IronClad. She doesnt have class 100 strength. Again peoples feats vary just because Ironclad can take class 100 shots one day doesnt mean he can on another.No characters are always portrayed the same. According to your logic Crossbones whouldnt be able to hurt Captain America.
You stated that cage hits harder than a 100 tonner.
I never said anything about crossbones or captain America.
Just asked you a question since you STATED that cage hits harder than someone with 100 ton by saying cage can K.O. someone who can take 100 ton punches.
And crossbones hurting captain america is a very BIG diffrence than cage a 30 tonner can hurt a guy that took a beating from a angry or enraged prof hulk who's base strenght is 100 ton ( and even iff he's the most level headed of the hulks, his strenght still goes up iff he get's angry).
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
She-hulk has one shoted IronClad. She doesnt have class 100 strength. Again peoples feats vary just because Ironclad can take class 100 shots one day doesnt mean he can on another.No characters are always portrayed the same. According to your logic Crossbones whouldnt be able to hurt Captain America.
She hulk is a 100tonner now and back in the day she was a 70 tonner and could go higher than that in her savage persona.She is at least in the ballpark luke cage is not.She is the weakest person to do that to ironclad if we go by his showing's nobody anywhere near Cage's strength has ko Ironclad.
Also why are you using to showings you agreed are low showing to back up your claim and one where he had assistance in the case of orka.Nobody here is posting any fights of abomination to should just what this guy is capable off ill do that later.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Uhhh again so that was bad writing? So in other words your point is that anything that you dont agree with is incorrect? That is precsialy what you are doing.
So what do you consider it? Do you really think that Cage should be able to fight, let alone one shot characters that are so much further up the ladder than he is? I consider it wanking from the company.
1. A pissed off Spiderman has severaly damaged an advanced Iron Mans armour from the future. Considering that Luke Cages punches are harder than Spiderman because of his skin its possible for him to do it.2. Hes damaged Dr Dooms armour as well. Let me guess thats bad writing as well? C'mon man be reasonable I keep picking all these feats you keep stating that its bad writing that sound reasonable to you?
3. Captain America has lots of showings that indicate that he can hurt class 100s. According to your logic because hes hurt his hand trying to punch Thor and had trouble trying to Ko Super Patriot (class 10) that means that its bad writing. Its not bad writing people feats vary, we dont just choose all the bad ones we look at both good and bad and come to an average. The avarage shows that its not bad writing.
Spiderman damaging Iron Mans armour is hysterical. I must have given Stark way to much credit. I had no idea that his armour was so weak. I'm going to have to throw away all the comics I own with Iron Man withstanding much, much more than what Spiderman could ever hope to dish out.
Dooms armour is not Starks amour.
Cap hurting class 100's is BS period. Peoples feats vary? So you agree with inconsistencies in characters and deem it normal? How do you even guage a debate? So by your rationale (just an example) if a character like Punisher who has a history of being a street level charcter, knocked out the Thing during a fist fight, that would be totoally alright with you? Thats basically what your saying. Out of character instances mean nothing to you and you accept them instead of calling the writer on it.
The Iron Man today is much more advanced so there no point in bringing that up.
But you brought up a pissed off Spiderman damaging a future Iron Mans armour? Also, Cage is supposed to be more today than what he was then so it should be relevant.
No you're not all you are doing is stating that any good feats done by Cage is bad writing. Lets summarise:Luke fighting Doc Samson. Bad writing.
Luke figting Ironclad . Bad writing.
Luke fighting Orca bad writing.
Luke cracking Iron Mans armour. Bad writing.
Luke being able to beat Samson is bad writing. The character has fought the Hulk for 6+ hours. He is above Cage in every way except for a slight decrease in durability. Ironclad is the same way. Orka? Again, I dont have every issue this charater has been in, but he has beaten Namor twice. Cage could not do that. You do the math.
Luke being so durable Carnage wasnt able to hurt him. Is that bad writing?
Hiriom punching Luke so hard that was almost level with a skyscraper and Luke getting straight back up Was that bad writing as well?
Luke Cage damaging Dr Dooms armour? Bad writing.
These are acceptable to me. Carnage shouldnt be able to hurt him in my opinion. I know nothing about Hiriom so I cant say anything about that. Dooms armour isnt that great of a feat in my opinion.
That was prior to his upgrade! You even indicated in your post why it was a bad example.....uhhhh!!!
Because you stated that prior to his upgrade, Cage was able to trade blows with class 80 characters. My example was to show that Cage doing so was pure BS. Grimm was class 80-85 then and he wrapped a freaking girder around him. That should be how easy any 80 class character should have it against Cage.
That was to indicate how agile he was! That was before his upgrade anyway and nobody is even debating that Cage could currently beat Hulk.
I dont care about his agility. I'm more concerned that he couldnt even break a rock, yet he was damaging Iron mans armour and throwing with class 80 characters? Hmmm. Also, not to throw the Hulk into the mix, but a guy that was throwing with class 80 characters should have had a little more effect on the Hulk than being a mere annoyance.
Because you say it is and nothing more. All you have done is stated that every good thing that Cage has done is bad writing, thats terrible debating.
No more so than accepting inconsistencies when it goes against a characters average that they have accumulated during their history.
What are you trying to say? Despite the fact that his bio states in black and white that the adamantuim increases his strength it doesnt?
🤨The fact of the matter is the bio strongly implies that Wolverine strength is doubled, you can feel free to ignore it if you wont.
I would like to know your opinion on this matter. Do you think that any character that recieves adamantium automatically gets a 50% strength increase? If so, could you possibly explain that to me the best you can? Is it magical? Does it boost muscle capacity? Does it produce some kind of chemical that allows for this strength increase? I need to hear this explanation from you because its clear your not getting the obvious reasons.
Is there anything in the comics that would suggest that Wolverine's strength doubled when he got the adamantium? Nope..
Luke Cage's durability is higher than his strength, his strength would not grow much or at all if he got adamantium bones. Hanging with someone who is stronger than you, doesn't necessarily mean you're as strong as they. You only need to be faster, more skilled, have a good durability etc.
Spider-man probably hits harder than Cage, thanks to his super speed. (hitting force is dependant of the mass of the thing you hit with and the speed it travels.)
Originally posted by Rhinoceros
Is there anything in the comics that would suggest that Wolverine's strength doubled when he got the adamantium? Nope..
I dont think that matters. His bio implies that it doubled by adamantuim unless somebody explicity says it doesnt I dont see why we cant give it the benefit of the doubt. Wolverine has been able to pull an elevator full of people with one arm so that at the very least indicates that his bones greatly augument his strength.
Also Sabretooth is stated that he has superhuman strength after getting adamantuim.
Originally posted by Rhinoceros
Luke Cage's durability is higher than his strength, his strength would not grow much or at all if he got adamantium bones.
At the end of the day I have more proof to say that it does. Of I course could be wrong but I do actually have sources that imply this, to be fair you just have your opinion.
Originally posted by Rhinoceros
Hanging with someone who is stronger than you, doesn't necessarily mean you're as strong as they. You only need to be faster, more skilled, have a good durability etc.
Yeah I know.
Originally posted by Rhinoceros
Spider-man probably hits harder than Cage, thanks to his super speed. (hitting force is dependant of the mass of the thing you hit with and the speed it travels.)
In general Luke Cages punches look more impressive regardless.
Originally posted by Brutacus
You stated that cage hits harder than a 100 tonner.
No I didnt you probably misinterpreted what I said.
Originally posted by Brutacus
I never said anything about crossbones or captain America.
I think you missed the point.
Originally posted by Brutacus
Just asked you a question since you STATED that cage hits harder than someone with 100 ton by saying cage can K.O. someone who can take 100 ton punches.
Like I said you misntepreted what I said. I didnt say that Luke punches were harder than class 100s I said that regardless of wether Ironclad has taking shots from the Hulk that doesnt mean that he can't get one shoted by Luke. People feats vary and are not always consistent Ironclad also got one-shoted by She-HUlk as well. Thats just the way its goes people have high showings and low showings we dont reject either we look at them as a whole.
Originally posted by Brutacus
And crossbones hurting captain america is a very BIG diffrence than cage a 30 tonner can hurt a guy that took a beating from a angry or enraged prof hulk who's base strenght is 100 ton ( and even iff he's the most level headed of the hulks, his strenght still goes up iff he get's angry).
No not really you missed the point. Cap has taken shots from people like Namor, Iron Man etc that doesnt mean he cant get hurt by Crossbones. Also Ironclad has taken shots from Hulk but doesnt mean he cant get Koed by weaker people. See the similarity?
The point is that eventhough Crossbones is not as strong as Luke and She-Hulk he still has the ability to hurt opponents that can take punches from people far more stronger than him.
Originally posted by SuperiorTech
She hulk is a 100tonner now and back in the day she was a 70 tonner and could go higher than that in her savage persona.She is at least in the ballpark luke cage is not.She is the weakest person to do that to ironclad if we go by his showing's nobody anywhere near Cage's strength has ko Ironclad.
I think when she one-shoted IronClad she wasnt class 100, she was classified as class 75. To be quite honest with you Professor Hulk didnt even look like he was trying anyway.
Luke Cage doesnt hit with just 25 tons of force his skin is harder than people in the class 25 range so he hits harder than class 25.
Originally posted by SuperiorTech
Also why are you using to showings you agreed are low showing to back up your claim and one where he had assistance in the case of orka.Nobody here is posting any fights of abomination to should just what this guy is capable off ill do that later.
I guess its my fault for not explaining properly. If you take what Luke cage did to Ironclad and Doc Samson on their own they can be seen as low showings but when you evaluate all of his feats it can be argued that Luke can at least trade blows with them but KOing them in one-shot is bad writing. If somebody does something enough times it not bad writing it shows what he is capable of.
When we add Orka to the list then we have to start questioning wether all his feats are bad writing because the number of feats of him fighting people around class 80 are starting to increase. Lets add some more to the list:
Hes been shown to be a physical match for Rhino (Whos fought The Hulk)
He was attacked by Carnage and Carnage was not even able to hurt him with his claws. Carnage has been classifed as class 50 and many a time edged damages has been shown to more destructive than blunt force.
Also he took a punch from Hiriom and got right back into the fight like nothing happened. From what I can remember Hiriom was able to cancel out Iron Fists power punch, therefore implying that Hirioms 'chi' punch is greater than Iron Fists. Iron Fist has sent Collosus flying with a punch.
Originally posted by tkitna
.Cap hurting class 100's is BS period. Peoples feats vary? So you agree with inconsistencies in characters and deem it normal? How do you even guage a debate? So by your rationale (just an example) if a character like Punisher who has a history of being a street level charcter, knocked out the Thing during a fist fight, that would be totoally alright with you? Thats basically what your saying. Out of character instances mean nothing to you and you accept them instead of calling the writer on it.
No thats not what im saying at all. Punisher Koing the Thing Is BS because hes never shown to have the ability EVAH! the difference is that Captain America has shown to have that ability 100s of times but depsite that you want to call it BS, thats just complete and utter bias.
At this point ive decided not to respond to the rest of your post. If you want to keep dictating to me what feats are bad just because you dont like them then there is no point in continuing the debate. All im going to do now is try and explain why I think your debating style is wrong and explain my raesoning and if you don't accept it leave it as that.
What im doing is looking at characters feats as a whole, and trying to come to average that indicates what they are capable of. Its like if we have two atheletes and we try to deduce who would win a race. What we would do is look how fast they run 100 meters, we would evaluate all their times and come to an average, that would include all times lows and high.
Im well aware that Luke has looked bad against Namor and Wrecker but Luke also has better showings as well. The point is that if a character does something enough times that indicates its within his abiltiy and regardless of wether you like it or not that makes it true.
Its like if I said to you that an athlete can run 100 meters in 8.3 seconds and you call it BS because hes run it in 11, I then state to you that hes done it 6 more times, for you to reject that makes it bias because you are simply rejecting reality and at the end of the day the writers make that reality.
Hell sometimes it doesnt even have to make sense Steel is a scientific genuis but he cant figure out that Clark Kent is Superman. Does that make sense? It doesnt matter because its a reality in the comic.
I dont think that matters. His bio implies that it doubled by adamantuim unless somebody explicity says it doesnt I dont see why we cant give it the benefit of the doubt. Wolverine has been able to pull an elevator full of people with one arm so that at the very least indicates that his bones greatly augument his strength.
You don't think the comics matter...? Keyword here is "bio". Bios aren't primary canon or canon at all. Wolverine being able to pull an elevator suggest that he has enhanced strength, not that his bones are the cause of it.
Also Sabretooth is stated that he has superhuman strength after getting adamantuim.
He had superstrength way before he ever got adamantium. I think the weapon x dudes also augmented his speed and healing ability. If they had just given him an adamantium skeleton, he would have healed slower and been slower. They obviously augmented him some other way too. (When Sabes first got the adamantium, Logan didn't notice anything being different until he hit a bone)
At the end of the day I have more proof to say that it does. Of I course could be wrong but I do actually have sources that imply this, to be fair you just have your opinion.
No you don't. Only thing you have is one lousy bio and a pretty damn bad logic to boot.
In general Luke Cages punches look more impressive regardless.
Spider-man holds back a lot and he's not a brawler.
So it's more likley that abom get's one shotted or beaten by this upgraded version of luke who is still a lot weaker than hulk who abom fought for years.
Than for abom to beat luke cage?
The strenght diffrence between the two is still a lot.
Also look at the size diffrence luke is not a small guy, but put him next to abom he is a little guy that would give abom also the reach advantage luke has to get in close to punch abom.
Originally posted by Brutacus
So it's more likley that abom get's one shotted or beaten by this upgraded version of luke who is still a lot weaker than hulk who abom fought for years.Than for abom to beat luke cage?
The strenght diffrence between the two is still a lot.
Also look at the size diffrence luke is not a small guy, but put him next to abom he is a little guy that would give abom also the reach advantage luke has to get in close to punch abom.
Very Very unlikely as abomation consistently withstands more damage that this upgraded luke cage is capable of putting out "from the hulk" I would think the better question is how much defensive protection does this upgrade give luke cage against someone with abomination lvl of strength.That IMO is mostly what this upgrade is mostly defensive in nature though I do think that the adamantium would increase his stiking power.
Originally posted by tkitna
Yeah, i'm done with this too. I realize that your just not going to get it.
I really dont know what to say to you. Ive gone the extra mile to pull feats that prove that he can do what he does. All I hear from you is "Thats bad writing!"
Hell Brutacus and Supeior Tech seem to get my point about the feats but you just dont get it, why is that? Somehow you think you can pull whatever feats you like and just decide that they take priority, regardless of the characters history. I guess everybody should just agree with you....jeezus Christ!
There is nothing to get except whatever you say goes and you pick what feats you like and they automatically take priority.
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Increase strength, adamantium bones do not.
His bio says it does.
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
His bio says it does.
Originally posted by Silent Guardian
um yes they would 💃
🤨
So you're saying that if I was suddenly given an adamantium skeleton (barring any of the negative effects of adamantium, and let's even assume there is no additional weight), I would be twice as strong?
Originally posted by Metalmanx
🤨So you're saying that if I was suddenly given an adamantium skeleton (barring any of the negative effects of adamantium, and let's even assume there is no additional weight), I would be twice as strong?
The adamantium bones would help you, if you were so strong, that your bones would give in on the weight before your muscles would. That's not the case since Cage's durability is always hyped.